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Hi,I'm new to this forum. I'm female and experiencing similar symptoms. What baffles me is the fact that these symptoms usually get called post-traumatic stress disorder, flashback or dissociation when you have them as a woman. So I'm wondering- do men and women exprience the same thing? Is it due to trauma or a physical problem, or what? I don't know if anyone has brought up this aspect before, and I don't feel quite comfortable to adress this, but it's just too strange. Aloha
I finally told my younger son about POIS (and that I have it). His immediate reaction was that it is "psychosomatic". My early upbringing was with religious teachers who taught that sex is "dirty", so he has a point.I insisted that POIS is not psychosomatic, but I was weak in defending that. To me, it really is just my best educated guess after 30 suffering years plus the wonderful journey with you all here.ANY IDEAS TO EXPLAIN WHY POIS IS NOT PSYCHOSOMATIC?Thanks!
There was no reaction at all to the questionnaire being posted, after sooo much work. And only one person has even filled it out. This is the key to getting help ...
beta blockers : apart from imre1 (Emconcor / bisoprolol) and Counterpoints (Nadolol), anyone else tried or trying these?
I'm embarrassed to say that my prejudice comes from the fact that if it were psychosomatic (which I used to believe exclusively), then I - with all my considerable willpower, strength, intelligence, etc. - can't bear to admit that I have been unable to unravel my POIS - in fact not even make a dent! - after 30 years of strenuous effort, including psych meds, over-the-top exercise, and marathon talk therapy! In addition, I endlessly chased numerous "spiritual" paths and practitioners...to no avail. So....if the Great Unlicensed Doctor (me) couldn't cure my own POIS with a frontal attack on anything psychological/spiritual, "how could it be psychosomatic"? Make sense?As Counterpoints states, we should be open to any and all possibilities of POIS development and cure. At this stage, I'll even consider aliens from UFO's having conducted wild experiments on us pre-natally with a cure of Kryptonite!
Quote from: Counterpoints on 02/09/2008 05:10:46There was no reaction at all to the questionnaire being posted, after sooo much work. And only one person has even filled it out. This is the key to getting help ...Hi Counterpoints, Took a brief look at the questionaire the day after you posted the link and thought it looked very comprehensive. Great attention to detail which must have taken plenty of effort; sincere thanks for that. I've started working on my answers (will cut/paste into questionaire when done) but I've had no time to really sit down and do it justice due to recent travel obligations. Is there a way to edit my responses after submission?I wouldn't worry if the early reaction to the questionaire seems slow (this might just be consistent with the way people eventually get around to posting an extended amount of information when they are feeling up to it).May I suggest that the link is reposted here on a regular basis (perhaps so that it appears at least once on each page of TNS posts).I've modified the signature on my TNS account to advertise it, but I may not post frequently enough (and I suspect that new TNS accounts don't display other users signatures by default).Thanks again for your efforts!
John21, and Counterpoints, thank you very much for shedding more light on the psychosomatic.I'm embarrassed to say that my prejudice comes from the fact that if it were psychosomatic (which I used to believe exclusively), then I - with all my considerable willpower, strength, intelligence, etc. - can't bear to admit that I have been unable to unravel my POIS - in fact not even make a dent! - after 30 years of strenuous effort, including psych meds, over-the-top exercise, and marathon talk therapy! In addition, I endlessly chased numerous "spiritual" paths and practitioners...to no avail. So....if the Great Unlicensed Doctor (me) couldn't cure my own POIS with a frontal attack on anything psychological/spiritual, "how could it be psychosomatic"? Make sense?As Counterpoints states, we should be open to any and all possibilities of POIS development and cure. At this stage, I'll even consider aliens from UFO's having conducted wild experiments on us pre-natally with a cure of Kryptonite!
