Why do some posters get upset when their theories are challenged?

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Offline Geezer

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Perhaps this should be under medical science?

Anyway, some posters go to a lot of trouble to post their theories on the NSF (BTW, do you have to be naked while posting? I always try to be, but it's getting slightly parky here, so I'll either have to crank up the heating or slip into a "snuggie" - but I digress.)

So, aforementioned posters post their theories, but seem to get really ticked off when others politely ask questions. As Neil would have it,

"Why's that then?"

(And he claims he went to a grammar school!)
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline Madidus_Scientia

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Haha, good question, i've noticed that :p

Maybe it's because they're just parroting theories they've heard elsewhere, and don't actually have the understanding or intellectual ability to defend the theory, they just "like the idea", so instead they just try to dismiss critics.

Or maybe they have it in their head that they're absolutely right, and everyone who disagrees must therefore be absolutely wrong, and contrary arguments or evidence must therefore be ignored since they just cannot be right.

Or maybe it occurs in people who share 2 traits - both the desire to be outspoken, and the incapability of admitting they were wrong about something. So because they want to be outspoken they quickly formulate opinions without proper reasoning, go forth and assert them to the world, and then when their errors are pointed out to them, because they are incapable of admitting to be wrong, are forced to cherry-pick for evidence and use false logic to argue their way out of it.
« Last Edit: 07/11/2009 20:12:03 by Madidus_Scientia »

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Offline Don_1

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..... As Neil would have it,

"Why's that then?"

(And he claims he went to a grammar school!)

No, no, no. He went to his Grandma's school.

I think perhaps they feel that they have gone through such pain and effort to figure out and write down their theory, then feel so proud of themselves for having done it, it comes as a bit of a shock to find someone questioning their well thought out deliberations.

The fact is that they should be pleased that others have taken the time and trouble to read their piece and perhaps ask for clarification on some points. Not jump to its defence before it has been criticised.

Of course, it might be understandable if it were the case that, having got your theory down here, some less than tactful member simply replies with 'What a load of old cobblers'. Unless, of course, it is indeed a load of old cobblers and deserving to be called so.
If brains were made of dynamite, I wouldn't have enough to blow my nose.

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Offline LeeE

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I've never met, seen, or even heard of anyone who was always entirely rational about everything; everyone is a little bit bonkers, to a greater or lesser degree and I think this behaviour is just one of the ways in which this irrationality is expressed.

Some aspects of this type of behaviour seem quite straightforward to understand: except for the cases where a person wants to be wrong about their assessment of things i.e. because they predict that something bad is going to happen to them, anyone who says something to anyone else does so in the hope, or even the expectation, that the people they say it to will listen to them, and moreover, that they will agree with the point they make.

When people agree with a point that someone makes, the person who made the point will feel respected and be reassured that they are correct, but when someone disagrees they're saying that the person who made the point is wrong.  At the very least, this can be embarrassing and disappointing when the person was expecting respect and success, but at worst it can threaten someone's interpretation of reality and actually lead to psychosis.

Whether it just results in embarrassment and disappointment, or goes more deeply and leads to psychosis, you're likely to see at least some degree of irrationality as a result.

There's a caveat to this, of course; if someone doesn't really care whether they're right or wrong then they're not likely care about being embarrassed or disappointed either; indeed, they might not even be bothered by finding that their interpretation of reality is skewed.  However, if someone doesn't care about anything then they're unlikely to start making points about things in the first place.  And besides, you could also argue that not caring about anything is irrational anyway.

As a related side-note, I think it's likely that the amount of irrationality and psychosis in the world is likely to increase in proportion to the amount of knowledge acquired by humanity i.e. it is going to increase, for we long ago passed the point where anyone had the capability to know all of the acquired knowledge.  The result is that everybody is ignorant to some degree and therefore their picture of reality is also incomplete, but it is upon a person's picture of reality that their beliefs and actions are based.
...And its claws are as big as cups, and for some reason it's got a tremendous fear of stamps! And Mrs Doyle was telling me it's got magnets on its tail, so if you're made out of metal it can attach itself to you! And instead of a mouth it's got four arses!

