Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6000 on: 10/11/2009 03:05:22 »
Pablo, my testosterone treatment, combined with my other meds, has given me a 90% POIS relief, after 30+ years of full-blown POIS misery.

Very often, if I simply take advantage of the sunshine/outdoors, and nap/siesta, it jumps to 100%!

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Offline martin88

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6001 on: 10/11/2009 14:38:39 »
So why do I feel better in Mexico?   Maybe a combination of stress free life by the ocean, with plenty of sunshine and exercises together with great food?  :-)  Now I need to find a doctor who will prescribe this novel therapy…  But seriously the good news is that if I feel better during thses short periods it means I *can* feel better. The key may be somewhere in the Caribean.
Hi, you have an interesting approach of things. I'd add vitamin D from sunshine + light clothes. Some POIS sufferers were deficient in vitamin D. Just make the test. Also you can try "quinton isotonic", and take it out of meals I think it's important (like when you go in the sea).
I repeatedly felt great effects from trace minerals if taken 30 min before the first meal of the day, otherwise no effect.

-(Maybe less milk product too?) I felt quite improved recently after I took a lactose free milk containing enzyme lactase too.
Lactose is converted to glucose in the body.

Like you say the combination of all this is probaby what is helpful.  I hope it's not a temporary effect (just the time for you to lose this new energy in sex).

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Offline martin88

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6002 on: 10/11/2009 14:52:57 »
Today it's day 1 for me .It seems that my symptoms have decreased further. Even cognition  is better. Placebo, luck or real ? I'm more and more convinced by the role opioid system on my symptoms.
Nice news you're better :)  I think too opioid system is one of the causes. I believe endorphins are involved in the fact that I'm more depressed with NEs (vs orgasm).   

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Offline Pablo445

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6003 on: 10/11/2009 15:50:10 »
Today it's day 1 for me .It seems that my symptoms have decreased further. Even cognition  is better. Placebo, luck or real ? I'm more and more convinced by the role opioid system on my symptoms.
Nice news you're better :)  I think too opioid system is one of the causes. I believe endorphins are involved in the fact that I'm more depressed with NEs (vs orgasm).   

Could you explain what NEs stands for? - Newbie here  :-)

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6004 on: 10/11/2009 17:14:30 »
"" Prostaglandin is an extremely important hormone necessary for the tissue action in the body. If the amount of prostaglandin is low, and the level of adrenaline is high – as it happens after a person masturbates – then pains and cramps may be felt due to tightness and constriction of the tissues in the ligaments, joints and the various blood vessels.

A similar mechanism occurs when you have pains due to stressful conditions. These pains are also felt in the posterior part of the brain, i.e. in the region where the nape of your neck lies. ""

http://www.library.ayurvediccure.com/over-masturbation/mental-effects-masturbation.htm


That is exactly where I feel POIS and could explain why I sweat and feel really hyper after "O", adrenaline, also could explain its extended release caused by drinking coffee.  I don't know where most of you guys "feel" POIS, but mine is definitely located in the back of my head right above my neck.

""Many people claim stress and the intake of caffeine causes them headaches. This is true to a great extent. But the fact is, excessive masturbation also has the same effects on the body as stress and an overdose of caffeine. All these factors bring on headaches by causing dopamine to convert into excessive adrenaline, which finds it extremely difficult to reconvert back into dopamine once the stimulus is removed. This is done due to the low production of serotonin in the body.""
« Last Edit: 10/11/2009 17:17:05 by goingcrazy »

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Offline Pablo445

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6005 on: 10/11/2009 20:36:57 »
Who else…

1. has really bad nightmares on Days 2, 3 and 4 after O?
2. has a dry mouth for 4 or 5 days after O?
3. has a drop in eyesight quality and lots of eye floaters after O?
4. has a much weaker digestion for 5 to 7 days after O?
5. feels shortness of breath for 5 days after O as if gasping for air?

Has any of these symptoms become better for anyone?

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6006 on: 10/11/2009 21:19:04 »
Who else…

1. has really bad nightmares on Days 2, 3 and 4 after O?
2. has a dry mouth for 4 or 5 days after O?
3. has a drop in eyesight quality and lots of eye floaters after O?
4. has a much weaker digestion for 5 to 7 days after O?
5. feels shortness of breath for 5 days after O as if gasping for air?

Has any of these symptoms become better for anyone?

eye floaters once or twice in two year history.

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Offline Pablo445

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6007 on: 10/11/2009 21:24:44 »

Hi, you have an interesting approach of things. I'd add vitamin D from sunshine + light clothes. Some POIS sufferers were deficient in vitamin D. Just make the test.

Yes of course: vitamin D. Very good point thank you!

