Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)

  • 20075 Replies
  • 6560931 Views

0 Members and 5 Guests are viewing this topic.

*

Offline underwater

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 158
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2500 on: 26/12/2008 00:14:10 »
B_Jim-------
I did know my numbers, but I forgot them. They were a little high with the "good"
cholesterol being significantly higher. My office sent me a letter saying I need to eat better and get in shape; come in for a seminar on diet and exercise. If there's anything I've done right in my life it is serious exercise and hardly eating any animal fat. I know a few incredibly fit, diet fanatics also around 60 yrs. old who have very high numbers. When we get together we just throw up our hands; we have enough problems already. In fact, I often crave cheese and bacon, but alas, like my monitoring of POIS, I am compelled to exercise serious restraint.

Another Toast To All At This Forum:  To Life, To Health,  La'Chaim



*

Offline Finally

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 73
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2501 on: 26/12/2008 00:54:29 »
I was experimenting with raw organic veganism with emphasis on extremely large quantities of living foods. It worked remarkably well in the sense that my sexual desire was eliminated( just as Gandhi's work states that it will) However I discovered through blood work 10 days ago that I have become iron, Vitamin D and b-12 deficient . This has been doubly vexing in that the weakness associated with anemia can be confused with POIS symptoms.
For 11 months I was plagued with anemia, but the POIS symptoms were completely gone. When I began to see my partner again 8 months ago, and engage in non-orgasmic sexuality, the 'onslaught' commenced. Through thoughtful negotiation, very careful sexual boundaries and the willingness of my partner I have avoided the full torrential consequences of POIS....Whew!
Hi SteveD, but my post adress to other as well.
Everytime I eat a vegan diet I feel a peace in the mind, a better nervous system in some way difficult to describe, along with joy. But I'm not willing to do this for a long time however because this effect is not permanent.

When you eat only vegetables, phosphorus is decreasing and this give a chance to other nutrients necessary to metabolize phosphorus to increase
(I insist on the "only" because vegetables have not the same effect otherwise.)

Also because of the reduced amount of proteins, there is a raise in B6 which is necessary for amino acids metabolism.

By the way, note that phosphorus is necessary for ATP production and for parathyroid gland. (We talked about adrenals, thyroid, pancreas, sexual glands, pineal gland, but a missing one is parathyroid, associated with calcium regulation and maybe tremors)

I strongly suggest to keep this somewhere in our theories :
Guaiafesin is used to treat phosphates intoxication in the body and may help with ATP production : It is used to treat fibromyalgia.
We now postulate that a defective metabolism, possibly a kidney enzyme, forces retention of phosphate, which gradually accumulates to detrimental levels in many tissues. This excess induces inadequate energy formation (ATP), cellular fatigue and malfunctions that explain all the symptoms of fibromyalgia. Our paper for interested professionals defends that theory.

     We no longer prescribe gout drugs (uricosurics). We now use guaifenesin for fibromyalgia because it has no side effects and is even safe for children
Source : http://www.fibromyalgiatreatment.com/GuaiProtocol.htm [nofollow]

check this link on Guaifenesin.


http://fmnetnews [nofollow],com/rescources-alert-product6.php
« Last Edit: 26/12/2008 06:26:04 by Finally »

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2502 on: 26/12/2008 01:41:50 »
Another Toast To All At This Forum:  To Life, To Health,  La'Chaim

Thanks, Underwater, and best wishes to you! Glad you're here.

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2503 on: 26/12/2008 02:35:35 »
<<<application as a standup denied




Maybe this is a way to
"reduce POIS" ???
« Last Edit: 26/12/2008 17:26:01 by demografx »

*

Offline martin88

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 453
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2504 on: 26/12/2008 03:12:40 »
Hi Martin---
Over the last ten years or so, I have a very balanced diet. Plenty of protein and carboydrates. I need to consume more fruit. I am about 5'11' and weight about 165 lbs. with 9% body fat. Very little fat, sugar (processed), alcohol (none) and caffeine (none)in diet.. I need to eat about 5 small meals a day, but I don't. I can't believe I haven't the discipline to do this. This will be my new year's resolution. (by the way, my last blood test was normal, sugar, thyroid etc.)
When I did marathons (years ago), I ate like a pig, but still very little sugar and caffeine; though tons of carbos.  When I slowed down in the 90's, that's when POIS started manifesting itself significantly. POIS seemed to have reignited by panic disorder from the 1970's--I always dealt with the underlying anxiety/panic first (and still do). This is because POIS was tolerable though very uncomfortable, and CONSTANT anxiety is NOT. Right at the moment, I am dealing with my anxiety condition as usual, but POIS is messing it up. However, I feel some progress with my GAD, and am now completely off meds. For me, orgasm, NE's and erotic dreams can cause problems. Sometimes I don't know if its POIS, POIS LIKE, Sexual Anxiety, Panic etc.etc. This is because symptoms are so similar. Over the years, POIS for me has been defined by the 2-4 day recovery time frame that is so clearly delineated. It's like an anxiety episode with a specific time frame. Regarding Chlorine, I'm very aware of the research and potential dangers. In fact, right now I am swimming every other day to see if there's effect. Sorry if this is a rambling,incoherent answer. I just sat down and peeked at the site. Also, I am adding to my myriad of supplements all the time. This I will list this weekend, as I don't remember every one, and I don't feel like going downstairs right now. HOWEVER, I am going to take Girlwind's advice and focus on strengthening my adrenal glands and overall nervous system. I'm going to buy Adrenal Support supplements tomorrow. I have this intuition that I'm missisng something real simple, and that I've failed to scrutinize my diet, with regard to supplements (because it's a lot easier than changing my acutual food diet). Certainly this forum is helping me focus, but I hope that some rancor that I'm sensing ceases. Each contributor has the potential for creating an epiphany for another member, and we must always add new members; This is so logical. 
Thank you very much for these precisions. Maybe you'll let us know the results with these supplements it will be interesting. I'm glad there is no problem with chlorine since swimming is a very good sport for depression, anxiety. Concerning supplements, I'm not sure if you'll take rhodiola, but in my case, with a small dose,  my sleep became very rare for a week. Night was like during the day ! Very bad experience and I have absolutely no clue why ...