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Offline Don_1

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As a related side-note, I think it's likely that the amount of irrationality and psychosis in the world is likely to increase in proportion to the amount of knowledge acquired by humanity i.e. it is going to increase, for we long ago passed the point where anyone had the capability to know all of the acquired knowledge.  The result is that everybody is ignorant to some degree and therefore their picture of reality is also incomplete, but it is upon a person's picture of reality that their beliefs and actions are based.

I like this Lee. Succinct and plausible.

Have I made you feel good on this morning?
If brains were made of dynamite, I wouldn't have enough to blow my nose.

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Offline neilep

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Did someone say I went to skool ?.....wasn't that the building with lots of kids in it ? and plasticine and a black board ?

I think many  people(not all) get upset when their theories are challenged because they have spent loads of time convinced they are right and expect others to "see the light" and feel enlightened at the revelation they present to us !!..when this does not happen and  their theory is challenged and open to scrutiny and critique, they get all flustered , have a hissy fit and become all upset !.
It is difficult to take critique not personally, it's a wound.

This of course does not happen to me because...as a sheepy..I'm of course always right !...even if ewe say I'm not !..this is not smugness or arrogance it's a sheepy fact !
Men are the same as women, just inside out !

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Offline glovesforfoxes

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The best way to combat it is 1 memory pill a day that reminds you that you don't the s word.
« Last Edit: 09/11/2009 01:47:50 by glovesforfoxes »
The animals of the world exist for their own reasons. They were not made for humans any more than blacks were made for whites, or women for men. - Alice Walker

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Offline Geezer

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The best way to combat it is 1 memory pill a day that reminds you that you don't the s word.

Ah! One of those German jokes where nobody can laugh until they hear the verb at the end of the sentence.

OK - spill the beans. What is it then?
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline glovesforfoxes

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Sorry, I was just trying to keep it child friendly! No joke [:P]

 [:I]
The animals of the world exist for their own reasons. They were not made for humans any more than blacks were made for whites, or women for men. - Alice Walker

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Offline Geezer

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Sorry, I was just trying to keep it child friendly! No joke [:P]

 [:I]

Yes, yes. But what is the missing verb? Is it "use" or "say"?

".....1 memory pill a day that reminds you that you don't the s word."
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline Geezer

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As a related side-note, I think it's likely that the amount of irrationality and psychosis in the world is likely to increase in proportion to the amount of knowledge acquired by humanity i.e. it is going to increase, for we long ago passed the point where anyone had the capability to know all of the acquired knowledge.  The result is that everybody is ignorant to some degree and therefore their picture of reality is also incomplete, but it is upon a person's picture of reality that their beliefs and actions are based.

Pardonez moi, Chez Lee, but I resemble your imputation that I might be even slightly bonkers. People have often remarked, even some complete strangers, that they thought I was extremely sane, and I was not brandishing any sharp implements in their general direction at the time.

You do paint a rather depressing picture, but you also raise a very interesting question. Is there some sort of human "impedance" to knowledge? It seems to me that there is. There might also be some sort of human "conductance" to anti-science (non-knowledge). When either one becomes too great, do we precipitate another "dark age".

We seem to be on the verge of such a thing at this time. At no time in the past has so much knowledge been so accessible to so many humans on this planet. However, it's probably also true that, at no time in the past, so much knowledge has been rejected by so many humans on this planet.

Perhaps you should start another thread on this subject.
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline glovesforfoxes

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Sorry, I was just trying to keep it child friendly! No joke [:P]

 [:I]

Yes, yes. But what is the missing verb? Is it "use" or "say"?

".....1 memory pill a day that reminds you that you don't the s word."

Haha. Oh forgive me - it's know [:D]
The animals of the world exist for their own reasons. They were not made for humans any more than blacks were made for whites, or women for men. - Alice Walker

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Offline neilep

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Sorry, I was just trying to keep it child friendly! No joke [:P]

 [:I]

Yes, yes. But what is the missing verb? Is it "use" or "say"?

".....1 memory pill a day that reminds you that you don't the s word."

Haha. Oh forgive me - it's know [:D]

Forgot to take your memory pill on that one !!

[attachment=10518]
Men are the same as women, just inside out !

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Offline Geezer

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Sorry, I was just trying to keep it child friendly! No joke [:P]

 [:I]

Yes, yes. But what is the missing verb? Is it "use" or "say"?

".....1 memory pill a day that reminds you that you don't the s word."

