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  1. Naked Science Forum
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  4. Is my Model for Particles Correct?
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Is my Model for Particles Correct?

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Offline talanum1 (OP)

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #140 on: 10/03/2022 14:24:06 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 10/03/2022 13:05:36
Get back to us if that happens.
Until then, please don't try to raise it on a science page.

I must post it somewhere where scientists have access to it to inform them to be on the lookout.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #141 on: 10/03/2022 16:16:15 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 10/03/2022 14:24:06
Quote from: Bored chemist on 10/03/2022 13:05:36
Get back to us if that happens.
Until then, please don't try to raise it on a science page.

I must post it somewhere where scientists have access to it to inform them to be on the lookout.
Why would scientists want to be on the lookout for hogwash?
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Offline Kryptid

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #142 on: 10/03/2022 17:18:36 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 10/03/2022 11:37:48
For a computer to think you need some operator to load and run the program. Who does this for Humans?

Embryonic development.

Quote from: talanum1 on 10/03/2022 11:37:48
There must be momentum non-conservation even if the soul is made out of energy.

Not if the soul has momentum, but like I said before:

Quote from: Kryptid on 09/03/2022 16:42:36
The fact of the matter is that you can't justify one speculative case of violation of conservation of momentum by pointing out a different speculative case of violation of momentum.

Quote from: talanum1 on 10/03/2022 12:57:57
It can become science if a lot of people experience it for themselves.

Can you tell us how to have this experience?
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Offline Origin

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #143 on: 10/03/2022 22:45:55 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 10/03/2022 14:24:06
I must post it somewhere where scientists have access to it to inform them to be on the lookout.

This becoming a bit pathetic.

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Offline talanum1 (OP)

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #144 on: 11/03/2022 11:33:55 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 10/03/2022 17:18:36
Can you tell us how to have this experience?

Just observe a Pi-minus decay, and be sure to be the only one observing it.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #145 on: 11/03/2022 12:50:37 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 11/03/2022 11:33:55
Just observe a Pi-minus decay,
NOBODY CAN.
Why don't you understand that?

Only you think you can, but that's a consequence of an hallucination, not of reality.
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Offline Origin

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #146 on: 11/03/2022 15:53:43 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 11/03/2022 11:33:55
Just observe a Pi-minus decay, and be sure to be the only one observing it.

Come on, I mean WTF!!?
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Offline Kryptid

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #147 on: 11/03/2022 17:50:28 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 11/03/2022 11:33:55
Just observe a Pi-minus decay

How? Be specific. Explain it to me like I'm 5 years old.
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Offline talanum1 (OP)

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #148 on: 11/03/2022 19:26:08 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 11/03/2022 17:50:28
How? Be specific. Explain it to me like I'm 5 years old.

Go to a particle accelerator with a cloud chamber detector and stare at it.

Quote from: Kryptid on 10/03/2022 17:18:36
Not if the soul has momentum, but like I said before:

The soul causes new thoughts, so whether the momentum starts in ions in the brain or in the soul, since the soul starts new mental processes, it creates momentum from nothing.

Quote from: Kryptid on 10/03/2022 17:18:36
For a computer to think you need some operator to load and run the program. Who does this for Humans?

Embryonic development.

God starts the program in babies. He says: "live" and then the mind boots up.
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Offline Origin

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #149 on: 11/03/2022 19:30:37 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 11/03/2022 19:26:08
God starts the program in babies. He says: "live" and then the mind boots up.
Do we have a religion subforum for this?  We have not been discussing science for quite awhile in this thread.
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Offline Kryptid

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #150 on: 11/03/2022 19:53:22 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 11/03/2022 19:26:08
Go to a particle accelerator with a cloud chamber detector and stare at it.

You said earlier that you weren't at a particle accelerator when you sensed the pion decay.

If I do sense something, how I am supposed to know it's pion decay and not neutron decay or something else?

Quote from: talanum1 on 11/03/2022 19:26:08
The soul causes new thoughts, so whether the momentum starts in ions in the brain or in the soul, since the soul starts new mental processes, it creates momentum from nothing.

That's not how that works. When you start a car and it begins to move forward, momentum wasn't created from nothing. It's pushing back on the road just as much as the road is pushing forward on it. That means the total momentum hasn't changed. There's no reason to believe that such would not also be true of a soul causing movement.

But like I have said twice already...

Quote from: Kryptid on 09/03/2022 16:42:36
you can't justify one speculative case of violation of conservation of momentum by pointing out a different speculative case of violation of momentum.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #151 on: 12/03/2022 00:52:39 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 11/03/2022 19:26:08
God starts the program in babies. He says: "live" and then the mind boots up.
And, unless you can provide evidence for that, you just proved that you are trolling
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Offline talanum1 (OP)

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #152 on: 12/03/2022 08:46:03 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 11/03/2022 19:53:22
If I do sense something, how I am supposed to know it's pion decay and not neutron decay or something else?

They can produce a Pi-minus.

Quote from: Kryptid on 11/03/2022 19:53:22
That's not how that works. When you start a car and it begins to move forward, momentum wasn't created from nothing. It's pushing back on the road just as much as the road is pushing forward on it. That means the total momentum hasn't changed. There's no reason to believe that such would not also be true of a soul causing movement.