*

Offline martin88

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 453
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2505 on: 26/12/2008 03:52:39 »
check this link on Guaifenesin.
http:fmnetnews,com/rescources-alert-product6.php
It works better like this : http://fmnetnews.com/resources-alert-product6.php

Thank you  Finally for this link, it's interesting, I had to remove "I strongly suggest" ! Sorry for my invasive theory. I was excessively passionate about this because since a very long time I believe that excessive phosphorus intake is one of the cause of my problems. If you check everything you eat you'll certainly find that phosphorus is in excess, at least according to nutrition books. Lack or excess of it is potentially harmful because it's important in the body (works with B vitamins, calcium, magnesium, zinc, involved in carbohydrate metabolism, ATP, constituent of the brain (phospholipids),...)

An other possible explanation about temporary benefits from eating only raw vegetables is the high intake of vitamins not destroyed by heat. Since carbs,proteins need vitamins for their metabolism, theoretically eating cooked food (containing carbs,proteins without vitamins) should be bad..

*

Offline martin88

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 453
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2506 on: 26/12/2008 04:22:46 »
Even in the bible there are some nutritional tips :
Please don't ban me for this one Demo, it's about medicine!
I have nothing against or for religion, I'm just reporting what I read.
Remember that according to Steve this can lead to nutritional deficiencies.

From Daniel 1. A guy is following a special diet and have more psychological skills (dream interpretation) than other people. The story doesn't say if it's because of vegetables or alcohol abstention.

Please test your servants for ten days, and let us be given some vegetables to eat and water to drink. 13 “Then let our appearance be observed in your presence and the appearance of the youths who are eating the king’s choice food; and deal with your servants according to what you see.”
14 So he listened to them in this matter and tested them for ten days. 15 At the end of ten days their appearance seemed better and they were fatter than all the youths who had been eating the king’s choice food. 16 So the overseer continued to withhold their choice food and the wine they were to drink, and kept giving them vegetables.

17 As for these four youths, God gave them knowledge and intelligence in every branch of literature and wisdom; Daniel even understood all kinds of visions and dreams.
« Last Edit: 26/12/2008 04:28:18 by martin88 »

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2507 on: 26/12/2008 08:06:08 »
Martin,

>>>>Even in the bible there are some nutritional tips :
Please don't ban me for this one Demo, it's about medicine!
I have nothing against or for religion, I'm just reporting what I read.
Remember that according to Steve this can lead to nutritional deficiencies.

I, like you, am not afraid to use the wisdom from the Bible if it helps me, either.

>>>>An other possible explanation about temporary benefits from eating only raw vegetables is the high intake of vitamins not destroyed by heat. Since carbs,proteins need vitamins for their metabolism, theoretically eating cooked food (containing carbs,proteins without vitamins) should be bad..

This is my experience with raw foods...

Whatever works! I'll just be more careful with my iron and B12 intake in the future.

Steve D.


*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2508 on: 26/12/2008 08:31:46 »
Demo,

>>Steve, if I may respectfully submit to you: just my opinion, but we have all suffered POIS too long and too agonizingly to be "ginger". Many of us take risks here just by posting publicly about POIS and some incredibly private, confidential details! But what's worse, risking someone's rage or staying in the hellish pits of POIS? I vote for the latter being worse. Much worse.But I do appreciate your sensitivity.

I dink I be 'ginger' none de less...




*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2509 on: 26/12/2008 17:16:06 »
Please don't ban me for this one Demo, it's about medicine!

Don't be silly, Martin [;D], you have been extremely generous in all your contributions to this forum!

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2510 on: 26/12/2008 17:19:40 »
Steve, if I may respectfully submit to you: just my opinion, but we have all suffered POIS too long and too agonizingly to be "ginger". Many of us take risks here just by posting publicly about POIS and some incredibly private, confidential details! But what's worse, risking someone's rage or staying in the hellish pits of POIS? I vote for the latter being worse. Much worse.But I do appreciate your sensitivity.

Demo,
I dink I be 'ginger' none de less...

OK, Steve, thanks for your consideration and reply.
« Last Edit: 26/12/2008 17:22:13 by demografx »

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2511 on: 26/12/2008 20:35:11 »
Feeling hopeful today...

