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Quote from: iko on 22/08/2007 22:05:55I overstressed on purpose intriguing reports from medical literature to open the discussion on how to find a cheap and easy way to avoid these treatable ailments going undetected for months and years, with all the human suffering involved. In a few words, modern PCR technology will eventually allow us -in the near future- to develop special inexpensive microchips to detect by one simple blood test most of the germs that we carry 'on board'.An infectious disease will be diagnosed in seconds starting from the germ this time, not from patients' medical history, signs and symptoms.Quite a little revolution in clinical medicine, but today we do already use other 'screening' tests.Of course we'll need top notch sensitivity and the highest number of bugs searched through a single test, to make it reliable, easy and cheap.Unfortunately, these days we see some of this magic hightech show used mostly in forensic medicine.ikodnotes [^] http://images.the-scientist.com/content/figures/0890-3670-050411-44-1-1.jpghttp://www.five.tv/media/image/11970633.jpgQuote from: iko on 15/06/2007 23:22:25The BugWhat is it? Where is it found?How is it transmitted? What diseases does it cause? Who/what is at risk of infection? click here for free full-text!http://microbiology.mtsinai.on.ca/bug/TW/tw-bug.shtml
I overstressed on purpose intriguing reports from medical literature to open the discussion on how to find a cheap and easy way to avoid these treatable ailments going undetected for months and years, with all the human suffering involved.
The BugWhat is it? Where is it found?How is it transmitted? What diseases does it cause? Who/what is at risk of infection? click here for free full-text!http://microbiology.mtsinai.on.ca/bug/TW/tw-bug.shtml
Working in a laboratory, I see very few 'real patients'and follow some cases through clinical reports from mycollegues and friends.Then I read med. literature and case reports, of course.In the last few years WD draw my attention for variousreasons:- Intriguing clinical presentations.- technical difficulties in making diagnosis.- cheap, easy and instantly accessible cure (when caught on time).- reported as a 'very rare' disease, but underdiagnosed frequently.- cases found more often in Europe (many in Germany and Switzerland?).I open the discussion with simple bits and peaces plus whipple-picsHope many of the NKSforum readers will partecipate in this open thread. http://www.sanger.ac.uk/Info/Press/gfx/030221_T_whipplei_300.jpg
Could you explain Hypersomnia better please?
Any comment, criticism, contribution?While I'm here waiting, I post a new Carnivalin Venice picture that I've just grabbed...http://www.ssqq.com/halloween/images/venice%2001a.jpg
Whipple disease is a very rare infectionmainly observed in middle-aged men andonly in some cases affecting the brain.Statistically, of course.
Hummm I see maybe a young boy, but No women?? Why do you suppose?
Quote from: Karen W. on 03/07/2007 00:00:00Hummm I see maybe a young boy, but No women?? Why do you suppose?Hey,I'm not going to report and copy ALL whipple cases in MedLine!But if you check the previous abstracts, you'll find women too...In autoimmune disorders women win 10 to one, approximately.Immune systems -is suggested- are heavily controlled by sex hormones.We should ask Chris about Whipple naughty beasts...he doesn't seem interested, or he's just too busy right now.May be he had a very bad Carnival in Venice! Take careikod
Do you mean ask him about the fastedious bugs you spoke of to me when you are talking about this? "We should ask Chris about Whipple naughty beasts...he doesn't seem interested, or he's just too busy right now" Are those the same ones you refer to that can get into your heart??
Quote from: Karen W. on 03/07/2007 00:31:07Do you mean ask him about the fastedious bugs you spoke of to me when you are talking about this? "We should ask Chris about Whipple naughty beasts...he doesn't seem interested, or he's just too busy right now" Are those the same ones you refer to that can get into your heart?? Me no catch this: too difficult 4me.Say it in italian!ikodfused 
Screening and diagnosisWhipple's disease is rare and many doctors may be unfamiliar with the disorder, so it's often diagnosed in its late stages. However, the earlier the diagnosis, the better because of the serious health risks associated with nontreatment.
Quote from: iko on 03/07/2007 00:55:57Quote from: Karen W. on 03/07/2007 00:31:07Do you mean ask him about the fastedious bugs you spoke of to me when you are talking about this? "We should ask Chris about Whipple naughty beasts...he doesn't seem interested, or he's just too busy right now" Are those the same ones you refer to that can get into your heart?? Me no catch this: too difficult 4me.Say it in italian!ikodfused It's OK Iko I am confused to a lot lately.. don't pay any attention to that post as I can't figure it out either..! LOL! Only slept for 3 hours felt like 3 minutes.... I have re read it and think I was thinking that the infectious bugs that can get into your heart heart might they be one and the same as in Whipples disease?? I think that is what I was asking.. LOL That still sounds wrong.. HEE HEE HEE.. Oh well!
