Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)

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Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12800 on: 14/04/2011 22:53:38 »


Demo T/P Update


This morning, Day 3 of my T/P treatment, I woke up with a very significant increase in my libido. I wrote to my endocrinologist, wondering if it was just a coincidence or a placebo effect.

He replied that he is speculating  but it is possible that I am experiencing a side effect of the T/P treatment!

Hopefully it will be temporary, or you'll end up with one arm way bigger than the other!

Maybe you've got a good use for the specimen bottles. (what were their names again?)

How does Murphey do it??

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12801 on: 14/04/2011 23:13:09 »

Hopefully it will be temporary, or you'll end up with one arm way bigger than the other!


Nah, I just got an offer from Charlie Sheen to help out with his goddesses.

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Offline John21

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12802 on: 14/04/2011 23:34:36 »
Demo: Glad to hear that you might be benefiting from your new treatment!
 
For a week or so I have been feeling somewhat lousy, sort of what the second half of POIS used to feel like. I am surprised by this as I didn’t O or NE recently that I remember. Lately I have been having a lot of tension in my shoulders, and last week my upper back went out on me. Now, a week later and I am feeling drained and foggy. I am contemplating that perhaps my POIS is due to essentially a prostate problem. I have no negative sensations from that area, but I imagine that having inflammation down there would feel like this. Perhaps this possibility fits with Lauracostis’s hypothesis on how POIS might not be due to a semen allergy at all.  So I have ordered some prostate herbs to pop and perhaps it will have some effect, although they seem to have spotty performance at best from what I have read so far.

Now tonight I was looking in a prostate forum and came across this.
He says that his prostate problems persisted after the bacterial infection was gone, due to trauma that left the "pelvic floor" area weak and tense. He says that he overcame this condition from doing pelvic floor exercises and perhaps Thai massage. I’m thinking I’ll look into the exercises at least. I have always had “shy bladder syndrome”, so that might fit as well.  Anyway, I have to go figure out where my pelvic floor is, hope I don’t hurt my neck more looking for it.  :o)

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Offline Vandemolen3

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12803 on: 15/04/2011 00:43:39 »
Demo: Glad to hear that you might be benefiting from your new treatment!
 
For a week or so I have been feeling somewhat lousy, sort of what the second half of POIS used to feel like. I am surprised by this as I didn’t O or NE recently that I remember. Lately I have been having a lot of tension in my shoulders, and last week my upper back went out on me. Now, a week later and I am feeling drained and foggy. I am contemplating that perhaps my POIS is due to essentially a prostate problem. I have no negative sensations from that area, but I imagine that having inflammation down there would feel like this. Perhaps this possibility fits with Lauracostis’s hypothesis on how POIS might not be due to a semen allergy at all.  So I have ordered some prostate herbs to pop and perhaps it will have some effect, although they seem to have spotty performance at best from what I have read so far.

Now tonight I was looking in a prostate forum and came across this.
He says that his prostate problems persisted after the bacterial infection was gone, due to trauma that left the "pelvic floor" area weak and tense. He says that he overcame this condition from doing pelvic floor exercises and perhaps Thai massage. I’m thinking I’ll look into the exercises at least. I have always had “shy bladder syndrome”, so that might fit as well.  Anyway, I have to go figure out where my pelvic floor is, hope I don’t hurt my neck more looking for it.  :o)
I have this too. Tension in the shoulders and back. Stabs in the whole body. My urologist said that it could be an UTI with a virus. Once they didn't find anything in the urine. But the doctor gave me antiobiotics. This helped. And now I have it again. Today they checked my urine and they found a small amount of protein. If you had 1 UTI the chance is big that it will return. And with POIS that chance is bigger.

I had scans and a camera inside the prostate. In my case everything was perfect. In my case I think it's POIS-related.
« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 00:59:44 by Vandemolen3 »

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Offline Vandemolen3

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12804 on: 15/04/2011 00:50:22 »
Another symptom of an UTI is an itchy scrotum. And the p. pulls back and looks smaller. Just like it's cold or when are in a cold swimming pool. A retreat.

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Offline John21

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12805 on: 15/04/2011 01:51:46 »
Demo: Glad to hear that you might be benefiting from your new treatment!
 
