[sgsg777]

thankyou soo much demo........... []

[Counterpoints]

I found an excellent post about cortisol.  http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/757599.html.
I've quoted it below:

High cortisol levels are mainly caused by stress and there are many
ways to reduce the levels of high cortisol, obviously starting with
removing the stressors.
Remember not all stressors involve emotion. Infections, over-training
in exercise, skipping meals, improper diet (activation of gut
associated immunity), high sugar and refined carbohydrate intake and
more also put stress on the body.
You just have to find the stress reduction technique that works better for you
Some of the recommended ones are

deep-breathing techniques
massage
yoga
Neuro-linguistic Programming
meditation
self-hypnosis
moderate aerobic exercise
attitude changes
rest
low glicemic diet (Sugar handling stress increases cortisol levels.)

It is important to remember that without stress reduction, all
therapeutic and support measures will eventually fail.


If you are also looking repair the damage done to the brain from high
cortisol, by mean of nutritional supplements here are some substances
you should consider.

Nutritional Supplements to Support Low or High Cortisol Levels For
basic adrenal support, include:

A good Complete Multiple Vitamin Mineral Supplement.

Mag-C, one capsule three times per day. This is a source of buffered
vitamin C and a source of absorbable magnesium.

Advanced Essential Minerals, two capsules three times per day. Mineral
absorption and assimilation can be impaired by stressed adrenal
glands. Minerals are essential for energy metabolism.

B5, one capsule per day

B6, one capsule per day

      One of the best known and most effective ways to lower excess
cortisol levels is with the nutrient Phosphatidylserine (PS).
Phosphatidylserine is believed to facilitate the repair of the
cortisol receptors in the hypothalamus. It is believed that the
cortisol receptors get damaged by high cortisol levels reducing the
ability of the hypothalamus to sense and correct high cortisone
levels. Because Phosphatidylserine helps repair the feedback control
apparatus, it is useful in correcting both high and low cortisol
levels. Phosphatidylserine is also useful for preventing short-term
memory loss, age-related dementia and Alzheimer's disease. Typical
dosages are one to three 100 mg. capsules per day.

However to achieve the levels necessary to help repair the brain
scientists have found that it takes an oral supplementation of about
800 mg daily. At this dose, oral supplementation would cost hundreds
of dollars per month. It is much more efficient and far less costly to
use transdermal (through the skin) delivery by use of a PS skin cream.
In this form, the phosphatidylserine is micellized and is absorbed
through the skin directed to the blood stream. This avoids any PS
being lost through digestion and the first pass through the liver. The
product, ?Cortisol Balance? was designed for transdermal delivery of
PS in levels that will be effective for the protection and repair of
the brain.

There is an abundance of scientific data on the ability of PS to
support and protect the brain. No other nutrient or pharmaceutical can
match the effectiveness of PS. This PS product combined with a
healthier lifestyle will safely enhance brain function.


      Adaptogens are an entire category of herbs that assists the body
in coping with stress by restoring hypothalamic cortisol receptor
sensitivity. AdaptaPhase I from Vitamin Research Products is one such
blend of adaptogenic herbs that is based on Russian research. It is a
combination of Siberian ginseng, Manchurian Thorn Tree extract,
Hawthorn extract, Echinopanax elatum and Schisandra. Typical dosages
are from 1 ml. to 4 ml. per day. AdaptaPhase II is an anti-catabolic
blend of herbs that can be used to enhance the effects of AdaptaPhase.

      AdaptaPhase II is synergistic blend of ingredients designed to
help the body overcome the exhaustion that is experienced by people
under such extreme stress. The formula includes soy protein isolate,
Rhaponticum carthinoides, Tribulus Terrestris, and Adjuga
turkistanica. These ingredients exert profound energizing, anabolic,
muscle-building effects. This product is best used in cycles, with
each cycle lasting 10 days with a break of two to three weeks between
each 10 day cycle. Dosages range from 4-10 capsules per day depending
upon the individual's weight and the amount of physical or
psychological stress that individual is undergoing.