I have the day off . My partner and I have negotiated a 'no genital contact day' for today. Spent 30' in meditation, which I find helpful and calming. I'm fasting until dinner which gives me a little more clarity when I do it. Going to work out with yoga and core exercises (Underwater had noted a relationship between his back and POIS symptoms and so I'll be watching for that today). Then a session with my partner and I's therapist who introduced us to the idea of POIS.

I'm just going to easy does it today and be grateful.

One of the things I'm grateful for is this forum. It's remarkable to have the opportunity to share with people about a disease that I've known I had for decades, but for which the most loving and wise people did not understand.
Thanks everybody.

Steve D.

*

Offline underwater

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 158
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2512 on: 26/12/2008 22:23:43 »
Steve----
Your thoughts are very Lincolnesque------
As you may know, he suffered severe, cyclical depression and exhaustion.
Most historians consider his condition as falling in the serious, depressive category, with explanations (psychoanalytic) often centering on the losses of the many women he loved.
I tend to agree with that, but I've read that these episodes would come over him and then slowly fade a few days later? I believe he knew these episodes would pass. Although deeply disturbed and miserable, he always saw the light at the end of the tunnel. I submit that he learned how to "wait" for recovery. Could POIS have been a component of his condition? If so, did he do anything behaviourally to ameliorate this, or at least to make it more bearable?
Your words in your last post remind me of Abraham Lincoln, except that he, in the age of Victoria, certainly could not express his intimate concerns in a public forum.


*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2513 on: 27/12/2008 05:04:09 »
Steve----
Your thoughts are very Lincolnesque------
As you may know, he suffered severe, cyclical depression and exhaustion.
Most historians consider his condition as falling in the serious, depressive category, with explanations (psychoanalytic) often centering on the losses of the many women he loved.
I tend to agree with that, but I've read that these episodes would come over him and then slowly fade a few days later? I believe he knew these episodes would pass. Although deeply disturbed and miserable, he always saw the light at the end of the tunnel. I submit that he learned how to "wait" for recovery. Could POIS have been a component of his condition? If so, did he do anything behaviourally to ameliorate this, or at least to make it more bearable?
Your words in your last post remind me of Abraham Lincoln, except that he, in the age of Victoria, certainly could not express his intimate concerns in a public forum.

What has forever confused me about Lincoln and his depression is his famous quote, "A man is about as happy as he makes up his mind to be."

If he really believed that, wouldn't he have "controlled" it more??

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2514 on: 27/12/2008 05:16:25 »
I strongly suggest to keep this somewhere in our theories :
Guaiafesin is used to treat phosphates intoxication in the body and may help with ATP production : It is used to treat fibromyalgia.
We now postulate that a defective metabolism, possibly a kidney enzyme, forces retention of phosphate, which gradually accumulates to detrimental levels in many tissues. This excess induces inadequate energy formation (ATP), cellular fatigue and malfunctions that explain all the symptoms of fibromyalgia. Our paper for interested professionals defends that theory.

     We no longer prescribe gout drugs (uricosurics). We now use guaifenesin for fibromyalgia because it has no side effects and is even safe for children
Source : http://www.fibromyalgiatreatment.com/GuaiProtocol.htm

check this link on Guaifenesin.
http://fmnetnews.com/resources-alert-product6.php

B_Jim, would this fit in with any of your summaries on page 1 or Page 11? Or are you mainly looking at actual POIS experiments?
« Last Edit: 27/12/2008 05:28:19 by demografx »

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2515 on: 27/12/2008 05:44:08 »
MRI OF THE BRAIN

It went well today, except the lab tech for the first injection for contrast "missed" the first time and it had to be repeated. I'm not wild about injections.

I'm hoping that the MRI of the pituitary gland will reveal why my prolactin is sky-high (4X the norm!).

And I also hope it eventually reveals something about POIS! Prolactin has been mentioned often in conjunction with the biochemistry of orgasm and as a possible culprit in POIS.

Girlwind was right, it is a loud procedure. At least they gave me earplugs.

*

Offline martin88

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 453
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2516 on: 27/12/2008 06:04:52 »
About religion it's always a delicate subject ! Thanks for my theory Demo, but we probably need more trials and evidences.

I'll just be more careful with my iron and B12 intake in the future.
Perhaps there are other problems resulting from doing this on a regular basis ? Personally I wouldn't feel safe, but it's only my education and culture speaking. I don't really know the consequences. I really wish you the best in the way you choose.

I didn't have enough time to do the cortisol tests but I'll do them as soon as possible, with a prolactin test, and free T3, free T4 as well. My TSH was 3.1, 15 days after orgasm. I just hope that pois is not something a lot bigger than just cortisol, which could just be a simple alarm to advise us that there is a serious problem in the whole system if we continue to have sex in our actual condition. Everything has an end, a limit somewhere. If you run too much, fatigue is there to tell you to stop. Maybe it's the same with sex and we have to accept our own limits. If I feel better after a success in reducing a high cortisol I'll keep as much as possible my actual sexual frequency (low).

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2517 on: 27/12/2008 06:40:29 »
I just hope that pois is not something a lot bigger than just cortisol, which could just be a simple alarm to advise us that there is a serious problem in the whole system if we continue to have sex in our actual condition.