For a week or so I have been feeling somewhat lousy, sort of what the second half of POIS used to feel like. I am surprised by this as I didn’t O or NE recently that I remember. Lately I have been having a lot of tension in my shoulders, and last week my upper back went out on me. Now, a week later and I am feeling drained and foggy. I am contemplating that perhaps my POIS is due to essentially a prostate problem. I have no negative sensations from that area, but I imagine that having inflammation down there would feel like this. Perhaps this possibility fits with Lauracostis’s hypothesis on how POIS might not be due to a semen allergy at all.  So I have ordered some prostate herbs to pop and perhaps it will have some effect, although they seem to have spotty performance at best from what I have read so far.

Now tonight I was looking in a prostate forum and came across this.
He says that his prostate problems persisted after the bacterial infection was gone, due to trauma that left the "pelvic floor" area weak and tense. He says that he overcame this condition from doing pelvic floor exercises and perhaps Thai massage. I’m thinking I’ll look into the exercises at least. I have always had “shy bladder syndrome”, so that might fit as well.  Anyway, I have to go figure out where my pelvic floor is, hope I don’t hurt my neck more looking for it.  :o)
I have this too. Tension in the shoulders and back. Stabs in the whole body. My urologist said that it could be an UTI with a virus. Once they didn't find anything in the urine. But the doctor gave me antiobiotics. This helped. And now I have it again. Today they checked my urine and they found a small amount of protein. If you had 1 UTI the chance is big that it will return. And with POIS that chance is bigger.

I had scans and a camera inside the prostate. In my case everything was perfect. In my case I think it's POIS-related.

About ten years ago when I was still bugging doctors about my POIS I discovered that I routinely had microscopic amounts of blood in the urine, and also protein. I have never known what having elevated protein in urine might indicate.  I was completely checked by a urologist and everything was fine, but I suppose that was a crude measure of his finger. They also looked up inside my urethra with the scope, it all seemed good.

It occurs to me that I have been sitting more recently at nights as I have been reading a book. I have read that simply sitting for long periods can put stress on the prostate area. I suppose even more so if the area is susceptible from prior trauma.  Maybe this is why I have been feeling so lousy this week.

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12806 on: 15/04/2011 03:38:43 »


Demo T/P Update


This morning, Day 3 of my T/P treatment, I woke up with a very significant increase in my libido. I wrote to my endocrinologist, wondering if it was just a coincidence or a placebo effect.

He replied that he is speculating  but it is possible that I am experiencing a side effect of the T/P treatment!
didnt you increase your testosterone, this might be why.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12807 on: 15/04/2011 04:21:22 »
Yes, CC, I did, temporarily, like I very often do on Day Zero (Tuesday, Lab Day). But I don't usually feel like I did this morning (2 days later).

Oh well, time will tell. Meanwhile, I hope this drowsy-dreamy feeling isn't from T/P, I napped a lot today.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12808 on: 15/04/2011 04:22:48 »

Demo: Glad to hear that you might be benefiting from your new treatment!


John, thank you!

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12809 on: 15/04/2011 06:43:37 »

I would eat my own excrement if it meant for a pois cure  [:P]


haha, I'll stop right there.


GoingCrazy, we all thank you for doing so!  [;D]


Are you sure?  I could say more...  [:-\] haha

I suggest you guys just give excedrin pm a try.  I had 5-6 O's yesterday and usually today is my worst but i feel incredibly normal and happy.  Although I did feel semi pois (yesterday), I'd say about < 25% yesterday. 

Also I've noticed my eyes turning blue and red, but I believe that's possibly from me rubbing them, because I feel some kind of inflammation behind my forehead... so I've stopped rubbing them and the feeling is getting better and my eyes are no longer looking like i am a walking dead.  This condition is weird.

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12810 on: 15/04/2011 06:48:06 »

GC, interesting. Sometimes I take medications sublingually for a speedier effect.

Not sure I'd want to try semen that way, though  [:)]


Demo, we all know that you've done it before.  [:o]

haha, I'll stop right there.


There is also chance that saliva neutralizes substances present in the ejaculate thus biasing the result hoped for


Carlitto, excellent point.


Uh-oohh

Would that mean that the test done by the nurses here might be skewed?





I mean, the process of just putting semen under your tongue doesn't seem too bad, at least compared to the guy who drank a whole load ([:D]LOL [:D]).  After all it's just different elements, protons and neutrons, you just have to look at it a different way.  Like eating certain foods, or worms, you just look at it and think oh my g*d its a worm, but really all it comes down to is the elements (not saying i eat worms ?).  So taking semen under your tongue doesn't seem too disgusting for me.