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Hi, 3 concepts in this post:1.- information gathering: I read about many topics, ideas and diets and I think that it should be centralized in some place. For a newcomer and a longterm visitor we don`t have a place to skim through and a reference of terms on which we/you operate (I dont know many of them - and have to look them up in a dict ... repeatedly . If there is an interest in this Idea - we could set up some place or make a research on tools to gather the knowledge in an accessible way (like wiki or wikia for example). Please tell me what you think about that.2.- garlic: yesterday I had an orgasm unshielded by garlic diet. Results are as follows: lighter brain fog (due to a better diet probably), stiffnes in neck as always and usual symptoms like backpains and bowel pains. I work in IT and feel the effects of pois overwhelmingly at my daily job. since the garlic diet its much lighter. there is a real change in the attitude actually, I feel much more hopeful after that garlic invention and wanted to share it with you 3.- diet: I have to tell you that I recently added fresh citruses to my diet - I feel much much better after eating them, I have much more energy! (they dont react with POIS directly thou)good luck.James
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that I'm in agreement with everyone, i.e., POIS is largely physical, and not in the least psychologically rooted - ALTHOUGH early psychological trauma may have contributed to its development.
QUESTION: Does anyone else feel that POIS symptoms are "otherworldly"? Don't write me off as a UFO nutcase, I mean that my POIS symptoms are unlike anything else I experience in life, e.g., the exhaustion is a "special" kind of exhaustion only experienced after orgasm; my burning fingertips are surreal and drive me crazy and I don't know why; my "disconnect" with my surroundings are, as well, unlike other periods of social and other withdrawal.Would be curious to know if any of you also feel that POIS presents uniquely felt symptoms.
As for the trauma aspect, it's my experience and observation that early psychological trauma can cause both psychological AND physical damage to the body. STRESS IS BOTH TOXIC AND DAMAGING to a physical organism, (the effects of spikes in cortisol can damage brain cells), and being abused in any way is undoubtedly stressful. Some people resolve their issues and heal more quickly from abuse than others; and some perpetuate it by medicating themselves with various addictions, both substance and behavior addictions (to numb/avoid their pain), which can damage them even more. So, seen in this light, even type 2 diabetes could possibly be considered the result of early trauma--abuse leading to stress, leading to food addiction, up to the point that it endsup as a physical disease.
Perhaps that's one of our missions on this forum--to come up with a solid description of the surrealness of this malady.
Thanks much for that, girlwind. I'm suspecting more and more that I'm still a victim, 50 years later, of early psychological abuse (e.g., "sex is dirty")and brutal corporal punishment - all perpetuated by religious teachers who ran sadistically wild, and unchecked, in the '50s. And, as you point out, I'm one of those who hasn't resolved issues and healed quickly, in spite of decades of psychotherapy and psych meds. Hope I don't sound much like a whiner. If I do, don't tell me 
Thinking POIS is psychosomatic is a logical conclusion for anyone who hasn't experienced it, the problem is unimaginable to them. How to explain it? Good luck! [:)] As Girlwind explained, history is full of misunderstood conditions that came to light over time....and it ain't over yet.
As I said previously, I think it's very possible these problems could be psychologically rooted. No-one seems to want to hear that, because it implies that their condition isn't "serious", or that it's "all in the head". (Girlwind described it very well ). That's not what I mean. The mind is extremely powerful, and can change its chemistry through our experiences. There is no profound distinction between "psychological" and "physical": traditionally psychological problems often have *chemical* causes. And people are genetically predisposed to depression, and other psychological issues. And depression, schizophrenia, and other conditions can often be diagnosed just by looking at brain metabolism!This is somewhat counter to the old 'conventional wisdom' that we can easily switch on and off such problems with conscious effort; that we can "not let it get to us". That there is no difference between person A and person B, except that person A is choosing to obsess about something. (Girlwind's above description about self-willed sickness). Or that person A is just weak. Not true!So if "psychological" IS "physical", why have a distinction at all? This is a very good question that probably isn't asked often enough. The distinction, in my opinion, is that psychological ailments often1) are provoked by environmental stimuli2) are more likely to improve with determined, long-term, conscious effort3) involve brain chemistry
I understand your argument, but see holes in it. The idea that psychological problems have chemical causes isthe argument of modern psychiatry, which at this point is driven by the pharmaceutical industry and its desireto make a profit by altering our brain chemistry with their often toxic mood altering concoctions. Not that thereis absolutely no place for these happy tablets. I will albeit reluctantly admit that there are certain situations where they might be temporarily helpful, until a less toxic long term solution is found.
