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  4. What is the speed of gravity?
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What is the speed of gravity?

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Offline jeffreyH

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Re: What is the speed of gravity?
« Reply #40 on: 05/03/2016 15:10:54 »
Quote from: Bill S on 05/03/2016 14:28:02
Quote from: Space Flow
If you are making the claim that this is not what GR claims as the cause of Gravity I wish you would present your source of information when you make such a statement. 

This one probably comes closest to what I said.  I'm pushed for time at the moment, but I think I could find a few more ewxamples if you need them

http://www.quantum-field-theory.net/einstein-didnt-say/

Equations of motion do not describe a curved path in the absence of a force.
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Offline Bill S

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Re: What is the speed of gravity?
« Reply #41 on: 06/03/2016 01:31:24 »
Quote from: Jeffrey
Equations of motion do not describe a curved path in the absence of a force.

Would that force be gravity?
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Offline Space Flow

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Re: What is the speed of gravity?
« Reply #42 on: 06/03/2016 01:44:35 »
Quote from: Bill S on 05/03/2016 14:28:02
This one probably comes closest to what I said.  I'm pushed for time at the moment, but I think I could find a few more ewxamples if you need them

http://www.quantum-field-theory.net/einstein-didnt-say/
 

 
I think such view points as is suggested by this link and yourself, are not mainstream and use a lot of quotes out of context.  This or one of many other various differing viewpoints may one day be found to be closer to the truth than current majority belief but that is certainly not the accepted by majority view of classical GR physics as I understand it today. 

By the way, this a quote from your link.   

Quote from: Albert Einstein
When working on a comprehensive paper on the special theory of relativity… there occurred to me the happiest thought of my life…. for an observer falling freely from the roof of a house there exists – at least in his immediate surroundings – no gravitational field (Einstein’s emphasis). Indeed, if the observer drops some bodies then these remain relative to him in a state of rest or of uniform motion, independent of their particular nature… This simple thought made a deep impression on me. It impelled me toward a theory of gravitation. – A. Einstein (P1982, p. 178-179)
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Offline dhjdhj

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Re: What is the speed of gravity?
« Reply #43 on: 06/03/2016 13:26:11 »
I have been following this thread with great interest and whereas I am reluctant to interrupt this discussion by obviously learned people I would like to make these observations. The speed of wave propagation through the mediums we encounter on earth is proportional to the density of the medium. The denser the medium the faster the wave. This works until we get to the very fastest wave speeds electromagnetic fields and light where they propagate through the least dense medium or a medium of no density. This brings me to the reasoning behind my 'crackpot' left field hypothesis that the cosmos may be made up incredibly small inelastic spheres fruit-packed into a matrix. At the risk of sounding 'Boxxy' I now believe the basic posit might be right. If these spheres or beads as I called them only appear real in our world if moved i.e. given a co-ordinate of time, after which they become awake and form matter as we know it, then suddenly a lot of things begin to make sense. If you park the standard model for now (I believe a sensible and suitable structure can be found) as the structure I suggested has some issues which I am working on, then the rest  of the hypothesis seems to work very well. A spinning bead provides a gravitational field which propagates to infinity through its un-awaken neighbours in accordance with the inverse square law. It satisfies ,in fact requires time dilation exactly as Einstein's equation and the mass energy equivalence equation drops out. The speed of light is C in any direction as it should be. The photon is now energy travelling as a wave function in the densest material possible only waking up a tiny piece of mass as it goes. It has duality, angular momentum, no axial momentum, spin and will happily go through two slits at a time. It also has a tiny gravitational field that causes gravitational lensing, and if you have enough of them like close to a star it will provide sufficient additional gravity to effect the nearby planet. The matrix itself will provide multiple paths for entanglement and even allow energy to flow outwards instantly negating the need for expansion. Dark matter become a requirement as kilo for kilo energy transfer would supply 2 times 10 to the 40 more gravity than normal astronomical mass, so there would be huge supplies of gravity, probably centred around galaxies which would give rise to the dark matter effect. So the answer to the question would automatically be, gravitational waves which would happily travel through this matrix, would travel at C, whilst gravitational fields would appear instantly. If the sun suddenly disappeared it would not take 8 minutes for the earth to feel it, it would be instant. Now this idea supposes that time is absolute, supports relativity, space is three dimensional and flat and that the wave speed of light and gravity is back in its right place on the graph. At the risk of being considered mad what's not to like?
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Offline jeffreyH

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Re: What is the speed of gravity?
« Reply #44 on: 06/03/2016 13:31:47 »
Quote from: Bill S on 06/03/2016 01:31:24
Quote from: Jeffrey
Equations of motion do not describe a curved path in the absence of a force.

Would that force be gravity?

Yes
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Offline Bill S

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Re: What is the speed of gravity?
« Reply #45 on: 06/03/2016 22:45:46 »
Quote from: Space Flow
.....that is certainly not the accepted by majority view of classical GR physics as I understand it today.


Scientific veracity is not determined democratic vote, but the following link indicates that there are those in the scientific community who agree about what Einstein actually said.

http://www.quantum-field-theory.net/scientific-american-einstein-didnt-say-that/

This link also shows how easy it is for experts to give us "hitch-hikers" the wrong impression.
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