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...He [my husband] said he would be concerned that depressing dopamine with an herb [such as fenugreek] might be bad for someone with depression or social anxiety disorder (both tied to low dopamine).
...think about learning to make love without orgasm.;-)
Girlwindís posts about thyroid function have jumped out at me and I would like to draw attention to my particular case as I first detailed on page one of this forum. My POIS symptoms only appeared after I was treated with radioactive iodine to kill off part of my overactive thyroid. As usually happens in cases of radio-iodine treatment, my thyroid then became underactive. It is since then that I have suffered POIS symptoms. According to some of the articles girlwind has posted, a better treatment should be a combination of T4 and T3. Wow! My TSH has long been coming back as what doctors regard as Ďnormalí I think I have actually been tested for T3, T4 including (I think but am not sure)free T3 or T4 on occasion. I REALLY need to check my medical records and get the results of all my tests. I canít believe I havenít chased this up more! I guess in the periods between POIS that I am feeling well enough I have a tendency just to get on with and enjoy life when I get the chance. Anyway, Iím left wondering if there are some organs that are not getting the T3 they need and perhaps this is contributing to POIS. Iím out my home country until the end of the year so canít look into this yet, although thinking about it perhaps Iíll be able to email my doctor and at least get the results of my last few tests and see if they tested free T3 and T4. I definitely want to look into a combined T4/T3 supplement instead of T4 only and will keep you posted.As Girlwind has highlighted, it is possible to have low free T3 and still not be diagnosed as having an underactive thyroid. It doesn't sound from other posts like all people on the forum can be underactive but the fact that I only got POIS after my thyroid treatment seems important. It's possible the radioiodine somehow damaged parts of other organs too?
Martin88, just curious about your testosterone remarks. Last time we checked the research, the fluctuations in blood levels of testosterone after orgasm moved around, with a consistent brief spike at day seven, but over all there was no increase or decrease. Has something new come out?What *may* account for the changes in libido/energy is the androgen receptor levels in key parts of the brain after orgasm. For example, male rats, after sexual satiety (sex to the point of disinterest), show decreased androgen receptors for sometime, and the changes correlate with their decreased libido. Androgen receptors are the receptors on nerve cells that *respond* to testosterone. So if lots of them are missing for a while, no amount of testosterone will "register" as good feelings. This may be at work in humans, too. Another reason to think about learning to make love without orgasm.;-)
Limejuice, Your experience complements mine: after consuming fenugreek I had a "small" NE. Perhaps your theory on orgasm intensity is correct, when I was young I had such an addiction as well, perhaps we somehow taught our bodies to go big. I tried another pill yesterday morning just to try it's effect on me again, and even one produced a small antidepressant-like effect, noticeable within a day of taking it. It messed up my fragile sleeping again so I will discontinue it for now. Do you experience any side effects with fenugreek?
Girlwind, have you noticed anything that helps your POIS but not CFS?
Thanks to everyone who has filled out the form at http://pois.olympe-network.com. We are now developing quite a large database of information that will be easily accessible to researchers!
I saw the importance of the database today when I spoke with a major local university endocrinology research group. It's not easy to get our case taken on as a clinical trial, but the database helps.
Limejuice [MessageID: 204675] Your post about fenugreek decreasing both the intensity of your orgasm and the POIS hangover was fascinating. My curious husband quickly found that fenugreek may increase prolactin (or act like prolactin). That is, it increases lactation...AND likely suppresses dopamine. (Prolactin is released after orgasm, and its function is to hold dopamine down for a while. It acts as a "sexual satiation" hormone.) Your results make perfect sense. The fenugreek would be suppressing dopamine from the start.He said he would be concerned that depressing dopamine with an herb might be bad for someone with depression or social anxiety disorder (both tied to low dopamine).
Thanks Demografx for your determination. What was their [university endocrine specialists] answer ?
Hi Demografx - what are these endocrine specialists saying?
Maybe we should look for different keywords?