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6008 on: 10/11/2009 21:25:22 »
Welcome Pablo445 :) Many things can influence Pois symptoms. Maybe you could copy the lifestyle that reduces your symptoms (food, activity, light...).

---

Today it's day 1 for me .It seems that my symptoms have decreased further. Even cognition  is better. Placebo, luck or real ? I'm more and more convinced by the role opioid system on my symptoms.

have you heard of methadone it is suppose to be what is used for opiod addicts.
and there is some reasearcher alex bodkin, psycopharmacologist doing reasearch. supposedly top

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Offline martin88

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6009 on: 10/11/2009 23:39:51 »
Prostaglandin is an extremely important hormone necessary for the tissue action in the body.
It's something to investigate. Prostaglandins are present in semen..

Who else…

1. has really bad nightmares on Days 2, 3 and 4 after O?
2. has a dry mouth for 4 or 5 days after O?
3. has a drop in eyesight quality and lots of eye floaters after O?
4. has a much weaker digestion for 5 to 7 days after O?
5. feels shortness of breath for 5 days after O as if gasping for air?

Has any of these symptoms become better for anyone?
(NEs = nocturnal emissions)
I had nightmares cured with red meat suppression in the evening.
Shortness of breath, only if I eat too much fat.
These symptoms are not necessarily after orgasm.
Weakest digestion after orgasm, yes.
By the way, a sea bath improves digestion and increase appetite for me.

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Offline mister_z

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6010 on: 11/11/2009 14:06:37 »
I'd like to ask you how to go about increasing free testosterone ...
My doctor is not very keen on giving me testosterone supplementation because he considers my free testosterone is not low enough for it (but it is quite lower than normal still) and even then testosterone patches or injections wouldn't really help free testosterone for long...
So what could I try ? (hopefully something that wont cost me a bundle)

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Offline martin88

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6011 on: 11/11/2009 14:44:12 »
Quote
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg280668#msg280668
This is very interesting and I believe it's involved. But how to explain the fact that POIS is present immediately after orgasm when endorphins are released.
Also if I have orgasm everyday (more endorphins) I feel sexually exhausted with heavy POIS.

However endorphins withdrawal can explain the POIS day 2 aggravation. I think there are less endorphins after NEs (vs orgasms). Since I rarely have NEs I don't remember if there is a POIS day 2, and usually, when I have one NE I try to have an orgasm after to avoid feeling too bad.
I always thinked POIS day 2 aggravation was caused by sperm not fully resplenished + bad sleep the precedent night + endorphins withdrawal. But I could be wrong since no research on POIS has been done yet! [???]

(Exercise is a good way to have more endorphins..)
« Last Edit: 12/11/2009 00:52:41 by martin88 »

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Offline John21

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6012 on: 11/11/2009 16:34:26 »
A simple theory:
Either neurotransmitter or endorphin release is depleting stores of raw materials that make them. What if a phenylalanine supplement was taken the day before, might this keep the machinery working? Some people have tried taking amino acids following sex with at least some success, but I am wondering if this is like changing the smoke detector batteries after the house has burned down. I notice that phenylalanine is available in two forms, the D form is said to be the best for increasing endorphins. I am going to order some DLPA (has both L and D forms) to see how it affects me.

The reason I am wondering this is because I recently tried tyrosine outside of POIS. I had tried it post sex before and I didn't have symptoms that time but it made me feel a little weird, maybe I took too much. This time it made me feel quite relaxed. Whereas many supplements I have tried have an antidepressant-type effect on me, this one did not make me feel good, just normal, which I like! It made a definite change in my insomnia. I have a chronic sleep problem of sleep maintenance insomnia, waking up in the middle of the night and having difficulty getting back to sleep. After consuming the tyrosine I have been waking more frequently, but getting back to sleep easier and sleeping deeper. I only took it for two days, at first a full 500mg cap, the the next day about quarter of a cap. I'm going to stop taking it now and see how my system responds.

Also, I was doing lots of exercise back in the spring/early summer when I was having my zero symptoms, and attributing it to cranberries, etc. Maybe not just exorcise but higher adrenaline (exciting) exorcise is good for endorphin making?
« Last Edit: 19/11/2009 10:09:32 by John21 »

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6013 on: 11/11/2009 16:47:54 »
My abstinence period is typically about 2 weeks than I "O", and this time I "O'd" 4 times because I couldn't help myself.  The first "O" happened and I just got a wave of extreme tiredness, than the second "O" made me feel hyper, the third and fourth even more hyper, couldn't sleep until 7a.m.  That was Sunday.  Today is Wednesday and I actually feel no POIS, think my body is adjusting to it. 
I feel "happier" for some reason, I don't know if it is endorphins or what but I am feeling a natural high.  The pain in my head is gone.  When I had sugar the day after 4 "O's" that made me really manic and I couldn't sit still.  I have been taking calcium magnesium and chelated magnesium because I believe it affects adrenaline output.  I also try to keep my hands "away" and not touch my youknowwhat at all, only during bathroom "activities" lol.  Because I've read that for just sexual stimulation your body converts dopamine into adrenaline (sorry for no link), but this issue couuld just be for me, again we may have different causes of POIS.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6014 on: 11/11/2009 18:20:55 »

testosterone patches or injections wouldn't really help free testosterone for long...


