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  4. How to calculate current from electrons flow
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How to calculate current from electrons flow

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Offline scientizscht (OP)

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How to calculate current from electrons flow
« on: 19/11/2019 12:47:59 »
Hello

A reaction generates 0.083mol of electrons per 90min.

What is the power/current of this?

Thanks
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Online chiralSPO

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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #1 on: 19/11/2019 13:17:58 »
Current is easy to calculate from these numbers, just use Faraday's constant: 1 mole of electrons has a charge of 96485 Coulombs

And 1 amp is the movement of 1 Coulomb per second.

To calculate the power, you will need to multiply current by potential drop across the circuit.
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #2 on: 19/11/2019 15:40:27 »
Great thanks. What happens to an electron when it is generated in an oxidising molecule inside water?
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #3 on: 19/11/2019 16:01:26 »
The electron has to go somewhere. Either there is an oxidizing agent in the solution that takes the electron (or electrons), thereby getting reduced, or there is an electrode nearby that can accept the electron(s), which then flow through a circuit to reach the oxidizing agent.
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #4 on: 19/11/2019 18:05:20 »
Interesting, how does the electrode solution works exactly? Is it a piece of metal in contact with the oxidative or it needs to be connected to a battery or something?
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #5 on: 19/11/2019 18:35:07 »
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_cell
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolytic_cell
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Offline evan_au

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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #6 on: 20/11/2019 04:57:51 »
Quote from: scientizht
]or it needs to be connected to a battery or something?
This is a common way of creating a battery.

Quote
Is it a piece of metal in contact with the oxidative
Battery chemistry gets very complex, because gas is often generated at one electrode; the gas is insulating and blocks the flow of electrons and/or builds up pressure and explodes the battery.
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #7 on: 21/11/2019 20:30:53 »
If electrons are continuously generated from a reaction and are transferred to a conductive material (electrode) immersed in the solution, what will happen? The electrode is not connected anywhere as the goal is to move away the electrons and not generate electricity. Is there a technology used for that?
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #8 on: 22/11/2019 14:54:32 »
The circuit must be completed for electrons to flow for any meaningful amount of time. The closest thing I can think of is a capacitor.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supercapacitor
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolytic_capacitor
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Offline evan_au

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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #9 on: 22/11/2019 17:18:13 »
Quote from: scientizscht
the goal is to move away the electrons and not generate electricity
A Van der Graaf generator moves electrons, and is not an electrical generator, and does not require the circuit to be closed
- In fact, it consumes electricity to move more and more electrons to the negative terminal.
- It takes thousands of electron volts of energy to move one electron to the negative terminal, once it gets going (and its not real efficient anyway...)
- This is far more energy than you can get out of chemical reactions - perhaps 0.5 to 3 electron-volts.

This meets your criteria and yet is such an inefficient solution that I wonder what you are trying to achieve?
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_der_Graaf_Generator

Quote from: ChiralSPO
The closest thing I can think of is a capacitor.
Electricity will flow until the capacitor charges up to the electrochemical potential of the reaction.
Then the electrical field will slow down (and almost stop) the reaction generating the electrons.
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #10 on: 22/11/2019 18:41:10 »
My goal is to remove the electrons from the electrode so that the reaction continues and is not inhibited by the accumulated electrons in the electrode.

What materials can take many electrons before they inhibit new ones coming in? Or capacitors? Or is there any sacrificial material that can take lots of electrons?

I am looking for 1Amper, how many grams of such materials/capacitors are needed?
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #11 on: 22/11/2019 20:20:40 »
Protons can accept electrons and become hydrogen (given suitable pH and potential).

Oxygen from the air can accept electrons (and protons) to make water (given suitable pH and potential).

Plenty of metal cations can accept electrons to make their neutral metal (given suitable potential).

As always, the more information you provide about what you actually want to do, the more relevant the answers you get will be.
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #12 on: 22/11/2019 20:43:50 »
OK but the thing is that once the electrons are generated by the reaction, they will move into the electrode. So the electrode will become negatively charged.

Is there an electrode that will grab protons like the electrodes that grab electrons? I know that there are conductive polymers that grab electrons generated from reactions.

If we can do the same with protons, won't this result in a positively charged electrode?

So if we connect those two electrodes, won't the electrons and the protons move to the middle of the connection under the potential generated and release hydrogen?
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Re: How to calculate current from electrons flow
« Reply #13 on: 22/11/2019 20:55:50 »
Protons can't move through wires--they move through electrolytes.

If the goal is to produce hydrogen, you don't need any wires--just use an active metal like aluminum, magnesium, zinc, or even iron, and react it directly with acid (aluminum will also react vigorously with strongly alkaline water).

If you want to use wires, the same reaction can be done such that the metal gets oxidized far from where the protons get reduced, but there still needs to be a way for electrons to flow from reductant to oxidant (wire) and ions to flow between reactions (electrolyte). If the reaction won't go spontaneously, you can even push it along using an applied potential (have a driving force for the electrons in the wire to pull electrons out of reductant, and shove them into the oxidant)
« Last Edit: 22/11/2019 21:00:59 by chiralSPO »
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