[demografx]

CC, do you feel these guys are as good as a local hospital lab?

i cant really compare them to local hospital labs, Most private doctors use either quest or this other lab(forgot name). two biggest  labs in us.
lef is going send patient to quest.   
am going to say they are good because doctors use  them alot

Thanks, CC!

[demografx]

Great Job for the TV Documentary !!!

DO NOT HESITATE TO SHARE YOUR BLOOD TEST RESULTS ON THE OTHER FORUM : http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=98.0

It could help us to see some common disfunction... we could even split into sections (hormonal, immunology, vitamin and others) like a real database.
Of course, the most important stays the NORD fund !
Thank you !

Thank you very much Habibou. I don´t have access right now to my blood test results, but i will post them when i get them.

Thank you for sharing that with us, Observer!

[demografx]

According to the dailymail.co.uk, the Who recognizes adrenal fatigue as a real condition. But I don't find anything on the Who site.

B_Jim, my guess is that DailyMail.co.uk doesn't know what they're talking about : - )

[demografx]

Thank you, B_Jim, I am of course only guessing.

Nordnurse has given me some excellent input regarding this possibility.

[GoingCrazy]

I´m trying this and it's not working for me.

Really, I´m feeling even worse.

This is a perfect example of the harm we can do by irresponsibly recommending a "cure" to anyone.

I did not recommend a "cure" to anyone.  Just stated what has been really helping me.  I guess I could agree with you if I had said to him "try this it is the cure" but I didn't say that.  I'm sorry if people misunderstood me.  Maybe I shouldn't even be defending myself as you're right, that could be the consequence of somebody recommending a cure.

Anyway Fidalgo and everybody else,  I've sinced stopped the Sea Salt and vitamin C since I ran out of vitamin C.  I am now taking nothing and surprisingly I am having very good sleep.  I am so exhausted right now and am sleeping very well.  So far I haven't had any orgasms but I will update in the future of the affects.  I actually feel better now than I was taking any vitamin C, claritin, or sea salt.  Sleep is like heaven to me, I haven't slept this well in quite a while.  Perhaps (in my previous posts), when my headache "left", POIS "left", but I will know soon.

I am not sure if it was the C and sea salt that has done this to me.  I am leaning toward the prolonged use of high doses of vitamin C that is making me currently immune to POIS, the sea salt and C I am not so sure about but it still was part of the equation and could have possibly played a role.  I will update in the future.

Anyways about the 2 weeks rule, yes I did wait 2 weeks, and even more than that, I've waited 2 months after taking high doses of vitamin C, and another 2 weeks while on the sea salt & C, I was just feeling so good that I had to say something.  I will update on my future O's

[demografx]

I´m trying this and it's not working for me.

Really, I´m feeling even worse.

This is a perfect example of the harm we can do by irresponsibly recommending a "cure" to anyone.

I did not recommend a "cure" to anyone.

No one accused you. 

All we're saying is: let's  A L L be EXTRA-sensitive when it comes to our fellow POISers, some of whom are desperate and will try ANYTHING! - even a lupus test lol.

So our POIS TREATMENT EXPERIMENTS language should be as "non-promotional", non-emotional as possible - not easy for anyone here who finally "finds" something that works. It's exciting!. But for our vulnerable, often silent readers we must be subtle, factual, scientific. As objective as possible.

GoingCrazy, your intentions are good. Thank you for your many contributions.

[observercenter]

I want to share with the forum that there is a major newspaper interested in publishing a lenghty article/report about P.O.I.S. and the health journalists/a prominent doctor  have asked me for help. This could have wider and very positive repercussions. I will update shortly on this issue.

[demografx]

observercenter, thank you for the wonderful news!

[demografx]

Testosterone fertility risks

At the suggestion of forum members who wanted to know,  I once did a Sperm Count Analysis at a fertility lab.

My Sperm Count is zero.

I will never know if this is because of my high-dose/my choice TRT (testosterone) - my primary treatment for POIS - or something else.

