[jman05 (OP)]

This is my most fundamental argument for God.  Where did it come from.  You cant just get all that energy/time and mass out of nothing.

Here is a quote from Stephen Hawkings, A Brief History of Time:
”In an unchanging universe a beginning in time is something that has to be imposed by some being outside the universe; there is no physical necessity for a beginning

Cant argue with steven.

YOu do have to admit that his is the only HUGE evidence of a god.

I am open to Opinions.

[David Sparkman]

It is rather difficult to understand the creation of our universe. Our science is picking at the initial moments after the Big Bang where the current laws break down. (too hot, too much matter and energy, gulons not yet combined into matter, etc.) It is hard for us to imagine such a time.

Further more the Big Bang theory has not been around too long, and the universel background radiation seems to be the clue that makes most people think that the Big Bang was the way it started. Be warned: theories do get revised and refined. This theory may be as well.

The curious thing (Gospel according to Me) is that the current thinking says that the universe exists in itself and causes itself. I.e. there is no "outside" the universe according to the current set of laws we are using. That I find a little hard to swollow. It may be beyond our comprehension, though I grit my teeth to even think such a thought.

The concept of God creating the universe attributes this initial cause to an intelligence instead of just random chance. That to me is just semantics. It can be argued for years with no progress.

I am more interested in learning if a Superior being or race stirred the pot and helped us along the way. I think that is what the message of quite a few religions is. Are the teachings man made or is there significant wisdom in them to point to a God advising us, and teaching things that science has not yet answered?

David

[Simmer]

quote:Originally posted by David Sparkman


The concept of God creating the universe attributes this initial cause to an intelligence instead of just random chance. That to me is just semantics. It can be argued for years with no progress.

Agreed. Not understanding how the universe started isn't evidence for God unless God is just a label for something we don't understand.

[jman05 (OP)]

what does random chance have to do with it.  random chance has nothing to do with the idea of how is space time and matter created out of nothing.

[David Sparkman]

Some scientists have proposed that small amounts of matter and antimatter can appear spontaneously. This theory has been stretched to suggest something similar created the initial material for the universe.

As I said, it is a stretch, but it gets airtime because there aren't too many theories out there, and we don't think we can replicate it. Please remember these are theories in Science, and don't take a God made creation into account. If you prefer the God theory, there is not too much more to research unless you want to ask how he/she did it. Scientists prefer to never stop asking questions []

David

[ukmicky]

If there had to be something that created the universe like a god, then my argument is so if god created the universe then who created god?

My opinion is we will never know how it all started because our form of existence or life isn't capable of understanding.

We act like we are the most superior form of life in the universe, maybe we are. But i bet we're not.    
Just like the spider that ran across the floor in front of my wife last night didn’t understand the consequence of his actions maybe we are also in the position of not understanding the creation of the universe.

We can theorize how our universe evolved once it began, but in my opinion we haven't got a hope in hell of understanding what came before.
Most people believe we had a big bang due to evidence like cosmic radiation and expansion of space etc, but as far as we know there could be other causes for the radiation and expansion.
I'm not saying it’s wrong to believe in god or the big bang or any other theory of life the universe and everything, as in the end it all helps our understanding.  

But what do i know i'm only a postman  

 Michael                                      

[gsmollin]

quote:Originally posted by jman05

This is my most fundamental argument for God.  Where did it come from.  You cant just get all that energy/time and mass out of nothing...

Actually, that is exactly the current thinking. The universe happened ex nihlo, from nothing. The matter and energy we see is all a result of the gravitational binding energy of the universe.

If you are looking for a rationalization for a supreme being from scientific study, you are on a poor foundation. Religious convictions must be articles of faith.

"F = ma, E = mc^2, and you can't push a string."