[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

An alternating voltage on an oscilloscope

What would you expect me to have seen?
How would what you expect differ from what Faraday's laws say?

I don't believe you. You are bluffing just as you were bluffing about the quotation from Faraday.
As I see, you are from UK. It is a rich country and the schools are surely good equipped, much better than in your time. Please go in some school and repeat the experiment and put it on YouTube.

[hamdani yusuf]

Here I found a youtube video showing what would happen in rotating coil experiment. Just skip to 1:55.

[Bored chemist]

An alternating voltage on an oscilloscope

What would you expect me to have seen?
How would what you expect differ from what Faraday's laws say?

I don't believe you. You are bluffing just as you were bluffing about the quotation from Faraday.
As I see, you are from UK. It is a rich country and the schools are surely good equipped, much better than in your time. Please go in some school and repeat the experiment and put it on YouTube.

Rather than calling me a liar, just answer the questions

An alternating voltage on an oscilloscope

What would you expect me to have seen?
How would what you expect differ from what Faraday's laws say?

[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

Here I found a youtube video showing what would happen in rotating coil experiment. Just skip to 1:55.

I see a flaw in this experimental setup, but to explain it I have to draw something which I cannot do at the moment. I will post soon what I think about this.

[Bored chemist]

BTW, are you happier with this  animation?
It's rather more realistic. It uses 6 coils and, when the magnet is "pointing at" the coil, the voltage is zero.

Just because you found one sloppy diagram in a textbook does not mean that  the world of physics is wrong.

[Bored chemist]

I see a flaw in this experimental setup, but to explain it I have to draw something which I cannot do at the moment. I will post soon what I think about this.

While you are sharpening your pencil, you can answer my questions.

What would you expect me to have seen?
How would what you expect differ from what Faraday's laws say?

[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

An alternating voltage on an oscilloscope

What would you expect me to have seen?
How would what you expect differ from what Faraday's laws say?

I don't believe you. You are bluffing just as you were bluffing about the quotation from Faraday.
As I see, you are from UK. It is a rich country and the schools are surely good equipped, much better than in your time. Please go in some school and repeat the experiment and put it on YouTube.

Rather than calling me a liar, just answer the questions

An alternating voltage on an oscilloscope

What would you expect me to have seen?
How would what you expect differ from what Faraday's laws say?

I expect that you have seen a straight line on the scope. Even if I am wrong about this (which  I am not, but let us assume that I am), this still doesn't tell at which moment the current is at maximum, what was the initial assertion of my original post.
Hamdani has posted a video which disproves what I say. I will answer soon.

[Bored chemist]

I expect that you have seen a straight line on the scope.

If that had happened, what would the teacher have said when we all laughed at him (because he, and the textbooks. predicted AC voltage)?
That's about the least plausible outcome.

Even if I am wrong about this (which  I am not, but let us assume that I am)

I did the experiment.
You didn't.
This is a science page.
So, no, we do not assume that you are right and reality is wrong.

this still doesn't tell at which moment the current is at maximum,

If I feed the electrical  power into something like a heater which is pretty much  a resistor then, by ohm's law, the current and the voltage are proportional to one another.
If one is zero, the other is also zero.

Hamdani has posted a video which disproves what I say.

Well, since we have now got- as you say- proof that you are wrong, perhaps you should apologise for calling me a liar, and for wasting everyone's time.

[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

BTW, are you happier with this  animation?
It's rather more realistic. It uses 6 coils and, when the magnet is "pointing at" the coil, the voltage is zero.

Just because you found one sloppy diagram in a textbook does not mean that  the world of physics is wrong.

Well, about the problem with the synchronous generators and motors we have come to the solution - to the solution of mine.
But who is this "Quellstrom" (the uploader of the video)? Isn't he an anonymous, a "crackpot",  like some people want to call me, too. You post a video from some "crackpot" to prove that the Science is right?!!!
I have posted a picture from a textbook from seven authors, all of them professors, doctors, magisters and engineers. The book has more than ten editions and in every edition the picture is the same (to be honest I have seen only two editions, the 8th and the 9th).
So, you call "sloppy" the book from academics, and a video from a "crackpot" is not sloppy.
 
I prove the Science wrong on works of professors, you prove the Science right on works of crackpots. There is a difference.

Here is yet another example of it:
http://xn--drmstrre-64ad.dk/wp-content/wind/miller/windpower%20web/en/tour/wtrb/syncgen.htm

If you think consequently, you will understand that the error is not accidental. It is a consequence of the Faraday's law.

If you have a reply to this, please wait with it, I have to prepare an answer for Hamdani.

[Bored chemist]

But who is this "Quellstrom"

I don't know, and I don't care.
I can judge the video for myself.

I have posted a picture from a textbook from seven authors, all of them professors, doctors, magisters and engineers. The book has more than ten editions and in every edition the picture is the same (to be honest I have seen only two editions, the 8th and the 9th).