To balance the momentum of the ions, the soul must have momentum in the opposite direction. What then stops the soul from exiting the brain?
« Last Edit: 12/03/2022 08:54:01 by talanum1 »
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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #153 on: 12/03/2022 12:03:11 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 12/03/2022 08:46:03
What then stops the soul from exiting the brain?
The soul doesn't exist and therefore can't do anything.
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Offline Kryptid

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #154 on: 12/03/2022 17:46:22 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 12/03/2022 08:46:03
They can produce a Pi-minus.

No, I'm asking how I'm supposed to know that any particular thing I happen to see in my mind is supposed to represent any specific particle?

You also didn't address my issue about you not being at a particle accelerator yourself.

Quote from: talanum1 on 12/03/2022 08:46:03
To balance the momentum of the ions, the soul must have momentum in the opposite direction. What then stops the soul from exiting the brain?

Presumably whatever keeps the soul from exiting your brain when you walk. I'm done talking about the soul here. Any time you bring it up again in an attempt to justify violation of momentum conservation, I'm going to repeat this phrase:

"You can't justify one speculative case of violation of conservation of momentum by pointing out a different speculative case of violation of momentum."

Your particle violates momentum conservation. It's falsified.
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Offline talanum1 (OP)

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #155 on: 13/03/2022 09:07:37 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 12/03/2022 17:46:22
No, I'm asking how I'm supposed to know that any particular thing I happen to see in my mind is supposed to represent any specific particle?

They look at the decay products and if the trajectory makes a great circle in a magnetic field.

Quote from: Kryptid on 12/03/2022 17:46:22
You also didn't address my issue about you not being at a particle accelerator yourself.

I said I weren't at a particle accelerator. It is hard to believe but I saw a pi-minus decay.

Quote from: Kryptid on 12/03/2022 17:46:22
Your particle violates momentum conservation. It's falsified.

It does not violate momentum conservation since L0 does not carry momentum.

Quote from: Kryptid on 12/03/2022 17:46:22
Presumably whatever keeps the soul from exiting your brain when you walk.

That means the soul's momentum must be cancelled - violating momentum conservation.
« Last Edit: 13/03/2022 09:27:34 by talanum1 »
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #156 on: 13/03/2022 10:16:11 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 09:07:37
but I saw a pi-minus decay.
That which can be stated without evidence can be dismissed in the same way.
In reality, you imagined a pi-minus decay.
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Offline Kryptid

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #157 on: 13/03/2022 13:23:50 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 09:07:37
They look at the decay products

Who is "they"?

Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 09:07:37
and if the trajectory makes a great circle in a magnetic field.

And how is that supposed to tell me what particles I am seeing?

Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 09:07:37
I said I weren't at a particle accelerator.

That's exactly my point. Why are you telling me to go to a particle accelerator to look for particles when you didn't do so yourself?

Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 09:07:37
It is hard to believe but I saw a pi-minus decay.

And how do you know that's what you observed? Give me a good line of reasoning that what you saw in your head specifically represented such a thing.

Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 09:07:37
It does not violate momentum conservation since L0 does not carry momentum.

That's exactly why it does violate conservation of momentum. When it interacts with another particle, it must transfer energy to that particle. That changes the second particle's momentum. Since there was zero momentum before the interaction and non-zero momentum after the interaction, then momentum conservation is violated.

Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 09:07:37
That means the soul's momentum must be cancelled - violating momentum conservation.

You don't know how momentum conservation works, do you? Do you think momentum conservation is violated just because the wind doesn't blow my hair off of my head?

You can't justify one speculative case of violation of conservation of momentum by pointing out a different speculative case of violation of conservation of momentum.
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Offline talanum1 (OP)

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #158 on: 13/03/2022 18:33:14 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 13/03/2022 13:23:50
Who is "they"?

The Physicists working at a particle collider.

Quote from: Kryptid on 13/03/2022 13:23:50
And how is that supposed to tell me what particles I am seeing?

In a given magnetic field, positively charged particles turn in the opposite direction as negatively charged particles, while neutral particles goes straight.

Quote from: Kryptid on 13/03/2022 13:23:50
And how do you know that's what you observed? Give me a good line of reasoning that what you saw in your head specifically represented such a thing.

I know because I felt the L0 entering my mind.

Quote from: Kryptid on 13/03/2022 13:23:50
That's exactly why it does violate conservation of momentum. When it interacts with another particle, it must transfer energy to that particle. That changes the second particle's momentum.

It never gets a transfer of energy, the energy was always there in the pi-minus. It doesn't have speed but it can quantum jump to inside the observer's mind. Actually it need not jump into the observers mind, it just can just sit in space.

Quote from: Kryptid on 13/03/2022 13:23:50
You can't justify one speculative case of violation of conservation of momentum by pointing out a different speculative case of violation of conservation of momentum.

I am not trying to, I'm just going with the flow.
« Last Edit: 13/03/2022 18:39:33 by talanum1 »
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Is my Model for Particles Correct?
« Reply #159 on: 13/03/2022 19:25:21 »
Quote from: talanum1 on 13/03/2022 18:33:14
I know because I felt the L0 entering my mind.

You need to realise that that sort of comment isn't science.
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