[demografx]

T[estosterone] has so many actions (including sperm production) that you can feel a lot of things from it.

Yes, definitely. The first thing I noticed - before increased virility - was a positive overall mood shift!
 

[demografx]

On the forum to-get-tested list there was also

Neurotransmitter Test
=====================
Serotonin
Acetylcholine
Dopamine
GABA
Histamine

Has anyone had any success with this route?
For example, what is the GABA test?
Does a pois sufferer need to strengthen GABA nervous control, if so how?

FWIW, my endo, a top clinician, professor, practitioner, believes strongly that neurotransmitter testing is "a great idea, but basically unreliable today."

[Dave23]

On the forum to-get-tested list there was also

Neurotransmitter Test
=====================
Serotonin
Acetylcholine
Dopamine
GABA
Histamine

Has anyone had any success with this route?
For example, what is the GABA test?
Does a pois sufferer need to strengthen GABA nervous control, if so how?

Ive had these tested

On the forum to-get-tested list there was also

Neurotransmitter Test
=====================
Serotonin
Acetylcholine
Dopamine
GABA
Histamine

Has anyone had any success with this route?
For example, what is the GABA test?
Does a pois sufferer need to strengthen GABA nervous control, if so how?

FWIW, my endo, a top clinician, professor, practitioner, believes strongly that neurotransmitter testing is "a great idea, but basically unreliable today."

Use amino acid urine test to see where neurotransmitters are at due to the unrealiabe/inconsistent neuro test.  In my case the neurotransmitter urine test was accurate as I had extremely low serotonin, dopamine, gaba and high histamine which can effect general and sexual health. From my amino acid urine test l also had very low glutamine, Tryptophan and L-Tyrosine.

Glutamine is Precursor too Gaba
Tryptophan is Precursor too Serotonin
L-Tyrosine is Precursor too Dopamine

Well Gaba worked well for my anxiety  and especially during POIS. Also after a period of taking glutamine with b6 to help the body convert Glutamine too Gaba it boosted sexual stamina tremendiously along with the 5htp/Tryptophan.

Low Gaba can be a sign for low pregnenolone and progesterone hormone levels since the body converts it.

Low Dopamine can mean low testosterone or high prolactin.

High histamine can mean methylation liver detoxification issues. Also high histamine is linked to premature ejaculation. They have drugs to dampen histamine for the PE sufferers.

 

[Dave23]

lauracostis
i might be wrong but didnt limejuice originally quash a bout of pois by taking a one-off a high dose of progesterone?

if so, wouldnt there be a release of LH and FSH after the drugs wore off to reload him with sperm?
if so, why didnt he get a very late pois bout then?

perhaps, LS and FSH + inflammation = pois?

Perhaps. Only way to find out is to have LH+FSH blood checked.
Ive had high levels of both 10 and 12 through natural testosterone restart with HCG(LH), HMG(FSH) & clomid which all stimulate LH+FSH too raise testosterone and sperm production.

Ive also had extremely low LH+FSH levels at 0 or 1 by being on testosterone replacement therapy by intramuscular injections.The TRT ofc shuts down LH+FSH through negative feedback loop as Laura explained.

Ive experienced non and POIS symptoms on both but for now on TRT I have no POIS symptoms.

Ive found through testing and symptoms FSH and LH had no relations to POIS symptoms but maintaining a high total and free or bio testosterone levels made some difference between having or not having POIS symptoms along with keeping estradiol and other hormones in check.

[horizon]

In my case the neurotransmitter urine test was accurate as I had extremely low serotonin, dopamine, gaba and high histamine which can effect general and sexual health. From my amino acid urine test l also had very low glutamine, Tryptophan and L-Tyrosine.

Glutamine is Precursor too Gaba
Tryptophan is Precursor too Serotonin
L-Tyrosine is Precursor too Dopamine

Well Gaba worked well for my anxiety  and especially during POIS. Also after a period of taking glutamine with b6 to help the body convert Glutamine too Gaba it boosted sexual stamina tremendiously along with the 5htp/Tryptophan.
 

