Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)

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Offline Тимати

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17550 on: 07/01/2013 16:49:04 »
Gbolduev, Thanks what are you here , Эмин .
« Last Edit: 07/01/2013 16:50:54 by Тимати »

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17551 on: 07/01/2013 17:59:15 »
Hello, I am new to this forum, but I have been following it  for sometime.   I  tend to agree with  some people here and I  am 100% sure that  high histamine levels are the  cause of the  problem. Now, the big  question  is how you deal with it. Trust me, nothing will help you  on a longer term basis  if you are going to look for a magic pill or  a shot of  adrenaline or  a calcium blocker( by the way worst thing you can do). This is systematic  problem of your body.  Almost in 90% of all cases   this is  a problem related to copper imbalance.  Copper deficiency , which can be caused by  many factors  will lead to  increase in  Ferritin ( if you are a male  I am very sure your ferritin level  is  higher than normal), which  will cause inflammation and higher histamine.  You will have low  manganese which in turn will lower your dopamine levels.  High copper  low histamine , low copper  high histamine.   Low adrenals = low ceruplasmin = low copper bound and high  biounavailable or toxic copper, which in turn causes  hyper thyrodism and  lowers adrenal even more.    You need to take  manganese 30 mg a day ,  50 mg zinc  and 3 mg  copper,  also 1gr  vitamin  C, B5.   It will automatically  fix your  na/k ratio in your cell and take care of calcium  problem. Also  buy  open  water.  It is the water with the  different angle in the molecule and that will take care of your candida problems , since  no copper  say hello to candida.


Best  Regards, 
Herman Bolduev

Here is your original post. Are you able to link us to any scientific sources which would help verify these claims? I'd like to see a source to back up your claim that copper deficiency leads to an increase in Ferritin and that increased ferritin causes higher histamine levels.

You say that low ceruplasmin leads to low bound copper and high bio-unavailable toxic copper. Can you link a scientific source that shows evidence to support that taking vitamins and supplements can correct this?
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17552 on: 07/01/2013 19:15:47 »
Vincent M,

I will  only respond to blood work from now on.  Although I agree what Daniel said about irritability  and understanding. I  am not going to engage in  online research at this time. Sorry.

P.S   from what I am seeing in the blood work.    Most people  are  with low ceruplasmin,  some people  are with high ferritin/
The  major  imbalances seen ,   low dopamine/ serotonin  ratio.    High RT3 ratio which points to copper overload.


   

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17553 on: 07/01/2013 19:22:31 »
It would be nice if we could all see these blood tests. It's unfortunate that you are unable to back up your claims with scientific evidence.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17554 on: 07/01/2013 19:27:10 »
I simply dont have time now to  wonder around  the internet and  collect   as you say facts to things that are obvious to me.    It is like  proving  that 2+2=4  and I mean to  disrespect.

On the Russian POIS site, we   have created  a separate topic where everyone posts their tests.( so  after the 15th you would  see a lot of tests there)   I dont know if it is possible to do  here.

Thanks



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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17555 on: 07/01/2013 19:29:12 »
I dont understand why this was not done here a long time ago..  750 cures  and no blood work to compare. 

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17556 on: 07/01/2013 19:36:46 »
You don't have time to find sources for facts that you see as obvious and yet you still have time to repeatedly post here about how you know so much more about POIS than us. That is too bad.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17557 on: 07/01/2013 20:21:14 »
I am not  trying to compete with you, dude.   Dont post to me.

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17558 on: 07/01/2013 20:32:44 »
We allowed to post here if we keep it scientific. Keeping it scientific means providing evidence.
If you did not just come up with this theory out of nowhere then you should past evidence you can easily provide.
nobody is competing or trying to attack you, we just want evidence.


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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17559 on: 07/01/2013 20:35:14 »
Hi,

An update after 2 and half months of after starting Calcium channel blocker.  Presently I can say it is best medicine I found for my POIS say 60% of my POIS depth has been cured now.  Further, now after orgasm I am not getting any POIS effects, rather after stress, travelling, nightout i am getting POIS symptoms. 

Disadvantage:  Increased 8 kg in 2 months.  Doctors telling to continue for next four months.  But decided to quit as my weight reached 100.  Will update the more updates.  Soon.

@ German:  I thankful for your help in this site.  Pl explain, how calcium channel blocker i.e. fluneraize helps me in reducing the depth of my POIS.  further, I already done all the tests prescribed by you and I will get the result on 10th of this month.  I will mail you all my results. 

Finally thanking for this forum. 


good to here your improvements. am interested in trying ccb but am already pretty big.  Did you attempt to exercise while you use ccb inorde to curb weight gain. Did you get any serious fatigue.

POis caused by stress, how long did they last.