And true about the saliva, the sperm might only stay there for a few minutes at most right?
« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 06:50:45 by GoingCrazy »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12811 on: 15/04/2011 07:02:41 »

Demo T/P Update Day 3


POIS was greatly improved today. T/P? Placebo? Stay tuned  [:)]
« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 07:14:21 by demografx »

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12812 on: 15/04/2011 07:25:48 »


Demo T/P Update


This morning, Day 3 of my T/P treatment, I woke up with a very significant increase in my libido. I wrote to my endocrinologist, wondering if it was just a coincidence or a placebo effect.

He replied that he is speculating  but it is possible that I am experiencing a side effect of the T/P treatment!

Hi demo,
I'm also glad you got your sperm count before starting the treatment. That is definitely valuable information.
Good to hear your treatment might be benefiting you.

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Offline lauracostis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12813 on: 15/04/2011 08:23:42 »

Demo, even though your doctor said you have no sperm, try and see if you can get an actual count(number).  No sperm may just mean you barely have any sperm compared to a regular male.


OK, Laurac, you asked for it! [:)] Directly from The Lab:

Sperm Concentration         0.00000  mill/mL
         Total Sperm                    million
Total motile sperm             0.0000   million
Total progressive                       million

Ejaculate volume                 4.80    mL


I have more data if you want (seminal pH, sperm motility, etc.)
yeah, demo your doctor was not joking when he said you don't have any sperm.  I hope the symptoms of increase libido and sleepiness are not from the P/T combo, or if they are that they go away.  I am not sure if those numbers are really accurate down to 10 sperm/ml, but that's how accurate the test say it is.  How much relief do you think you are getting from the T alone if you were not taking the adderall with it.

I do not remember if I asked you this before but do you take Lipitor or any Statins for high cholesterol/LDL.

Also, you will not have to worry about impregnating any of Charlies goddesses with a sperm count like that. 

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Offline Vandemolen3

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12814 on: 15/04/2011 10:02:17 »
About ten years ago when I was still bugging doctors about my POIS I discovered that I routinely had microscopic amounts of blood in the urine, and also protein. I have never known what having elevated protein in urine might indicate.  I was completely checked by a urologist and everything was fine, but I suppose that was a crude measure of his finger. They also looked up inside my urethra with the scope, it all seemed good.

It occurs to me that I have been sitting more recently at nights as I have been reading a book. I have read that simply sitting for long periods can put stress on the prostate area. I suppose even more so if the area is susceptible from prior trauma.  Maybe this is why I have been feeling so lousy this week.
If there is a lot of protein in the urine this could mean that there is something wrong with the kidneys. But in my case it was a very small amount.
Maybe it's an idea for you for a new urine check.

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Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12815 on: 15/04/2011 12:31:15 »

......

Also, you will not have to worry about impregnating any of Charlies goddesses with a sperm count like that. 

Although there's probably someone there who'll say he'd have a lot more to worry about if he tried!! [;D] [;D]
How does Murphey do it??

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Offline scooby

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12816 on: 15/04/2011 12:58:12 »
Hi Demo,
Thanks for your encouraging reply about your children. That is really good. Im single and its just a worry trying to explain these things. I live in the UK and feel embarrassed to tell my doctor about POIS.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12817 on: 15/04/2011 18:18:53 »

I suggest you guys just give excedrin pm a try.


GoingCrazy, I do know that you mean well, your intentions are sincere, but please refrain from giving others POIS treatment advice. Even physicians do not do this over the Internet without seeing the patient. We are all different, and some people here have been desperate enough to try anything.

They might even try overdosing your suggestion.

There are also countless "silent readers" here who are not necessarily up to speed on everything we discuss.

GC, many thanks for your cooperation.

We value your participation here very much!

« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 18:31:24 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12818 on: 15/04/2011 18:27:15 »

Hi Demo,
Thanks for your encouraging reply about your children. That is really good. Im single and its just a worry trying to explain these things. I live in the UK and feel embarrassed to tell my doctor about POIS.


scooby, yes, it's sad that most doctors do not understand.

Do you know about Dr Goldmeier and Dr Dexter in London? They have both written about POIS, and they are listed  in our Collaborators' Database.
http://72.52.181.21/collaborator_list.php

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12819 on: 15/04/2011 19:11:02 »

Hi demo,
I'm also glad you got your sperm count before starting the treatment. That is definitely valuable information.
Good to hear your treatment might be benefiting you.


Many thanks, Animus! Hey, Animus, when your TV show comes on, maybe you could cash in and start Animus' Korner???