Thanks!!
"Well Gaba worked well for my anxiety"
is there a drug called Gaba then for low GABA?
or is it a herb type natural drug?

Glutamine with b6 and 5htp/Tryptophan
These are herbal/natural supplements arent they?
Although, im very grateful for the info, Im kinder "through" with the natural option, if you catch my drift..(unless im wrong)...

Ive experienced non and POIS symptoms on both but for now on TRT I have no POIS symptoms.

Overall then, it sounds like TRT was best for you
and is the most effective option?

along with keeping estradiol and other hormones in check.

How did you do this?
Which ones?

[horizon]

Is there excessive Norepinephrine in POIS?

[wooder]

exercise increases testerone, doesn't it ?

[wooder]

and alcohol lowers it ?

[daveman]

Ive found through testing and symptoms FSH and LH had no relations to POIS symptoms but maintaining a high total and free or bio testosterone levels made some difference between having or not having POIS symptoms along with keeping estradiol and other hormones in check.

Couldn't this indicate that it's rather the sperm which creates the POIS symptoms than the FH/FSH?

With testoserone high, sperm production is low. And if FH/FSH don't seem to effect symptoms.....

[Dave23]

In my case the neurotransmitter urine test was accurate as I had extremely low serotonin, dopamine, gaba and high histamine which can effect general and sexual health. From my amino acid urine test l also had very low glutamine, Tryptophan and L-Tyrosine.

Glutamine is Precursor too Gaba
Tryptophan is Precursor too Serotonin
L-Tyrosine is Precursor too Dopamine

Well Gaba worked well for my anxiety  and especially during POIS. Also after a period of taking glutamine with b6 to help the body convert Glutamine too Gaba it boosted sexual stamina tremendiously along with the 5htp/Tryptophan.
 

Thanks!!
"Well Gaba worked well for my anxiety"
is there a drug called Gaba then for low GABA?
or is it a herb type natural drug?

Glutamine with b6 and 5htp/Tryptophan
These are herbal/natural supplements arent they?
Although, im very grateful for the info, Im kinder "through" with the natural option, if you catch my drift..(unless im wrong)...

Ive experienced non and POIS symptoms on both but for now on TRT I have no POIS symptoms.

Overall then, it sounds like TRT was best for you
and is the most effective option?

along with keeping estradiol and other hormones in check.

How did you do this?
Which ones?

In my case the neurotransmitter urine test was accurate as I had extremely low serotonin, dopamine, gaba and high histamine which can effect general and sexual health. From my amino acid urine test l also had very low glutamine, Tryptophan and L-Tyrosine.

Glutamine is Precursor too Gaba
Tryptophan is Precursor too Serotonin
L-Tyrosine is Precursor too Dopamine

Well Gaba worked well for my anxiety  and especially during POIS. Also after a period of taking glutamine with b6 to help the body convert Glutamine too Gaba it boosted sexual stamina tremendiously along with the 5htp/Tryptophan.
 

Thanks!!
"Well Gaba worked well for my anxiety"
is there a drug called Gaba then for low GABA?
or is it a herb type natural drug?

Glutamine with b6 and 5htp/Tryptophan
These are herbal/natural supplements arent they?
Although, im very grateful for the info, Im kinder "through" with the natural option, if you catch my drift..(unless im wrong)...

Ive experienced non and POIS symptoms on both but for now on TRT I have no POIS symptoms.

Overall then, it sounds like TRT was best for you
and is the most effective option?

along with keeping estradiol and other hormones in check.

How did you do this?
Which ones?

Gaba can be looked as neurotransmitter, amino acid, chemical messenger, supplement,drug etc You can take Gaba as a supplement but its difficult
to pass the brain blood barrier. Glutamine would be better
too increase Gaba levels to help anxiety as its much better absorbed
and actually helps the digestive tract in repairing the Gi tract/stomach linen,
helps friendly bacteria, detoxfies ammonia, removes waste/toxins and many more.