      CortiTrophin is a combination of adrenal concentrate and
glycyrrhizinate. Glycyrrhizinate is a natural cortisol-mimicking
extract from licorice. Taking a small amount of CortiTrophin 25-100
mgs/day can be beneficial in treating symptoms of adrenal exhaustion
and can provide significant relief from the symptoms of chronic
fatigue and fibromyalgia. To best mimic the body's own physiology,
CortiTrophin should be taken on an empty stomach, first thing in the
morning. If a second dose is required, it should be taken before
lunch. Since CortiTrophin mimics the action of cortisol, one should be
very judicious in using it. It should only be used intermittently and
if any adverse effects occur, such as water retention or elevated
blood pressure, use should be discontinued immediately. Individuals
with high blood pressure should be very cautious with this supplement
and should consult their doctor. Saliva testing should be seriously
considered when using cortisol simulating supplements.

The previous information were collected  from a series of web sites,
some of them are

http://www.vitaminlife.com/view_article-exec/article_id/809
http://www.advance-health.com/cortisol.html
http://www.drdebe.com/fitness.htm


Here is also a quick guide of "8 ways to Reduce your Cortisol"

1. Use cortisol reduction supplements: I use a variety of herbs in my
clinic to reduce cortisol at peak times. Some of my favorites include:
ashwaghanda, phosphatidylserine, and rhodiola rosea.

2. Eat at regular intervals throughout the day: Avoid skipping meals,
as this will create a cortisol release.

3. Eat right for your Metabolic Type: Excessive carbohydrate intake
creates cortisol release in response to constantly elevated insulin
levels. Find out your metabolic type and eat consistently with it.

4. Utilize stress reduction techniques at peak cortisol times:
Neuro-linguistic Programming, meditation, self-hypnosis, or simply
lying on the floor doing belly breathing for 10-15 minutes can work
wonders at reducing stress and thus cortisol levels.

5. Get to bed on time: Get to bed by 10:30 pm at the latest.

6. Avoid stimulants: Stay away from energy drinks that contain
ephedra-like compounds and caffeine. Stimulants shift the body into
sympathetic dominance, ie. "fight or flight". Stimulants can also
disrupt your sleeping patterns. If you must have your daily coffee, be
sure that you do not drink any after 12 noon.

7. Keep your workouts under 1 hour: At the 1 hour mark, your
testosterone levels begin to decline and cortisol levels rise.
Forty-five minute workouts are even better.

8. Do not overtrain: Strength coach Charles Poliquin recommends not
training more than 2 days in a row. Doing so will simply overtax the
hormonal system and therefore increase cortisol levels. Listen to your
body. If you do not feel recovered from your previous workout, simply
take an extra day off or reduce the number of sets you perform in your
workout.

http://www.ezinearticles.com/?8-Essential-Ways-To-Lower-Cortisol-And-Feel-Great!&id=142635

[Counterpoints]

One more article on cortisol: http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=252375

[Limejuice]

I may have stumbled on something 'new' with POIS and serotonin (I ran a google search and found little in this thread about serotonin).

Question for POIS suffers (to test serotonin) - does anyone have an addictive personality or become easily addicted to things like alcohol, tabacco, attention, people etc.

I ask because outside of orgasms I've never been addicted to anything, moreover I can't be addicted to anything.  I can't really grow an attraction to anything enough to depend on it.  So is this just me or a trait of POIS suffers?

[demografx]

I may have stumbled on something 'new' with POIS and serotonin (I ran a google search and found little in this thread about serotonin).

Question for POIS suffers (to test serotonin) - does anyone have an addictive personality or become easily addicted to things like alcohol, tabacco, attention, people etc.