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Offline gabin

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17560 on: 07/01/2013 21:27:41 »
You don't have time to find sources for facts that you see as obvious and yet you still have time to repeatedly post here about how you know so much more about POIS than us. That is too bad.
He's not trying to sell you anything, he's not a proselytiser. Initially I was also sceptical about the rationale of his postings, but since it's not profit driven and not insane (I mean "psychological" cures), then why do you attack him? All he asks you about is a bunch of lab tests, it's absolutely voluntary not to provide them. And besides that, since you advertise yourself as a much deeper insider of POIS subject, can you provide some scientific papers or books explaining POIS? No, since there is none (except for Waldinger's papers, but it's more of an intro description). So please calm down and just ignore his posts if they touch you so deeply.

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Offline gabin

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17561 on: 07/01/2013 21:31:17 »
We allowed to post here if we keep it scientific. Keeping it scientific means providing evidence.
If you did not just come up with this theory out of nowhere then you should past evidence you can easily provide.
nobody is competing or trying to attack you, we just want evidence.
Imagine you self-cured. How can you provide any scientific evidence at all? There's no official ongoing research, NORD is about it. But still that doesn't eliminate an opportunity to find a cure, does it?

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Offline Chaos

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17562 on: 08/01/2013 02:23:48 »
1) Welcome Sohail! We're very happy that you found this forum. :) We really think and hope 2013 is the year that we can finally get some good research and solve this POIS problem once and for all!
Thank U. ;D i hope 2.


Hi,
We had a big discussion about histamine receptors over on poiscenter.
There's some stuff here http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=795.30.
I think it's best not to post about new theories over there (as it's against the rules) but you could read the posts if you want. The h3 idea isn't new. H3 blockers aren't widely available. Alternatives are mast cell stabilisers.

Just so you know, everyone releases histamine when there's an erection. When h2 blockers are given to someone, it impedes them getting an erection.
That doesn't mean there's not an immunological reaction going on here but the question is why are POIS sufferers different rather than why do POIS sufferers have histamine release upon an O.
Hi, Thanks 4 the link. I read a couple of posts there.
Yes clobenpropit is one of them and sadly that's not available(like other h3 A.H.). I take Lorazepam if i get extremely depressed. but i usually only take loratadine because lorazepam is harmful.
I'm not sure if i understand your view. Histamine has many functions in the body. Pois is not related to erection/histamine realese for erection. I don't get depressed or numb because of erection. our symptoms seems like an allergy(allergy to seminal fluid). Probably histamine release for erection is local and little. But allergy to seminal fluid releases lots of histamine in whole body.
Allergy theory is not new. I'm not sure but I remember that was Dr waldinger's theory.  anyway
It seems there are different kinds of pois. Probably...
« Last Edit: 08/01/2013 04:21:08 by Chaos »

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Offline Chaos

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17563 on: 08/01/2013 02:28:51 »
I'm 21 and still there is no beard on my cheeks. is that related to POIS?

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Offline GDRTW

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17564 on: 08/01/2013 05:47:23 »
Great to see all this new information coming out. A couple of power plays from me as my biggest issue is with sensitivity to light. Feels like a very weak retina that makes me lethargic and very easily tired. I found Huperzine to be a big help and I have also discovered that passionfruit seeds (need to be bitten and chewed on) can help alleviate as well. I am in Taiwan where teas are readily available around the corner. I go for a passionfruit green tea in times of need.

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Offline acronym

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17565 on: 08/01/2013 09:54:34 »
"Most people  are  with low ceruplasmin,  some people  are with high ferritin/ The  major  imbalances seen ,   low dopamine/ serotonin  ratio.    High RT3 ratio which points to copper overload."
Gbolduev...so low ceruplasmin. means no carrier for copper in the body...and you say copper overload. why because it accumulates in the wrong places? With low ceruplasmin I thought this would result in copper deficiency symptoms, not copper overload. If any of us have low ceruplasmin, then taking extra copper in a supplement would be a waste wouldn't it because it is not going to get picked up.
I have been taking fairly high doses of zinc for a number of years as part of a treatment for Pyroluria. I wonder if I have screwed up my Cu levels because of this. I had hair mineral test a number of years ago (prior to the Pyroluria diagnosis) and most metals showed up in the normal range except titanium.

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Offline Chaos

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17566 on: 08/01/2013 10:03:34 »
@kurtosis I'm so happy I found you're an INTJ. I'm really interested in personality psychology stuff.
I'm an INTP-big5:RLUAI-enneagram:5.
Do you think asking other members to take personality test is a good idea?
I'm really curious if there is any correlation between personality type and pois.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17567 on: 08/01/2013 10:04:19 »
ACRONYМ,

What happened to me  that I was stressed  and  for some stupid reason I started to take zinc also, and took it for a while.   that is when my Pois started.    it sped my  thyroid  relative to  adrenal gland, and my  dopamine which is  associated with adrenal  became  lower than   serotonin   which was associated with  thyroid.    Basically the gap between  dopamine and serotonin increased//   To tell you the truth from the blood work that I  saw , this is the imbalance  in 90% cases/    So the cure for this imbalance  is to  lower your thyroid, and at the  same time increase your methylation.