I have two adult sons, so I was obviously fertile 30 years ago. And I don't plan to have more children - so it's ok now.

But if you're younger (most of you are), starting/expanding a family, fertility risk is something worth exploring if you are considering TRT as a possible POIS cure.

[Vasian1980]

Do you have a white coating on the tongue and not a pleasant smell? Even if you have sweaty palms? We are constantly wet hands. Answer please.

[acronym]

I´m trying this and it's not working for me.

Really, I´m feeling even worse.

This is a perfect example of the harm we can do by irresponsibly recommending a "cure" to anyone.

I did not recommend a "cure" to anyone.  Just stated what has been really helping me.  I guess I could agree with you if I had said to him "try this it is the cure" but I didn't say that.  I'm sorry if people misunderstood me.  Maybe I shouldn't even be defending myself as you're right, that could be the consequence of somebody recommending a cure.

Anyway Fidalgo and everybody else,  I've sinced stopped the Sea Salt and vitamin C since I ran out of vitamin C.  I am now taking nothing and surprisingly I am having very good sleep.  I am so exhausted right now and am sleeping very well.  So far I haven't had any orgasms but I will update in the future of the affects.  I actually feel better now than I was taking any vitamin C, claritin, or sea salt.  Sleep is like heaven to me, I haven't slept this well in quite a while.  Perhaps (in my previous posts), when my headache "left", POIS "left", but I will know soon.

I am not sure if it was the C and sea salt that has done this to me.  I am leaning toward the prolonged use of high doses of vitamin C that is making me currently immune to POIS, the sea salt and C I am not so sure about but it still was part of the equation and could have possibly played a role.  I will update in the future.

Anyways about the 2 weeks rule, yes I did wait 2 weeks, and even more than that, I've waited 2 months after taking high doses of vitamin C, and another 2 weeks while on the sea salt & C, I was just feeling so good that I had to say something.  I will update on my future O's

I've been doing the Vit-C and sea salt routine for a bit over a week now and I think its helping me. Its certainly not a 'omg this is fantastic' outcome, but i've felt a bit better than normal. I should point out I started taking P-5-P two weeks prior, which is helping with my sleep/dreams as well.
Both the sea salt + high dose vit-c could easily play a part in any improvement, but it may not be the same for everyone as a number of us could have other concomitant health issues....for instance parasites or mineral deficiences which the salt will help with.
I actually took high dose (30-40gm) Vit-C injections years ago as part of the treatment to recover from CFS. In later years I have also taken the Myers cocktail when really run down (high dose Vit-C,  Vit-Bs, Ca, Mg, Zn) and felt wonderful on them, very diminished pois symptoms. The catch with continuing to take these injections....I had to go to a special clinic an hours drive away, expensive ($150/wk), and there is no residual benefit...within 3-4 days of stopping you feel the same as you did before taking them.
I didn't think GC was irresponsible at all. These substances are hardly risky, and for those of us who have had pois for years, feeling temporarily worse for trying a new 'prospective' treatment is better than not trying anything beyond abstinence. I think its wonderful whenever I read of someone getting an improvment when trying something new (that I've never tried), as it gives me hope, even if its short lived. People here know the posters here are not medical professionals (and even then with my experience of medicos over the years they are not experts when it comes to something that is not in their textbooks). Its up to the individuals to read up on any substance or discuss it with their doctor or continue ignore it and wait till there is an official treatment protocol.

[demografx]

Thanks, acronym!

[demografx]

People here know the posters here are not medical professionals.

The more active, astute ones do.

Sadly, there are desperate readers who will try - indiscriminately - any strong, lengthy, enthusiastic reporting about POIS experiments.

We have had members here who have been suicidal, extremely vulnerable and not thinking clearly.

We have a responsibility to them, too. I don't want to get a Private Message one day saying "Forum Member X is in the hospital (or dead) after trying what was very enthusiastically reported by Forum Member Y."