Although I would strongly recommened amino acid urine test too see where your at for neuro/amino acid levels before suggesting to take this n that.

Yep all natural, b6 a B vitamin, glutamine and tryptophan both amino acids.

Your very welcome and I agree natural through diet changes, supps is best & hormones/meds last resort.

hmm Ive posted some of my experiences with TRT/hormones and how it relates to POIS since page 4 on this
thread but I would agree TRT for males with low testosterone is most effective
for dealing with POIS symptoms.Although there was a period of several months
without TRT and I did not experience any POIS symptoms during this.

Clomid+hcg+hmg and few other things here and there helped
to raise my low test naturally without any TRT
 but overindulgence in sex, having fun,partying,
possibly overtraining, lack of discipline in diet brought back low testosterone and POIS.

Keeping estradiol in check during TRT is the difference whether one
experiences any benefits on TRT or not. Due to the increase in testosterone levels
the body converts some of the testosterone too estrogen, mainly estradiol.Process is called aromatasation.

How one aromatises is all individualistic.A few dont even need an aromatase inhibitor too control estradiol like the admin Demo.

Blood test of estradiol and total+free/bio testosterone while on TRT
after 4 weeks or so once hormones have been giving enough time to stabilise
is the only way to truly know where ones levels are at. Symptoms help as well.

High estradiol is related too low libido, unable to get an erection, no/less morning
erection, poor erection quality, weight gain, feeling bloaty, increase in sweats,
brain fog, lack of drive and focus. High estradiol can cause low testosterone, go hand in hand.

This is a good start for blood hormones tests :

Total Testosterone
Free Testosterone/Bioavailable testosterone
SHBG
Estradiol
Pregnenolone
Progesterone
Prolactin

Another thing me and Demo had in common is high prolactin levels.
When we both got our prolactin and testosterone issues sorted out
a few yrs ago, POIS symptoms began too improve.

PL goes hand in hand with low test levels and ive seen a few other
POIS/Sexual exhaustion members with very high prolactin for long
periods after an orgasm. With healthy non POIS individuals you may
heard of them having an orgasm and then being able to have another
straight after with no long refractory period. As well as having an
orgasm(s) every day with with no issues.

However its common to read after an orgasm one doesnt feel the urge
to have another for days or weeks with Pois sufferers.


Prolactin causes this and thenlowers testosterone and dopamine
which affects well being, focus, drive,  good mood,
lowered libido, lower testosterone, needle dick, poor erections,
much slower sperm production, heavy brain fog > feeling withdrawn
from the world, inbility too socialise and much more.

[Animus]

But if I'm not mistaken, the sperm of the seminal vesicles comes form the testicles by way of the vas diferens. It seems that he must be talking about the content supplied in the moment of ejaculation.


[/quote]

sperm does not come out of the seminal vesicles, as was recently said by larurac.. sperm is the dna component of semen which fertilizes the ovum. sperm are those squiggly little tadpole-like cells that swim and impregnate the egg.  the seminal vesicles are a pair of glands that secrete seminal fluid which carries the sperm. look it up on wikipedia!

[Animus]

Would anyone else on this forum be interested in a POIS conference?
I know I would be willing to travel from my city of San Francisco to another city in Europe or USA- wherever it makes the most sense. I think a conference could substantially move our cause forward.
We could have doctors and POIS members contribute their research and experiences. It would 1. Show the size and seriousness of the POIS-suffering community. 2.Attract medical and professional interest. 3. Come to a more accurate definition of POIS- define the illness better. 4. Point out what directions we can go forward in helping people solve the illness. 5. Gain Legitimacy in the medical community.

I would be interested in working with the leaders of this forum to organize this.

[Dave23]

exercise increases testerone, doesn't it ?

