[Titanscape]

Love involves commitment, like a foundation. Emotion, will, thought and then commitment to build and rebuild. Commitment not to contradict the love and emotions at a time of other pressures on the emotions...

Titanscape

[Titanscape]

Love is generated in the unseen parts, the heart and mind, will, emotions, and involving the consciousness.

It is expressed in the body and there are pressures in the body to the effect of contradicting the ideals of love. The sex drive for example. And sex involves the heart and will and mind and emotions and body, to contradict or express love. The latter is a good thing.

Titanscape

[moonfire]

Karen, I love the forum too!  I also love ya and the rest of the group you mentioned  too!  What an incredible group of people here!  You are all invited to my wedding!  I am laughing as you just handed future hubby a piece of gum...myself?  I met Denny in the UK as I had a stopover before heading to London the next morning to run off to Frankfurt all for the love of business...we met briefly and this guy wouldn't leave me alone...he kept bugging me!  I was as polite as I could be with a pest...lol  Okay not nice at all as I thought he was just trying to pick me up...and then he found out some of my business associates were with me and one of them gave him my cellphone number(personal), swore them to secrecy and to this day I don't know which one did it?  I had it narrowed down to 3 suspects, wined and dined them...and the guilty one was strong???whomever he or she was?  To this day he won't tell me...

It took him 4 months later after much pestering...when I finally agreed to meet him in NY for brunch as he was there on business too or so he says?  My plan was to meet him and end this "so called love he was in with me"...and I discovered I enjoyed his conversation face to face when before I wouldn't give him much time on the phone to discover who he was due to our distance. He has told me he fell in love with me the minute he laid his eyes on me...I never believed in love at first sight...it isn't logical to me?  But after this time he has not changed and I believe him now.

He reminds me of how I tried to lose him, but he was a strong enough man as he could tell I was different than anyone he has met...hehe I tell him I am a simple person... but for some reason he laughs.  I have the feeling he doesn't believe me??

"Lo" Loretta

[tootsie78]

Karen,
I am currently 28, and my hubby is 29 1/2...

*Joy*

[Karen W.]

Joy you and hubby are  Close to what I thought you might be. You guys have been seeing each other for 15 years and married for 10 years. Thats great. Keep that attitude, you will need it. There will be times you think you can't stsnd each other, but you will be fine! You remind me of myself at that age, you have spunk!

 Loretta that is a sweet story about Denny. I bet you never imagined you would be marring him back then when he was the "pest."  I believe in love at first sight or first talk, as many people meet through correspondanse. I have a cousin on my husbands side of the family that met his wife  as a pen pal in Japan. They are now married and have several grown children. They have a wonderful relationship. They overcame many obstacles between them and have remained very much in love for all these years! It is easy to fall in love with someone when you talk via mail or email. I think you tend to be able to speak more honestly about the inner most parts of your heart, which allows another to see the person you really are. You are able to express yourself without that embarrsed feeling or apprehension you might have if you were face to face. I guess I am just a mush pot. I am a pretty sappy person and even for me at home I know that is something I restrain. I think it is a defense mode thing, I guess.
  I know that some people can be totally different persons through the mail, but I think that is the exception rather then the rule!

  Joy you two sound so great! I wish you every happiness. Loretta The same for you. You are a fun couple it seems to me!...Karen

[tootsie78]

Karen,
Yes, Jason & I have had our many ups & downs, but I try not to let it affect me too awful bad.  It's the ones who get up, brush theirselves off, & get going again that will overcome their obstacles, & these are the same ones who will win in the end!!!  Every couple is going to have hard times, but you can't just walk out of a marriage when the going gets tough.  You take your vows "FOR BETTER OR FOR WORSE, IN SICKNESS & IN HEALTH"!!!  You don't just leave just b/c you don't get your way!!!  I know a few girls who have done this, & if you ask me, it wasn't true love, or they would've stayed & stuck it out!!!  You don't walk out on true love!!!  RIGHT???