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Offline kurtosis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17568 on: 08/01/2013 10:53:59 »
@kurtosis I'm so happy I found you're an INTJ. I'm really interested in personality psychology stuff.
I'm an INTP-big5:RLUAI-enneagram:5.
Do you think asking other members to take personality test is a good idea?
I'm really curious if there is any correlation between personality type and pois.
Daveman on poiscenter was also an INTJ. Not sure about the others.
Several POIS sufferers experience POIS symptoms upon erection. Histamine release on orgasm is greater. In response to Vincent M, H1 do not appear to be responsible for maintaining an erection. The h2 receptors in the penis are effected but histamine levels increase. Arguably not a problem for most people but it makes me itchy, sneezy and brings about something that feels like a headache that never quite develops.
See http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7850330
for a description of histamine's role in sexual function.
Quote
These results indicate that histamine may play a role in human penile erection. The erection-promoting action of histamine is probably due to H2 receptor activation, although another histamine receptor, possibly H3, also seems to be involved. This study suggests that histamine could be a valuable tool in the diagnosis of erectile dysfunction.
The results appear conclusive but scientists are supposed to be cautious in what they say. This is generally considered a good thing :)
There are other articles on ncbi about this also.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3133686

Quote
While the H2 antagonists do not always have strong behavioural effects when administered peripherally, there is evidence that cimetidine has a depressant effect on sexual function
Women have been known to get a "sex flush" reaction following an orgasm and some of them experience sneezing and mild symptoms associated with an allergic reaction. I spoke with my doctor, an allergist, about this and she said that it was not thought to be an allergy but rather a result of increased histamine levels.
It's an interesting phenomenon. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flushing_(physiology)#Sex_flush
but doesn't lead to headaches or confusion in most sufferers.

There are some reports of people developing POIS like symptoms following taking propecia. I think this was discussed on poiscenter but I haven't time to look it up now.

One reason the flush might lead to confusion and nausea is an overloaded calcium channel. As Yasko is fond of saying "glutamate is the gun and calcium is the trigger" when discussing excitotoxins and seizures in autistic kids.
http://www.dramyyasko.com/resources/autism-pathways-to-recovery/chapter-4/
But you don't have to trust Yasko on this. She's just collecting a "well known" set of facts about glutamate and Ca ion interaction. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glutamate_receptor#Excitotoxicity

Quote
Overstimulation of glutamate receptors causes neurodegeneration and neuronal damage through a process called excitotoxicity. Excessive glutamate, or excitotoxins acting on the same glutamate receptors, overactivate glutamate receptors (specifically NMDARs), causing high levels of calcium ions (Ca2+) to influx into the postsynaptic cell.[34]
High Ca2+ concentrations activate a cascade of cell degradation processes involving proteases, lipases, nitric oxide synthase, and a number of enzymes that damage cell structures often to the point of cell death.[35] Ingestion of or exposure to excitotoxins that act on glutamate receptors can induce excitotoxicity and cause toxic effects on the central nervous system.[36] This becomes a problem for cells, as it feeds into a cycle of positive feedback cell death.

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Offline FinalPanic

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17569 on: 08/01/2013 14:33:35 »
ACRONYМ,

What happened to me  that I was stressed  and  for some stupid reason I started to take zinc also, and took it for a while.   that is when my Pois started.    it sped my  thyroid  relative to  adrenal gland, and my  dopamine which is  associated with adrenal  became  lower than   serotonin   which was associated with  thyroid.    Basically the gap between  dopamine and serotonin increased//   To tell you the truth from the blood work that I  saw , this is the imbalance  in 90% cases/    So the cure for this imbalance  is to  lower your thyroid, and at the  same time increase your methylation.
Hi Gbolduev - how do you go about re-balancing these factors - this is of interest to me, thank you. My POIS started over 30 years ago after a bout of stress and terrible insomnia and anxiety - it all just kicked off and the condition has stayed with me ever since, lasting anything from two days to two weeks after O.