Haha. Oh forgive me - it's know [:D]

Forgot to take your memory pill on that one !!

[attachment=10518]

We have recently received a large consignment of the amazing Memory Pill here on at the reservation our corporate headquarters, and we would like to make them available to NSF readers for only $1 (or one GB Pound) per pill.

Please forward your credit card deatils to:

Honest Geezer
C/O NSF.con
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline Make it Lady

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To answer the question, as long as replies aren't rude, patronising or wrong, then I don't see why people should get upset by having their theories quetioned.
Ah but I'm forgetting myself, this is TNS. Please pass me a memory pill quick so I can remember myself again.
Give a man a fire and he is warm for a day, set a man on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life.

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Offline raptorguy

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 This site, at least 'in name', is a science site. I agree with the saying that 'there are no dumb questions' but I don't extend that to 'there are no dumb theories.'  There are lots of dumb theories.  Now this doesn't imply the people proposing them are usually 'dumb' but they are often ignorant of the science discipline into which they have wandered.

 Somebody will wander into a science discipline and start with a so-called 'fact' they have picked up off the internet. I can google 'alien abduction' and come up with over a million hits with 'evidence'.  It's all baloney.

 If folks get their back up or nose out of joint then 'so be it'.  Science isn't about pandering to ignorance.  In fact a disciplined scientist SEEKS refute of a theory and welcomes it if the rationale so implies.  Science isn't about the person being 'right or wrong' but about the journey. Science starts a discussion and has no stake in where it leads. If someone gets bummed out because their theory is dismissed as dumb then their initial goal had nothing to do with science. 

 
« Last Edit: 16/11/2009 22:55:59 by raptorguy »

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Offline LeeE

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...Science isn't about pandering to ignorance...

I think that just about hits the nail on the head.
...And its claws are as big as cups, and for some reason it's got a tremendous fear of stamps! And Mrs Doyle was telling me it's got magnets on its tail, so if you're made out of metal it can attach itself to you! And instead of a mouth it's got four arses!

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Offline Geezer

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...Science isn't about pandering to ignorance...

I think that just about hits the nail on the head.

Nor should science ignore the pandas.

(Sorry!)
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline Ophiolite

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Nor should science ignore the pandas.
Your remark has bamboozled me.
Observe; collate; conjecture; analyse; hypothesise; test; validate; theorise. Repeat until complete.

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Offline Geezer

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It's supposed to be a play on words. A rather poor play on words evidently! [:D]

Pandering to ignorance
Ignoring the pandas
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline Hadrian

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Perhaps this should be under medical science?

Anyway, some posters go to a lot of trouble to post their theories on the NSF (BTW, do you have to be naked while posting? I always try to be, but it's getting slightly parky here, so I'll either have to crank up the heating or slip into a "snuggie" - but I digress.)

So, aforementioned posters post their theories, but seem to get really ticked off when others politely ask questions. As Neil would have it,

"Why's that then?"

(And he claims he went to a grammar school!)


EGO the bigger it is the bigger the upset


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Offline Ophiolite

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It's supposed to be a play on words. A rather poor play on words evidently! [:D]

Pandering to ignorance
Ignoring the pandas
What do pandas eat?
Their diet is restricted to bamboo.
Consequently I was bamboozled.

Try to pay attention.
Observe; collate; conjecture; analyse; hypothesise; test; validate; theorise. Repeat until complete.

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Offline Geezer

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It's supposed to be a play on words. A rather poor play on words evidently! [:D]

Pandering to ignorance
Ignoring the pandas
What do pandas eat?
Their diet is restricted to bamboo.
Consequently I was bamboozled.

Try to pay attention.

Ya got me Bugsy. Hoist by me own petard......  [xx(]
There ain'ta no sanity clause, and there ain'ta no centrifugal force Šther.

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Offline Madidus_Scientia

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No need to give each other black eyes

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Offline Don_1

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Do Pandas' have black eyes?












Yes,

Thanks for the answer, but why the big paws.
If brains were made of dynamite, I wouldn't have enough to blow my nose.

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Offline Ophiolite

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Do Pandas' have black eyes?
Yes. Of course they do. You have heard of black eye peas. Those are the P's at the start of each panda.

Will someone stop me before I say something relevant!
Observe; collate; conjecture; analyse; hypothesise; test; validate; theorise. Repeat until complete.