Very interesting, Martin, that even if we don't find a "cure" we might be able to develop a "POIS alarm/warning system", to alert us to how well, or how poorly, our physiology is equipped to handle the powerful effects of an orgasm.

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2518 on: 27/12/2008 10:42:39 »
Hey gang,

My couples therapist suggested today Welbutrin and having an orgasm everyday as a treatment for POIS,
which was suggested to him by Dr. Charles Moser, his mentor,
who has been quoted several times on this thread.

I gave up masturbating 18 1/2 years ago, today, because of POIS. I am not going to follow his suggestion.

I did however swim 60 laps today in 81 minutes... a lifetime high, and I feel great.

Steve D.

*

Offline tarkington

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • 39
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2519 on: 27/12/2008 18:15:44 »
I have recently finished my second bottle of Relora.  That means about two months.  During that time I have had an orgasm on average at least once a day. During that time I have also taken a Centrum Daily tablet every day.  The results:  I have not felt the effects of brain fog and axiety and total mental depression in two months.  However, I have noticed, as a single male who is not sexually active, that I still have emotional problems like loneliness and feeling down some days due to my own emotional problems.  These emotional problems were existant before I started taking Relora and are still there. 

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2520 on: 27/12/2008 19:55:52 »
I have recently finished my second bottle of Relora.  That means about two months.  During that time I have had an orgasm on average at least once a day. During that time I have also taken a Centrum Daily tablet every day.  The results:  I have not felt the effects of brain fog and axiety and total mental depression in two months.  However, I have noticed, as a single male who is not sexually active, that I still have emotional problems like loneliness and feeling down some days due to my own emotional problems.  These emotional problems were existant before I started taking Relora and are still there. 

Tarkington, congratulations on your successes with Relora! Did you also have POIS problems with fatigue/exhaustion?

Sorry to hear of the emotional problems. Maybe the improvements in POIS will free you up to better deal with other emotional problems. Are you seeing a therapist?

I just saw B_Jim's post come in same time as mine. Looks like he is saying something similar, Tarkington.
« Last Edit: 27/12/2008 19:58:53 by demografx »

*

Offline tarkington

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • 39
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2521 on: 27/12/2008 20:10:30 »
Concerning fatigue and exhaustion: for three days after orgasm it was hard to get myself to exercise and do physical activity.  When I did do physical activity, sports, work out, etc. I felt like I wasn't "in the game" and almost physically weak. 

No therapist, but I might be overstating my emotional problems. I feel great but I am sure everyone in the world suffers from some emotional problems.  I was just trying to say that POIS is independent of some of those problems.

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2522 on: 27/12/2008 20:48:21 »
Tarkington,

>>>>>
Concerning fatigue and exhaustion: for three days after orgasm it was hard to get myself to exercise and do physical activity.  When I did do physical activity, sports, work out, etc. I felt like I wasn't "in the game" and almost physically weak. 

>>><  I was just trying to say that POIS is independent of some of those problems.

That was my experience too, physically, I had the symptoms with POIS independent of my emotional health...Welcome


Steve D.

*

Offline Finally

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 73
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2523 on: 27/12/2008 21:21:44 »
check this link on Guaifenesin.
http:fmnetnews,com/rescources-alert-product6.php
It works better like this : http://fmnetnews.com/resources-alert-product6.php [nofollow]

Thank you  Finally for this link, it's interesting, I had to remove "I strongly suggest" ! Sorry for my invasive theory. I was excessively passionate about this because since a very long time I believe that excessive phosphorus intake is one of the cause of my problems. If you check everything you eat you'll certainly find that phosphorus is in excess, at least according to nutrition books. Lack or excess of it is potentially harmful because it's important in the body (works with B vitamins, calcium, magnesium, zinc, involved in carbohydrate metabolism, ATP, constituent of the brain (phospholipids),...)

An other possible explanation about temporary benefits from eating only raw vegetables is the high intake of vitamins not destroyed by heat. Since carbs,proteins need vitamins for their metabolism, theoretically eating cooked food (containing carbs,proteins without vitamins) should be bad..

 I don't know about Guaifenesin but the high Phospherous symptoms are very similar to my long term effects.  How Phospherous retention would increase from Urgasm/sexual stimulation I don't know.  I have had an inclination away from high Phospherous vegetables toward low ones.   The only problem may be carbonated soda. 
My current program of Herbs/enzymes has worked remarkably well in breaking up the "cement" and restoring muscle fleibility.  I am being as abstinent as possible to prevent any setbacks.  It seems as if by restoring the energy levels, the body begins to heal itself?   
I avoid Calcium supplements as the last time I took them I could barely stand up.

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2524 on: 27/12/2008 22:03:24 »
Hi Finally,

>>>>Hi SteveD, but my post address to other as well.
Everytime I eat a vegan diet I feel a peace in the mind, a better nervous system in some way difficult to describe, along with joy. But I'm not willing to do this for a long time however because this effect is not permanent.

I grew up on a cattle farm in Virginia so I love steak, but I've stayed away from it for 20 years, because I feel those effects that you mention above pretty consistently. In the last two weeks though I've added back daily red meat because I am iron anemic and B-12 deficient.


>>>>I am being as abstinent as possible to prevent any setbacks.