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12820 on: 15/04/2011 19:23:09 »

Demo T/P Update Day 4



I hope the symptoms of increase libido and sleepiness are not from the P/T combo, or if they are that they go away. 


Thanks, Laurac! Much better today. No libido increase(yesterday was Day Zero, though),  2 hours after T/P "libido++" is coming back a little...and sleepiness is much better! Not 100% better (I almost decided to quit T/P for this drowsiness!), but improved enough to the point of staying with T/P treatment for now. Wrote to endo about this.

edits above: in green.
« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 20:46:45 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12821 on: 15/04/2011 19:35:45 »

How much relief do you think you are getting from the T alone if you were not taking the adderall ritalin with it.


Testosterone is unquestionably the vast majority of my POIS relief. Hard to say exactly how much ritalin (insurance switch) contributes, but it helps my attention/focus both in-and-out-of-POIS. During POIS I increase that, along with T.


I do not remember if I asked you this before but do you take Lipitor® or any Statins for high cholesterol/LDL.


Yes. Previously Lipitor®, now Crestor® for LDL. Doc wants me on Niaspan® for HDL. I've been avoiding starting up Niaspan® because of crappy initial side effects, which I can counter with uncoated 325mg aspirin...wotta pain lol!

(impressed with my ® ? hee hee)


Also, you will not have to worry about impregnating any of Charlies goddesses with a sperm count like that. 


Laurac, impregnation is the least of my worries. Biggest problem is how do I keep pace with the goddesses' accustomed romps with The Winning (Duh) and Bitchin' Torpedo-Of-Truth Rock Star From Mars???

Remember, Defeat Is Not An Option!!!! [;D]
« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 20:48:41 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12822 on: 15/04/2011 19:41:29 »


The most amazing thing to me so far in this T/P experiment is how devastating POIS can be - even with no sperm!!! (Sorry, Dr Waldinger!). Wait, he did say SEMEN. [:)]

Even if the zero-sperm is a result of testosterone treatment, I am not 100% cured, I am 80%.

And - believe me - I have had some LULU 20%-days!!!!



« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 19:44:09 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12823 on: 15/04/2011 21:16:19 »

Demo T/P Update Day 4


I'm sorry guys, but if this drowsiness doesn't improve enough, I'll have to quit.
« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 21:17:59 by demografx »

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12824 on: 15/04/2011 21:49:06 »

I suggest you guys just give excedrin pm a try.


GoingCrazy, I do know that you mean well, your intentions are sincere, but please refrain from giving others POIS treatment advice. Even physicians do not do this over the Internet without seeing the patient. We are all different, and some people here have been desperate enough to try anything.

They might even try overdosing your suggestion.

There are also countless "silent readers" here who are not necessarily up to speed on everything we discuss.

GC, many thanks for your cooperation.

We value your participation here very much!



You want me to stop giving advice on what has helped me?  I understand the possibility of overdosing.  You can get information on any site about drugs. That's really their own responsibility.  I totally understand, but is there a way I can suggest a medication?

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12825 on: 15/04/2011 22:16:21 »

You want me to stop giving advice on what has helped me?  I understand the possibility of overdosing.  You can get information on any site about drugs. That's really their own responsibility.  I totally understand, but is there a way I can suggest a medication?


Just do what the rest of us do, which is to share our own personal experience. "This is what I do, and it's working for me." Not, "Here, try this."

And if you notice many of our posts, even when we say, "this is working for me", you'll notice a disclaimer: "but this is not meant as a suggestion for YOU."

To suggest a medication over the internet is generally not permitted ethically, even by physicians.

Thank you very much for understanding.
« Last Edit: 15/04/2011 22:46:25 by demografx »

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12826 on: 16/04/2011 00:14:27 »


The most amazing thing to me so far in this T/P experiment is how devastating POIS can be - even with no sperm!!! (Sorry, Dr Waldinger!). Wait, he did say SEMEN. [:)]

Even if the zero-sperm is a result of testosterone treatment, I am not 100% cured, I am 80%.

And - believe me - I have had some LULU 20%-days!!!!





My experience also confirms that same observation. I was surprised also. Because after I had the oriectomy I could not produce sperm, yet I still had pretty much the same amount of ejaculate. And I still had significant POIS. It lessened the POIS, but was not away completely. For me it was more like 20% better instead of 80% though.

Now that I think of it, maybe more of us should get our semen analyzed if possible. If one can afford it. Just to have a "baseline" measurement to compare to later. What do you think?