I've been on T patches about a year now and it has cured my POIS 90%+.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6015 on: 11/11/2009 18:22:23 »
POIS Research Study

We now have a 7th volunteer/donor here at the forum, who has pledged between $1,000 and $1,500! Thank you!!

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Offline Pablo445

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6016 on: 11/11/2009 18:42:57 »
.
However endorphins withdrawal can explain the POIS day 2 aggravation. I think there are less endorphins after NEs (vs orgasms).
(Exercise is a good way to have more endorphins..)

In my case POIS only begins on the second day. I feel just fine on the first day. So this comment is particularly interesting to me. If I am confronted with a big stress the same process occurs: I feel OK the first day and meet the challenge but on the second day I experience similar symptoms as POIS.
I too have noticed that exercise (aerobic) does help up to a certain point. Excess exercise has a negative effect.



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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6017 on: 11/11/2009 23:31:21 »
Forum suggestions needed!

Hi, all!

As we're coming up on our 3rd Year Anniversary of this Forum, we have obviously accomplished some things (e.g., built a communications center for POIS sufferers) and NOT accomplished some other things (e.g., a cure!)

What would you like to see happen next in this forum?

PLEASE: post your answer publicly or send me a Private Message!

Since I have gratefully found treatment for my POIS (with many thanks to this forum!) my new "vision" might not be completely in sync with where you need to go next.

I'm flexible: I'll help do whatever's needed.

I'll even step aside if someone can do a better job moderating!

So...please speak your mind. (But if it's too vulgar I might delete it! [;D] )

Sincerely awaiting your replies!.................
« Last Edit: 12/11/2009 00:11:41 by demografx »

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Offline POIS-SUFFERER

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6018 on: 11/11/2009 23:37:21 »
I was wondering if somebody could take Benadryl allergy and/or motrin to see if they have relief of at least some their symptoms.  Something is helping me but I'm not sure what it is.
I am taking vitamin B's, chelated magnesium, calcium magnesium, and motrin.  Even rhodiola rosea.  I've also been stretching my neck out and rotating it (not sure if that's really helping me or not). 
But I would like if somebody has either motrin or benadryl allergy to take some and tell me how you feel, if you don't feel a difference it just cancels those out for me.  I don't think it is the vitamins I'm taking, even though I really "felt" the good feeling of vitamin B after I haven't taken it in a long time.  Thank you

Benadryl liquid caps I just tried and seem to work, also taking B3 and B12.

However over the last week I have had two very odd occurrences. Had an O after 10 days break, lost muscle strength in arm and fingers twitched uncontrollably for hours.... that was 7 days ago now just got a little aroused and lost feeling in my left foot! Both have come back but what the hell is going on? all the time during two episodes all the other fairly familiar POIS feeling were there also. I am tending to be getting angrier and angrier where I am having outbursts at everyone too.... things just going downhill. I have a DR visit tomorrow so will see what he thinks of this, he is unclear what to do, but I think its time for MRI EEG etc....

PS.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6019 on: 12/11/2009 00:10:12 »
Email Letter to NORD

Dear Stefanie,

We're having a rough time (bet you never heard THAT before! [:)])

We've raised somewhere between $3,500 to $4,000, but we need to do something NOW. The frustration level of so many wasted lives is something I know you understand.

Raising money as per the case studies you sent is reassuring, but privacy is an important issue for us, because our disorder is based on....well, SEX! We're not in the Victorian era, but we aren't that enlightened yet as a society! So a neighborhood fundraiser barbecue asking our friends and neighbors for money to research our difficulties after orgasm....is not conceivable. And personally, I would feel reluctant to sit across from Oprah Winfrey and respond to the question, "Do you feel the same after masturbation as with sex?" [:)]

Rather than our going out and hiring doctors, labs, and/or a researcher ourselves, which is definitely a consideration on the table, would there be a possibility of your providing us with a starting point, perhaps a researcher who has expressed interest in studying something in our area? (sexual disorders, endocrine studies, etc.)

We could perhaps then "graduate" to a NORD commitment, with a small starting point and some successes (I, for example, have found 90%+ relief with my treatment! That was through the data and interchange of ideas at the forum)

I thank you once again for responding to us and being a friend of POIS Disorder!