Actually, we've only been officially "together" for 11 1/2 years almost to the day...married 10 years.  Not bad for marrying young, huh???  Most young couples in this day & age won't make it to 4 years!!!  (according to statistics!)

*Joy*

[moonfire]

Karen, the countdown is off!  Denny made me mad...government is holding him back with property there..i know the government is not going to release property but he is stubborn...he wants to stay until it is over..i told him i wouldn't ask again when he was coming, he could tell me.  this is going to be 6 months soon for him to be over there...Denny and I aren't fun to me...I maybe just upset...not sure? Can't clearly think as I am steaming upset...maybe I don't need to get married?  I even asked him how could he be caught dead with a dumb american like me...he was a bit upset when I said that...then he had nerve enough to ask me to prove it!  How do I prove to be a dumb American?  Okay, I told him I don't know how to open my email anymore...pretty dumb statement I think...he was just quiet and said he loved me...I hung up...I was rude...I was awful...and dumb! I will send him an email that tells him my feet are big and if we marry, they would need more covers!

Joy, interesting...had a huge tiff today with man...maybe I am not the marrying type?  Maybe I am still not ready for marriage???  I know you have to have ups and downs...but you are scaring me with the for better or for worse part, I think seeing that hit me hard!  Is it possible?  Could I live with this as I do keep my promises and don't want to ever break any?

"Lo" Loretta

[another_someone]

Lo,

I don't remember exactly, but I have a recollection that you are somewhere around 40 years of age.

It is generally a lot more difficult getting married when you have got that far into your life without having to make the compromises that marriage requires.

My cousin, who is 43, has just got engaged, and I have no doubt he will have quite a transition to make.  At my age (49 (50 in a couple of weeks), and never in a long term relationship), I would not ever dream of taking such a risk.  Then again, I have a father who changes wives as often as most people change jobs (wife number 5 at present, and a few unofficial one's inbetween), so I suppose I am more cynical than most about marriage.

George

[moonfire]

George,

Yes, I am 43 actually...I know about compromises and have done it a few times before.  LOL  There are a lot of things I have thought about here, adjustment is one, but this back and forth for the last 6 months has been hard on both of us, but there are other things besides this too..but at least if he was here we could work through some other things...
I struggle with some things myself such as my space as when I cleaned out my closet so I can make room for Denny's stuff...I thought about it and realized it is more than just closet space room has to be made there are so many things I have to deal with myself...I do thank God he is patient and understands my stupidity...If I do get married he and I have both agreed there is no out...

"Lo" Loretta

[Karen W.]

Love stands strong in every heart Loretta, you mustn't give up your faith in Love! Within love you will find your strength! You are stronger then you know and I continue to think of you with great admiration for your love and zest for life. Peaceful dreams my friend!

[moonfire]

Karen, I haver irrationally and rationally tried to sort this out...I am now going to walk through the door of destiny of what is going to be and what will be....?  I have to make a call to wish Denny a happy birthday regarldess how unhappy he or myself is at the moment...today is his birthday.  I cannot be a coward and just email or im...and yes i left an offline message but he hasn't been online...i know, i know it was the pollo or poulet way out of hearing his voice...and I know I have to pick up the telephone to call and wish him a Happy Birthday...I don't want to, this goes against my principals...but it also goes against my principals not to call as it is the right thing to do...my faith for love has went down the tubes...maybe I should read one of those trash novels so I can quit thinking...hehe  I have no more strength it is taking ever bit of my willpower to pick up the phone in 21/2hrs to make this call...this is one of the hardest things to do...I just wonder why this had to hapen right before his birthdday, why ccouldn't this have transpired after so I wouldn't have to pick up the stupid phone?  I am looking at the phone as it it is a traitor and should be punished for treason of the heart in a bit...

