The Naked Scientists
  • Login
  • Register
  • Podcasts
      • The Naked Scientists
      • eLife
      • Naked Genetics
      • Naked Astronomy
      • In short
      • Naked Neuroscience
      • Ask! The Naked Scientists
      • Question of the Week
      • Archive
      • Video
      • SUBSCRIBE to our Podcasts
  • Articles
      • Science News
      • Features
      • Interviews
      • Answers to Science Questions
  • Get Naked
      • Donate
      • Do an Experiment
      • Science Forum
      • Ask a Question
  • About
      • Meet the team
      • Our Sponsors
      • Site Map
      • Contact us

User menu

  • Login
  • Register
  • Home
  • Help
  • Search
  • Tags
  • Recent Topics
  • Login
  • Register
  1. Naked Science Forum
  2. Life Sciences
  3. The Environment
  4. Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« previous next »
  • Print
Pages: 1 [2] 3   Go Down

Should Plastic bottled water be banned?

  • 48 Replies
  • 46358 Views
  • 0 Tags

0 Members and 4 Guests are viewing this topic.

another_someone

  • Guest
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #20 on: 07/10/2007 21:30:31 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 07/10/2007 21:14:41
I think the image problem with bottled water is quite simple. You can't get cola or milk out of the tap so they have to be delivered in bottles (or some such) but you can get perfectly good water out of the tap (at least in most places we are talking about) so there's no justification for the expense and waste associated with bottled water.
Water is water (and the requirements for purity, sterillity etc are often more stringent for tap water).

But the point is that you certainly can functionally substitute cola with tap water, even if it is a different product.

Water is not water - nobody drinks distilled water, so each water is water+, and that makes each water subtly different.

As for the justification for the expense of bottled water - that is rather like arguing there is no justification for the expense of tourism - but those of choices people make about where they spend their money.  Is it really more expensive (whether in money terms, or in environmental terms) paying for bottled water for a year, or flying 12,000 miles for your annual holiday?
Logged
 



Offline pirunner (OP)

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 74
  • Activity:
    0%
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #21 on: 07/10/2007 23:47:06 »
Quote from: another_someone on 07/10/2007 21:25:00
Now let me ask you - if they piped a different brand of sports drink, rather than Gatorade, would you be willing to forgo your bottled Gatorade because you do have a sports drink on tap, even if maybe not exactly the taste you desire?

Well, I could really go either way, since I mainly just drink water. I only drink sports drinks every once in a while. I may drink them a bit more if they were piped to my house however.But.... I see your point. I guess I'm just lucky that I have tasty tap water!

I completely agree with your three points on size determination. I try my best to conserve, but common sense always governs.
Logged
 

Offline pirunner (OP)

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 74
  • Activity:
    0%
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #22 on: 07/10/2007 23:48:06 »
Yeah....I got these quotes down now...My first step on my way away from "Newbie."
Logged
 

Offline elegantlywasted

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 573
  • Activity:
    0%
    • Deviant Art
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #23 on: 08/10/2007 01:57:08 »
I'm afraid my comment may have made me seem a bit shallow.
I just want to state (for my own happiness) that I am an avid supporter of sustainable agriculture and despise the idea of buying food from half way around the world when it is available locally. At the risk of sounding like a hypocrite, I do not buy fijian water regularily. Its much to expensive, and I agree the imprint left on the environment is too great.
I'm also a realist. As long as these so called "enivronmentaly-friendly" celebrities continue to drink fancy imported waters, I will ocassionally feel the need to be a sheep in the herd and buy something outlandish. And I keep a hold on my sheeplike behaviour. There are far too many people in the world who need to emulate successful people.
Not to mention it costs about 2 dollars for half a litre.
Logged
-Meg
 