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17570 on: 08/01/2013 15:54:13 »
In response to Vincent M, H1 do not appear to be responsible for maintaining an erection. The h2 receptors in the penis are effected but histamine levels increase. Arguably not a problem for most people but it makes me itchy, sneezy and brings about something that feels like a headache that never quite develops.
See http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7850330
for a description of histamine's role in sexual function.
Quote
These results indicate that histamine may play a role in human penile erection. The erection-promoting action of histamine is probably due to H2 receptor activation, although another histamine receptor, possibly H3, also seems to be involved. This study suggests that histamine could be a valuable tool in the diagnosis of erectile dysfunction.
The results appear conclusive but scientists are supposed to be cautious in what they say. This is generally considered a good thing :)
There are other articles on ncbi about this also.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3133686

Quote
While the H2 antagonists do not always have strong behavioural effects when administered peripherally, there is evidence that cimetidine has a depressant effect on sexual function

Interesting. I have taken ranitidine, an H2 receptor inverse agonist, with no effect on my erections. Perhaps I'd need something for the H3 receptor as well.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline nathan123

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17571 on: 08/01/2013 16:10:48 »
@ German:  I have one interesting factor for my POIS.  What I always observe is if I take new medicine for the first time, it will decreae the POIS symtoms.  Later this will not works for reducing the POIS pain.  I experienced this for SSRI, Sodium tablet, all herbal (around 10 to 15 varities) and other medicines.  What is the reason behind this.  We are not able to find the solution to this problem.  Please clarify.
Further I will get my test results after 20th.  In my town some of the test you mentioned is not avialble and I required to go to another big city for this and I am planning to go on 15th.  On 20th I will update all the test you require. 

thanks for the your help. 
with regards,

Nathan.


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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17572 on: 08/01/2013 16:37:55 »
Nathan, 

it is hard to say ,  since you were taking all kind of  stuff...but I can  guess, that   when you take  something  to increase  serotonin  lets say ,  then it  spikes and then crashes, and the actual effect might be  the decrease,  but if you  take it all the time , may be  it  starts  building up , and thus your ratio stays  impaired, I mean  dopamine serotonin  ratio.  That is why  when you smoke all the time and then quit  you find yourself with really  low serotonin  levels , since smoking  was providing  constant serotonin boost and  the methylation of  serotonin  adjusted.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17573 on: 08/01/2013 16:46:06 »
To me , lets say with  the niacin,   it releases serotonin in the flush,  so  the actual ratio  might  go up , I mean  dopamine  to serotonin , since  niacin has released some of  the serotonin.  after orgasm , your dopamine   goes up and then crashes,  and serotonin  goes up.  So  if you have   low  dopamine / serotonin ratio  from the getgo, I mean before the orgasm,  then after naicin   it goes up   and then  after orgasm  becomes normal, that is why may be some people feel normal after naicin.   Since the  ration of dopamine and serotonin   tells you  about the state,  either  infection or inflammation..   high  or low  is bad.

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Offline kurtosis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17574 on: 08/01/2013 17:19:57 »
In response to Vincent M, H1 do not appear to be responsible for maintaining an erection. The h2 receptors in the penis are effected but histamine levels increase. Arguably not a problem for most people but it makes me itchy, sneezy and brings about something that feels like a headache that never quite develops.
See http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7850330
for a description of histamine's role in sexual function.
Quote
These results indicate that histamine may play a role in human penile erection. The erection-promoting action of histamine is probably due to H2 receptor activation, although another histamine receptor, possibly H3, also seems to be involved. This study suggests that histamine could be a valuable tool in the diagnosis of erectile dysfunction.
The results appear conclusive but scientists are supposed to be cautious in what they say. This is generally considered a good thing :)
There are other articles on ncbi about this also.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3133686

Quote
While the H2 antagonists do not always have strong behavioural effects when administered peripherally, there is evidence that cimetidine has a depressant effect on sexual function

Interesting. I have taken ranitidine, an H2 receptor inverse agonist, with no effect on my erections. Perhaps I'd need something for the H3 receptor as well.

The theory is that those people with less active mast cells may need less rantidine to reduce libido.  It is a noted side effect of the drug but it doesn't appear to affect everyone & I think the reason is base histamine levels.
http://www.drugs.com/sfx/ranitidine-side-effects.html
h3 receptor inverse agonists are viewed as a potential treatment for ADHD as they may promote attention. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciproxifan
Again, this is all very new. The classic ADHD drugs are still amphetamines and it's possible that there will be new insights into the role of mast cells and histamine levels in attention related disorders. Similar to those anecdotal reports of kids with autism being more likely to suffer from allergies.
Stuff is related but figuring out how is the problem. I don't know how long it will take medical researchers to integrate their knowledge but a condition like POIS is interesting as it appears to have symptoms from multiple physiological systems which are viewed as different specialities now. I.e. immunology, psychiatry, neurology and endocrinology. So in one respect, solving POIS may yield new light on other illnesses but in another it appears to be a rare disease with limited economic value from curing it...