I am in the process of negotiating with my partner to be permanently non-orgasmic in our contact with each other. She is bitterly disappointed, so I am trying to make it up to her in other ways, like supporting her in taking care of herself around an abusive family and being there for her around challenges with her two children. It's not the same but I want her to know that I care and am not abandoning even though I am wanting to commit to  this sexual choice.

>>>  It seems as if by restoring the energy levels, the body begins to heal itself?   

That's currently the approach I am using today, an overall health approach.
Have the day off so I did 90" of meditation this morning, fasting until dinner/ but having 4 ounces of homegrown wheat grass, going to work out hard at the gym now, spent time on the phone being helpful to other folks, which , for me, is a very ameliorative process around the POIS symptoms.

Steve D.



*

Offline underwater

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 158
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2525 on: 28/12/2008 01:00:33 »
Great Discussion Today:
Hi Demografx--
I too have considered Prolactin to be a possible "culprit" in POIS. I also have thought that quickly elevated Cortisol with a steep decline in Dopamine may also be implicated. Even Epinephrine. The great helper neurotransmitters (besides Dopamine) of Serotonin and Gaba may also play (or not play as it were) their respective parts in the so called recovery phase. I do know from my past experience with Benzodiazepines (taken at very low, subtherapeutic doses)that when my Gaba was increased I felt a lot better all around and during POIS. Unfortunately or fortunately as one may look at such issues, these "better periods" only lasted two months. But at least I knew that Gaba was involved and that I did feel pretty good.
If my body were not to experience tolerance/withdrawal, who knows, I might still be on them? But alas, they don't last long, and I don't like meds anyhow. Ironically, I had more energy on the Benzos than I do without. POIS, or the recovery phase after orgasm, which seem to be very closely relate, is appearing to be very complex, because the nervous system is not only responsive to orgasm but to overall psycho-sexual arousal.
I am pleased to see that there are already some remedies discussed here that may improve the condition of some individuals:Relora, Fenugreek, Garlic, Levitra etc.
There may never be a total "cure", but I for one would be ecstatic if I could reduce my symptoms to "mild discomfort" lasting less than one day. This is my goal.
Regarding Abraham Lincoln, I think he did the best he could given the pathetic state of pharmacology in the mid 19th century. He probably went to drug stores or took some home remedies and made things worse, who knows. For sure, knowledge regarding effective medicine was very little then (in Euroamerican culture) compared to the incredible ethnobotanical knowledge of, let's say, the indigenous indians of California. I still find it very intriguing that some members here at times will actually escape POIS. I also find it fascinating that the intensity and recovery time varies significantly. Thus, I intend to focus on all aspects of my changing physiology: Behavioral (stress, exercise sleep etc), Psychological (attitudes, emotions), Nutritional/Dietary (Foods and Supplements), Immune System, Medical Interventions (prescription drugs if any), Other Professional Interventions (Chiropractor, Acupuncture etc.)and await great discoveries on this Forum!!!!!!!!!
Of course if I can be so lucky as to come upon anything helpful, I will so comment.
I may be making some progress now with my current supplements, but I think I will wait a few weeks before commenting. I am presently avoiding "O" if I can, out of necessity.

*

Offline CertainlyPOIS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 727
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2526 on: 28/12/2008 04:24:34 »
Has any body read the book "science of orgasms" 
It talks a lot  how orgasms is centered on the brain.
It also focuses on dopamine, oxycotin, serotonin,prolactin as one of the main chemicals involved orgasms. 
The author mentioned gcortisol should not be byproduct of orgasm.
I recomend reading it since the big "O" seems determined to get us.

The book dose not mention anything similar to our situation other than cortisol can cause depression. 

*

Offline martin88

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 453
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2527 on: 28/12/2008 04:53:10 »
  How Phospherous retention would increase from Urgasm/sexual stimulation I don't know.
It's always possible but I don't know how! I don't even know if it's a lack or an excess of it.
Phosphorus is probably involved in pois because I took a homeopathic remedy (phosphoric acid) and it was touching exactly the pois problem, specially in the mental symptoms, libido, depression, mental functions were definitely improved in pois. I was more able to communicate with other people. The side effect : not possible to fall asleep at night. I searched "phosphoric acid onanism" in google
Phosphoric-Acid
Debility from loss of animal fluids; bad effects of onanism; difficulties arising from rapid growth, grief, chagrin or care; great prostration, and nervous weakness; chronic diarrhoea.


I say it again for new people, I do not recommend to take homeopathic products if you're nervous. Not all are harmful but you'll probably have serious aggravations of your condition. That's my experience.


My current program of Herbs/enzymes has worked remarkably well in breaking up the "cement" and restoring muscle fleibility.  I am being as abstinent as possible to prevent any setbacks.  It seems as if by restoring the energy levels, the body begins to heal itself?   
I avoid Calcium supplements as the last time I took them I could barely stand up.
I know you took a lotof supplements at the same time. Do you have an idea which one was the best to achieve these results. It's great that you have some success !

*

Offline Animus

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 242
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2528 on: 28/12/2008 06:31:26 »
Hi Friends,
I see this site has grown a lot since I last visited.
My theory has always been that my problems are in large part due to excessive semen loss.
Background:
I was fine with ejaculation until I began taking VigRX- which caused an increase in semen production and heightened sexual intensity. After VigRX I began having lots of problems, mental and physical.