lyner

  • Guest
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #24 on: 08/10/2007 18:56:38 »
Quote
I was having to replace my shower unit every year until I installed a water softener, but that water softener leaves high sodium levels in the water, which makes it less than ideal for human consumption.
Probably it is only your kitchen tap that provides you win any significant quantity of water for bodily intake. Just run another pipe to it, by-passing the softener.
You can then use a filter - if your local water is poor tasting.
Quote
Would you think it better that wine, bear, soft drinks, etc. should all be piped into everybody's home?  Water is just another drink (nobody expects to buy bottled bath water - that they take through the pipes).
Water supplies in most of the western world are lumped together - washing and drinking. And nearly everyone (UK at least) has piped water. You are right in your statement about bath water. Perhaps we should only pipe low purity / low cost water to homes and use a different source for drinking and cooking. Local purification might be more efficient.  Carrying a small quantity  for drinking, as passenger  on the bulk of non-drinking clearly makes sense. There is also the point about using your brown waste water rather than pouring it down the drain.  Re-use rather than re-cycling .

The idea of beer on tap at home has its attractions - you would be limited for choice, though and an alcoholic very soon.

btw, there is a clear distinction between drinking bottled water and other bottled stuff in that there is no alternative with fruit juice. You could keep a cow for milk, I suppose.



Logged
 



another_someone

  • Guest
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #25 on: 08/10/2007 19:49:05 »
Quote from: sophiecentaur on 08/10/2007 18:56:38
btw, there is a clear distinction between drinking bottled water and other bottled stuff in that there is no alternative with fruit juice. You could keep a cow for milk, I suppose.

I am very surprised that nobody has suggested that I should press my own juices.
Logged
 

Offline pirunner (OP)

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 74
  • Activity:
    0%
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #26 on: 09/10/2007 00:45:26 »
Well there is quite obviously always going to be an alternative to bottling anything. After all, people did drink before plastic was first produced. Juice COULD be freshly pressed, a cow COULD be kept on hand, your COULD have a distillery in your basement.....but there is also a fine line between helping the environment and convenience or cost effectiveness. I believe that this convenience factor is different for everyone due to the different situations and lifestyles that people have. So... I think that as long as people make a conscious effort to conserve WHEN THEY CAN, we will be off to a good start. The biggest problem currently, however, is the fact that the fast majority of people do not even conserve or recycle when they have that option available. 
Logged
 

paul.fr

  • Guest
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #27 on: 11/11/2007 00:33:23 »
from NPR

Quote
posted by Ira Flatow on Thursday, October 11. 2007
Sometimes the facts speak for themselves. Here are some about bottled water, via the American Museum of Natural History in New York. My favorite, is the last one...


Bottled water may be a healthy and increasingly common alternative
to soft drinks, but the plastic bottle turns out to have a hidden dark side:
energy consumption, waste disposal, and other environmental concerns. As
bottled water grows in popularity, these problems also proliferate.

. Worldwide, bottled water consumption nearly doubled between 1997 and 2005,
with U.S. residents tipping back the largest share-nearly 26 gallons per
person in 2005.

. Bottled water costs as much as $10 per gallon for bottled water compared
to less than a penny per gallon for tap water.

. It takes three liters of water to produce a one-liter bottle of water.

. Worldwide, 2.7 million tons of plastic are used each year to make water
bottles, but in the U.S., less than 20 percent of these bottles are
recycled.

. The total estimated energy needed to make, transport, and dispose of one
bottle of water is equivalent to filling the same bottle one-quarter full of
oil.

. An estimated 40 percent of bottled water sold in the U.S. is just filtered
tap water.

To learn more about water-where it comes from, how it shapes the
planet and the lives of people, plants, and animals everywhere-visit the
special exhibition Water: H2O = Life at the American Museum of Natural
History, November 3, 2007, through May 26, 2008. For more information visit
www.amnh.org.

« Last Edit: 11/11/2007 00:43:13 by paul.fr »
Logged
 

Offline Karen W.

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31886
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 41 times
  • "come fly with me"
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #28 on: 11/11/2007 08:43:53 »
That was an interesting video also. That paper seemed odd. Wouldn't you think it would be hard to use ink on.. you now how sometimes ink does not want to write on plastic or metal products.. It is interesting but she said it is tougher! I wonder if they can recycle it again after its used the second time round.. did you catch weather they can do that a second time! and if so what kind of breakdown in the quality would you see each time the product has been recycled and made anew into a new product?
Logged

"Life is not measured by the number of Breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away."
 