Best regards,

[first name]


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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6020 on: 12/11/2009 00:13:37 »

In my case POIS only begins on the second day. I feel just fine on the first day.


Pablo, we have found this to be very common here.

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Offline Limejuice

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6021 on: 12/11/2009 00:40:21 »
If were talking goals, in 2010 I'd like to find the route cause of POIS. Another goal is to cure, say, 25% of forum members and readers.

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Offline martin88

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6022 on: 12/11/2009 01:18:18 »
Demo, your letter to NORD is great, this gives me some hope. Thanks!

B_Jim, I thought initially that endorphins remained high during a long time after orgasm and that only the weaning from endorphins was causing POIS. That's why I asked this question.
But maybe the withdrawal symptoms start immediately after orgasm because endorphins are released during orgasm and not after.
I have read a bit on opium effects :
-4h euphoria,lassitude,stupor (I'd like to understand why)
-a 7 to 10 days weaning occurs with big symptoms, high anxiety etc.. and 6 months to be fully normal.

 
In my case POIS only begins on the second day. I feel just fine on the first day.
I do not feel fine the first day but I'm aggravated a lot the second day.  Demo is right, a lot of POIS sufferers have this and this is to me one of the better indication that POIS is not psychological, with the fact that 97% of the POIS sufferers are men. I agree also with you when you said that stronger orgasms cause more POIS.
« Last Edit: 12/11/2009 05:57:46 by martin88 »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6023 on: 12/11/2009 05:49:53 »

If we're talking goals, in 2010 I'd like to find the root cause of POIS. Another goal is to cure, say, 25% of forum members and readers.


Thanks, LJ! Very noble goals, indeed.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6024 on: 12/11/2009 05:56:18 »

Who else...

1. has really bad nightmares on Days 2, 3 and 4 after O?
2. has a dry mouth for 4 or 5 days after O?
3. has a drop in eyesight quality and lots of eye floaters after O?
4. has a much weaker digestion for 5 to 7 days after O?
5. feels shortness of breath for 5 days after O as if gasping for air?

Has any of these symptoms become better for anyone?


I believe POIS nightmares come from our inner depths "screaming" to be back to normal.

Dry fingertips instead of dry mouth. This symptom drives me CRAZY!

Drop in vision quality, yes.

Some shortness of breath.

All my symptoms improved dramatically over the last year with my testosterone treatment.
« Last Edit: 12/11/2009 06:03:00 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6025 on: 12/11/2009 05:58:09 »

Demo, your letter to NORD is great, this gives me some hope. Thanks!


Wonderful, Martin. Thank you! And thank you very much for your help with the project!
« Last Edit: 12/11/2009 06:25:34 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6026 on: 12/11/2009 06:10:07 »

I'd like to ask you how to go about increasing free testosterone ...
My doctor is not very keen on giving me testosterone supplementation because he considers my free testosterone is not low enough for it (but it is quite lower than normal still) and even then testosterone patches or injections wouldn't really help free testosterone for long...
So what could I try ? (hopefully something that wont cost me a bundle)


mister_z, below, from an older post of mine, are the results of some free-T results after wearing T-patches for 6 weeks. I have more recent results, which to me aren't important because the patches are working very nicely on my POIS. But if you'd like, I can dig them up for you.


SOME TESTOSTERONE TESTING

Someone here asked me privately for my "free testosterone" testing results (much more was tested), so I thought I'd post it in case anyone else is interested:


Before POIS treatment:
(December 2, '08)
                                    reference range

%FREE T            1.47 %           1.5 - 2.2
FREE T             24.4 pg/mL        35 - 155


After POIS treatment:
(March 2, '09 after about 6 weeks of wearing T-patches)


%FREE T             1.45 %             1.5 - 2.2
FREE T              37.0 pg/mL          35 - 155


Free T jumped 50%, from 24.4 to 37.0.

Endocrinologist expects the numbers to keep increasing through June. If they don't, he'll switch me from Androderm T-patches 10mg daily to a pump gel to increase my testosterone.

mister_z, your doctor says that your free-T is not "low enough" to augment. My endo, who has a very good reputation in the field, agreed with my theory, that even when the T-patches brought me into normal T range and I saw improvement, a 50% increase in T-patches would help POIS dramatically and it did.

I would suggest getting a second opinion.
« Last Edit: 12/11/2009 06:24:28 by demografx »

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Offline Pablo445

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6027 on: 12/11/2009 18:23:01 »
A bad POIS day today.

Do you ever feel it is "indescribable"? A feeling of anxiety, lack of air, panicky, as if I was stuck in a giant spider web and not succeeding to get out of it. There is no words or metaphor I know for it in any of the 3 languages I pretend to speak. Maybe just plain miserable. The only good thing about it is the fact that it does not last. I always get through it. But while "in it" it really feels miserable. What a waste of time - what a waste of life.