That in addition to getting the full hormonal analysis too!  [:)]

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12827 on: 16/04/2011 00:19:08 »

Demo T/P Update Day 4


I'm sorry guys, but if this drowsiness doesn't improve enough, I'll have to quit.

I hope it improves, demo!!
You're doing valuable research for all of us! Can we send you some extra strength coffee? [:)]

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12828 on: 16/04/2011 00:46:37 »
Haha, thanks, Animus, but I beatcha to it!

I'm ok now, it was periodic sluggishness (on top of my NORMAL sluggishness lol), and it's been getting better.

Your encouragement is super-appreciated. I can't even BEGIN to fathom how you made it through all your nightmare decisions without a forum like this!

And you - as a POIS Trailblazer - (Daveman, where's his medal already?????) don't hold a grudge against us (I would have!) for all of us  finding easier methods, or at least trying to!

Please take that as a sincere compliment!! (Albeit clumsily worded!)
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 00:53:54 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12829 on: 16/04/2011 01:28:17 »

Hi Demo,
Thanks for your encouraging reply about your children [and sperm production]. That is really good. Im single and its just a worry trying to explain these things. I live in the UK and feel embarrassed to tell my doctor about POIS.


Scooby, I just spoke with my endocrinologist and he says that even if you experience problems producing sperm - for whatever reason - there are methods available for many patients to re-stimulate sperm production.
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 01:34:51 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12830 on: 16/04/2011 01:40:08 »

The most amazing thing to me so far in this T/P experiment is how devastating POIS can be - even with no sperm!!! (Sorry, Dr Waldinger!). Wait, he did say SEMEN. [:)]

Even if the zero-sperm is a result of testosterone treatment, I am not 100% cured, I am 80%.

And - believe me - I have had some LULU 20%-days!!!!



My experience also confirms that same observation. I was surprised also. Because after I had the oriectomy I could not produce sperm, yet I still had pretty much the same amount of ejaculate. And I still had significant POIS. It lessened the POIS, but was not away completely. For me it was more like 20% better instead of 80% though.

Now that I think of it, maybe more of us should get our semen analyzed if possible. If one can afford it. Just to have a "baseline" measurement to compare to later. What do you think?

That in addition to getting the full hormonal analysis too!  [:)]


Absolutely agreed, Animus!

Especially after scooby's posted concern. (Thank you, scooby, your post will help others, I'm sure).

My Semen Analysis was $175. Insurance rarely covers it. But for POISers, might be worth investigating.


Just to have a "baseline" [Semen Analysis] measurement to compare to later.


Once again, absolutely agreed. I just asked my endocrinologist if my testosterone treatment is the "culprit" in my no-sperm-count. He said we'll never know.

But, he said that if I did a "baseline" Semen Analysis measurement BEFORE I started testosterone therapy....we would know!!
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 01:41:49 by demografx »

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12831 on: 16/04/2011 04:22:34 »

You want me to stop giving advice on what has helped me?  I understand the possibility of overdosing.  You can get information on any site about drugs. That's really their own responsibility.  I totally understand, but is there a way I can suggest a medication?


Just do what the rest of us do, which is to share our own personal experience. "This is what I do, and it's working for me." Not, "Here, try this."

And if you notice many of our posts, even when we say, "this is working for me", you'll notice a disclaimer: "but this is not meant as a suggestion for YOU."

To suggest a medication over the internet is generally not permitted ethically, even by physicians.

Thank you very much for understanding.

no problem

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Offline Vandemolen3

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12832 on: 16/04/2011 10:01:54 »


The most amazing thing to me so far in this T/P experiment is how devastating POIS can be - even with no sperm!!! (Sorry, Dr Waldinger!). Wait, he did say SEMEN. [:)]

Even if the zero-sperm is a result of testosterone treatment, I am not 100% cured, I am 80%.

And - believe me - I have had some LULU 20%-days!!!!

Maybe it's not only a semen allergy but also an allergy for the other liquids after an ejaculation.
Take care.

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Offline cab771

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12833 on: 16/04/2011 13:53:09 »
The day one of us a a prostate cancer and he has his prostate removed in a conservative way so that he can still experience erections and orgasm, we will no fore sure if POIS is a semen allergy or not.