This could have happened with a member who had GREAT ideas (carried forward expertly now by Victor.kons). In this case, his enthusiasm for injectable XN went as far as publicly and privately offering to mail XN+hypodermic syringe to every member on the forum. Even me, who found a cure!

So...there is no way am I going to think, "Well, tough cookies, Forum Member X should have studied it better." Not if we inadvertently contributed to lead him astray!

We are not medical practitioners, true, but in the absence of true medical knowledge "out there" about POIS in MedicineLand...we're IT!

All I'm simply suggesting, acronym, is to let's keep these people in mind when posting experiments.

[demografx]

Funny parallel: I myself followed the forum's strong - but theoretical - enthusiasm about progesterone (with testosterone) - called T/P.

I convinced my endocrinologist to let me try it, got the Rx, got sick and stopped taking it.

I'm lucky my reaction wasn't worse!

[manutao]

Hey all, serious question.  I know for sure I get POIS symptoms when I masturbate and I thought it was ONLY that. As I mentioned before I'm 19 and most of my time spent when I was a younger was on masturbating and video games, I barely went out at all. Now It wasn't easy but I stopped masturbating all together and the positive changes on how I think and feel are amazing, I felt good. But just recently I visited my moms for the weekend and I got my symptoms back after 3 days of getting sucked into the beta for the upcoming game Diablo 3. Somewhere in all that time playing I felt a numbing sensation come over my head and it all came back, I'm fatigued, I can't think clearly no matter what, and I can't be socially active. I mean, last week at school I was the complete opposite, I was feeling confident with clear thoughts and I had a response to everything, made people laugh and even flirted. Now, all I could do the last 2 days was stay quiet, yawn, put my head down, and to talk as little as possible because my mind is off, the same feelings after I masturbate days before. This pisses me off because I'm avoiding masturbation for this sole reason and now I find out gaming gives it to me as well, I'm not sure what to do or how to explain this to people, If I tell a doctor she might misdiagnose me thinking its something else, I feel I brought this upon myself after abusing my mind and body so much from the late nights but will this be permanent? What can I do to stop this?
But my real question is, do any of you get symptoms that are similar to POIS symptoms from anything else other than orgasms or masturbating?

i have exactly the same reaction  :0 ..with the numbing sensation over the head after playing video games. symptoms after playing games are similar to the POIS symptoms. i also have it after eating junk food (pizza, fat meat)..or overeating in general and after listening to emotional (!) music. POIS symptoms fade away after a pronounced fasting period of minimum 14 hours. (garlic+fenugreek+intermittent fasting is my formula) i think that some of us have a really oversensitive, fragile dopaminergic system..and some dopaminergic stimulations (like orgasm, video game) leads to a total dopamine crash afterwards..therefore POIS symptoms are similar to symptoms of dopamine depletion.

[kurtosis]

Hey all, serious question.  I know for sure I get POIS symptoms when I masturbate and I thought it was ONLY that. As I mentioned before I'm 19 and most of my time spent when I was a younger was on masturbating and video games, I barely went out at all. Now It wasn't easy but I stopped masturbating all together and the positive changes on how I think and feel are amazing, I felt good. But just recently I visited my moms for the weekend and I got my symptoms back after 3 days of getting sucked into the beta for the upcoming game Diablo 3. Somewhere in all that time playing I felt a numbing sensation come over my head and it all came back, I'm fatigued, I can't think clearly no matter what, and I can't be socially active. I mean, last week at school I was the complete opposite, I was feeling confident with clear thoughts and I had a response to everything, made people laugh and even flirted. Now, all I could do the last 2 days was stay quiet, yawn, put my head down, and to talk as little as possible because my mind is off, the same feelings after I masturbate days before. This pisses me off because I'm avoiding masturbation for this sole reason and now I find out gaming gives it to me as well, I'm not sure what to do or how to explain this to people, If I tell a doctor she might misdiagnose me thinking its something else, I feel I brought this upon myself after abusing my mind and body so much from the late nights but will this be permanent? What can I do to stop this?
But my real question is, do any of you get symptoms that are similar to POIS symptoms from anything else other than orgasms or masturbating?

