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pyropeach: there definitely is hope for you to "grow out of this".
There have been cases of complete POIS recovery. Unfortunately, once someone recovers they probably don't feel compelled to help others (anyone who recovers has to promise to let us know all about it! ).... In fact, this last year I was close to 100% recovery. I still no longer suffer from brain fog (on most occasions), and I know how to remedy that symptom in the case that I do. The other symptoms have returned somewhat -- I would describe them as a feeling of being in great withdrawal -- but they are also improving.
The Orgasm Cure...If anything, perhaps this 'good orgasm' effect will help us learn more about the underlying cause of this problem: how could the *severe* symptoms that follow one orgasm be alleviated by a subsequent orgasm?
One thing I am absolutely secure, when I have an orgasm I feel almost inmediately that something weird happens in my stomach. I feel like my organism whants to sweep stomach contents to intestine, and that get manifested with fatigue and bad mood. I think that may be some substance poured inside by the orgasm mechanism produce this effect. The process I described it last few days and it is acompanied by other common Pois symthoms that I think are result of that process. And not necessarly having diarrea, it is not my case, I start to get very constipated, wich it helps to get worse others symthomps, like to much fatigue, headaches, swollen nose, greasy nose, sweats, get hungry, specially need for sugar foods somethimes or big meals, little of acne, hard hair hard to comb, among many others.
Here's the note I just sent to Dr William Timmins at Bio Health Diagnostics:
Counterpoints: I'm pretty sure I'd remember if I had read about cases of complete recovery; are you assuming that these 100% recovery cases exist based on your own experience of near 100% recovery? If so then intuitively I might agree, because there are times when my symptoms seem almost negligible. But from time to time I get clobbered badly for about a week. So I consider myself at risk and try to minimize the risk of a rogue episode impacting on 'normal' life.I will consider myself 100% recovered when I know that having an orgasm has not, at any time in the previous few months (perhaps more like 6 to 12 months), resulted in any degree of brain fog, or persistant myalgia, dizziness, fatigue etc.
Hey guys! Guess what! I got a response from the people at the Bio Health Diagnostics Lab. Here it is.   "This is a new one for us. Dr. (William) Timmins is no longer available for these matters, but I will be asking around my top clients to see if anyone has ideas. Follow up with me in a week or so." (Bryan Timmins) By "top clients" he means health care professionals who use his laboratory services. Hopefully there is someone in that clientele pool that cares enough to want to help us figure this out. Let's keep our fingers crossed!
sparx, there have been cases of 100% recovery. You will see references to this if you read this thread from the beginning again. Someone (with POIS) was given Zoloft for depression. Supposedly it did not cure the depression, but there was a 100% recovery from POIS.Perhaps that is not a 'cure', but it is a 100% treatment, in any case, for that person. There may have also been a case where someone used Wellbutrin and recovered from POIS. (This would make sense if POIS were primarily caused by dopamine depletion).
I'm seriously considering Wellbutrin (Zyban) to see if its effects on POIS brain fog. Just a little hesitant though, because the possible side-effects look a bit scary and it would have to happen in a systematic way over several weeks to really understand its efficacy (meaning also, that if it doesn't work or takes time to kick in I could be fogged for weeks - not an appealing thought).
If anybody is interested i found a connection between asexuality and high prolactin.On a Dutch site "http://www.lydiavanderweide.nl/viva/artikel.php?pArt=017 [nofollow]" i found out:"Wanneer bij mannen of vrouwen het lichaam bijvoorbeeld veel te veel prolactine produceert - het hormoon dat bij vrouwen wordt afgescheiden die borstvoeding geven - zijn zij op geen enkele manier te prikkelen en ervaren geen zin of lust. Dit hormoon zet de sexuele thermostaat namelijk op nul."Wich translates as:"When the body of men and women produces to much prolactine - The hormone that is excrated by women who breast feed - they are in no way susceptible to libido and they have no interest in sex. This hormone sets the sexual termostate to 0."Given the fact that men are known to masturbate on average every 3 days. And the people here can often go without sex to up to a month without major problems. This might be an indication of high prolactin.Of high prolactin, and acompanying low dopamine, it is known to cause symptoms similar to the once described on this forum and here:http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_in_the_brain [nofollow]Which might be an indication that post orgasmic symptoms are a form of asexuality. The body does not want sex and if you do it anyway it reacts badly.
my POIS is similar to things I do that deplete my adrenaline, like playing soccer or rugby for more than 2 hours, I get very tired and sometimes nauseas, dehydrated. if anyone plays tennis or squash or does very physical extreme sport for more than 3 hours, tell us if your feelin the day afterwards is similar to POIS. I guess if you are fit, then your POIS is also not as bad as the days when you were unfit? With fit I mean trained to endure long physical activity, and good lung pump to muscular and nervous system.A good indication may be: does POIS make your legs and arms stiff. Like you feel you cannot stretch them easily?
Demografx: I don't see why Levitra would be more or less dangerous depending on whether the person taking it had ED?