OK I just wanted to rant a little. Nothing positive to contribute right now. Thank you for listening.

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Offline mister_z

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6028 on: 12/11/2009 18:39:10 »
Before POIS treatment:
(December 2, '08)
                                    reference range
%FREE T            1.47 %           1.5 - 2.2
FREE T             24.4 pg/mL        35 - 155

I have my free testosterone results here; but they are in ng/mL since I am in europe and I don't know how to convert to pg/mL.
So, my results are:
0.89 ng/mL   reference range 1.00 - 3.7
3.09 nmol/L


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Offline Limejuice

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6029 on: 12/11/2009 19:01:47 »
My free T was also under the reference range in the two T blood tests I took.

Regular T was within the reference range so the doctor would not prescribe a T prescription.

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6030 on: 12/11/2009 19:33:40 »
not pertaning to pois but to the big "O", stroke after orgasm, this is nuts and extremely scary at the same time.
http://current.com/items/89310977_woman-suffers-orgasm-related-stroke-wtf.htm
« Last Edit: 12/11/2009 19:50:50 by CCconfucius »

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Offline mister_z

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6031 on: 12/11/2009 19:37:03 »
My free T was also under the reference range in the two T blood tests I took.

Regular T was within the reference range so the doctor would not prescribe a T prescription.
Exactly the same case as you...
That's why, since my doctor is being quite inflexible about it, I am looking to "brew my own" with supplements and what not...

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Offline CertainlyPOIS

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6032 on: 12/11/2009 19:43:29 »
My adavancement in testosterone.
I did a test while in hyper recovery stage.
testerone; 681ng/dl 175-821
FT  19pg/ml no range

Test after three days of orgasm
testosterone; 292ng/dl 241-800
FT         14.1 pg/ml no range.

I am totally confused, there is a big drop in total T and but not really in FT.

I am going to do one more test when supposedly normal hopefully  testerone is low as hell.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6033 on: 12/11/2009 19:59:01 »

Regular T was within the reference range so the doctor would not prescribe a T prescription. [emphasis mine - demo]



I am going to do one more test when supposedly normal hopefully  testerone is low as hell.



That's why, since my doctor is being quite inflexible about it, I am looking to "brew my own" with supplements and what not...




At first, mine wouldn't prescribe testosterone either, but I insisted emphatically: "I need testosterone for POIS!".("Not for standard testosterone therapy!") In my arguments, I relied on my 'advisor', Petr Weiss, a well-known Czech sexuality researcher who I found through a Larry King CNN interviewee's (he was a sexuality expert/author) "referral to a referral" about POIS. After listening to my story, Weiss told me on the telephone that he firmly believed that MORE testosterone was the answer to my POIS. To my doctors, I also cited Dr Waldinger's study which just had recently been published. And I told them, truthfully, that I'd been suffering badly for decades and I desperately needed relief!

So the doctors both relented.

This was several years back, when I saw a GP and urologist, before my current T-patch treatment with an endo, which is as smooth and wonderful as I could ever hope for. Back then, the GP and urologist both agreed to my demand (no more "requesting"!!), but they insisted that I monitor PSA regularly and re-test T regularly. They stopped me when T went way too high, which was ok with me. They also made me buy the testosterone with the urologist's prescription, then the GP nurse injected me regularly. They put me through hoops, and it was crazy, but I got what I wanted!

NOTE: This is NOT medical advice for anyone to follow! I am not qualified to give medical advice: I am simply describing my own personal experience.
« Last Edit: 13/11/2009 05:04:11 by demografx »

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Offline Limejuice

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6034 on: 12/11/2009 22:12:29 »
I understand.

I'm reluctant to push to try T for one reason - I don't want to jeopardize my natural production of T.  If supplemented T is not the answer to POIS for me, and in testing this disrupted the natural levels for the rest of my life, I would be....upset.

With only you, Demo, cured that risk is too high for me.  If most the forum was cured with T that’s a different story.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6035 on: 13/11/2009 02:15:06 »

[if testosterone therapy] disrupted the natural levels for the rest of my life, I would be....upset.


Limejuice, I can't thank you enough for adding that extremely important cautionary note!

Testosterone therapy can, indeed, disrupt the natural production of testosterone. Not always. But enough to be a major concern.

Re-starting natural testosterone production is not guaranteed!

But I was, and am, desperate enough, and at the right age (I have had POIS for somewhere between 30 and 40 years!), where I just don't care: "I want relief and I want it now" was my attitude.

Also, I determined that it's unlikely that I will find another way to increase my insufficient manufacture of testosterone. If others can do it without testosterone replacement therapy (TRT), and have the patience to try different methods...my best wishes!!!

