An essay in futility, too long to read :)

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Offline yor_on

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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2150 on: 10/06/2016 21:29:13 »
Why not become a warrior?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2151 on: 10/06/2016 21:30:32 »
You really think you thought it through?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2152 on: 10/06/2016 21:37:07 »
I don't know, I aint you. But a cowards paradise is not what  I search. Backstabbing may be a strategy. but I don't believe in it. Education, to be fair, maybe lose at times, but keeping yourself.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2153 on: 10/06/2016 21:41:18 »
That's what makes it worth living.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2154 on: 13/06/2016 08:39:37 »
If you now happen to have some time off?
Clifford Simak

One of the forgotten authors. so good.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2155 on: 14/06/2016 13:07:07 »
So, how bad is it?

Eh, not my writing, although some might think so :)

"In all, our single species now commandeers somewhere between 25% and 40% of primary productivity on Earth. It is a productivity, that over large areas of land, is “hyper-fertilised” by the extraction of millions of tons of nitrogen from the air, in the Haber-Bosch process, and by digging comparable amounts of phosphate from the ground.

These super-fed crops are fed, highly efficiently, to farm animals, that we eat in turn. The scale of this operation is a large reason for the scale of the ongoing mass extinction of other organisms.

The scientist Vaclav Smil, of the University of Manitoba, has calculated that simply measured by mass, humans now make up a third of land vertebrates, and the animals that we keep to eat – cows, pigs, sheep and so on – make up most of the other two thirds. All the wild animals – elephants, giraffes, tigers and so on – are now less than 5% by mass. It’s a measure of how they have been pushed to the fringes by humans." https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jun/21/mass-extinction-science-warning

It's pretty bad but we don't notice it, yet. A lot of it is due to the slogan 'populate the world', beloved by religious, as well as other, movements. From one billion to seven billion people, in one hundred years. If this trend doesn't stop we're going to eat up this world.

But this do not take away global warming, no use blaming it on over population solely. It's all a human 'system error' coming from the way we live and act. It's about ideals, and ways of living. We lost our connection to this earth, some of us believing that it doesn't matter if we condemn this planet, its fauna and flora. We can always move 'somewhere else', usually involving some 'space habitat'.

How dumb can one be?

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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2156 on: 14/06/2016 13:14:16 »
I see no problem in us eating meat. I do see a problem in our domestic stocks pushing away the rest of the fauna though. We need to find a sustainable balance. The problem with our shortsighted species is that we probably will try to solve it by 'competing for resources', which means wars. Small arm wars, 'cold wars', and escalating. You can see the trend already. One child per person, starting today.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2157 on: 14/06/2016 13:19:04 »
Eh no. one child per person is still no trend, even though some western society's have shrunk its childbearing. I'm talking about 'international diplomacy' and its failure to handle relations.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2158 on: 14/06/2016 13:23:47 »
A war, a third world war won't solve a thing. It will just put the last nail in our coffin. A real war has no limits, everything is allowed, forget about Geneva conventions for that one.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2159 on: 14/06/2016 13:25:57 »
The 'winner', and that's what they all believe themselves to become, can always write a new convention, can't he :) Stupidity Galore, and no ethics.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2160 on: 14/06/2016 13:31:47 »
Very human solution though. Fast, short sighted, with those surviving hopefully finding themselves to have more resources available (per person living), at least in a short term scenario, and that is after all what we are 'best on'.

=
Spelling
« Last Edit: 14/06/2016 13:45:17 by yor_on »
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2161 on: 14/06/2016 13:33:18 »
Then again, hopefully you will prove me wrong.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2162 on: 14/06/2016 17:09:11 »
Remember "Shortly before a pivotal climate summit in Copenhagen in 2009, thousands of their e-mail streams were hacked in a sophisticated espionage operation that has never been solved—although the official police investigation revealed nothing, an analysis by forensics experts traced its path through servers in Turkey and two of the world's largest oil producers, Saudi Arabia and Russia."

The funny thing, if now something funny can come from this, is that Saudi Arabia is one of the already hottest places on this planet. to me it seems as if they was digging their own grave a little deeper and faster. When it comes to Russia, reality will be decided by the state, not by science :) And then we have USA with its Janus face, some of the best climate science in the world alongside with some of the most fervent deniers on the planet. http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a36228/ballad-of-the-sad-climatologists-0815/

Won't mention Canada (much), and if you understand that they, those days, appear to get a better weather coverage from the USA than from their own country, you probably can guess why.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2163 on: 14/06/2016 17:22:32 »
What I'm really tired of is those people turning every stone to find something 'bright' to say at the end of some gloomy climate report. It's human nature maybe but it's also disinformation. How the f* can you decide when everyone ends with a promise that its not as bad as it looks :) Sort of funny in a way, but it's just as a bad as it looks, and what we don't see is even worse. It's like constantly referring to ten, twenty, forty years in the future, statistics as a proof.