Great value to us of course :D

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17575 on: 08/01/2013 17:20:31 »
so basiciallly    in    the normal POIS,   thyroid  makes your  adrenal  pump harder.  And   cortisol is usually high ,  since cortisol  is pumped to  create RT3 hormone to stop   the thryoid affect... This  the  ratio of dopamine/serotonin is   not right and also  conversion  of noradrenaline  into  adrenaline.    That is why  naicin works,   it grabs methyl   and  inhibits conversion of noradrenaline to adrenaline.

Herman

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Offline kurtosis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17576 on: 08/01/2013 17:22:08 »
We allowed to post here if we keep it scientific. Keeping it scientific means providing evidence.
If you did not just come up with this theory out of nowhere then you should past evidence you can easily provide.
nobody is competing or trying to attack you, we just want evidence.

I'm not even sure there's a moderator any more. Like Elvis, they may have left the building :)


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Offline Gbolduev

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17579 on: 08/01/2013 17:50:09 »
Interesting, Kurtosis. I have read a bit about H3 receptor inverse agonists and they do seem to have a lot of potential. It'd be interesting to see how they'll do when they hit the market.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17580 on: 08/01/2013 17:54:18 »
Norepinephrine
Also known as:   NE;  Noradrenaline;  Levarterenol
Description
Catecholamine Stimulatory Neurotransmitter that is chemically similar to Adrenaline.
Beneficial Biological Functions of Norepinephrine
Norepinephrine possesses Life Extension potential:
-   A high ratio of Serotonin/NE accelerates the Aging Process.
-   A low ratio of Serotonin/NE slows down the Aging Process.
Immune System
NE stimulates the release of Hormones that provide the Thymus Gland with correct instructions.
Metabolism
NE alleviates Obesity (by stimulating the body's Brown Adipose Tissue to utilize other Adipose Tissue in the production of Energy).
Nervous System
Norepinephrine is produced and secreted by the Adrenal Medulla.
   Norepinephrine controls the Adrenergic Nervous System (a component of the Autonomic Nervous System).
   Age related decline in NE levels are associated with Age Related Memory Decline.
   Persons afflicted with Alzheimer's Disease usually have insufficient Norepinephrine in their Brains [scientific research - humans].
NE depletion can cause Apathy.
   NE suppresses Appetite.
   NE stimulates Beta-1 Adrenergic Receptors.
   NE stimulates Beta-2 Adrenergic Receptors (although NE has less affinity with these Receptors than does Adrenaline).
NE is involved in Moods (due to its central role in the excitatory drives associated with mood and Emotion).
   NE deficiency is a major cause of Depression.
   NE enhances Learning.
   NE enhances Memory.
Norepinephrine helps to minimize the sensation of Pain:
-   Norepinephrine travels via a descending pathway that originates in the Locus Coeruleus of the Medulla of the Brain and terminates in the Dorsal Horn of the Spinal Cord to inhibit the release of Substance P (the Neuropeptide that initiates Nerve Impulses relating to Pain).
Sexual System
NE increases Sexual Desire.
Norepinephrine Enhances the Function of these Substances
Hormones
NE is the immediate precursor of Adrenaline:
NE is required for the release of human Growth Hormone (hGH).
   Norepinephrine stimulates the release of Luteinising Hormone Releasing Hormone (LHRH) from the Hypothalamus.
   The nightly production of Melatonin occurs primarily as a result of NE release from postganglionic sympathetic Neurons that terminate in the Pineal Gland:
-   Following its release from these Neurons, Norepinephrine interacts with Adrenergic Receptors which (via a specific G-Protein) in turn activate Adenyl Cyclase in the Membrane of Pinealocytes (Cells of the Pineal Gland).
-   Activation of Adenyl Cyclase in the Pineal Gland increases the intracellular production of Cyclic AMP (cAMP) which then activates the N-
acetyl Transferase (NAT) enzyme (a precursor for Melatonin synthesis from N-acetyl Serotonin).
-   Approximately 85% of Melatonin produced in the Pineal Gland occurs as a result of Norepinephrine activating Beta-Adrenergic Receptors and approximately 15% occurs as a result of activation of Alpha-Adrenergic Receptors.
These Substances Enhance the Production or Release of Norepinephrine
Coenzymes - Electron Transport System
Nicotinamide Adenine Dinucleotide (NAD) is essential for maintaining proper levels of Norepinephrine in the Synapses of Neurons:
-   After Norepinephrine crosses the Neuron's Synapses it loses one electron to form oxidized Norepinephrine.  In the presence of NAD, this oxidized Norepinephrine then re-converts back to active Norepinephrine.  If there is a deficiency of NAD, the oxidized Norepinephrine loses another electron to irreversibly form Noradrenochrome.
-   NADH increases the production of Norepinephrine within the Brain.
Enzymes
Decarboxylases are required for the manufacture of NE.
Alkaloids
Yohimbine increases blood levels of Norepinephrine [scientific research - Yohimbine increases serum NE levels by up to 66%].
Amino Acids
Phenylalanine is a precursor for the endogenous production of Norepinephrine.
   Tyrosine is a precursor for the endogenous production of Norepinephrine.
Environmental Factors
Regular Exercise increases the production of Norepinephrine.
Methylxanthines
Caffeine increases Norepinephrine synthesis and release within the Brain [scientific research - animals].
Minerals
Calcium affects the function of NE.
   Copper is a cofactor for the Dopamine Beta-Hydroxylase enzyme (that catalyzes the conversion of Dopamine to Norepinephrine).
Organic Acids
Fumaric Acid stimulates the activity of the Dopamine Beta-Hydroxylase (that catalyzes the conversion of Dopamine to Norepinephrine).
Pharmaceutical Drugs
Many Tricyclic Antidepressants (including Amitryptiline, Desipramine and Imipramine) increase Norepinephrine levels within the Brain by blocking the reuptake of Norepinephrine into Alpha-1 Adrenergic Receptors (i.e. by functioning as Norepinephrine Reuptake Inhibitors), thereby increasing the availability and effects of NE [caution:  Tricyclic Antidepressants have numerous potentially toxic side-effects and contraindications].
Sibutramine inhibits the reuptake of Norepinephrine.
   Venlafaxine (a relatively new type of Pharmaceutical Antidepressant) inhibits the reuptake of Norepinephrine into Neurons.
Smart Drugs
Deprenyl totally inhibits the destruction of Norepinephrine by Monoamine Oxidase Type B (MAO-B):
-   Deprenyl blocks the re-uptake of NE from the Synapses between Neurons into the Storage Sites within Neurons (thereby increasing the level of Norepinephrine in its active state within the Synapes) - Deprenyl could therefore be described as a Norepinephrine Re-Uptake Inhibitor.
Idebenone enhances the endogenous production of Norepinephrine (by facilitating the cellular uptake of Tyrosine).
   Vinpocetine increases the Brain's turnover of Norepinephrine.
Vitamins
Vitamin C is a cofactor for the conversion of Dopamine to Norepinephrine by Dopamine Beta-Hydroxylase (it is converted to its Dehydroascorbic Acid form during this metabolic process).
These Herbs Enhance the Function of Norepinephrine
Ginkgo biloba stimulates the release of Norepinephrine within the body [scientific research].
   Ginsengs increase the body's Norepinephrine production when the body is under Stress [scientific research].
These Substances Interfere with or Block Norepinephrine
Enzymes
Monoamine Oxidase Type A (MAO-A) causes the breakdown (oxidation) of Norepinephrine to Dihydroxymendalic Acid [this activity is essential to keep Norepinephrine levels in check, however excessive MAO production can over-deplete Norepinephrine].
Flavoproteins
If Nicotinamide Adenine Dinucleotide (NAD) deficiency exists, Norepinephrine is oxidized to irreversibly form Noradrenochrome.
Neurotoxins
DSP-4 causes long-lasting depletion of Norepinephrine by damaging Noradrenergic Neurons.
Neurotransmitters
Gamma Aminobutyric Acid (GABA) inhibits the release of Norepinephrine (by binding to and activating GABAb Receptors).
Alkaloids
Cocaine causes depletion of Norepinephrine due to its over-stimulation of the Central Nervous System causing the sudden release and non-replacement of the body's reserves of NE.