I found an interesting site which backs up my theory on semen loss:

http://www.semenloss.info/node/6

I have had an oriectomy (both testicles removed) and am on a low dose of testosterone.  There was considerable improvement after this.
I am pursuing further surgery to remove the seminal vesicles, reduce the prostate, and cauterize the ejaculatory ducts. The aim is to achieve a minimum of semen production, and dry ejaculation.
I have this surgery planned for next week, and will update you on the results.


*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2529 on: 28/12/2008 07:47:03 »
Animus,


>>>>My theory has always been that my problems are in large part due to excessive semen loss.

I like that theory. The Hindu's believe that, as did the pre-Reformation Christians.

Florence Nightengale, The Beguines, The Shakers, Van Gogh, Newton, Tolstoy, Gandhi. All these folks had some serious concerns around sex and decided to stop.
Mohammed Ali wasn't sexual for 6 weeks before a title fight.
My favorite story though  is that JH Kellogg invented corn flakes to help in dulling the tastes to minimize potential sexual behavior...LOL


A good night to all

Steve D.




*

Offline Coreman

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • 22
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2530 on: 28/12/2008 12:37:07 »
Hi all,

I'd like to tell you that I've found something that really helps for me!

Its name is Alpha 20C. Manufactured by Sunrider.

Effects: my brain fog terminated, my good mood returned, as well as my physical strength. Together with my sense of humour and association skills.   

Administration:  I take 2,5-5 grams (one pack) right after an evening orgasm, and 5 grams(one pack) - in two portions - the day after.

It may not be placebo, owing to the situation I found it.
The way I discovered it: I felt under the weather thanks to a flu.A good friend of mine suggested taking it, in order to strengthen my immune system against the virus. I started to take it. Afterwards, a POIS episode started, and I took 5 g in the office, as a matter of course, against flu! Remarkably, my brain fog wore off in 10 minutes. I began to see the world much more clearly. My physical strength came back, too. I was over the moon!

So I started to take it directly against POIS. It helps a LOT.
(Important note! I also take Clonazepam, Wellbutrin, Ca+Mg, and Vitamin C, not solely Alpha 20C)     

I wonder if it would be useful for others. If somebody else takes a try, please leave feedback)

Conclusion: no conclusions. However, the "immunostimulant" character is more than interesting.

Looking forward to hearing from you,

Coreman

*

Offline Limejuice

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 313
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2531 on: 28/12/2008 15:11:48 »
So much positive news!

tarkington - how did you do it? I know, I know.  Are you still taking Swanson brand three times a day?  I'm going to try my bottle of it starting now.

Demo - nothing needs to be said for your management and leadership of this 'team'.  It would be all to fitting if your medical results found the culprit.

Coreman - Nice going!  I'll have to try it.

I've be chugging along in life still using fenugreek.  Something I've noticed after much use is that fenugreek suprising manages my blood sugar levels well.  Blood sugar is a problem area in POIS and may be the reason why fenugreek works for me.  Over and out.
« Last Edit: 28/12/2008 15:15:10 by Limejuice »

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2532 on: 28/12/2008 17:42:58 »
So much positive news!

tarkington - how did you do it? I know, I know.  Are you still taking Swanson brand three times a day?  I'm going to try my bottle of it starting now.

Demo - nothing needs to be said for your management and leadership of this 'team'.  It would be all to fitting if your medical results found the culprit.

Coreman - Nice going!  I'll have to try it.

I've be chugging along in life still using fenugreek.  Something I've noticed after much use is that fenugreek suprising manages my blood sugar levels well.  Blood sugar is a problem area in POIS and may be the reason why fenugreek works for me.  Over and out.

Limejuice, thanks for the summary/update...and for the nice compliment!

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2533 on: 28/12/2008 18:15:17 »
SEMEN LOSS

Fascinating subject. I chased Taoist Master/Author Mantak Chia's "orgasmic sex w/o ejaculation" theories and methods for years, and they failed me. Maybe because his technique simply diverts semen to the bladder and is thereby still "lost"?

(Semen Loss theories - they are numerous - generally posit that when semen leaves man, it takes a portion of his own life, leading to POIS-like results. Conversely, semen retention builds strong, healthy, vigorous life.)

My two big questions
1. If the ancient wisdom of semen loss/retention is true, why doesn't everyone in the world suffer POIS?To my understanding, the opposite is true: many people experience rejuvenation following orgasmic sex.

2. Nocturnal emission. This is involuntary and still causes the agony of POIS? Could the "God", or the Universe - that of the ancients - who created this system be so cruel? Should we wear eye-blinders so that we will never be stimulated, even ever-so-slightly, during the day?
« Last Edit: 29/12/2008 07:49:27 by demografx »

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2534 on: 28/12/2008 18:59:59 »
POIS, or the recovery phase after orgasm, which seem to be very closely related, is appearing to be very complex, because the nervous system is not only responsive to orgasm but to overall psycho-sexual arousal.

Hi, Underwater, interesting to see that some people here are affected by arousal. Thankfully, it doesn't affect me negatively.

There may never be a total "cure", but I for one would be ecstatic if I could reduce my symptoms to "mild discomfort" lasting less than one day. This is my goal.