Offline pirunner (OP)

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 74
  • Activity:
    0%
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #29 on: 12/11/2007 00:36:55 »
I love the facts! Recently, the science club in my school posted a series of signs around the school with recycling info on them. I have decided to do the same with bottled water facts. These facts should help!....I didn't catch a video. Could you paste a link? Thanks!
Logged
 

Offline Karen W.

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31886
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 41 times
  • "come fly with me"
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #30 on: 12/11/2007 01:42:51 »
http://www.sciencefriday.com/videos/watch/17
from Pauls Npr post!

Watch the video on green packaging they talk a little about some interesting products!
Logged

"Life is not measured by the number of Breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away."
 

Offline pirunner (OP)

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 74
  • Activity:
    0%
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #31 on: 08/12/2007 03:30:37 »
I have recently purchased a Sigg aluminum water bottle that I refill several times a day while I am at school. It is 1 liter (or litre if you prefer-by the way, what's the deal with that-it's not even pronounced like that in Britain)and very lightweight and durable. Prior to this I have always used reusable plastic bottles, which ALWAY gave my water a funny taste now matter what number plastic I would use. This really proved to me that all of chemicals leeching into my water were NOT being made up. Anyway, I love my new bottle and think it's a great step toward good green living.
Logged
 

Offline Alandriel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 520
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 8 times
    • Some of my photography
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #32 on: 08/12/2007 21:42:19 »
Go you!  [;D]
Logged
 



Offline Karen W.

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31886
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 41 times
  • "come fly with me"
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #33 on: 09/12/2007 04:49:01 »
Thats cool but is there still any truth in the aluminum and Alzheimer's connection?
« Last Edit: 09/12/2007 15:28:59 by Karen W. »
Logged

"Life is not measured by the number of Breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away."
 

another_someone

  • Guest
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #34 on: 09/12/2007 14:11:58 »
Quote from: Karen W. on 09/12/2007 04:49:01
Thats cool but is there still and truth in the aluminum and Alzheimer's connection?

What is without doubt is that consuming large quantities of aluminium can cause mental degeneration akin to Alzheimer’s, but aluminium is a common element in the environment, and what is not clear is what the effects of long term low level exposure might be (i.e. are the observed effects due to poisoning with an acute overdose, but perfectly safe at low levels?).

http://www.guardian.co.uk/medicine/story/0,,1757171,00.html
Quote
Leading scientists called for a fresh inquiry into the effect of Britain's worst large-scale water poisoning yesterday after providing the first evidence to suggest it caused the death of a woman from an extremely rare form of Alzheimer's.

Research published yesterday suggests Carole Cross's neurological illness and subsequent death could have been brought on by the 1988 Camelford incident, in which 20 tonnes of highly toxic aluminium sulphate was added to drinking water at a treatment works by mistake.

 Up to 20,000 people were exposed to concentrations of aluminium up to 3,000 times the legal limit but, despite three inquiries, there has been no systematic monitoring of residents.

Now Chris Exley, the lead author of research published in the Journal of Neurology, Neurosurgery and Psychiatry, and Professor Daniel Perl, an authority on Alzheimer's and aluminium, are calling for the Camelford residents to be monitored after finding that Mrs Cross had more than 20 times the normal level of aluminium in her brain. She also suffered from a rare type of Alzheimer's, sporadic early onset beta amyloid angiopathy, which would not be expected in someone with no genetic predisposition to it.

"This may be a one-off, although it is highly unlikely, " said Dr Exley, reader in bioinorganic chemistry at Keele University. "We need to set up a monitoring programme of the people so we can put their minds at rest."

The scientist, who conducted the research with Professor Margaret Esiri of Radcliffe Infirmary, Oxford, added: "There has to be an element of risk [to other residents] before we discover this. This can't be explained away easily."

Mrs Cross and her husband, Doug, were living in the small north Cornwall town in July 1988 when a driver tipped the aluminium sulphate into the wrong tank at the water treatment works at Lowermoor, on the edge of Bodmin Moor. She tried to avoid drinking the water but realised she had been exposed when she took a bath which turned blue when she added soap to it. "Like a lot of people in Camelford, she refused to talk of it. She found it too traumatic," Mr Cross said yesterday.