I really thank you for thinking I am stronger than I really am...but the truth...I am very vulnerable and hate to think when I make this call that I may breakdown and cry...this could be it, our relationship could take flight and never return the same again as we may now take separate paths which logically this job has separated us more than anytime in 2 years. Or this could make me cry and show more vulnerability than ever...also, it is the first time I have ever recalled Denny being this strong not calling, emailing, or im'ing after the first day...maybe he is tired of fighting this too? maybe he realizes this is the end? maybe he has given up like I am on my pathway of giving up too?  I feel like it is a stalemate where we face each other and have to decide if we continue on or if we go forward or not...we have one move to make.

Thanks Karen for your admiration for my love and zest for life...not sure if I can meet those standards in your eyes but you are a great encouragement to me for seeing your strength day by day in the many things you have accomplished...I can't thank you enough my friend.  If it hadn't been for you, neil, Joy, and a few others here...I would probably have turned into a total recluse...but this forum and the other one seems to help keep me on my toes and laughing...
I am afraid to report no dreams tonight...sleep has escaped my clutches...I hope you were able to sleep?

"Lo" Loretta

[Karen W.]

Yes I slept. Am thinking of you at this difficult time! All will be alright Loretta!.....Karen

[tootsie78]

Hang in there Loretta!  I am still thinking about you & this situation!!!  You'll get through it girl!  I can tell this is "the real thing" between the 2 of you!!!

*Joy*

[moonfire]

Karen and Joy!  Thanks!  This is really dragging and  as my computer now.  I had difficulty getting in touch with Denny but manage to say Happy Birthday to him...but the phone cut us off...he sounded happy...but I am not still...need to get to the bottom of this issue.  I have to call him back as I have to go over a couple of things with him.  I am just wanting this to be over soon.  Talk to you guys later...I can't type any thing else.  Good night for now..have a new book to get into.

"Lo" Loretta

[moonfire]

Karen, thought more rationally about this situation...just like in the diary I think he thinks I am about to throw in the towell on this relationship...which can only happen if he chooses too or if he stays another 3 months over there in that country..I know 9 months total is long enough for him to be stubborn or tired of situation as I will not go to Africa to meet him there as he needs to think how this decision is affecting him...he has enough mercy from me to allow another 3 months...which I will email him and tell him that...I was not going to, but have decided to tell him he has 3 months to make up his mind the land or me?  I understand his decision but what I understand is how corrupt the government is over there...they have more staying power and he is stubborn but sometimes it can be a bad thing...which will be for us.  yes, I could go over there, but that would not change his mind.  Maybe I shouldn't tell him in my mind that I have 3 months as his ultimate timeframe?  Nah, thought about this too much and at some point and time I need to regain my life back this depression is not worth it.  

Talk to you guys later...(boy, my spelling is attrocious as I read a post or two of mine ago...)hehe

"Lo" Loretta

[Karen W.]

Well Loretta, Comunication is good! Glad to see it friend, and you are right about The depression being no good!

 You know Loretta, we all make decisions about things, to stay or not to stay; but sometimes we all have to learn the hard way or we don't learn anything! Isn't that just a kick in the pants. No matter what I say to my children, I always find that more then likely they will try it their way, anyway before they learn. There have been more then one occasion that this held true and many times that I could have said, "I told you so!" Live and learn I guess!...have a great day! ....karen

[moonfire]

Yes, Karen...so true.  I did talk to him in between every 3 words and think he said he was coming home for a moment or two???  then he has to return.  I did not say a thing...I think he was scared that I was about to throw in the towel on this relationship, darn phone cut off and we were supposed to meet online at 1pm...well, guess who worked until 4pm...me!  I am a little skittish you might say as this is a bit overwhelming.  If I didn't love this man...it would be so much easier and I would throw not only the towel, but the washcloth too!

Hope you are having a great day?

"Lo" Loretta

[Karen W.]

Oh Loretta, You are a great soul! Much love to you!
  You have a great day too!

[moonfire]

You are the "bestest" Karen...thanks for your support!  Couldn't do it without you guys!  More love to you and let it surround you like a furry blanket in the dead of winter!

"Lo" Loretta

[Karen W.]

Ooooh! Thank you loretta as I love to be warm in the dead of winter. I don't like being cold, or hot! No Prob friend you mean alot to us!