By the way, I produce a lot of testosterone and semem, making POIS even harder to control. High testosterone is only interesting if it is exogenous and therefore can lower semen production, or at least sperm count.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12834 on: 16/04/2011 16:33:56 »

Demo T/P Update Day 5


I woke up nauseous, tired, with a strange libidinous-sensation, so I'm not taking norethindrone (the P in T/P) today any more. That's all for now with this experiment.
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 19:32:12 by demografx »

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Offline alky

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12835 on: 16/04/2011 19:01:52 »
Hello guys. So the conclusion is that POIS is not an allergy to sperm ? i personally presumed that from the beginning because i have POIS symptoms only from arousal which gets me back

to neurotransmitter and hormonal imbalance and not any type of allergy. What do u think ?

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12836 on: 16/04/2011 19:20:05 »

So the conclusion is that POIS is not an allergy to sperm?


Where on earth did THAT conclusion come from?

edit - sorry if my initial reaction came across harshly, see follow up posts.
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 20:58:48 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12837 on: 16/04/2011 19:26:50 »


The most amazing thing to me so far in this T/P experiment is how devastating POIS can be - even with no sperm!!! (Sorry, Dr Waldinger!). Wait, he did say SEMEN. [:)]

Even if the zero-sperm is a result of testosterone treatment, I am not 100% cured, I am 80%.

And - believe me - I have had some LULU 20%-days!!!!



Maybe it's not only a semen allergy but also an allergy for the other liquids after an ejaculation.


Semen includes non-sperm liquids. Are you suggesting liquids that are NOT semen?

Perhaps you meant to write, "Maybe it's not only a semen sperm allergy but also an allergy for the other liquids after an ejaculation."
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 20:39:50 by demografx »

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12838 on: 16/04/2011 19:35:55 »

The P/T contraceptive treatment, if it works may have the potential for working by alternate actions than just removing the sperm from our bodies(this is an alternate hypothesis to just the regular sperm allergy theory, and was the primary reason I thought of using P/T as a treatment).  It will stop a myriad of hormones that are associated with the production of sperm.  I believe that there is a possibility that these hormones are causing the reaction in our bodies; possibly something like "gonadotropin releasing hormone". these hormones are released after ejaculation to replace the sperm, I also believe that some of these hormones are preemptively released in response to arousal and stimulation in preparation of what the body believes will end in sperm loss to jump start the process of sperm production before ejaculation happens. 
Don't worry, if the P/T contraceptive works, there are a number of different possibilities why it is working besides just removing the sperm for sperm allergies. 
Another possible theory is based on the fact that both progesterone and testosterone can suppress the immune system.  Progesterone is one of the possible hormones in pregnancy that some believe is responsible for the immune system not attacking the fetus as a foreign invader in the body during gestation.  I am doing an obstetrics rotation right now and I have been told that autoimmune disease usually significantly improve during pregnancy and then return to normal afterward.
The P/T contraceptive is going to cover a bunch of bases at once.



Worth repeating!

I think Lauracostis could be on to something really interesting here. Laura, it's good to have another scientific mind in on the discussion!
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 19:37:33 by Animus »

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12839 on: 16/04/2011 19:41:13 »

Demo T/P Update Day 5


I woke up nauseous, tired, with a strange libidinous-sensation, so I'm not taking norethindrone (the P in T/P) today any more. That's all for now with this experiment.

Bummer. Sorry to hear that. But totally understandable.
Wondering if in those 5 days that you were on it, did it prevent any POIS from occurring? (did you experience an "O" while you were on it?)

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12840 on: 16/04/2011 19:54:50 »

So the conclusion is that POIS is not an allergy to sperm?


Where on earth did THAT conclusion come from?

We have to remember that sperm is just one small (volumetrically) component of semen. And it looks so far like at least 2 people who stopped sperm production still did suffer from POIS after ejaculation. It's hard to draw any solid conclusion from just 2 people, but it would point to the conclusion that the substance of sperm by itself does not cause all of the POIS symptoms. I think that's as far as we can conclude! Does anyone agree with that?

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Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12841 on: 16/04/2011 19:55:56 »
Hello guys. So the conclusion is that POIS is not an allergy to sperm ? i personally presumed that from the beginning because i have POIS symptoms only from arousal which gets me back

to neurotransmitter and hormonal imbalance and not any type of allergy. What do u think ?

We're at a very crucuial point here, and it's not as easy as saying that it IS or it ISN'T sperm allergy. Very, very far from it. Yet, we're probably closer than ever to some definitve answers.

We've had several very casual tests in the last month or so. What have they pointed to? Can anyone say? Tests have to be more than casual to come to reasonable conclusions. Demo is one actor with HIS particular situation. Habibou and  Hurray and Vandemolen3 are others. Each with their own situationas and each with their different results.