Quote from: demografx on 13/11/2008 17:59:58Maybe we should look for different keywords?I didn't know about these words:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-coital_tristessehttp://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22875051/
Quote from: CCconfucius on 13/11/2008 16:22:07 While i was browsing i saw that a symptom for babies with hypothroidism is Jaundice and I had jaundice when i was baby, am just wondering who here had jaundice. I have a little chronicle jaundice and after an important stress i become as yellow as this smiley : 
While i was browsing i saw that a symptom for babies with hypothroidism is Jaundice and I had jaundice when i was baby, am just wondering who here had jaundice.
...Well...I never need a recovery period...
Also very quickly.....Last time I was posting I said I'd had a reply from the International Society for Sexual Medicine (ISSM). One of the doctors there was going to talk to Dr Waldinger about POIS. I see since then that Dr Waldinger has been in touch with the forum which is great news. I totally understand that the time he can spend on POIS is limited but its terrific to know he is aware of us. Everyone on this forum is doing a great job in chasing this illness down.
LOCAL UNIVERSITY ENDOCRINOLOGISTSContinuing my discussion about yesterday's talk with the local major University endocrinologists on behalf of the POIS Forum, maybe the best back-door I can take is to sign up as a patient! I will call them this morning and hope they won't be too expensive for my first visit.
Quote from: Limejuice on 13/11/2008 18:09:23...Well...I never need a recovery period...Maybe we could submit you to the Guinness Book Of World Records and raise some money for the Forum? 
Quote from: demografx on 14/11/2008 15:32:00LOCAL UNIVERSITY ENDOCRINOLOGISTSContinuing my discussion about yesterday's talk with the local major University endocrinologists on behalf of the POIS Forum, maybe the best back-door I can take is to sign up as a patient! I will call them this morning and hope they won't be too expensive for my first visit.OK, I have an appointment with them December 2. As a patient. $200 to $500 consultation fee, but insurance will cover some.
Thanks DEMOGRAFX for doing this [university endocrinology consultation]. I hope something good comes out of it.
Quote from: girlwind on 15/11/2008 05:24:45Thanks DEMOGRAFX for doing this [university endocrinology consultation]. I hope something good comes out of it. Thanks girlwind. Please remind me which thyroid and testosterone tests to request? Sorry to keep asking, I should ask them for a brain-memory scan, too 
I'm assuming you are not using ZRT? and just going with a local medical lab... Yes?
Demografx: Please do get the memory scan! I highly recommend it.
I just found this. I'm not sure if this has been referenced before here. Alcohol also gives me similar effects as Poishttp://www.actionlove.com/extra/headache.htm
Quote from: Finally on 14/11/2008 06:45:14I just found this. I'm not sure if this has been referenced before here. Alcohol also gives me similar effects as Poishttp://www.actionlove.com/extra/headache.htm Finally...I do recall that some of my hangovers mimicked POIS. And they lasted 4 days!Come to think of it...jet lag too! And Monday work re-entry aka Monday morning blues (which could last till Thursday!)Has anyone else here experienced non-sex-related POIS? (with me, it wasn't exactly the same, but enough similarity to make me wonder...)
Yes it is, for some of us. All stress stimulate adrenal glands even if orgasm is the most important one (but short, opposite of chronicle stress). When adrenal glands are tired, steroids might be converted into cortisol => brainfog. You must find you sources of stress and try to eliminate them. For me, the bad glycemia (hypo/hyperglycemia)is a severe cause of stress.
Has anyone else here experienced non-sex-related POIS? (with me, it wasn't exactly the same, but enough similarity to make me wonder...)
Two things that have helped are: Avoiding running on empty when it comes to food or energy--as in always eating regular meals, especially breakfast, and not allowing myblood sugar to drop during the day to the point of becoming hypoglycemic...and avoiding pushing myself be-yond the point of exhaustion. Also getting to bed by 10 pm has been really helpful for me. The later I go to bed the worse I feel the next day.
I road a rollercoaster last year and after the ride finished I felt POIS symptoms...weird. It was like I was on a high during the ride (all thoughs sensations going fast upside-down) and after it was a low.Go go fenugreek at the amusement park?