Michael,I'd like to know if you have other sources mentionning differents ranges than conventionals for hormones. Also, is there a place where i can read about the top 5 labs ? I believe that lack of testosterone or problem with testosterone utilization is involved in pois but i'm concerned about side effects of T replacement. For example testicles shrinking (at least it's hormone cream savings !). What can you do for this ? http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=173268 [nofollow]A solution can be to take clomid to restart your own production of T but the whole thing seems to me to be a risk. http://www.saanabolicreview.co.za/clomid.html [nofollow]Please keep us informed about the planned tests you mention in your post, i'll apreciate.In the link posted by Sparx http://www.alternativesmagazine.com/36/robinson.html [nofollow]it's written : "after sexual satiation there is a drastic reduction in androgen receptor density". Does someone know more about these androgens receptors ? This theory can explain why only the first shot of T was effective for Demografx. (or placebo you're right Demografx !)I know about 5 alpha-reductase deficiency which is causing lack of DHT (an androgen responsible for secondary sexual characteristics)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-alpha_reductase [nofollow]Perhaps it's the androgen receptor mentionned above.
Quote from: hk1979 on 13/05/2008 19:31:05my POIS is similar to things I do that deplete my adrenaline, like playing soccer or rugby for more than 2 hours, I get very tired and sometimes nauseas, dehydrated. if anyone plays tennis or squash or does very physical extreme sport for more than 3 hours, tell us if your feelin the day afterwards is similar to POIS. I guess if you are fit, then your POIS is also not as bad as the days when you were unfit? With fit I mean trained to endure long physical activity, and good lung pump to muscular and nervous system.A good indication may be: does POIS make your legs and arms stiff. Like you feel you cannot stretch them easily?Yes after 2-3 hours of exercise/sports the next morning will feel like a POIS morning, very similar although not as intense.
Hi there! I have been curious about this problem for a long time; I finally found this message board and have been casually working on a response for a while. I am a 28 year old male who has been diagnosed with PVFS (post-viral fatigue syndrome) or equivalent (CFS, chronic fatigue syndrome), which developed relatively suddenly when I was about 14 years old; “POIS” didn't become a major problem until late teens when CFS became worse, although perhaps existed in mild form until then. I have since been attributing POIS-like symptoms to CFS as a secondary complication, but it could instead be a separate additional condition?The symptoms that people here describe as POIS are similar to the post-exertional aspect of CFS. However with CFS, any type of significant exertion (physical or cognitive) can cause an exacerbation of symptoms, and abstinence from such exertion doesn't resolve the baseline symptoms. I don't think CFS and POIS are the same illness, but I can vouch for noteworthy similarities. I don't know how common POIS is for people with CFS. For me, even though POIS symptoms and other post-exertional CFS symptoms aren't exactly the same, both have or can cause an increase in myalgia/arthralgia & fatigue as well as cognitive symptoms. The possibility of POIS being a neuroimmune effect has been discussed at this forum; this is intriguing to me because some researchers suspect that CFS is a neuroimmune disorder or state. Also, the field of “psycho-neuro-endocrino-immunology” may open up a whole new understanding of illnesses which have previously remained “under the radar”, like POIS. Unless there are serious disturbances relating to psychosocial stress or religious guilt, I doubt that POIS is a psychological problem. Also, I have noticed that some philosophers have viewed sexual activity as seriously draining and unhealthy, but they may have had POIS themselves and therefore incorporated it into their world view; most healthy people don't experience these symptoms even if they are hypersexual (some people may feel sleepy for 10 minutes but then they are OK).I have typed up more to say later about my experience with POIS and related ideas about what I think it is, but this first message is plenty for a introduction! Regards, "post-chronic".
Michael, thank you for these posts. You can try differents treatments but you should be careful with your body (specially with hormones), you have only one. I'm not sure if L-Cartinine will be of any help. You can see in my precedents posts (not a lot) the hormone tests i have done.
when i was 23 my cortisol level was too high (pois day 10) . I was taking multivitamin at this time (with C and B5 in it). I have never done any other test after that but perhaps it's still high because i often wake up very early (3am). When i was 35 i have done a bioavailable testosterone test pois day 15 and the result was 5 (normal range 4 - 15). I wasn't doing sport at all at this time. I wasn't very tired before the test.2 years later i have done an other one for testosterone, pois day 1, exactly the same test, same hour. I was very tired before the test. Result 8 (normal 4 - 15) .I was surprised because i red this study : http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11760788 [nofollow] (about this study my doc say it's not a problem because testosterone stay in the range)I was playing tennis 2h00/week at this time. Perhaps this could have changed the result . I have never played tennis before in my life, i'm not very sports oriented since pois, however at 26 i was able to run non stop for two hours every day, only with total sexual abstinence and good nutrition. If i had a wet dream i could only run (not easily) 15-20 min which is not a lot with the training i had at this time. Hope this helps. For me it's only confusion.
...there have been cases of 100% recovery. You will see references to this if you read this thread from the beginning again. Someone (with POIS) was given Zoloft for depression. Supposedly it did not cure the depression, but there was a 100% recovery from POIS.
I suggest all those with questions on this topic to visit(LINK REMOVED !)
WELCOME TO ALL THE NEW PEOPLEI continue to be astounded by the incredible contributions of everyone, including the new people here at the POIS Forum! Thank you all!