I ask because outside of orgasms I've never been addicted to anything, moreover I can't be addicted to anything.  I can't really grow an attraction to anything enough to depend on it.  So is this just me or a trait of POIS suffers?

Interesting question. What's your take Limejuice, on the connection between serotonin and addiction?

I think of serotonin more in connection with depression a la SSRI's.

I left you some more information in your mailbox.

I used advanced-google search for serotonin and POIS Forum, found quite a few posts. The MessageID (#) is in the link:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=POIS+serotonin+site%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenakedscientists.com&btnG=Google+Search&aq=f&oq=

[demografx]

One more article on cortisol: http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=252375

CP, is your doc suggesting any specific treatment based on your cortisol reading?

[demografx]

It's day2 for me. Pois is already finished.

B_Jim, congratulations on the continued progress!

[Counterpoints]

One more article on cortisol: http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=252375

CP, is your doc suggesting any specific treatment based on your cortisol reading?

Not yet, he wants me to take some more tests.  Initially he wanted to rule out the possibility of a tumor, or something like Cushing's disease (which I probably don't have, since my cortisol goes down significantly from morning to evening, even though the evening readings are still usually above the upper reference). But I have noticed an interesting trend (in my tests).  I don't want to say anything until I'm more confident about it, though.  Note: I took a T3 and T4 test, recently, as well.  T4 was normal.  T3 was slightly above the upper reference (flagged, but not alarming).  TSH levels are very good.  Might be worth getting one more T3 test.

[barry_duffman]

Welcome, Barry!

Don't forget to grab some popcorn and see Girlwind's POIS video:
newbielink:http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=UWBxAUC9k1g [nonactive]

For our internal information sharing and outside researchers' use, a questionnaire:
newbielink:http://pois.olympe-network.com/ [nonactive]

Barry, the dried up fingertips are hard to explain. I only get them in POIS. The fingertips feel numb, dry and the sensation - for some reason - drives me nuts! []

I once visited a skeptical dermatologist about this, and he said, indeed, I had dermatitis during POIS! He prescribed a worthless skin care lotion []

I hope you find this place reassuring and helpful and welcoming!

Thanks for your reply demographx! It is interesting that you get dermatitis on your finger tips. I get atopic dermatitis in several areas, but not my finger tips (yet). Which lotion were you prescribed?

Here is another article relating to the autonomic nervous system and the skin:

"Does Autonomic Dysfunction Play a Role in Atopic Dermatitis?" (Br J Dermatol. 2008 Sep;159(4):834-8.)
newbielink:http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/582162 [nonactive]

[John21 (OP)]

Counterpoints,
This info is interesting, particularly the claims that phosphatidylserine can reduce cortisol. I might try eating some high phosphatidylserine foods regularly such as mackerel, perhaps it could help my insomnia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phosphatidylserine

Another supplement that is purported to reduce cortisol is Magnolia bark

http://www.florahealth.com/flora/home/Canada/HealthInformation/Encyclopedias/MagnoliaBarkandFlowers.htm

[Coreman]

I ve been away for a month, however, I was testing different stuff. No theories, just my experiences to tell.

Good results:

1. Tribulus Terrestris (1500 mg a day) - helps brain fog.

2. Relora (250 mg * 4 a day) - very effective against panic attacks, the day after. (I take 2 right after orgasm)

3. Calcium-Magnesium caps - give me a good sleep. Better dreams, better state of nerves, better morning.

Comment on Ca-Mg: I strongly believe (after 10 years' POIS), that the quality of your night sleep strongly influences your day after.

4. Rivotril - this is an anti-anxiety drug, keeps away 90% of my anxiety (Addictive, but I don't care. Now, I am able to work regulary (intellectual job) and in a good pace. The feeling I been waiting so long...! )

5. Rivotril is good, but it makes me lethargic a bit. I eat chocolate, to keep the balance.
 
Other observations:

1.    Worst day of the week:  is about Thursday, 'cause: 1. Already stressed/worn-out due to work, 2. already having lack of sleep,......  and THAN an orgasm:  POIS is like a nightmare, makes it difficult to cope with )

Seems that factors 1. + 2. together makes things worse...