when all the statistics finally hangs on the wall our chance to make a change to it is gone.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2164 on: 14/06/2016 17:27:23 »
Why deniers probably accept (future) statistics, well, they will nag at it, is because it's about something not happening now. It's a promise of you not needing to change today and that business will continue 'as usual'. Because we have to wait on the 'statistics', don't we? :)
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2165 on: 14/06/2016 17:28:04 »
We're one clever species :)
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2166 on: 14/06/2016 17:43:22 »
The economic and political ideals that steer our Western society is not geared for tackling this issue. You might compare it to already being at war, a war that we can't win as our 'enemy' are ourselves. So Russia and Canada, and parts of the USA. Sweden is not any better. Even though most accept the idea of anthropogenic climate change, there also is a lot of conservatism involved, not 'rocking the boat'. Norway wants to think it not happening at all mostly :)

What can I say?
We're all humans.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2167 on: 14/06/2016 17:46:04 »
So we need something new, people that are awake.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2168 on: 14/06/2016 17:47:01 »
Not a state, you.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2169 on: 14/06/2016 18:10:24 »
democracy

1. The political orientation of those who favour government by the people or by their elected representatives

2. A political system in which the supreme power lies in a body of citizens who can elect people to represent them

3. The doctrine that the numerical majority of an organized group can make decisions binding on the whole group
==

Of those I will agree with nmbr 3. That is what democracy is, but not 1 or 2. That's just lazy thinking, not unheard of by me either btw :)

Although the first part of 1 "The political orientation of those who favour government by the people" do have a relevance, the last part seems more of a convenance to me than a democracy.

The question is simple.

How do we assure a working democracy, where the state is its citizens servant, not master?

We have the Internet, we have asymmetric encryption.
But all of that will fail if you're not awake.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2170 on: 15/06/2016 13:59:18 »
We can change it, the whole shebang. Even if there was no Global Warming it would be high time to change our behavior. And if getting awake makes you grumpy? Have a coffee, take your time and let it do its work. Life is a nice thing, isn't it?
=

Eh a cup of tea will work too naturally :)
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2171 on: 15/06/2016 14:06:02 »
Education and fairness, two good things. And being able to tell it as it is, a third. Trust your gut, so to speak. If the feeling is there you better listen, and speak up. There are worse things in life than your co-workers, boss, etc etc getting disturbed. Some of them comes from knowing that you should have done something, said something, but you never did.

Be a warrior.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2172 on: 15/06/2016 14:12:17 »
We do listen to each other, but if no one speaks up?

And that's the way it is today. Too many too lazy to check the facts, too many staying inside a 'safe environment'. Look where it took us as the only people speaking up was the ones craving for 'power' in its different disguises. And you can't buy away your responsibility, neither vote away it.

We need to stop listening to stupidity's greed.


Heh, slightly better ;)
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2173 on: 15/06/2016 14:14:54 »
So?

You want to try it?
Do it.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2174 on: 15/06/2016 14:25:52 »
"How do we assure a working democracy, where the state is its citizens servant, not master?"

One thing to guard against is leaving the decision making in the hands of the few. But that is exactly what we've done, economically and politically. And those two rather small groups of individuals mingle with each other, not with you though (as a guess :). Today they are 'global' due to communications, and the groups are becoming ever refined. And they probably believe themselves to stand for 'democracy'.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2175 on: 15/06/2016 14:26:46 »
Look at it, is it democracy?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2176 on: 15/06/2016 17:03:22 »
Depends on your definition of it.

I won't call it democracy though, it has a resemblance to 'the will of the people', that's all.
Ever wondered what a politician fears most, in Sweden, as politicians everywhere?

Referendums.

Very dangerous that kind of stuff, and the 'information' you get someone will pay for, either from your taxes or from other profits made. That's another thing you can knit to the newfangled 'regulations' of the Internet. Free information, but, not too 'free'.

Democracy again?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2177 on: 15/06/2016 17:08:47 »
It all knits together, if you want to take responsibility. Responsibility for yourself, and ethics, your ethics. Or you can stay 'inside' and 'conform'. Conforming has left us here, that and egoism.  To it you can add hubris and narcissism. The economic and political, model you live with associate buying with happiness.
« Last Edit: 15/06/2016 17:10:51 by yor_on »
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2178 on: 15/06/2016 17:11:21 »
Then the richest dead wins, right?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2179 on: 15/06/2016 17:12:54 »
:)

Weirder than most of my ideas that one.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2180 on: 15/06/2016 17:15:15 »
Let's see, the model prefer you consuming, and the more you consume the greater the profits, which means more jobs, which crave you to consume more, which leads to more profits, which ...... .....

Should I be impressed?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2181 on: 15/06/2016 17:19:08 »
And that knits to Earth as a planet of 'infinite riches', which was what we thought for the longest time.
It's not of 'infinite riches' anymore though.

