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quote:Will you be moving some of the old - or at least the recent - environment-related threads across to this forum, so that they’re easier to find? For example, global warming, manhattan project for clean energy, etc.)
quote:Originally posted by VAlibrarianIf you talk to an atmospheric scientist, you will find out that 95 to 99% of them are very worried about the time period of 50 to 100 years from now due to this issue. It is not because they are ridiculously well paid (they are not), or because they enjoy upsetting people. They actually believe this stuff, and they want us all to believe it and do something about it.
quote:Originally posted by VAlibrarianAha! Scientists cannot be trusted to do science, because they are all closet socialists leveled to idiocy by peer pressure, huh? Sorry, another someone, I do not buy that notion. If you do not believe that scientists know anything about science, I suggest that you spend your time on another message board more in tune with your views.chris wiegard
quote:Originally posted by VAlibrarianI did read an excellent article in Scientific American this week on the topic of hybrid vehicles, explaining why many scientists view that currently available technology as a more promising way to reduce gasoline use than the use of hydrogen vehicles, which are really not practical and may never be. Extremely accurate material appears in print sometimes- peer reviewed journal material is rarely nonsense, unlike the internet stuff.chris wiegard
quote:Originally posted by VAlibrarianIn reply to Solvay, yes there are people who do not believe that we are anywhere near the halfway point of our consumption of fossil petroleum. (I use the word fossil because they are not making any more of the stuff down there under the ground so consuming it is by definition unsustainable- it's just a matter of when.)However most of the people who argue that we are centuries away from the halfway point of petroleum consumption happen to work for oil companies, and they make those statments because they want to continue to work for oil companies. Here in the U.S. we have had former oil company staff people go to work in the White House, editing the phrase "global warming" out of every scientific report that crosses their desk. I do not make this up, it is in the newspapers over here. So who do you want to trust, scientists or oil company people who claim to be scientists?chris wiegard
quote:Originally posted by Solvay_1927Ophiolite - why do you say that renewable energy is often environmentally unfriendly?
quote:Originally posted by OphioliteThose who say we have nothing to worry about, that we shall find a solution when we need to, are, in a word, dumb.
quote:Originally posted by Solvay_1927In trying to find out more about the "peak" point, I found the following (in case anyone's interested in a detailed discussion):...sorry, you cannot view external links. To see them, please
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quote:Originally posted by VAlibrarianBut the rules of logic compel me to admit that even an ignorant person can come up with a good idea sometimes.
quote:I have to admit that I cannot prove to an absolute degree that the burning of fossil fuels at current rates will result in rising sea levels that will flood half of Bangladesh within a century. A majority of atmospheric scientists believe that it will happen, and that our CO2 contribution will be the cause. But without a time machine, there are plenty of people I cannot convince, partly because they simply do not wish to be convinced. It is very frustrating, because these people will no longer be living in the year 2060, and neither will I. I will never be able to say "you silly ass, I warned you about this and you prefered to plug your ears and go with business as usual". So be it. If the human race is able to change behavior in order to yield a survivable planet to their grandchildren, we will deserve that survival. If we are not willing to adjust our behavior for the benefit of posterity, I am hard pressed to suggest that a benificent Deity should yank us out of a frying pan of our own devising.
quote:Originally posted by AlphBravoWell oil are getting harder to extract, it is not hard to extrapolate the outcome,
quote:as both the World Wars we have had were about oil and it's supply
quote:(6) Japan Utilize the New Energy Resource: Methane-HydrideThe Japanese Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry will start a new energy project to utilize methane-hydride lying under the sea floor. The 3-year first phase is to estimate by artificial seismic wave the amount of deposits existing around Japan, and then by actually drilling into the sea floor. Following this first phase, the next step will start in 2007 to extract methane directly from the frozen methane-hydride layers. The total deposits around Japan is expected to reach 7,400 billion square meters, which is equivalent to consuming natural gas for 100 years in Japan. The METI plans to put this project into commercial service in 2016.
quote:Originally posted by AlphBravoWell oil are getting harder to extract, it is not hard to extrapolate the outcome, we is one selfish lot, and as both the World Wars we have had were about oil and it's supply
quote:1) Consider carbon dioxide generated in extracting raw materials for the wind turbines, manufacturing, transporting and erecting them, as well as the infra structure of roads and buildings required for their maintenance. This is rarely figured into the calculations of wind power benefits.
quote:2) Consider the unsightly nature of wind turbines.
quote:3) Consider the economic impact upon home owners where wind turbines are installed in their neighbourhood.
quote:4) Consider the high mortality rate of birds transiting wind turbine sites.
quote:5) Consider the low frequency noise generated by these turbines which is detectable over great distances and whose long term effects upon humans and other animals has not been thoroughly determined.
quote:6) Consider the resource consumption of valuable materials to construct these turbines.
quote:1. When will the world run out of oil?
quote:2. How will we cope when we do run out of oil? If we really do only have maybe 50 years or so, isn’t that too short a time to completely switch our dependence from oil to other forms of energy?
quote:Will we be able to harness enough solar/wind/wave power to meet the demands of 2050 onwards?
quote:Can we really expect to have developed safe, sustainable, cost-efficient, large scale nuclear fusion within that timescale?
quote:What other energy sources are there that we might develop?
quote:And will we really be able to develop alternative materials to the plastics, lubricants, etc. that currently come from oil?
quote:3. Which will be worse – the situation after we’ve run out, or the changes that will happen on the way to running out? I think the human race will find a way to manage without oil eventually.
quote:What worries me more is the changes that we’ll undergo before we get there.
quote:While oil supply falls and oil demand rises, oil prices can be expected to go through the roof - perhaps within the next couple/few decades.
quote:Won’t that lead to economic (and political) crises? And to social changes (e.g. fewer and fewer people being able to afford cars, air travel, heating, etc.)?
quote:Will the big oil companies become more powerful than the world’s governments?
quote:Will we see more “intervention” (i.e. military coercion or even invasion) by the US (and China and Russia?) to protect their sources of oil (and their oil pipelines)?
quote:...the burning of fossil fuels at current rates will result in rising sea levels that will flood half of Bangladesh within a century. A majority of atmospheric scientists believe that it will happen, and that our CO2 contribution will be the cause.
quote:Originally posted by Atomic-Squote:Can we really expect to have developed safe, sustainable, cost-efficient, large scale nuclear fusion within that timescale?Probably not. Nuclear fusion still remains largely in the realm of science fiction.
quote:quote:And will we really be able to develop alternative materials to the plastics, lubricants, etc. that currently come from oil? We may not have to. For these things we might rely upon vegetative crops, which can form the starting material for many organic chemicals.
quote:quote:3. Which will be worse – the situation after we’ve run out, or the changes that will happen on the way to running out? I think the human race will find a way to manage without oil eventually. We may not have to.
quote:I don't see crops as being the answer to everything, or even the answer to most things. Crops are very inefficient at producing single products because they need to create such a complex mix of products, so unless you have a need for that complex mix, then they are inevitably inefficient. There may be some benefit if you can create crops that will supply a whole range of raw materials at once, but if you are looking to extract only one major product, and discard the rest, then it is inefficient.
quote:All we are using crops to do (from and industrial perspective) is to absorb solar energy, and utilise it to extract carbon from CO2. In the long term it would make much more sense to do this directly; whether using solar, nuclear, or other energy sources, to develop industrial technologies to extract carbon directly from CO2 and convert it into industrially usable substances.