iko,First, let me say thank you to you for your insight and thoughts on Tropheryma whipplei bacteria.A good friend of mine has recently begun treatment consistent with that for Whipple's disease.After reading a bit on this bacteria and the Whipple's disease, I have come to believe that it is considered to be rare only because it is so difficult to observe.I think Tropheryma whipplei may be a common germ in our environment, nevertheless it causes troubles in very few people. Even considering a consistent number of undiagnosed cases, it should be a rare pathogen anyway.I overstressed on purpose intriguing reports from medical literature to open the discussion on how to find a cheap and easy way to avoid these treatable ailments go undetected for months and years, with all the human suffering involved. Also, I am curious about a few potential issues relating to this bacteria:- Is this bacteria is able to be passed from one person to another by becoming airborne?I think it survives happily in the environment (Actinomycetae) with its triple layer membrane, consequently air, dust, water and contacts may be the routes of infection.As in many other cases, infection is routinely kept under control efficiently by the defence systems: only in rare instances -probably because of some immune defect- whipple bacteria manage to spread around.See the previously cited reviews for details.- Has any researcher actually ever seen this bacteria alive, since an electron microscope does not allow for live viewing?Interesting point: Whipple bacteria had been successfully cultured at the end of the last century. They are intracellular germs...I think it's quite difficult to see them alive.- If not, how does this restrict the effort of researchers to understand the nature of this bacteria?- Could many, many diseases that are presently known to the medical community be simply manifestations of different stages of this bacteria's existence within its human host and be incorrectly viewed as stand alone diseases?Good point, and the actual target of this thread, but never forget that this could be just one of several germs playing dirty tricks and hiding behind some 'idiopathic' human diseases.I decided to start with this peculiar one knowing that it's not alone.- Are some or all of the bacteria in the family of this bacteria being underestimated in terms of their ability to work together?- Can evolutionary change to any of the (six?) bacteria in this family allow a systematic evolution from one to another to another ... and ultimately to the T whipelii?I'd like to be able to answer these questions! - Is it possible that this bacteria plays a very substantial role in cancer diseases?We cannot exclude it, if we accept the connection between persistent infection, chronic inflammation and cancerogenesis. Helicobacter pylori causes intestinal lymphomas and gastric cancer.- Do you think that routine efforts to check for this bacteria and further understand the likelihood of its role in medical conditions listed on the following website as soon as a few of these symptoms are recognized (http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/whipples-disease/DS00757/DSECTION=2) would help to substantially increase advanced detection of this bacteria, prevent more advanced illnesses and deaths, and thus save the medical industry money?Give me some time to check this out...- Do you believe that until this bacteria is dressed up in threads of economics and globally paraded before the medical insurance industry as a profit thief that that industry will continue to underestimate it or overlook it?Sometimes peculiar issues and rare disorders are ignored just like that: I would not always search for a hidden negative influence by medical insurance industry or others.I tend to think that we need many more new smart brains most of all, honest enthusiastic researchers. I've met many, maybe we need more.Medical research about fastidious persistent germs could be partly supported by our govs and independent foundations. Major pharmaceutical companies will followThank you again for your insight and for your devotion to this subject.I look forward to seeing what your responses to these questions are.
iko,Thank you very much for your responses to my questions.Kindly take notice of some relatively new findings regarding previous studies on the prevalence of Tropheryma whipplei in certain populations.http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1890548If this new study is accurate, then how does this affect the widely held belief that for those testing positive for the Tropheryma whipplei bacteria in their saliva that the bacteria itself is less responsible for disease than a defect in one's immune system or individual immunity to Tropheryma whipplei? <<<<<<<this is the key question here!Previous estimates have suggested that as many as 40% of the population carry Tropheryma whipplei in their saliva, and that only a small percentage of those testing positive for it have Whipple's disease - or one of the accepted forms of it. Is it possible that the methods used in the new study could still have overlooked additional false positives, despite greatly reducing the prevalence of Trpheryma whipplei in the general population?Am I misreading the data or are as much as 80% of the positives reviewed, in this May 2007 study, "false positives?"Thank you again for your time and effort.
iko,Sorry for my delay in responding.Do most symptoms for a person suffering from parasites mimic those of a person suffering from a classic case of Whipple's disease?There are many different species of parasites and they cause a wide variety of symptoms, so the 'classic' presentation of Whipple's disease, diarrhea-fever-weightloss-anemia and joint pain may overlap a parasite infestation.Anyway, parasites are carefully searched in any severe case of diarrhea.Once antibiotic treatment for classic Whipple's disease is ongoing, should routine blood analysis show histaminase and basophils reacting as though one is being treated for parasites?I cannot answer this question.WD bacteria duplication time is very long: approx. 18days.When you start antibiotic therapy bacteria don't die in a short time, and for this reason treatment has to be extended (at least one year).Are these just overlapping symptoms and reactions?Thank you again.