[Titanscape (OP)]

This documentary is by the work of doctors, psychologists and physiologists and mentions the brain in terms of physics and relativity, the human quantum computation, being in two places at once. I'd like it if scientists would watch this and comment on and explain these concepts, post links...

This documentary is a study of the brain and mind in experiences under doctors observation, of people who died on the operating table.

[Bored chemist]

What's to explain?
I only watched the 1st 10 minute clip and it didn't say anything that cannot be explained by simply accepting that the brain, when deprived of oxygen, does not work properly and produces odd effects.

[Titanscape (OP)]

The things they mention are interesting. The patients brains are inactive, dead, not merely starved of oxygen.

They see operating instruments and hear things, they later describe.

A woman blind from birth reports seeing for the first time, seeing things as the others who NDE.

Their is mention of microscopic parts of neurones, quantum computation, generating the mind, as one theory. The psychologist/physiologist describes what you bored chemist think, brains starved of oxygen, about part three I think, but this is insufficient an explanation as the documentary goes on. Lights and joy and peace, coming from endorphins or something...

But there is more to it. Because people see their operations, see instruments, procedures, tool boxes, hear procedurses... that mean they are conscious, and observing from above, while brain dead. Makes the point about mind and brain, and questions what generates consciousness.

[Laura_Kelly]

The fact that they can tell us about it afterwards might raise the question about whether they were actually dead, as well as the fact that after being starved of oxygen for a period of time, the brain can often plant what could be called 'false memories' of event sor things that did not actually happen, or they did not witness. The power of suggestion is a strange thing.

[Bored chemist]

Re "The patients brains are inactive, dead, not merely starved of oxygen."
How can you tell exactly when someone is having this experience?
Doesn't it make more sense to say that the experience must have happened before or after the brain was shut down?
As I said, I don't see anything here that really needs an answer.

[Titanscape (OP)]

How could these false memories, or hallucinations/delusions arise, the distortion of time... that lead to factual difficult to explain observations of things at that time? And not far off from the event dreams instead?

The look or a saw for example, "like an electric tooth brush". Or again he comes in unconscious, but later recognises a nurse and tells her what he saw her doing? He was correct.

Why not LSD like, or Mescaline like hallucinations? Why facts?

Also, if they are for example from a cardiologist experience, a science field professional with others around the world, with up to date technology, how could they get it wrong with regards to brain death and no pulse over measured times?

Dead or not, how can they see things with their eyes taped shut, lying on their back?

And just one Dr documented 150 cases.

[RD]

Wanabe pilots who undergo centrifuge testing can experience "the tunnel with white light",
 because their brain is temporarily deprived of blood/oxygen at high G ...

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[Titanscape (OP)]

RD your point is explained and is rendered insufficient in the course of the documentary. With regards to nerve cells in the retina and oxygen starvation. The view held by the psychologist/physiologist.

[RD]

Just trying to point out that "the tunnel" is not a channel from this life to "the afterlife" as is often suggested,
 it purely is physiological, as are the vivid dreams which can accompany hypoxia... 

Effects of g-forces

As g-force increases, or the longer it is sustained, the victim may suffer progressively:

    * Brownout- a loss of color vision
    * Tunnel vision - loss of peripheral vision, retaining only the center vision
    * Blackout a complete loss of vision but retaining consciousness.
    * G-LOC where consciousness is lost.

Recovery is usually prompt following removal of g-force but a period of several seconds of disorientation may occur.
 Brief but vivid dreams have been reported to follow G-LOC. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G-LOC#Effects_of_g-forces

BTW euphoria is also a symptom of hypoxia, (again physiological explanation for the feelings of "love" described).

So "the tunnel", the visions of dead relatives, and luvved-up feelings are all explicable without invoking the supernatural.
 BTW #2 some patients may have their eyes taped, but their other senses may still be able to function, e.g. their ears are not plugged.

[_Stefan_]

The instruments used in the situations described in the documentary may not have been sensitive enough to detect extremely low level brain activity. To my knowledge, very few vigorous experiments of NDE/OBE patients have been performed.  This, together with the strong possibility that the memories may be of events that occurred before and after the NDE/OBE, explain the phenomenon.