However, I have to ask how many psychiatrists do you know who would actually even bother investigating very important factors like nutritional deficiencies, hormonal imbalances and environmental toxins as the causes of some serious "psychological" conditions? None that I know. They are completely omitted from psychiatric intake agendas. Yet there are food allergies that can make people seriously depressed. There are nutritional deficiencies that can negatively alter one's mood, severely. And there are toxins in our environment that are now proven to upset both the endocrine and nervous system. Many petro-chemically based products--paints, carpets, cleaners,laundry soaps and cosmetics contain amounts of these neuro toxins, xeno-estrogens and endocrine disruptors. (They had a segment on the NBS news several years ago about mice that went into a coma from being exposed for a few hours to the chemicals in new carpets. How's that for altering your brain chemistry!!!)
So personally, I don't buy the theory that those of us with POIS have to have our brain chemicals "re-set" by some kind of pharmaceutical in order to get over our problem. I am certain that I'm not deficient in Prozac. And also, I don't know anyone in this modern culture of ours who is truly sexually "healthy," and has not had issues of some kind around sex. I know 3 women who were raped, one quite brutally, but none of them have POIS. I alsohave known quite a few people who were molested as children, and none of them have POIS. I was not molestedor abused sexually, and yet I do have it. So I do agree that this problem is more complex than we can understand so far.
Also you mentioned the beta-blocker cure, but forgot about the garlic.
As a victim of POIS and a sufferer, I've come to terms with the losing battle, after being in constant denial for years.I've now concluded thats its much more profound than just being psychosomatic.I'm certain its a genetic predisposition, much like my scoliosis. I followed the effects closely over the years and thought of every possible scenario that's responsible for triggering the symptoms. As a results I've already lost 3 relationships due to lack of energy, physically and mentaly which settles in for 3 days and mysteriously disappears. Yes the effects very slighly to a certain degree in all of us but they're all very similar.What's frustrating about it, is explaining to your partner and having her wait days before having another sexual ritual, epecially if she is a sexual being and has a high sex drive. This made things extremely difficult and as frustrating as this was, in simply english, I was labelled as someone with only a low sex drive but none of them had to endure the unhealthy impliciton afterwards! I'm 27 and things are looking grim, on a positive note if there is one, this does deter me from forming relationships to having me concentrate more on school.
The source you refer to (western medical profession) is the most scientifically credible source available.
It's well known (and accepted by the medical profession) that environmental toxins can detrimentally affect brain chemistry.
Not to mention, the research goes deeper than the opinions of psychiatrists. You can use functional scanning to tag neurotransmitter activity in the brain, as well as brain metabolism, and researchers have found significant differences between those with severe psychological conditions, and those who are relatively problem free. Further, the effect drugs have on our mood -- the fact opiates make us feel euphoric, alcohol decreases inhibition, amphetamines act as stimulates -- is testament to the extent to which chemicals affect our mind....
Just because you are not deficient in something doesn't mean that thing won't fix the underlying problem. I could give many examples of this.But I never said "those of us with POIS have to have our brain chemicals "re-set" by some kind of pharmaceutical in order to get over our problem." I listed psycho-active pharmaceuticals as part of a logical approach to psychological ailments.
Having an open mind can be a good thing, as long as it does not give you a hole in the head.
Quote from: girlwind on 08/09/2008 18:13:00Having an open mind can be a good thing, as long as it does not give you a hole in the head. Why not ? Our brain fog will escape !
I definitely do not consider you a victim or a whiner! More like a resilient persevering survivor. I think everyone on this forum would agree that you are one of the most, if not the most, welcoming, supportive and upbeat of the people here. I empathize with what you've been through and am grateful that you have been willing to share so many of your experiences.
Quote from: martin88 on 08/09/2008 21:55:03Quote from: girlwind on 08/09/2008 18:13:00Having an open mind can be a good thing, as long as it does not give you a hole in the head. Why not ? Our brain fog will escape !martin, haha, good one!
Quote from: girlwind on 08/09/2008 01:14:23I definitely do not consider you a victim or a whiner! More like a resilient persevering survivor. I think everyone on this forum would agree that you are one of the most, if not the most, welcoming, supportive and upbeat of the people here. I empathize with what you've been through and am grateful that you have been willing to share so many of your experiences. GIRLWIND, I must admit I became emotional reading your post today and your compliments. It proves to me that sometimes people DO understand! Perhaps there is a bright side to all the ignoramuses about your conditions that you've suffered for so many years: you now have tremendous empathy for others' similar situations! Thank you!