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  4. Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
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Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone

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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #20 on: 13/12/2014 11:49:35 »
Quote from: Rev on 12/12/2014 12:55:44

Why should doctors consider two 21 inch long rods be indispensable
for his healing if there was even a small chance to get it healed
by the natural healing process ?


Because the surgery is almost guaranteed to work, but the alternative is a grave gamble.
It would be utterly unprofessional, (not to mention a legal minefield) not to recommend the option with a known good outcome.

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Offline Rev (OP)

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #21 on: 13/12/2014 19:50:04 »
I'm a medical physicist with a particular interest in imaging the spine."

Good to know, thank you.

Thought is indeed important in such a case: you need to think carefully about every movement you make, but after 5 years studying the spine, nerves and skeletal muscles, this shouldn't be too much of a problem for someone who does manual work most days - which chiropractors do.

for  two  hours  twice  a  day,  I  went  within  and  began  creating  a  picture  of  my intended result: a totally healed spine. . . .

Apart  form being vey aware of every movement - can you imagine that the
visialization work had had any influence on the healing process ?
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Offline RD

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #22 on: 13/12/2014 21:58:56 »
Quote from: Rev on 13/12/2014 19:50:04
... can you imagine that the visialization work had had any influence on the healing process ?

Life-span is hard-evidence as to the efficacy of a therapy , it is superior evidence to patients self-assessing how they feel, as that is subject to the placebo-effect ...

Quote from: cancerresearchuk.org
Visualisation (guided imagery) ...
 Some well designed studies have shown that imagery can improve quality of life in some patients, but have not found that it can help people to live longer.
http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/about-cancer/cancers-in-general/treatment/complementary-alternative/therapies/visualisation

[ bold emphasis is mine ]
« Last Edit: 13/12/2014 22:04:03 by RD »
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Offline CliffordK

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #23 on: 13/12/2014 23:47:43 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 13/12/2014 11:49:35
Quote from: Rev on 12/12/2014 12:55:44
Why should doctors consider two 21 inch long rods be indispensable
for his healing if there was even a small chance to get it healed
by the natural healing process ?
Because the surgery is almost guaranteed to work, but the alternative is a grave gamble.
It would be utterly unprofessional, (not to mention a legal minefield) not to recommend the option with a known good outcome.
No surgery is "Guaranteed to Work".

One of the biggest risks is infection. 

Insert the rods and they become infected, and suddenly a high probability outcome becomes a low probability outcome, with a log of pain, suffering, external immobilization, and perhaps even DEATH.

Is the plan to leave the rods in permanently, thus permanently reducing range of motion?  Or are they a temporary stabilization device which is later removed?

As far as immobilization without the pins...  one has to consider the risks vs benefits. 

Risk: slow fusing of bones due to excessive movement
Risk: paralysis.  If the spine or neck is too unstable, a bad movement could lead to paralysis, or even death depending on where the fracture is.

Benefits: Weight bearing and some range of motion can be good for both muscle and bone.
Benefits: No pins for the rest of the life (if the other ones ere to be permanent).
Benefits: No hassling at airports.
Benefits:  Pain?
Benefits: Surgery isn't perfect, and back surgery often has poorer results than expectations.
Benefits: Less scar tissue formation.  This can be serious and impinge on nerves.

Anyway, this is something where one should carefully consider the options.  Also consider whether there is significant risk from passive treatment, and delaying the surgery.

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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #24 on: 14/12/2014 08:33:25 »
Quote from: CliffordK on 13/12/2014 23:47:43
Quote from: Bored chemist on 13/12/2014 11:49:35
Quote from: Rev on 12/12/2014 12:55:44
Why should doctors consider two 21 inch long rods be indispensable
for his healing if there was even a small chance to get it healed
by the natural healing process ?
Because the surgery is almost guaranteed to work, but the alternative is a grave gamble.
It would be utterly unprofessional, (not to mention a legal minefield) not to recommend the option with a known good outcome.
No surgery is "Guaranteed to Work".

One of the biggest risks is infection. 

Insert the rods and they become infected, and suddenly a high probability outcome becomes a low probability outcome, with a log of pain, suffering, external immobilization, and perhaps even DEATH.




"No surgery is "Guaranteed to Work"."
Indeed, so it's just as well that nobody said it was.

However I still think that a doctor who said "Well, we could do surgery, which has risks and benefits and a known statistical outcome.
Or we could just hope that it gets better" would be in serious trouble if it didn't get better.
And I think that will have influenced the Doctor's advice.
Of course, there's a problem with some doctors who have what gets referred to as a "God complex"- but that's another issue.

The fact is that there is nothing "miraculous" about this person's recovery.
If I read the thread correctly, the damage was caused by a road accident while cycling.
One massive point in favour of healing is being fit and healthy before you get injured- regular cycling will ensure that.
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Offline Rev (OP)

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #25 on: 14/12/2014 11:36:23 »
A interesting and entertaining experiment of Derren Brown about the
powers of the plcebo effect >>

Being a mentalist he uses his insights into psychology and the human mind to demonstrate to what an extent we can be fooled by our own perceptions and expectations.  That is where science comes in to discern fact from fiction.
Not sure yet to which extent Mr Dispenza makes use of science in his work.

In his own healing it is impossible to find out if his visualization work had any influence in his healing process.
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Offline alancalverd

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #26 on: 14/12/2014 12:23:56 »
Not sure what he means by visualisation, but after most of a lifetime of back pain I can sometimes relax individual muscles to relieve pain in another area.

Some of my client chiropractors talk about "sacro-occipital technique" which seems to begin with the simple observation that in normal posture the occiput is directly above the sacrum, so that gives a primary "visualisation" of what you are trying to achieve by self-healing.   With more detailed knowledge of the optimal spine alignment, I guess it is possible for a fit cyclist to use his abdominal and paraspinal muscles to relieve stress on individual or groups of vertebrae and thus promote e.g. blood flow to the compressed areas.

There's no doubt that state of mind is associated with speed of healing, though whether the "will to win" makes collagen work better, or is merely a side-effect of the adrenalin and testoterone that are actually doing the work, is debatable.   
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Offline Rev (OP)

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #27 on: 14/12/2014 14:01:27 »
Alcanverd, thank you for your comment.
I am going through his book now and will give more info
about his method oh infuencing health by thought.

I have pasted description of him in a post before, about
his visualizations regarding his spine accident
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Offline Rev (OP)

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #28 on: 14/12/2014 14:53:50 »
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
This thread has been transferred to "This Cant be True"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

I would not have added it to this place as I am not accusing
or stating that Mr Dispenza is a liar. 

I have my doubts about about Mr Dispenzas statements, but i am
a medical laymen.

That is why I have asked for professional expertise and so far, it turned out that it is entirely possible that a self-healing took place.

Just wanted to clear that because I think it is OK to ask critical questions but not to prejudge anyone before having evidence,

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Offline Oceanbliss

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Re: Doctor heals 6 broken vertebrae in 9 weeks by thought alone
« Reply #29 on: 16/12/2014 08:07:42 »
pretty damn interesting.. but the body adapts to its surroundings.. When the mind creates an illusion of a surrounding the body tends to lead into that direction... Ive always wondered how people in prisons are able to get so ripped from such a poor diet... Its the disillusion of there self worth that's causing a plecebo effect on their bodies. at least that's my theory.
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