[RD]

Re: original question

Some individuals slowly lose their mind years prior to death ... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7579352.stm

Is this possible with the afterlife "hypothesis": can your psyche "pass over to the other side" in installments ?. 

Belief in the afterlife is not a harmless delusion ... http://www.google.co.uk

[Titanscape (OP)]

People going blind or born blind, see, after they leave their damaged brain, I suppose dementia's cloud is gone.

As for the killing, the person doing it was not apparently religiously motivated.

Indeed, belief that a clean heart, and justice, and love, means you will see God, and injustice, and unclean deeds mean you go to the world below, should deter bad behaviour.

Only centuries into the Christian church did things really begin to go wrong with politicisation... burnings at the stake, killing the Christ all over again.

I did read that the Jewish Christians in the first century fought to retake Jerusalem, but lost and it was burned down and evacuated by the Romans. So all that is left of the temple is the wailing wall.

Stefan, some people documented arrived unconscious, did not know what procedures they were to hear, and not know what equipment they were to see. But described it. Sights and sounds, the saw. The box it was in... she was a singer. She'd never seen it before. Eyes taped shut and unconscious before entering surgery.

[Don_1]

I think BC, RD & Co have given perfectly reasonable answers here.

As to the question "What happens to the brain and mind at death?", the brain dies along with everything else. End of story.

[Titanscape (OP)]

If the message is justice, cleaness and love, along with humility and a sense of honour. And it goes wrong, then, what can't?

[lyner]

BC
This sounds like a great example of where Double Blind Testing  would be applicable!

[Titanscape (OP)]

Please tell me what double blind testing is?

[Pwee]

Double blind testing is when the subject of the experiment and the experimental staff is deprived of some information concerning the experiment, so that they can not distort the outcome of the study not consciously nor unconsciously.

For example you want to test the effectiveness of a new pain killer to ease the pain of people after surgery. You recruit the subjects and tell them that in this study you will compare the effectiveness of a new pain killer with an older one. Then you randomly assign the subjects to either an experimental group (they get the new pain killer) or a controll group (they get the old pain killer, that has proven effects). The hospital staff administers the painkiller as needed by the subjects.

The key is that not the patient, nor the hospital staff knows which group is the individual patients are in, so the staff doesn't know if the painkiller that they are giving is the old or the new experimental one.
The reason for this is that if the experimental staff would have that information, they would maybe be more concerned about the patients getting the experimental medicine, watching over them more, giving them bigger doses or other types of medicine, responding to there requests or painkiller needs in a different way, this way distorting the outcome of the study as it will contain "artifact".
This could have an effect on the patient too, seeing the more concern towards himself by the medical staff could cause him to respond more rapidly or intensively to little pain too, requiring more medicine. etc.

I'm not exactly sure what could be a double blind setting in a near death experience study. The most important thing would be that the medical staff and the patient who are interviewed shouldn't have any contact after the experience/operation etc. So that the patient can't get any information about the procedure this way.

It is important that this is not just to ensure that the results can't be altered deliberately, but to avoid unconscious false evidence too.

The problem with these kinds of experiences is that they are so rare (or reported so rarely) that it's almost impossible to devise an experimental design for them, you can only do retrspective study by finding and interviewing the patients. This way you can't controll factors like communication with the staff.

[Titanscape (OP)]

Under NDE in youtube, there are testimonies of people who do not see a spot of light. They see pitch black, and others horrible places. Not joy but intense fear. Like Dr Whitaker. Assuming our brain physiology and chemistry is much alike, then brain death, or going through or recovery from Oxygen starvation should be similar in all cases, light and joy. But it is not.

[BenV]

But we know that the brain produces all sorts of weird and wonderful (and unreal) things - dreams, hallicinations.  No one argues that these are evidence of an external spiritual reality, but they're visions produced by the brain, just like vsions produced during NDEs are.

The brain will no doubt be in a highly stressed state during death - brain chemistry is almost certainly altered.

[Titanscape (OP)]

The cases with discerning surgery observations without Hell or Heaven are the most debatable issues. Just that I think everyone's eyes and larger brain should be the same in the same conditions. Especially the nervously simple eyes and white spot of light.