Yes, it is a very critical life decision to make!
« Last Edit: 13/11/2009 02:44:38 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6036 on: 13/11/2009 05:11:39 »

A bad POIS day today.

Do you ever feel it is "indescribable"? A feeling of anxiety, lack of air, panicky, as if I was stuck in a giant spider web and not succeeding to get out of it. There is no words or metaphor I know for it in any of the 3 languages I pretend to speak. Maybe just plain miserable. The only good thing about it is the fact that it does not last. I always get through it. But while "in it" it really feels miserable. What a waste of time - what a waste of life.

OK I just wanted to rant a little. Nothing positive to contribute right now. Thank you for listening.


Pablo, please feel free to rant! This whole forum started with John21's rant! [;D] (John, forgive me, I'm a twisted man! Blame it on my lifetime of POIS!)

It is such an incredible waste of life. Excellent wording, Pablo.

The one consolation is that some disorders in life NEVER return to normal. Ours always does.

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Offline mister_z

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6037 on: 13/11/2009 18:53:36 »
Hi,
I managed to get some piracetam from my doctor. I'll try it and report.

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Offline Dean93

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6038 on: 14/11/2009 02:00:36 »

What a waste of time - what a waste of life.


Excellent wording, Pablo.



Agreed.

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6039 on: 14/11/2009 04:10:25 »

A bad POIS day today.

Do you ever feel it is "indescribable"? A feeling of anxiety, lack of air, panicky, as if I was stuck in a giant spider web and not succeeding to get out of it. There is no words or metaphor I know for it in any of the 3 languages I pretend to speak. Maybe just plain miserable. The only good thing about it is the fact that it does not last. I always get through it. But while "in it" it really feels miserable. What a waste of time - what a waste of life.

OK I just wanted to rant a little. Nothing positive to contribute right now. Thank you for listening.


Pablo, please feel free to rant! This whole forum started with John21's rant! [;D] (John, forgive me, I'm a twisted man! Blame it on my lifetime of POIS!)

It is such an incredible waste of life. Excellent wording, Pablo.

The one consolation is that some disorders in life NEVER return to normal. Ours always does.


Yeah I really don't think anyone should be interrogated for posting anything out of the ordinary or saying something insulting, dumb, crazy, depressing, hyper, ranting, because this is a mental disease and it affects how we act and say stuff... and it absolutely sucks to have,  especially wouldn't blame demo because 30 years is a long time, i've had it for two and dont even now how I've made it through alive.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6040 on: 14/11/2009 04:18:28 »

Before POIS treatment:
(December 2, '08)
                                    reference range
%FREE T            1.47 %           1.5 - 2.2
FREE T             24.4 pg/mL        35 - 155

I have my free testosterone results here; but they are in ng/mL since I am in europe and I don't know how to convert to pg/mL.

So, my results are:
0.89 ng/mL   reference range 1.00 - 3.7
3.09 nmol/L


This might help to convert:
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080727171025AADDARl
« Last Edit: 14/11/2009 04:21:35 by demografx »

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Offline RhythmSpring

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6041 on: 14/11/2009 08:22:27 »
Hey all. What's the deal with cabergoline? Has anyone really tried it out?

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Offline Z_one

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6042 on: 14/11/2009 12:16:29 »
Dear all,

I kindly urge all POIS sufferers that are active on this forum...and particularly those of you that are living in the US, to seriously bring up this matter to the MEDIA. We have all been speculating going & back forth and turning in circles and back to spirals into vicious circles. Some of us claim to be cured others not....some believe some don't...all that while unfortunately most of us are not even specialists!!....Well yes brain storming, sharing ideas & experiences, and speaking out are all healthy at times....but I think it's time to call it game over,,,,before our lives are over!!

POIS has already taken a very big chunk out of my life and many others....I don't know about you guys but I have thought of suicide myself many times already.....while I know that my faith won't allow me to do it....The thing is I have absolutely no idea wether i will be able to continue my life normally with such a devastating yet by far still underestimated and camouflaged disease. The worst is that people around us don't have a heck about what on earth is wrong with us and they think at times that we are a kind of Zombies! I already got laid off last year due to POIS and I have no idea whether I am ever going to have a mother to my children....

It happens that I work in the advertising field..and I can confidently remind you that the power of MEDIA is HUGE! Thus as to greatly reduce time of research and endless speculations and greatly increase the probability of finding an accurate answer in terms of both cause and cure....we need to STRONGLY  SPEAK OUT TO THE WORLD. A simple youtube video and a forum though both beneficial are not enough at all and with very limited reach...we need much more than that,,,,such as DR. OZ...Larry king....Fox news...You name it....one thing is sure we need to act now...and do it right!