For over 30 years, I gave up hope on that. But since this very active forum/thread began, I now believe it's possible for everyone.

Regarding Abraham Lincoln, I think he did the best he could given the pathetic state of pharmacology in the mid 19th century.

In my previous Lincoln quote, it seems to me that he believed willpower, not chemicals, was the way out of depression: "Most people are about as happy as they make up their minds to be." (Emphasis mine) I agree, Underwater, it was pathetic back then; too bad we couldn't give the poor guy a retroactive-Prozac trial packet!

I intend to focus on all aspects of my changing physiology: Behavioral (stress, exercise sleep etc), Psychological (attitudes, emotions), Nutritional/Dietary (Foods and Supplements), Immune System, Medical Interventions (prescription drugs if any), Other Professional Interventions (Chiropractor, Acupuncture etc.)and await great discoveries on this Forum!!!!!!!!!
Of course if I can be so lucky as to come upon anything helpful, I will so comment.
I may be making some progress now with my current supplements, but I think I will wait a few weeks before commenting. I am presently avoiding "O" if I can, out of necessity.

Underwater, this is most comprehensive and inspirational! Best wishes!
« Last Edit: 28/12/2008 22:11:03 by demografx »

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2535 on: 28/12/2008 22:09:50 »
It seems i was wrong and Pyropeach was right but i need to read it and read it again to have a good analysis.

Have you seen Pyropeach lately? Since I didn't see him, I "took over" his job of emailing listmembers who want it Dr Waldinger's POIS Study of 2002. Hope he's well.

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2536 on: 28/12/2008 22:36:09 »
ALPHA 20C/Sunrider

Very little I could find about the product, so I asked my pharmacology-lawyer friend, and will post his reply.

Meanwhile, I found this on a cancer forum about Sunrider. This is not to disparage Alpha 20C/Sunrider. I just feel obligated to report info on new POIS ideas when I see it.

from http://www.cancerforums.net/about10516.html
"What I don't like is that Sunrider's marketing scheme is basically a MLM [multi-level marketing]system where you either pay $30/yr to buy direct online or $140 one time to be a "distributor" and get a 40% discount ordering online. These products are also expensive. It costs me $400/mo for the products my wife and I use but I personally believe they are quality products I just wish they had a better way to go about marketing them. Basically I love the products but I'm not really interested in marketing them to others in the "Amway" fashion they try to employ."
« Last Edit: 28/12/2008 22:44:03 by demografx »

*

Offline CertainlyPOIS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 727
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2537 on: 28/12/2008 23:12:02 »
srry about last post i was just testing to see if it works.   

On the Semen loss theory

I dont think is semen loss but probably orgasm because i had an orgasm without emission while i was sleeping. 
I knew this because of my dream and also waking up to check my surroudings for signs of emission, which there was none.
I was sure i had an orgasm when the previous day my daily life was superb i was socializing with ease, memory fine and thinking better than i expected but the next day all my nightmares returned. 

*

Offline CertainlyPOIS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 727
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2538 on: 28/12/2008 23:14:34 »
On Fenugreek
I used two tablets and got great night rest after orgasm.  I saw some improvements, brain fog dissapeared, tiredness improved , however socializaion and thinking problems where not changed at all.

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2539 on: 29/12/2008 00:14:35 »
>>>>Hi, Underwater, interesting to see that some people here are affected by arousal. Thankfully, it doesn't affect me negatively.

I am affected by arousal, but not near to the degree that orgasm affects me.

I am affected by orgasm in that, last night, I experienced some seminal loss with my partner.
This morning I felt needy, hurt, sad, lonely (A meta-feeling I describe as grief, which is quite different from depression). I felt numbed, low self esteem, a tendency toward self pity, negativity, isolation and thinking I was different ( in a negative way).

I also felt physically exhausted but the overwhelming feeling was physical weakness.

I am able, through attitudinal shifts, to nurture myself through grief, and I did this morning, but the physical weakness is something different.
It's extremely common in therapy circles to ascribe these symptoms, after orgasm , to unresolved childhood abuse issues.
That's not my experience...

There is a neurochemical loss in my brain upon being orgasmic regardless of my emotional or physical wellness. I experienced that last night and reported it immediately to my partner. She, thankfully. has gotten to where she doesn't take POIS personally, and I am grateful.

I've gotten to where I accept that, this is fact, in me, and choose to look at it like money. I can save/invest money or spend it on vacation. Both are excellent activities, but I can't do both with the same money (read-sexual energy)

Thanks for the forum,

Steve D.






*

Offline Counterpoints

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 592
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2540 on: 29/12/2008 02:48:44 »
I have recently finished my second bottle of Relora.  That means about two months.  During that time I have had an orgasm on average at least once a day. During that time I have also taken a Centrum Daily tablet every day.  The results:  I have not felt the effects of brain fog and axiety and total mental depression in two months.  However, I have noticed, as a single male who is not sexually active, that I still have emotional problems like loneliness and feeling down some days due to my own emotional problems.  These emotional problems were existant before I started taking Relora and are still there. 

Great news Tarkington.  I understand what you mean.  My POIS symptoms seem mostly independent of my emotional state.  (I say "mostly", because being in a good mood always tends to diminish other problems, slightly.  But sometimes I've been in a very bad mood, and still been completely free of POIS!).