But the economic, and so political, model hasn't changed.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2182 on: 15/06/2016 17:22:16 »
It's a political and economic hierarchy.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2183 on: 15/06/2016 17:23:20 »
You can call it 'democracy' depending on definitions, but not if you go by mine.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2185 on: 15/06/2016 17:41:54 »
It's educated guesswork naturally, based on 'projections' drawn from statistics. But we will decline, one reason or another, be it wars, famines, global warming, over crowding, you name it. There must be a apex to any population growth, and reasons why it will decline.

http://io9.gizmodo.com/how-rats-turned-their-private-paradise-into-a-terrifyin-1687584457
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2186 on: 15/06/2016 17:53:57 »
We can forestall it though.
One kid per person.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2187 on: 15/06/2016 17:55:30 »
Those kids won't be less loved than the ones we set to the world today.
I would say it should have the opposite effect.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2188 on: 15/06/2016 18:06:37 »
If you want a sustainable future, keeping our current economic ideals, the world wide population needs to shrink drastically. Probably under one billion, like in the beginning of the nineteenth century, or so. Or rather, what I really think is that those ideas will bankrupt us anyhow :) although a lot slower.

Contrast it to "Human population entered the 20th century with 1.6 billion people and left the century with 6.1 billion."
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2189 on: 16/06/2016 18:20:55 »
So, are we getting dumber?
http://www.livescience.com/37095-humans-smarter-or-dumber.html

Don't think so. We're getting more egoistic though. The ideals of 'the free market' and the one about your country each year needing to yield more profits isn't natural. It's an ideal we have, similar to our dream of winning a lottery,  a dream and a hope that we want to exist. What it leads to though is overexploitation, and injustices, all in the name of 'the holy growth'. combine that with a overcrowded planet where people will be forced to flee their homelands due to climate changes, with the effect of small arm wars rising. There are no illegals on this Earth. Everyone come from the same place and leave the same way. They didn't destroy their homes, global warming did, and that comes from the developed countries mostly, although all country's still strive for it. Even when understanding global warming.

The reasons they do it is the same as for us. They want to consume, and so become finally 'happy'. So are we happy here then?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2190 on: 16/06/2016 18:24:39 »
You could also see it as a result of our current ideals only encouraging short time solutions. Because buying yourself happy will be as a drug, the kick is fast gone, then you need it again. This society is creating drug addicts.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2191 on: 16/06/2016 18:25:44 »
'Happy consumers'
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2192 on: 16/06/2016 18:27:48 »
Why not read up on those rats again, they had their rodent paradise, didn't they?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2193 on: 16/06/2016 18:32:14 »
People think they can buy themselves free.
You can't, you can't vote yourself free from responsibility either.
But you can take it, as well as ethics, to start stand up for your views.

It will make you 'uncomfortable' possibly :)
That's a risk you take.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2194 on: 16/06/2016 18:43:36 »
We have it worse than those rats. Because we won't be able to turn a blind eye as injustices grows, instead we will start lying to ourselves. So the ideals not only will make you a drug addict, but also turn you into the worst kind of liar, the kind that lies to himself. If you can convince yourself that your lies is truth, then you can preach it to others, and believe it too :)

Narcissism, egoism and hubris.

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« Last Edit: 16/06/2016 18:58:46 by yor_on »
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2195 on: 16/06/2016 18:49:43 »
And I'm sure some will think that this fits my writing too ::))
We're a funny species, even lovable at times.

You got to see the humor hiding behind our actions, rather dark I admit, but it's there.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2196 on: 16/06/2016 18:55:04 »
We think ourselves the apex of creation. No mere 'animals' but  h u m a n s, nota bene. Equipped with a 'divine right' to overcrowd and drive the rest of the fauna and flora into extinction. And we all think the 'others' as 'losers' in this 'game', as we manipulate each other for 'profit'.

It is funny. Rather stupid, but funny in a dark mode.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2197 on: 16/06/2016 18:57:06 »
Why not become a warrior instead?
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2198 on: 16/06/2016 19:06:27 »
It's not 'democracy' that drives it, it's ideals and dreams, the promise of you always being 'happy'.
And the way to is according to the gospel, through consuming, and consuming, and consuming some more.  So we get 'game theory' :)

The answer to life.
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Re: An essay in futility, too long to read :)
« Reply #2199 on: 17/06/2016 17:58:15 »
you know, most of the things we do, we do from faith. Faith in a idea, a ideal, a friend, a country. Sometimes it f* you up badly when you see the other side of the mirror. But faith isn't wrong, neither is trust. sometimes you have to walk through it all, to the other side. If you have that courage you will find both faith and trust, again. It was always there, even though abused.
"BOMB DISPOSAL EXPERT. If you see me running, try to keep up."