I kindly urge those of you who are in the US to get together write an official letter with all necessary backups, proves, witnesses and send it to the concerned people, media and organizations......The more people are aware the less time we waist and the faster we find a cure to all.....Can you imagine how many concerned people, POIS sufferers, and specialists we can reach through a simple TV show like Dr. Oz for example? We're talking about hundreds of millions of viewers from around the globe that's for sure....

I am currently settled in a third world country so there isn't much I can do from where Iam....but I am definitely ready to help and support whoever is willing to take the initiative for that.....Again the power of Media is greater than you think...so hopefully will be worth my and your efforts ....

Thx for listening & God bless....

« Last Edit: 14/11/2009 15:58:38 by Z_one »

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Offline mister_z

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6043 on: 14/11/2009 12:50:47 »
Dear all,

I kindly urge all POIS sufferers that are active this forum...and particularly those of you that are living in the US, to seriously bring up this matter to the MEDIA

I agree. I am not in the US however.

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Offline Pablo445

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6044 on: 14/11/2009 17:29:28 »
I have been reading many posts on this forum. Impressive amount of work and thorough thinking. Congratulations everyone! And a special "thank you" to Demografx who does a great job as a moderator. But I could not find anywhere if someone actually understands the mechanism of POIS? What happens in the neuro-endocrine chain reaction that is different for a POIS sufferer?

I have noticed that for me any stressful event recreates the same problem but with less intensity. If the stressful event happens while I am in POIS it feels like I will die.  It makes it much worse.

Here are 4 opinions from professionals I have talked to. These were casual encounters, I am not their patient:

1. This is basically a clinical depression and for some the symptoms are more related to the sexual physiology. If you fix the depression these symptoms will disappear. My comments: yes I do feel depressed while in POIS but my life is good. I love my life. I have no reasons to be depressed at this time. Besides I do not generally feel depressed outside of POIS.

2. This is part of the burn-out syndrome. You are exhausted and any stress is just bad for you. Although a pleasant experience, orgasm is actually a huge stress in your body from a physiological perspective.  My comments: Yes I do feel burned out and exhausted but my sense is that I feel like that because of POIS - not the other way around. I may be wrong though.

3. From a Oriental doctor. Your kidney energy is completely depleted. This is common nowadays and a well known syndrome in the East. When you are at that point it takes 18 to 36 months to replenish the energy with massage, acupuncture and Chi strengthening herbs. My comments: even if I did study oriental medicine for few years I finally admitted I am a Western civilization white boy and I never quite "got it" with the eastern traditional perspective. But why not? That could be a good approach. But wouldn't I be lacking libido and maybe with an ED problem?

4. An experienced herbalist. Your endocrine/nervous system is depleted. Now is the time to take it easy, read good books, relax by a fireplace, do some light yoga, and take nourishing restorative herbs. It is imperative to avoid as much as possible everything stimulating: such as stimulating herbs, alcohol, coffee, stress,  etc. According to her it takes up to 3 years to recover from this and the big mistake is to try to fix the problem by stimulating the energy. It only makes it worse. My comments: so far I can only agree with her that anything stimulating makes me feel worse afterwards - including coffee, tea, chocolate, alcohol (beer especially), but also a problem at work, a disagreement with someone, even a scary movie will make things worse. It looks like I have become extra sensitive to "everything".

Anyway there are many ideas and perspective about this including literally hundreds of good ideas from this forum. I wish I could have at least a better understanding of the problem. Trying to find a solution when one does not understand the cause is like shooting a rabbit with your eyes close. Or whatever - you get the point!

My mind is not clear yet today so forgive me if my thoughts are somewhat scattered. (if there is one group in the whole world that should be forgiving it has to be this one). I have a good mind normally! :-)l  I am a Mensa member with an actual IQ of 155 but in POIS it feels like 75! It is so frustrating to not being able to count on my own mind. Arrrgh!

Contrary to many others I was not always like that. I had a very active sex life up to 34 years old ( I am 57 now) without any real POIS symptoms. Then I went though a very difficult and stressful event and it all started. Since then it fluctuates. Sometimes it is not a major problem if I have sex every 2 or 3 weeks. I just feel a little bit "edgy" the following 2 days, but nothing else. But at other times I get full blown POIS. It is unclear at this time why this is so. I have noticed I am usually much better in the summer and I get worse in November. Like now. So I will try a therapeutic light treatment to maintain the right level of serotonin - trying to fool my body/mind into believing this is always summer...  I will report of course.


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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6045 on: 14/11/2009 18:07:19 »

Then I went though a very difficult and stressful event and it all started. Since then it fluctuates. Sometimes it is not a major problem if I have sex every 2 or 3 weeks. I just feel a little bit "edgy" the following 2 days, but nothing else. But at other times I get full blown POIS. It is unclear at this time why this is so.


