[neilep (OP)]

Dearest Acid Advisors,

This is a bottle of Hydrochloric Acid



Nice isn't it ?..notice how well stored in a glass container and non-in-my-tummy it is ?


But it does live in my tummy doesn't it?

I know it breaks down food and stuff but then what happens to the acid ?...if the acid is constantly being replenished then where does the old acid go ?

[Karen W.]

I suspect that a certain amount is excreted into your tumy for digestion of food and is then carried out with the digested food. through the bowels etc. I think you also loose it through regurgitation when one is sick!

[Chemistry4me]

The food released from the stomach (chyme) moves on to the first part of the small intestine, the duodenum. Two digestive juices are secreted here- bile and pancreatic juice. Bile is a yellow-grenn alkaline liquid and it is this which neutralises the acidic effect of hydrochloric acid. It also plays a big part in fat digestion...

[Madidus_Scientia]

And it doesn't eat your stomach itself away because your stomach is constantly producing a protective layer of mucus.

[Make it Lady]

So if we have protective mucus, how do we get ulcers?

[graham.d]

The mucus production doesn't always give 100% protection and the acid strength can vary. Look up Helicobacter Pylori. I had recurring ulcers for years until these beasts were discovered by an Australian doctor (who infected and then cured himself to prove the point). I had a blood test to show that I indeed had this infection (and many people do), had a cocktail of antibiotics, then a "breath test" to verify the infection had been irradicated. Hey presto, never had an ulcer since.

[graham.d]

Of course sheep have four stomachs. Only the last of these has Hydrochloric acid in it. The pH is regulated by cells that sense the acidity and control production of more acid when needed (in humans and sheep).

[iko]

So if we have protective mucus, how do we get ulcers?

The mucus production doesn't always give 100% protection and the acid strength can vary. Look up Helicobacter Pylori. I had recurring ulcers for years until these beasts were discovered by an Australian doctor (who infected and then cured himself to prove the point). I had a blood test to show that I indeed had this infection (and many people do), had a cocktail of antibiotics, then a "breath test" to verify the infection had been irradicated. Hey presto, never had an ulcer since.

http://bioweb.uwlax.edu/bio203/s2008/pluym_evan/pictures/H%20pylori%20DJ%20flagella%20bulb.JPG

...4-6 flagella to swim from mucous to gastric cells and a specific enzyme, UREASE, to protect itself from the acid: helicobacter pylori is really unique in being able to survive in our stomachs and create problems ...sometime.

http://bioweb.uwlax.edu/bio203/s2008/pluym_evan/adaptation.htm

BTW, the "Australian doctor" were these two nice guys, Nobel Prize 2005 for Physiology & Medicine:

http://www.australianoftheyear.org.au/pages/images/WA%20Prof%20Barry%20Marshall%20&%20Prof%20Robin%20Warren%20AOTY%20(2).jpg

Barry Marshall and Robin Warren

Enjoy their Nobel Prize Lectures, interviews and their story in free-videos:
http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/medicine/laureates/2005/index.html


http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=14109.msg174127#msg174127
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6898.0

[Chemistry4me]

Helicobacter pylori is a bacterium that lives in the stomach wall of many people, and normally does no harm. In some people, the delicate balance between human host and bacterium becomes upset, and in some way triggers the processes leading to an ulcer.

[Karen W.]

A man I have known for now on 25 years, just 2 Years ago, had a really bad round with that heliobactor crud! He at one point when younger also had legionairs disease.... which almost Killed him... but the bacteria in the last caused him a great deal of grief for almost 2 years. He is Just now recovering and dealing with some heart problems from out of the blue!

He also dealt with ulcers which were horrible.. but since being treated are doing quite well.

[lancenti]

You can also get ulcers if you take NSAIDs which are non-specific COX Suppressors which cause the lining of your stomach to thin out since one of those enzymes are responsible for maintaining the mucous lining of your stomach.

So much for stress being the cause of ulcers.

[Make it Lady]

I hate doctors that blame things on stress. Why don't they just say "I don't know what is wrong with you."

[iko]

I hate doctors that blame things on stress. Why don't they just say "I don't know what is wrong with you."

You are certainly right MILady.
Squirrels look highly "stressed"
all the time and survive!
Stress is life...look at nature!
Watch this video of Bill Maher on BigPharma for a good laugh...

http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=TfDSlfVqjx8

[graham.d]

Hmm, well for someone who had an ulcer for many years before getting the H Pylori elimination treatment and a total cure, I would say that there WAS a relationship between stress and ulcers. The prime enabling cause was indeed the H Pylori, but many have H Pylori and do not get ulcers. I can only speak from personal experience, but I could often correlate the onset of an ulcer recurrence with periods of stress. Ever since I can remember my stomach has had a response to stress, and I know I am not alone when I had stomach "upsets" before exams or acting in a play etc. etc., or later, before a job interview or giving a presentation to a large audience. If peaks of stress can have such an effect, it seems reasonable that sustained stress can have an adverse effect on the digestive system too. I would not be too quick to ignore a collective view that was developed over a long period.

[iko]

Of course you are right graham.d: stress is bad and my "squirrels" citation was a joke.
The point here is not to blame patients for inevitable stress from everyday life, but search for a removable cause like H.pylori that had been neglected for such a long time.
In his Nobel Prize Lecture, Dr. Barry Marshall explains this much better than me: being so deeply involved in this matter, you cannot miss these documentaries for good Science...and a good laugh too!

http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/medicine/laureates/2005/marshall-lecture.html

ikod

[graham.d]

Yes Iko, it was a programme on TV (well before he got a Nobel prize) where I learnt about the connection with H Pylori and his discovery that these bacteria thrived in acid where it had been thought impossible for bacteria to survive. When I went to my GP about this it was also fairly new news to her too and I was one of the first people in my area to get the treatment. Barry Marshall is definitely one of the good guys!