And yet, we both agree that it is wrong.
Your idea of clipping the picture from one end of the sequence and putting it at the start is certainly an improvement.

It is a consequence of the Faraday's law.

That picture in the textbook is totally inconsistent with Faraday's law.
It certainly isn't a consequence of it.

[Bored chemist]

I prove the Science wrong on works of professors,

You don't even understand Ohm's law.

[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

Here I found a youtube video showing what would happen in rotating coil experiment. Just skip to 1:55.

This video does not disprove what I claim in the original post of this thread, but in the thread "What type of current is induced in a wire loop which rotates in a magnetic field?".
https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=78515.0

There I claim that no current is induced in a wire loop which rotates in a magnetic field.

In the video above I assume two flaws. If the flaws are eliminated, I claim that no current will be induced in the loop.

To explain the first flaw, I have drawn the following figure:

wire towards magnet.png (44.79 kB . 590x440 - viewed 7931 times)

In the figure (a) a wire is moving vertically towards the left edge of the magnet. A current is induced in the wire which flows towards us. In the figure (b) the wire is moving towards the right edge of the magnet. A current is induced in the wire which flows away from us. In the figure (c) the wire is moving exactly towards the middle of the magnet. No current is induced in this wire. In the figure (d) the wire is very little shifted from the middle to the right and is moving vertically towards the magnet. In this wire a current will be induced, but significantly weaker than that of the figure (b). The more the wire is shifted to the right, the stronger will be the current in it. It is the strongest when the wire is moving vertically towards the edge of the magnet. If we draw a graph, it will look approximately like this:

graph_distance from the middle.png (4.41 kB . 530x210 - viewed 7861 times)

Why do I say this? In the mentioned thread I claim that no current is induced in the rotating loop because the currents in the opposite and relevant sides of the loop cancel each other out. But this is valid only if both sides are at equal distances from the middle of the magnet. If they are not, then the two currents are not with equal strength and cannot cancel each other out fully.

In the linked video I notice that the wire loop is shifted a little upwards.

To understand the second flaw, please read first this post "Is electric current induced in a wire when it is moving perpendicularly to the magnetic lines of force or when it is moving in line with them?"
https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=78772.0

The shape of the magnet in the video above is similar to the shape of the magnet in the video of the just linked thread. It has also a vertical component which can induce a current in the loop. This component must be eliminated to carry out the experiment as it should be carried out. The experimental setup should look like this:

setup rotating loop.png (5 kB . 390x280 - viewed 7929 times)

If these flaws are eliminated from the experimental setup, I still claim that no current will be induced in the wire loop.

[Bored chemist]

There I claim that no current is induced in a wire loop which rotates in a magnetic field.

And all the evidence (including that video) shows that you are wrong.

[Bored chemist]

Have you heard of earth inductors?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_inductor_compass

https://www.geomag.nrcan.gc.ca/lab/vm/inductor-en.php

[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

There I claim that no current is induced in a wire loop which rotates in a magnetic field.

And all the evidence (including that video) shows that you are wrong.

I am not wrong. The experiment in the video is not properly conducted. I explain that in my last post of this thread.

Do you want to comment on this post of mine:
https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=78772.msg594433#msg594433

But this time not with "You are wrong". Try once to write something which deals with the essence of the post.

[Bored chemist]

Have you heard of earth inductors?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_inductor_compass

https://www.geomag.nrcan.gc.ca/lab/vm/inductor-en.php

[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

Have you heard of earth inductors?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_inductor_compass

https://www.geomag.nrcan.gc.ca/lab/vm/inductor-en.php

Would you elaborate how the earth inductor contradicts my assertions?

[Bored chemist]

Have you heard of earth inductors?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_inductor_compass

https://www.geomag.nrcan.gc.ca/lab/vm/inductor-en.php

Would you elaborate how the earth inductor contradicts my assertions?

An earth inductor actually lets you find out what happens when you move a wire through a (very nearly) uniform field.
People have done this (originally as novel science, recently as a school demonstration) for a few hundred years.

If your idea of what happens differs from what faraday's law predicts then you need to explain why countless experimenters didn't notice.

[Mitko Gorgiev (OP)]

Would you elaborate how the earth inductor contradicts my assertions?

An earth inductor actually lets you find out what happens when you move a wire through a (very nearly) uniform field.

And what is that ?

People have done this (originally as novel science, recently as a school demonstration) for a few hundred years.

Where are those school demonstrations? Are there some YT or other videos?

 
If your idea of what happens differs from what faraday's law predicts then you need to explain why countless experimenters didn't notice.

That would be a task for some future historians.

[Bored chemist]

I'm away on holiday at the moment and the internet connection's not great.
Can we just assume for the minute that you are wrong, and I will fill in the details when i get home?