Yes!  I also went through a stressful event which involved me taking coffee, so biological, and so did somebody else here on this forum who claimed that after taking adderal or some drug like that, than felt POIS symptoms... To me this just happened in one day I felt like I lost it after taking coffee for a year.  Does anybogy else have a"stressful" event which seemed to have caused this?  Maybe our bodies are in anti-stimulation mode?

And I am 19, so I believe age isn't a factor.  I am also like you, I can have sex every 2-3 weeks, but only once or else I go off the deep end.

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Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6046 on: 14/11/2009 18:13:42 »
I've also noticed a weird reaction when just gasping for air really quickly for about a minute, neither good or bad, anybody else have a similar reaction.  It could just be a normal response

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Offline Z_one

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6047 on: 14/11/2009 18:27:09 »

 So I will try a therapeutic light treatment to maintain the right level of serotonin - trying to fool my body/mind into believing this is always summer...  I will report of course.



I have been in the Gulf for the past three years,,,where the Sun hits for 99% of the year....and I can assure it did not make any difference in my case,,,,but try if you want....though I don't think light therapy is going to make any difference for many on this forum....

In addition, thx for sharing your consultations and views....but honestly and with all respect , I think the problem is MUCH more than : Adrenal exhaustion, Chi, kidneys, depression & depletion.....Otherwise , half the planet would have been suffers of POIS & specially that more than half of the earth's population live in poverty and thus through extreme daily stress....

Just a thought....
« Last Edit: 14/11/2009 18:54:11 by Z_one »

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Offline exponent

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6048 on: 14/11/2009 23:00:36 »
Hi, this will be my first post, just wanting to describe this syndrome as it applies to me right now. I have not read every page on this topic, just the first couple and last couple, you've gotten a lot of feedback but not much in terms of solid treatment breakthrough.

I'm 19, and a bodybuilder. Currently in my physical training I am bulking up, I'm at 205 lbs and am mostly lean. My sex life is variable at the moment, but recently (past few months or so) I have been extremely lethargic after ejaculating. Just this morning I went to the gym for my normal saturday shoulder workout and had a couple of emissions this morning beforehand. Merely the routine of going to the gym forced me to go, despite this lack of energy, but my strength was quite noticeably diminished during my first exercise (military press) and in the following exercises, for the first time my body began to ache in that "flu like" sense. Even after cutting the workout short and returning home I continued the aching, in my bones and joints.

Normally I don't experience the aching, but the cognitive disability in my worst enemy. It acts upon me in a way that many of you may not share. Whenever I'm suffering from it I feel like I absolutely cannot look someone in the eye. I just avoid their faces all together. I do experience some fading of vision as well. All of my symptoms usually fade within 2 days at most, and I avoid masturbating and sex most of the time so it isn't frequent, I hope to be able to act out my desires more fully, avoiding isn't good enough anymore.

In my own thoughts, before discovering this site I noticed  a few things, One is that compared to times before my affliction with these symptoms I have significantly less semen with each emission, even if weeks have passed between them. I feel like my body may be pulling resources from other important functions to help produce sperm because I may be deficient in something.

another is that carbohydrate consumption does have a good affect on the syndrome, elevating mood, but at this point in my training I'm eating so many carbs already that I can't afford to eat but so many more without gaining necessary amounts of fat.

the main thing that I'm looking at is starting supplementing additional nutrients specifically for sperm production, to see if my body is spared when there is a surplus. So B vitamins, and Zinc are on my list, but I don't know what else.

I don't know, thoughts?

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Offline ophicus1213

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #6049 on: 15/11/2009 00:55:21 »
This may help us in our quest but i can rememeber the exact night everything changed for me.  It was november of 1999, and I chose to "O"twice in a row.  The second session was very painful, because i was sensitive but i continued anyway.  After the second "O" it felt like something had seriously gone wrong.  I was in a state of panic, and I felt trapped.  Waves of sensation were flowing all over my body, and it continued all night long, i could not sleep.  I felt as if i was floating on water.  The state i lived in for the next day just felt wrong, and uncomfortable.  On the second day I awoke feeling completly recovered.  I stayed that way for an entire week.  For some reason I did it again and even without an "o" my body went back into the same shock, and I have lived that way perpetually for ten years.  I do however remember a similar feeling as a child when I had consumed nearly five cups of cofee.  Cofee which contains caffiene, which plays on dopamine and prolactin.  Currently I have disbanded my experiments with anihistamines, and methionine, having dwindling sucess.  It seems that every time I have found something that may help, it helps for only a few days and stops.  My last blood test showed extremely high blood sugar, so my focus is now on cortisol.