We see from Demo's tests, that thank GOD pre-test sperm levels were taken, but pre-TRT tests would have also given MUCH information. We see from Habibou and Hurray that there are varying results from Silodosin, but baselines and controls are very, very weak. How can we evaluate the results?

I'm not saying that we are wasting our time. These guys have made serious moves and sacrifices that others can't or don't want to make, and their efforts are very much appreciated, and even though the data isn't conclusive, it can be added to the growing database, where eventually conclusions may be able to be made.

But if we want to make real headway, we need to be responsible with the tests, so that those who make the effort, don't go out of their way for nothing, so that we can advance in the solution of the POIS problem.

We have seen that we are in a frontier, where even the MOST advanced of the experts isn't all that clear.

Who else but US is there?


Hey BTW Demo, you have to have an "O" today! For the good of the community!

We won';t watch!


How does Murphey do it??

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12842 on: 16/04/2011 19:57:07 »


The most amazing thing to me so far in this T/P experiment is how devastating POIS can be - even with no sperm!!! (Sorry, Dr Waldinger!). Wait, he did say SEMEN. [:)]

Even if the zero-sperm is a result of testosterone treatment, I am not 100% cured, I am 80%.

And - believe me - I have had some LULU 20%-days!!!!

Maybe it's not only a semen allergy but also an allergy for the other liquids after an ejaculation.


Semen includes non-sperm liquids. Are you suggesting liquids that are NOT semen?
semen is the name given to all the liquids but the seminal glands produces it own liquids separate from all the other glands involved in ejaculation.
I think there a about four sources of liquid in semen.

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12843 on: 16/04/2011 20:09:12 »
Hello guys. So the conclusion is that POIS is not an allergy to sperm ? i personally presumed that from the beginning because i have POIS symptoms only from arousal which gets me back

to neurotransmitter and hormonal imbalance and not any type of allergy. What do u think ?

We're at a very crucuial point here, and it's not as easy as saying that it IS or it ISN'T sperm allergy. Very, very far from it. Yet, we're probably closer than ever to some definitve answers.

We've had several very casual tests in the last month or so. What have they pointed to? Can anyone say? Tests have to be more than casual to come to reasonable conclusions. Demo is one actor with HIS particular situation. Habibou and  Hurray and Vandemolen3 are others. Each with their own situationas and each with their different results.

We see from Demo's tests, that thank GOD pre-test sperm levels were taken, but pre-TRT tests would have also given MUCH information. We see from Habibou and Hurray that there are varying results from Silodosin, but baselines and controls are very, very weak. How can we evaluate the results?

I'm not saying that we are wasting our time. These guys have made serious moves and sacrifices that others can't or don't want to make, and their efforts are very much appreciated, and even though the data isn't conclusive, it can be added to the growing database, where eventually conclusions may be able to be made.

But if we want to make real headway, we need to be responsible with the tests, so that those who make the effort, don't go out of their way for nothing, so that we can advance in the solution of the POIS problem.

We have seen that we are in a frontier, where even the MOST advanced of the experts isn't all that clear.

Who else but US is there?


Hey BTW Demo, you have to have an "O" today! For the good of the community!

We won';t watch!




Hi dave, I agree. It has been an eventful month, and we are closer to some answers. We need to try to document? or take note of the effects of the silodosin, T/P experiments. I guess none of these things has been 100% successful, but they have shed light on some things/ been partially successful. They've been very useful.
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 20:12:25 by Animus »

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12844 on: 16/04/2011 20:13:23 »
The day one of us a a prostate cancer and he has his prostate removed in a conservative way so that he can still experience erections and orgasm, we will no fore sure if POIS is a semen allergy or not.

By the way, I produce a lot of testosterone and semem, making POIS even harder to control. High testosterone is only interesting if it is exogenous and therefore can lower semen production, or at least sperm count.

I have an idea, sperm washing, it separates sperm from semen. ( i just need to find out accuracy i will prolly do that next week).
i hope to do intradermal test with sample of sperm(with little semen) and semen(with little sperm) and see which one i react to.

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Offline Animus

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12845 on: 16/04/2011 20:25:54 »
Haha, thanks, Animus, but I beatcha to it!

I'm ok now, it was periodic sluggishness (on top of my NORMAL sluggishness lol), and it's been getting better.