Amino Acids
Tyramine causes over-stimulation of the Adrenal Glands, resulting in depletion of the body's Norepinephrine reserves.
Pharmaceutical Drugs - Amphetamine Derivatives
GABAb Receptor Agonists inhibit the release of Norepinephrine (by binding to and activating GABAb Receptors).
   Ritalin causes the sudden release of stores of NE and subsequent depletion and deficiency.
Recreational Drugs
Amphetamine causes the Brain to release NE and to block the recycling of NE, resulting in the high concentration of NE in the Synapses between Neurons that is responsible for the stimulatory effects of Amphetamine [however long term or excessive usage of Amphetamine causes NE depletion due to the large amounts of NE that are released but not replaced].
These Ailments Cause the Depletion of Norepinephrine
Adrenal Glands
Continual Stress causes the over-production of NE and its subsequent depletion.
Aging Process
The body's supplies of Norepinephrine decline in tandem with the Aging Process:
-   The number of Neuron Receptors for NE decline with the progression of the Aging Process.
-   The conversion of nutrients into NE declines with Age.
Metabolism
Hypoglycaemia causes NE deficiency.
Toxic Effects of Excessive NE Production
Cardiovascular System
Chronically elevated Norepinephrine levels can induce abnormal Blood Clotting (increasing the possibility of Thrombosis and Heart Attack).
Nervous System
Excessive NE production causes Schizophrenia.