Yes it can. This is one of the many scientific studies out there:

http://jap.physiology.org/cgi/content/abstract/65/6/2406 [nofollow]

Not the best study but was in my bookmark.Squats and dealifts in low rep range would be best.

Soy can lower testosterone :

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17416779?ordinalpos=7&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DefaultReportPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum [nofollow]

Theres research out there that microwaving food in plastic containers will produce Xeno-estrogens which then lowers testosterone. Same as drinking water from plastic containers.Adding hormones in our meat as well all effects us in long run.

No wonder the average males total testosterone the last 30-40 years have dropped from 750 too 550.

Lowering bodyfat will also help lower estradiol/estrogen if high which will then increase testosterone naturally.

[John21 (OP)]

However its common to read after an orgasm one doesnt feel the urge
to have another for days or weeks with Pois sufferers.

This is not my experience nor do I recall it being the case for others on this forum.

[demografx]

NORD (National Organization for Rare Disorders) Update

Just had a lengthy, very positive phone conversation with Stefanie at NORD, who is definitely a champion for our cause!

I lamented the large pharmaceuticals' lack of interest in "small potatoes" (treating disorders that do not appear to be a major potential revenue stream, i.e., disorders which do not have large numbers of sufferers) like POIS.

Her reply was surprising. She brought to my attention the Orphan Drug Act, of 1983, with significant amendments since then, that encourages pharmaceutical firms with financial incentives to find treatments for rare disorders. (Like POIS!) Those firms who undertake medical research for rare disorders are given major tax incentives and exclusivity on patents for 7 years.

Even large organizations such as Pfizer and Bayer have already started Rare Disorders Units! And many smaller ones such as Genzyme (a _larger_ "small" pharma) are well underway with this type of research.

Stephanie is also sending us a list of a few medical clinics that specialize in Sexual Medicine.

Very encouraging news! Thanks much, Stefanie.

[wooder]

am puzzled, at what the poster a few posts above said

excessive training (exercise wise), partying(alcohol I presume he means) and overindulgence in sex, can all lower testerone and asisst with POIS symptons

but how does having fun, lower testerone levels

I am lost [] []

[horizon]

(to people who have tried T)
Do you think Testosterone patches can be used as emergency treatment, as in, put on ONLY after orgasm to stop POIS? (and then taken off/stop use when recovered).

Or do they take too long 'build up' testosterone and need to be left on at all times?

The reason is out-of-pois im not sure I need the patches
(hopefully getting the out-of-pois results tommorrow)

[horizon]

am puzzled, at what the poster a few posts above said

excessive training (exercise wise), partying(alcohol I presume he means) and overindulgence in sex, can all lower testerone and asisst with POIS symptons

but how does having fun, lower testerone levels

I am lost [] []

probably best to just experiment yourself to what helps and what dont.
personally, exercising during pois dont help me much (i think thats due to inflammation)
having fun, probably means lots of late nights/ no sleep etc

[wooder]

what does my head in about all this is nothing mcuh seems to be good for you and everything that is, seems to cost a fortune

like for example, the chinnese would say something similiar about over exercise but another school of thought would promote meat protein as helpful boost to testerone but then when you look at all the contamiants in food, fluoride in the toothpaste etc, it is no wonder, we get effected

its difficult to know what to do for the best with this issue

I o recently after 32 days abstinence, and feel ok but am beginning to think, this indirectly has been getting in the way of my whole life for years

I have an autoimmune disease called sarocidosis and am sure there is a link at some level

[wooder]

probably best to just experiment yourself to what helps and what dont.
personally

yeah, hear you there, def trial and error

cant believe i paid 20 squid for a porn filter that does not even work properly: still I have had no desire to go there for 31 days but broke the other day when lonley, bored and feeling a little, sexual I guess


having fun, probably means lots of late nights/ no sleep etc

[/quote]

I thought that is what he probably meant but was not sure