[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

The field has indeed changed due this rearrangement of the masses involved, and that change is propagated at lightspeed via gravity waves.

Gravitational waves is about an accelerated mass however in such case the gravity of the object will increase and strengthen but not in a form of waves.This about mass increment not accelerated mass.

[alancalverd]

As far as we know, the gravitational equation appears to be universally true.

The equation is not necessarily to validate the theory.

On the contrary, theories are validated by prediction, and prediction in physics requires an equation.

[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

As far as we know, the gravitational equation appears to be universally true.

The equation is not necessarily to validate the theory.

On the contrary, theories are validated by prediction, and prediction in physics requires an equation.

All tests for the equation are within gravity influence but not at infinite distances.The equation might be valid within gravity influence but wrong beyond that.

[Bored chemist]

The equation might be valid within gravity influence but wrong beyond that.

And you might turn into a unicorn tomorrow.
But that's not a good reason to assume that you will.

[alancalverd]

As r → ∞, F → 0, so the equation is an operational definition of infinity.

[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

As r → ∞, F → 0, so the equation is an operational definition of infinity.

Mathematically the equation is true, in reality it is not.It means it is true only if the influence reached infinity.
I don't want to involve in my personal ideas here , but suppose gravity influence decreases by the speed of light c and drops to zero beyond its range , then we would have gravity at earth's surface equals 9.8 m/s/s and a changeable amount "at the edge of its range " "decreasing" in such case the equation would be valid within its range and we can take double integration from zero to the edge and from the edge to the earth surface to calculate for instance escape velocity.In such case all current observations will be true using a concept of limited range.
The gravitational equation could be modified in order to be valid everywhere or it could be valid everywhere except beyond the gravity influence.

[Bored chemist]

suppose gravity influence decreases ... and drops to zero beyond its range

Then you need to answer the question I asked earlier.

Cut to the chase.
"How does gravity exert its influence infinitely?"
How could it not do so?
What would stop it?

[alancalverd]

Mathematically the equation is true, in reality it is not.

Any statement taken as a definition cannot be false. I defined infinity as the distance at which F = 0.

but suppose gravity influence decreases by the speed of light c and drops to zero beyond its range ,

This phrase is meaningless. Speed is not equivalent to distance. "Decreases by the speed of light" has no meaning.

If there is a finite range for gravitation (and why should there be? all other inverse square forces are unbounded), what determines the cutoff point?

[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

I defined infinity as the distance at which F = 0.

At F=0 the equation fails to determine the distance " undefined"

all other inverse square forces are unbounded

The same idea for other inverse square forces is applied as for gravity.

 what determines the cutoff point?

The time since the gravitational field comes to existence:
F=GMm/c²t²
ct is the distance from mass center to the cutoff point where t is the time elapsed.

[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

Just one question I want an answer for:
Why in case of a rotating object or God suddenly increased sun's mass, why the influence of gravity reach us with a delay? How to explain this phenomenon only with the idea of a limited range extending with the speed of light c?

[Bored chemist]

you need to answer the question I asked earlier.

[alancalverd]

You must abandon the obsession with "limited range", for which there is no evidence or mechanism. The position vector for a pulse travelling at velocity c at time t is obviously ct but there is no limit to t and in an empty universe there is no curvature to c.

What makes gravity unique is its unipolar suck, and what makes it interesting is its apparent propagation speed c. Adding imaginary and wholly unobserved properties like limited range doesn't improve any of our models. 

[alancalverd]

Quote from: alancalverd on Yesterday at 21:46:31

I defined infinity as the distance at which F = 0.

At F=0 the equation fails to determine the distance " undefined"

For every value of F, you can find a smaller value by increasing r. That is how we describe continuum infinities. If F = 0 then r must be larger than any distance you can measure or imagine, so "determine the distance" is meaningless.

[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

You must abandon the obsession with "limited range"

Just one question I want an answer for:
For a rotating object or God suddenly increased sun's mass,  the influence of gravity reach us with a delay .How to explain this phenomenon without the idea of a limited range extending with the speed of light c?

[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

If gravity is everywhere, as soon as mass increased or an object rotates gravity of the mass or energy should be available everywhere at an instance and never delay.
What equation is used in such case? giving the idea gravity will equal zero not for infinity but for real number distances, how the equation works then ?

[Bored chemist]

If gravity is everywhere, as soon as mass increased or an object rotates gravity of the mass or energy should be available everywhere at an instance and never delay.

Nonsense.
The best available evidence suggests that gravity and light travel at the same speed. (It's much easier to turn a light on than to suddenly create mass).
So let's see what happens if we pretend that your view is right, and apply it to light.


"If gravity light is everywhere, as soon as mass increased or an object rotates a bulb is turned on gravity light of the mass or energy bulb should be available everywhere at an instance and never delay."

It makes no sense with light, and it makes no sense with gravity

[Bored chemist]

you need to answer the question I asked earlier.

[Yahya A.Sharif (OP)]

"If gravity light is everywhere, as soon as mass increased or an object rotates a bulb is turned on gravity light of the mass or energy bulb should be available everywhere at an instance and never delay."

It makes no sense with light, and it makes no sense with gravity

It is not my idea, it is the current view that gravity is available everywhere but you answered:

It makes no sense with gravity

I still ask my question:

For a rotating object or God suddenly increased sun's mass,  the influence of gravity reach us with a delay .How to explain this phenomenon without the idea of a limited range extending with the speed of light c?

How the equation works in such case? we have masses and distance between them but the force equals zero for real number values of distance

[Colin2B]

"If gravity light is everywhere, as soon as mass increased or an object rotates a bulb is turned on gravity light of the mass or energy bulb should be available everywhere at an instance and never delay."

It makes no sense with light, and it makes no sense with gravity

It is not my idea, it is the current view that gravity is available everywhere but you answered:

It makes no sense with gravity

As @Bored chemist  answered, there is no reason to suggest that a change in gravity propagates instantaneously ie without delay.

For a rotating object or God suddenly increased sun's mass,  the influence of gravity reach us with a delay .How to explain this phenomenon without the idea of a limited range extending with the speed of light c?

This has been answered by @alancalverd  who explained that there is no reason to introduce the idea of limited range.
Light propagates at c but has no limited range, why should gravity have a limited range?

[Bored chemist]

I still ask my question:

Why?
You already have an answer.

It is not my idea, it is the current view that gravity is available everywhere

What do you mean by "available"?
It doesn't make sense in English to say "gravity is available everywhere".