Copyright 1997 In-Tele-Health

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17581 on: 08/01/2013 17:55:33 »
Kurtosis, notice the ratio of  serotonin to  noradernaline.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17582 on: 08/01/2013 18:17:31 »
Orgasm-Induced Catecholamine Imbalance via Pituitary Dysfunction
The psychiatric symptoms of dopamine depletion closely match those of POIS.  In a recent study, dopamine depletion was found to cause lessened fluency of speech, mental fatigue, confusion, loss of control over ideas, and poor concentration.  Given these close similarities between symptoms as well as dopamine’s essential role in the synthesis of catecholamines, which will be further discussed, it is arguable that an orgasm-induced deficiency of this neurotransmitter is significantly responsible for causing the psychiatric symptoms of POIS.

The physiological symptoms of excess norepinephrine, epinephrine, and cortisol also closely match those of POIS.  Abnormally high levels of the two catecholamines, norepinephrine and epinephrine, have been found to cause palpitations, insomnia, heightened blood pressure, feeling of uneasiness, heat, and sweating.  Overproduction of these catecholamines could potentially over-consume dopamine to abnormally low levels, and be the primary cause of the physiological symptoms of this syndrome.  Likewise, excess cortisol is known to aggravate these symptoms.

Immediately subsequent to orgasm, prolactin levels significantly increase and remain elevated for an extended period[ii].  It has been recently hypothesized that prolactin may modify the dopaminergic neurons in the nigrostriatal and mesolimbocoritcal system and the medial preoptic area as a means to alter sexual behavior (T.H. Kruger et al., 2003).  Animal studies have shown these sites are responsible for the regulation of genital responses, appetitive behavior, and motor activity (T.H. Kruger et al., 2003).  Although the inhibition of dopaminergic neurons by prolactin in these regions do not explain the psychiatric symptoms of POIS, it may clarify why some POIS sufferers experience light muscle tremors as the result of a potential overproduction of prolactin.  However, motor control is not significantly affected by POIS as people can still perform tasks requiring high dexterity and agility (i.e. playing piano). Blood testing has revealed abnormally high levels of prolactin in several of those known to have POIS.  So far, one of these individuals has attributed these elevated levels to a pituitary microadenoma located on the anterior lobe revealed by MRI scan.  The cause of high prolactin in others has not yet been determined.  However, it is evidence that suggest the pituitary gland is not properly functioning.

Similarly, norepinephrine and epinephrine levels peak upon orgasm and then return to basal levels (T.H. Kruger et al., 2003).  The synthesis of these catecholamines is accelerated by adrenocorticotropic hormone (ACTH) that is also secreted by the anterior lobe of the pituitary.  As a result, ACTH enhances the activity of two enzymes: tyrosine hydroxylase and dopamine β-hydroxylase.  Figure 1 below shows these enzymes in the biochemical pathway by which norepinephrine and epinephrine are synthesized.  If the anterior lobe of the pituitary is overproducing prolactin, then, by extension, ACTH might also be produced to abnormally elevated levels.  The only evidence supporting this contention is several POIS sufferers have reported having high ACTH levels.  ACTH also stimulates the release of cortisol to increase the expression of phenylethanolamine N­-methytransferase (PNMT) to enhance epinephrine synthesis (see Figure 1).

The potential overproduction or prolonged secretion of ACTH induced by orgasm may result in abnormally elevated levels of norepinephrine, epinephrine, and cortisol that could all give rise to the physiological symptoms.  So long as ACTH is present, dopamine is converted into norepinephrine at accelerated rates, which could potentially deplete this neurotransmitter and cause the psychological symptoms.  Moreover, the actions of prolactin during the post-orgasm stage is still largely unknown, making it more than possible for prolactin to directly inhibit dopamine secretion in the same manner dopamine inhibits prolactin secretion.


L. de HAAN, J. BOOIJ, J. LAVALYE, T. van AMELSVOORT, and D. LINSZEN,

“Subjective Experiences During Dopamine Depletion,” Am J Psychiatry, vol. 162, 2005, pp. 1755-. 

[ii] T.H. Kruger, P. Haake, D. Chereath, W. Knapp, O.E. Janssen, M.S. Exton, M. Schedlowski, and U. Hartmann, “Specificity of the neuroendocrine response to orgasm during sexual arousal in men,” J Endocrinol, vol. 177, 2003, pp. 57-64. 