Your encouragement is super-appreciated. I can't even BEGIN to fathom how you made it through all your nightmare decisions without a forum like this!

And you - as a POIS Trailblazer - (Daveman, where's his medal already?????) don't hold a grudge against us (I would have!) for all of us  finding easier methods, or at least trying to!

Please take that as a sincere compliment!! (Albeit clumsily worded!)

Thanks, demo! [:D]
I really don't hold any grudge here! I think I hold some grudges against doctors unfortunately, and that gets in the way sometimes.
I had to go solo to follow my hypothesis. Enough about me.
« Last Edit: 17/04/2011 01:44:22 by Animus »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12846 on: 16/04/2011 21:05:07 »

So the conclusion is that POIS is not an allergy to sperm?


Where on earth did THAT conclusion come from?

edit - sorry if my initial reaction came across harshly, see follow up posts.



We have to remember that sperm is just one small (volumetrically) component of semen. And it looks so far like at least 2 people who stopped sperm production still did suffer from POIS after ejaculation. It's hard to draw any solid conclusion from just 2 people, but it would point to the conclusion that the substance of sperm by itself does not cause all of the POIS symptoms. I think that's as far as we can conclude! Does anyone agree with that?


Yes. Well put.
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 21:06:50 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12847 on: 16/04/2011 21:31:38 »

Hello guys. So the conclusion is that POIS is not an allergy to sperm ? i personally presumed that from the beginning because i have POIS symptoms only from arousal which gets me back

to neurotransmitter and hormonal imbalance and not any type of allergy. What do u think ?


We're at a very crucuial point here, and it's not as easy as saying that it IS or it ISN'T sperm allergy. Very, very far from it. Yet, we're probably closer than ever to some definitve answers.

We've had several very casual tests in the last month or so. What have they pointed to? Can anyone say? Tests have to be more than casual to come to reasonable conclusions. Demo is one actor with HIS particular situation. Habibou and  Hurray and Vandemolen3 are others. Each with their own situationas and each with their different results.

We see from Demo's tests, that thank GOD pre-test sperm levels were taken, but pre-TRT tests would have also given MUCH information. We see from Habibou and Hurray that there are varying results from Silodosin, but baselines and controls are very, very weak. How can we evaluate the results?

I'm not saying that we are wasting our time. These guys have made serious moves and sacrifices that others can't or don't want to make, and their efforts are very much appreciated, and even though the data isn't conclusive, it can be added to the growing database, where eventually conclusions may be able to be made.

But if we want to make real headway, we need to be responsible with the tests, so that those who make the effort, don't go out of their way for nothing, so that we can advance in the solution of the POIS problem.

We have seen that we are in a frontier, where even the MOST advanced of the experts isn't all that clear.

Who else but US is there?



Daveman, really excellent State Of The State summation! Thank you.
« Last Edit: 16/04/2011 21:40:50 by demografx »

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Offline lauracostis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12848 on: 16/04/2011 21:48:38 »

Demo T/P Update Day 5


I woke up nauseous, tired, with a strange libidinous-sensation, so I'm not taking norethindrone (the P in T/P) today any more. That's all for now with this experiment.

Bummer. Sorry to hear that. But totally understandable.
Wondering if in those 5 days that you were on it, did it prevent any POIS from occurring? (did you experience an "O" while you were on it?)
That is too bad that the side effects were too much for you, at least you gave it a proper try.  I believe Lime juice was able to tolerate progesterone, but he was not taking T with it and also other prescription medications as far as I know.  As far as I know in the studies about the P/T contraceptive there were only mild side effects in some people.  So just because Demo's body does not like the addition of progesterone, does not mean that others cannot tolerate it. 

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #12849 on: 17/04/2011 00:53:23 »

Demo T/P Update Day 5

I woke up nauseous, tired, with a strange libidinous-sensation, so I'm not taking norethindrone (the P in T/P) today any more. That's all for now with this experiment.


As far as I know in the studies about the P/T contraceptive there were only mild side effects in some people.  So just because Demo's body does not like the addition of progesterone, does not mean that others cannot tolerate it.


Laurac, thank you very much, that REALLY needed pointing out!

Also, I've been on a  - - - - load  of medications since my open heart surgery a year ago, and I have had side effect issues since then.

So please, everyone, don't get discouraged. In fact I am still VERY enthused about the terrific potential of T/P (or is it P/T? [:)] ) - especially after reading Laurac's post about the myriad possibilities of this treatment!
« Last Edit: 17/04/2011 00:57:14 by demografx »