i have exactly the same reaction  :0 ..with the numbing sensation over the head after playing video games. symptoms after playing games are similar to the POIS symptoms. i also have it after eating junk food (pizza, fat meat)..or overeating in general and after listening to emotional (!) music. POIS symptoms fade away after a pronounced fasting period of minimum 14 hours. (garlic+fenugreek+intermittent fasting is my formula) i think that some of us have a really oversensitive, fragile dopaminergic system..and some dopaminergic stimulations (like orgasm, video game) leads to a total dopamine crash afterwards..therefore POIS symptoms are similar to symptoms of dopamine depletion.

One of the reasons why I wondered about taking L-Tyrosine. Under stress and catecholamine depletion it appears to enhance cognitive function. See http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1863555/. This is obtainable from health food shops as a powder or in foods such as milk, yoghurt and at its highest concentration in soy protein and spirulina. Eggs, whey and other body builders' favourites also contain high amounts of tyrosine.
It does appear that in its pure form it's most effective in increasing production of catecholamines.
One of the journal publications about military trials is available on mendeley at http://www.mendeley.com/research/tyrosine-potential-countermeasure-performance-decrement-military-sustained-operations/

[demografx]

Thanks, kurtosis!

[demografx]

manutao, welcome to the POIS thread of The Naked Science Forum!  We believe that 2012 is POIS' Breakthrough Year! We hope to launch serious POIS Medical Research! A great time to be here!


**(If you have any technical questions, please feel free to PM (private message) Daveman or me -- or another forum member - - go towards the end of this welcome message (after the 5 available research articles are described) for instuctions on how to send PM. We'll be happy to explain!)***


If you haven't already done so, but would like to like to join the new forum,  send "daveman" a PM here at the Naked Science Forum.


Here are some POIS resources which may be helpful to you:

Click here to see Mat780's excellent YouTube POIS Channel!   Mat's YouTube videos include (1) our great new April 12 POIS TV Documentary! A must-see. And (2) The Learning Channel documentary, featuring our forum member "Animus"!

Click here to see The POIS reddit post!  Outsiders (non-POISers) spontaneously gifted NORD's POIS Research Grant $1,000+ from this reddit post. Thanks to "mellivora" and "CCconfucius"!!!

Our POIS chatroom (realtime chat). Invite or visit another member(s) there, ANY TIME. We can all get to know each other better:
Just click here first, and then look for "CHAT" button towards top of page, 4th button to your right!

Our alternate POIS Forum - architectural genius: "daveman" - for detailed subject-by-subject discussion!
http://www.POISCenter.com/forums/index.php
Our 5-year-old POIS thread here at Naked Science Forum will also always remain open for newcomers, for general unstructured discussion, and historical research of the 10,000+ postings here since 2007.

Our POIS Information Website, built by "mat780", is here:
http://sites.google.com/site/POISwebsite/

The POIS Information Website is home to the POIS Forum Compendium, written by "Pyropeach", and contains theories already discussed here and treatments that have both worked and failed.

Please see "B_Jim"'s POIS Summary of All Cases, here as well as others on the Web. This includes remedies that we have tested, and results.
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149009#msg149009

"Girlwind" has created an excellent POIS Video:

Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome "POIS": Case report

Authors:
Abdalla M Attia*, Magda H Al-Ziny, Hossam A Yasien
*Corresponding author: Andrology Unit, Minoufiya University, Shibin El Kom, Eygpt

For more info, check out emi_b's  SMF POIS thread:
http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=191.0;topicseen


POIS Research Studies available Upon Request:

1. and 2. POIS Research Studies, 2011

These 2 papers reveal Dr. Waldinger's POIS autoimmune hypothesis and suggest one possible avenue of treatment.