2.  A reflection on Garlic:  Garlic gives energy and all, at first I found it downright superb, but it disturbed my stomach and my guts, so people with sensitive guts must take care, I think.

Thank you for your attention.

Good luck

Coreman.   

[girlwind]

I found an excellent post about cortisol.  http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/757599.html.
I've quoted it below:

I have consistently used many, if not most, of the adrenal supports on this long list, and have written up many of
them on this forum. And I agree strongly that adjusting personal habits (like eating regular meals, not overdoing
in any area of life--exercise, sex, work, etc, managing stress and getting to bed early) are ESSENTIAL to healing
exhausted adrenals. All the supplements you can swallow won't help, if you're constantly draining your reserves of
energy with unhealthy habits.

Also, I would be careful to not use all the supplements they recommend here at once, as that would be overkill,
and might potentially overwhelm one's system. I have personally found it most useful to "rotate" the adaptogenic
herbs, rather than taking them all together at the same time. They seems to retain their effectiveness better that
way.

Lastly, watch out for the Cortitrophin! In my experience (as official supplement guinea pig) it is REALLY STRONG!
I felt very over-amped, dizzy and shaky when I tried it, and wasn't willing to do it again.

[John21 (OP)]

Coreman,

1.    Worst day of the week:  is about Thursday, 'cause: 1. Already stressed/worn-out due to work, 2. already having lack of sleep,......  and THAN an orgasm:  POIS is like a nightmare, makes it difficult to cope with )

Are you saying that when you are in a stressed out/exhausted state and you have an orgasm the POIS is much worse?

[demografx]

I get atopic dermatitis in several areas, but not my finger tips (yet). Which lotion were you prescribed?

Barry, I assume your dermatitis is in-POIS only?

I threw out the Rx lotion long ago. As I did the OTC hand lotion which was mildly effective but not worth the trouble. Water helps immediately but then makes it worse.

I'm so glad to hear that you understand the skin problem! Even here at the forum, I was feeling like I had a symptom-from-Mars []

[demografx]

CP, is your doc suggesting any specific treatment based on your cortisol reading?

Not yet, he wants me to take some more tests.  Initially he wanted to rule out the possibility of a tumor, or something like Cushing's disease (which I probably don't have, since my cortisol goes down significantly from morning to evening, even though the evening readings are still usually above the upper reference). But I have noticed an interesting trend (in my tests).  I don't want to say anything until I'm more confident about it, though.  Note: I took a T3 and T4 test, recently, as well.  T4 was normal.  T3 was slightly above the upper reference (flagged, but not alarming).  TSH levels are very good.  Might be worth getting one more T3 test.

I hope my university endocrinologist on Tuesday will agree to cortisol tests!

[Finally]

I have been using many things that have but it seems that DHEA and Maca along with  Restore   been the most effective. For me Maca has been more effective than Horney Goat Weed.   Sleep and fresh air are very important as they can make you a little drowsy.

[CertainlyPOIS]

Demografx - if i write that letter to dr sue, what should as her to do for us.

[CertainlyPOIS]

I dont know if anybody has asked this question or not. But if guys are suppose to be sleepy right after sex, why is that people with pois do the opposite and get insomia.

[tarkington]

i believe it has alot to do with cortisol... maybe other chemicals as well.  Relora affects cortisol and allowed me to sleep after orgasm.  Without Relora I would have insomnia after orgasm.

[Whoa]

I dont know if anybody has asked this question or not. But if guys are suppose to be sleepy right after sex, why is that people with pois do the opposite and get insomia.

Maybe I'm a freak case, but after orgasm I have a nearly uncontrollable urge to sleep, whether it is 12pm or 12am.