How long did it take you to see dramatic improvement with Relora?  I have been taking Relora about 3x/day (250 mg) for 2 weeks.  I've also been taking about 300 mg of phosphytidylserine per day.  And 5 mg bisoprolol/day (beta-blocker).  Plus some B6, and Ashwaganda.  So a lot of cortisol reducing supplements!


*

Offline martin88

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 453
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2541 on: 29/12/2008 04:18:37 »
An interesting website from University of Maryland, talking about supplements and complementary medicine. http://www.umm.edu/altmed/

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2542 on: 29/12/2008 06:43:29 »
On the Semen loss theory

I dont think is semen loss but probably orgasm because i had an orgasm without emission while i was sleeping. 
I knew this because of my dream and also waking up to check my surroudings for signs of emission, which there was none.
I was sure i had an orgasm when the previous day my daily life was superb i was socializing with ease, memory fine and thinking better than i expected but the next day all my nightmares returned. 

CCc, this is very interesting. I experienced this and researched it and it was called "brain orgasm". But brain orgasms never led to POIS for me. But brain orgasms w/nocturnal emissions did.

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2543 on: 29/12/2008 07:46:26 »
On Fenugreek
I used two tablets and got great night rest after orgasm.  I saw some improvements, brain fog dissapeared, tiredness improved , however socializaion and thinking problems where not changed at all.

Really appreciate the fenugreek update!

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2544 on: 29/12/2008 07:57:39 »
I've also been taking about 300 mg of phosphytidylserine per day.  And 5 mg bisoprolol/day (beta-blocker).  Plus some B6, and Ashwaganda.  So a lot of cortisol reducing supplements!

Just curious, CP, besides Relora, how did you come up with this protocol to reduce cortisol? Thanks.

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2545 on: 29/12/2008 08:04:19 »
Tried Relora for the first time four hours ago.

Felt headachy, heart palpitations, speedy, then sleepy, relaxed/sedated, libido diminution and a little druggy/high.

Steve D.

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2546 on: 29/12/2008 08:14:05 »
Quote from: demografx on 28/10/2008 14:42:35

IMPORTANT: ...RELORA - PLEASE READ!
From my pharmacology-lawyer friend:

RELORA

"Relora is a plant extract. Because the actual active ingredients are not discernible, there's no way to know what the interactions with other drugs might be. Therefore, I would recommend not taking it with Rx drugs,or with OTC drugs either.

This is what the manufacturer says: [Note the elevation in BP]

'side effects also include dizziness, trouble sleeping, and higher blood pressure.'  "

Limejuice (and others) - always a good idea to check out Relora - and other meds/supplements - with your healthcare professional advisor.

[I think the "higher blood pressure" note was directed at me since I take blood pressure meds -Demo]

Relora is also mentioned/discussed in these forum posts:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=relora+site%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fthenakedscientists.com
« Last Edit: 29/12/2008 08:21:23 by demografx »

*

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • 8199
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2547 on: 29/12/2008 08:23:55 »
Curcuma increases cortisol.

Thanks, B_Jim, I guess some people are low in cortisol?

*

Offline SteveD

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • 197
  • "God is Truth"...Gandhi
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2548 on: 29/12/2008 14:15:27 »
Going to couples therapy again today. My partner is very challenged by the idea of letting go of me being orgasmic, however, a number of things in her life seem to be improving, as does my life, when I let go of the desire for me to be orgasmic. There seems to be something about intentionality here. Even in NE's. I used to feel bad about being orgasmic in my sleep, until I realized that being orgasmic, when not induced physically , is simply another feeling. I stopped trying to control it, and let myself feel that way, as I do all my feelings. I still had POIS symptoms but they were 10-15% as potent.

*

Offline tarkington

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • 39
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2549 on: 29/12/2008 17:46:22 »
So much positive news!

tarkington - how did you do it? I know, I know.  Are you still taking Swanson brand three times a day?  I'm going to try my bottle of it starting now.

Well, I miraculously found this forum and knew that I was suffering from the same problems following orgasm.  Then I read the forum looking for anything to help.  Relora and seaweed were the suggestions that stood out to me. They seemed safe (I am not taking any other medications) because both were natural.  I never tried the seaweed because Relora worked so well. 

I started taking Relora for three days (three times a day) and had an orgasm with litle to no symptoms.  Following another recommendation, at the same time I started taking daily vitamins.  Since Relora does work so well for me, and Relora is a cortisol decreaser, I am assuming that the only issue I had after orgasm was a large increase in cortisol. And since my previous symptoms were insomnia (the same night), brain fog, mental anxiety, and just feeling terrible depression with no social skills (for three days), I assume that cortisol was the cause.  My cortisol levels peaked the day of orgasm and gradually decreased for three days until back to normal.

Also since Fenugreek is supposed to increase cortisol and Relora decreases, perhaps either Relora or Fenugreek are the solution for the brain fog and mental problems.  It's only a matter of whether your body increases or decreases cortisol after orgasm.  If Fenugreek works then maybe its because immediately after orgasm those people have a large decrease in cortisol with the same effects as a large increase in cortisol (that doesn't make sense to me... how can a low amount have the same effects as a high amount) 

Just throwing out my opinion and thinking aloud... any ideas?