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17583 on: 08/01/2013 18:25:24 »
I hope this helps ,



Kurtosis,  the way you balanced  your body chemistry  is the way it is done by  any knowledgable nutritionist.
In USA   the creators  of mineral analysis  spent 50 more years researching  this stuff, and  they were fixing this imbalance  left and right, I dont understand why you think this is  something new..  and  somepeople   are collecting  money for  this research..  This research was done  years ago. .  People just  make up new names for imbalances,   which is silly. POIS, CFD  and stuff like that. 

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17584 on: 08/01/2013 18:26:57 »
The actualy research is done  in the lab  with patients   and  big population, not  the internet or providing  abstacrts from wikepedia.

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17585 on: 08/01/2013 19:33:49 »
Since we're reiterating old information I'll re-post an interesting thing in the news about chemo brain that CertainlyPOIS posted recently.

"Using brain scans, scientists in the US have uncovered physiological evidence for "chemo brain", a common and often debilitating side effect of cancer chemotherapy treatment that patients often describe as a "mental fog". With the help of positron emission tomography combined with computed tomography (PET/CT), the team found that following chemotherapy, areas of the brain involved with planning and decision-making use less energy."

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/253277.php

I find this study inspiring because it means there is hope for us to someday obtain evidence that will convince doctors that our POIS symptoms are not psychosomatic.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17586 on: 08/01/2013 19:46:51 »
serotonin/Ne is old info?   

this was the info in which RT3  is  addressed,  which takes to balance  3 months. and  this info   also provides the logic pattern to what I have said.   Including niacin possibly  influencing  conversion of NE to adrenaline.  High cortisol in POIS sufferers,    stress of the adrenal caused by  thyroid...  What new information do you need?  another miracle  herb?
This is sistemic problem  and understanding how  the system  works is the key , not the research of  new components,   ALL of the components of the  system are known and researched for many many years.  POIS is just an imbalance,  I dont know why you dont go get your body  chemistry balanced and get it over with.\\
Kurtosis   mentioned  for this forum to be scientific but  discussing    separate parts of the system  as  a problem  does not make any scientific sense.
Let

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17587 on: 08/01/2013 19:50:53 »
You keep on saying "scientific" and yet you didn't provide a scientific source for your serotonin/NE post.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17588 on: 08/01/2013 19:57:51 »
every column in  noradrenaline  piece is the   research  based  on  the  studies.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17589 on: 08/01/2013 20:00:52 »
Vincent,

I think  scientific does not apply to POIS,   

it is a  metabolic imbalance. You can go fix that   at 1000s of practioners  in the US.
It is like  taking   the results and trying to find a cause of a results  with many different things..   The cause of this  POIS is your  lifestyle or lifestyle of your parents  if you were born with it.   

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17590 on: 08/01/2013 20:02:35 »
every column in  noradrenaline  piece is the   research  based  on  the  studies.

Which studies? Give us links.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17591 on: 08/01/2013 20:06:12 »
I dont have links for every column .Sorry.

Good luck , Herman

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17592 on: 08/01/2013 20:07:41 »
serotonin.>NE ratio  conclusion  comes from  another piece anyway.  if you read carefully.

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17593 on: 08/01/2013 20:10:31 »
serotonin.>NE ratio  conclusion  comes from  another piece anyway.  if you read carefully.

I'm sure you don't happen to have a scientific source for that piece either.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17594 on: 08/01/2013 20:12:42 »
Vincent M, 

I want to help you, and I will . But  trust me on this,   orgasming  every day, you will never  let RT3 come down,  and cortisol  would not come down  until   you burn out.
Even if you have  perfect regimen for your imbalance.

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17595 on: 08/01/2013 20:14:35 »
Okay. I trust you. I trust you with my life. lol. This is just making me laugh at this point.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17596 on: 08/01/2013 20:17:02 »
Scientific source for the ratio?   Dude, you are something.    Serotonin   devided  by noradrenaline .   Yeah , I guess  somwhere   in China  they  studied what happens when you devide one neurotransmiter on another.   OR  you want me to prove that serotonin/ Ne is the life  ratio.   I think it is quite obvious, isnt it?

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17597 on: 08/01/2013 20:18:52 »
laughing  will  calm you down  , I am glad I can do  good for you ...

Herman

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Offline Gbolduev

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17598 on: 08/01/2013 20:24:24 »
if you  dont want to  give me tests,  go   find a practioner who will balance your body chemestry , they are 1000s of them  an d stop yo ur  guessing and shooting in the dark thing..  POIS is just  an imbalance  in 3 months you  wont have it.  I cant beilive people research this.   I guess I can ,  internet people do that.   Nothing is new here.  Your imbalance was  cured  for more than 40 years.   

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Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #17599 on: 08/01/2013 20:44:54 »
Herman, if you would just stop claiming to know everything about POIS then I would have no problem with you.
Taking fenugreek+tea/garlic, saw palmetto, huperzine, niacin, boswellia, and nutmeg.