In May 2003, at the age of 58, she was referred to a neurologist for headaches, difficulties in finding words and doing sums, and hallucinations. Her condition worsened and she died in April 2004.

An inquest into her death was adjourned in December last year, after the West Somerset coroner, Michael Rose - persuaded by Mr Cross, who refused to accept that she had died of an unknown neurological condition - called in the scientists to examine her brain.

The findings show Mrs Cross - who had no family history of Alzheimer's - had up to 23 micrograms of aluminium per gram of brain in parts of her brain compared with the normal concentration of two micrograms. Aluminium, which is a neurotoxin, has previously been associated with an increased risk of developing Alzheimer's. Dr Exley told the Guardian that Mrs Cross may have reached her toxic threshold for aluminium at 58. "There is nothing in her lifestyle to suggest abnormal exposure other than a period of weeks and months in 1988, when she was exposed to high levels of aluminium."

Mr Cross, an environmental scientist and member of the sub-group of the Commons committee on toxicity set up to look at the effects of the incident, said the findings sent out a "frightening message to people living in Camelford today".

"There is a cover-up going on. I know of up to 20 deaths that can't really be explained. We have been demanding testing for 18 years. It is absolutely essential."
Logged
 

Offline pirunner (OP)

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • 74
  • Activity:
    0%
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #35 on: 09/12/2007 15:23:40 »
Sigg bottles are coated on the inside with a non-leeching protective layer. 100% effective might I add-in theory and in practice. I noticed that difference on my first sip!

check out Sigg.com
Logged
 

Offline Karen W.

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31886
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 41 times
  • "come fly with me"
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #36 on: 09/12/2007 15:30:45 »
Thanks George and pirunner. that is good information to have! very interesting. I like the coating idea!
Logged

"Life is not measured by the number of Breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away."
 



Offline Karen W.

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31886
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 41 times
  • "come fly with me"
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #37 on: 09/12/2007 15:32:08 »
Quote from: another_someone on 08/10/2007 19:49:05
Quote from: sophiecentaur on 08/10/2007 18:56:38
btw, there is a clear distinction between drinking bottled water and other bottled stuff in that there is no alternative with fruit juice. You could keep a cow for milk, I suppose.

I am very surprised that nobody has suggested that I should press my own juices.

LOL LOL You should George, its the healthy thing to do.. I love fresh squeezed orange juice!
Logged

"Life is not measured by the number of Breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away."
 

another_someone

  • Guest
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #38 on: 09/12/2007 15:42:01 »
Quote from: Karen W. on 09/12/2007 15:32:08
I love fresh squeezed orange juice!

So do I, I just don't like making it.
Logged
 

Offline Alandriel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 520
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 8 times
    • Some of my photography
Re: Should Plastic bottled water be banned?
« Reply #39 on: 10/12/2007 13:47:52 »
But you don't. Not really.
Just take some fuit *) and chuck it into the machine. All you need to do is press a button.
Surely you're not too lazy for that?
 [;)]









*)peeled and washed of course, cough
 [;D] maybe *there*'s the problem in the first place
Logged
 



  • Print
Pages: 1 [2] 3   Go Up
« previous next »
Tags:
 
There was an error while thanking
Thanking...
  • SMF 2.0.15 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines
    Privacy Policy
    SMFAds for Free Forums
  • Naked Science Forum ©

Page created in 0.368 seconds with 69 queries.

  • Podcasts
  • Articles
  • Get Naked
  • About
  • Contact us
  • Advertise
  • Privacy Policy
  • Subscribe to newsletter
  • We love feedback

Follow us

cambridge_logo_footer.png

©The Naked Scientists® 2000–2017 | The Naked Scientists® and Naked Science® are registered trademarks created by Dr Chris Smith. Information presented on this website is the opinion of the individual contributors and does not reflect the general views of the administrators, editors, moderators, sponsors, Cambridge University or the public at large.