3. First POIS Research Study, 2002

We have a copy of the first formal medical investigation on POIS by Prof. dr. Marcel D. Waldinger,MD, Ph.D., and Dr. Dave Schweitzer, MD.

   
4. Recent POIS Research Study, 2010

CASE REPORT
Postorgasm Illness Syndrome - A Spectrum of Illnesses
Jane Ashby, MRCP, and David Goldmeier, MRCP
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg316781#msg316781


5. British Medical Journal Case Report, 2010

Case study by Dr. Selwyn Dexter of a patient with a headache-featured POIS symptom treated with progesterone/norethisterone.
http://casereports.bmj.com/content/2010/bcr.10.2009.2359.short?rss=1


How to get any or all of the above 5 studies: send me or "daveman" a Private Message (PM) with your regular email address (use "AT" instead of "@" ) and we'll send you back the PDF(s).

To send a Private Message, click on "My Messages" at the top of this page. Then click "Send Message". From that point on, it works just like posting a message here, except that it only goes to the person(s) you designate.


New York Times article,

January 20, 2009
Mind
Sex and Depression: In the Brain, if Not the Mind
By RICHARD A. FRIEDMAN, M.D.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/20/health/views/20mind.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=friedman%20sexual%20January%2020&st=cse

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

In addition to serving our own informational interests, the resources listed above can be useful for you to show our credibility to the medical world - which often shows little understanding and is sometimes skeptical of our condition: POIS has scientific underpinnings and POIS is not "just another psychological problem" related to sex - to be treated by the psychiatric/psychotherapeutic community. All of this information can greatly help you to fight the immediate reaction of some doctors: so just tell them, "IT'S NOT 'ALL IN YOUR HEAD'! "





It can be very  helpful to you when dealing with medical professionals to point out the
POIS' official listing, as recognized by the
National Institutes for Health (NIH), Office of Rare Diseases Research:

And in Europe: Orphanet now lists POIS on their website! - Click here!

POIS also appears in credible medical sources such as the Journal of Sexual Medicine (Dr. Waldinger's study), British Medical Journal (Dr. Selwyn Dexter's study), and wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postorgasmic_illness_syndrome

For over 5 years, our POIS forum has attracted over 200 POIS sufferers worldwide who have posted here, research on an additional 200 sufferers elsewhere on the internet, plus our pages have been read nearly 2,000,000 times! Not bad for a rare malady!

Show some of this to your doctor - with pride! Chances are, YOU know FAR more about POIS than s/he does! Don't be intimidated by fancy diplomas. It's almost impossible for ANY one doctor to know much about POIS before you walk into his/her office. Unfortunately, it's up to YOU to educate THEM! And if you happen to find yourself with a disagreeable "student"-doctor (you're the teacher!), find another doctor. Quickly!

SEARCH THE FORUM WITH GOOGLE

We have an overwhelming amount of data: more than 5 years' worth of posts (over  10,000 posts!) from 200+ Forum members, and an additional 200 POIS sufferers found elsewhere on the Internet by Member B_Jim.

In the Google search box, type
whatever-it-is-you're-interested-in-finding-out[space]POIS[space]site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

for example, I tried
nocturnal emission POIS site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

and 740 results came up for "nocturnal emission" within the Forum.

be careful with spaces (you can use them before the word "site") and no-spaces (everything after the word "site")

Google even provides you results with the Message# for each result. But Message #'s do change, so be patient and look for the approximate Message#.

[demografx]

Top 10 Reasons to Fire Your Doctor 

http://arthritis.about.com/od/buildyourhealthcareteam/tp/fireyourdoctor.htm

[Stef]

Great post, Demografx!!!

For those of you who have seen the movie, Network (came out several years ago) -- the following phrase became a mantra for many individuals who were disgusted with the negligent, disinterested treatment by the powers that be --

"I'm as mad as hell, and I'm not going to take this anymore!"

Let that be your mantra with doctors!