[GoingCrazy]

Hey Everyone
I have not visited the forum in quite some time. I was checking out some articles on google news and I came across the reports on the new study.  It is good to hear that the condition started to get some publicity.  I don't know if anyone remembers me, but on my last post I offered that for me the culprit is food allergies.  I would have never expected a connection between food allergies and my poor cognitive condition after orgasm.  The first time I noticed any problems with POIS was after orgasm, and I believed I had in some way irreparably damaged my body.  Your body wants to return to a homeostasis and I could not understand why even after abstaining, that I would still be nervous, depressed, have an inflamed prostate.  I started to think about periods in my life that I had felt better even without abstaining.  I realized that I felt the best during the periods when my dairy consumption was zero.  I started to research allergies and I came across topics about histamine and undermethylation.  I realized that many of the same symptoms of high histamine corespond with my experience with Pois.  An allergic reaction is a histamine release against what your body classifies as a threat.  I actually did some testing through a naturpath and found that I do have a reaction to casein (dairy), gluten (wheat), and eggs.  I eliminated these items from my diet, started taking co factors to increase my bodie's S-Adenosyl methionine, and also some herbs to reduce cortisol.  It has been almost a year now and I feel great.  I believe what was happening to me, based on my research and lab test results, was that food and environmental allergies were causing increased histamine levels.  Increased histamine levels were decreasing Serotonin, Acetylcholine, and Dopamine.  Dopamine is a Prolactin inhibitting factor, they balance eachother,  and orgasm was just increasing Prolactin and inhibiting an already depressed Dopamine level.  An increased Prolactin level also inhibits the release of Testosterone from the pituitary gland.  I was conditioned to believe that orgasm had caused this condition because it was after orgasm that I felt the worst.  They are correlated, but without causality.  I am not surprised about the results of the new study.  Some individuals on the forum disagree with the Semen allergy.  Last time I posted, I urged everyone to consider food and environmental allergies.  A semen allergy is possible, but I suggest thinking about other potential allergens once again.  It is life changing.  Best of Luck!

Why aren't there like 900,000,000 more people with POIS then I wonder?

There's no doubt that in POIS one is more sensitive to other allergies and some substances can aggravate POIS, but POIS is the central factor, or as I said, there'd be many. many more cases of POIS.

Not being argumentative in any way, but as stated in the past and just by ophicus, I believe people do jump from antidepressants to other drugs, not knowing that they have POIS.  I went to the doctor telling him what I felt and he prescribed me an antidepressant, and I had no clue at the time that what I felt was from having an orgasm.  I took one pill and threw it away.  I didn't like the idea that in able for me to function correctly I have to take a pill.  I kind of looked at it like a weakness.  After I threw the pills away it was then that i discovered why i felt terrible.  Probably many people take that pill and don't quit taking it, hence they'll never realize their actual condition.  If POIS isn't depression, than what is depression?  I mean, I couldn't imagine feeling any worse than I do in POIS.

As stated somewhere after searching on google, that an orgasm is like a shot of heroin, after it you want more and more of it to retain a certain temporary chemical balance, similar to just after O'ing, you become hornier, and have to resist.  But we don't know if this feeling of the hangover is POIS or a should be normal reaction to orgasm.

I've noticed that after I "O "and am in temporary POIS, that the only thing that makes me feel good is sexual stimulation,without "O'ing", but if I stop that, than I end up back at square one.

As many do note, POIS I think is more like a chronic condition that is greatly, at its highest intensity, aggravated by orgasm.  If I don't sleep right or have a terrible day somehow 3 weeks after my previous orgasm, I can get headaches and feel "POIS" like.

And btw, I told a friend about my condition and he just said that he thinks I should just have a day where I have nothing on my to-do list but orgasm, and O like 50 times.  So I did just that yesterday, but not 50 times, 8 times, and I can say that today I do feel POIS.  But not too badly.  So as far as sexual abstinence goes in the long term, for me at least, it is working.  The way I feel now with 8 orgasms would probably be equivalent to one orgasm if I did it 2-3 years ago.

[demografx]

GC, I agree that many of us "just don't know" what we have, e.g., depression or POIS?

We don't quickly connect sex to symptoms. Especially if symptoms are delayed one or two days.

Many of you have heard me say I've had POIS "30+ years". That's because I FIRST CONNECTED the two back then. But it could be 15 more! All I remember more than 30 years are...periodic severe depressions!

[daveman]

Daveman maybe they are among millions of Americans who jump between the benzodiazepines and SSRI's that their GP has prescribed to them.  People who do not know why they feel the way they do, and have not considered researching on their own. 

First of all, I can agree that some doctors tend to overperscribe medicines, of many kinds, not only antidepressants, and I understand your efforts to help people to seek natural means to resolve medical problems.

However, thousands, or 100's of thousands of allergies to food and all kinds of pollutants and additives, there must be. I wouldn't doubt that these allergies could lead to cases of mental disorder as you imply.

But POIS is not simply cured by diet, and lifestyle changes. Perhaps if you had to change only one of those two, only a lifestyle change of abstenance would work, providing you could control NEs of course.

We can show, that as long as we abstain for sufficient time(let's say 2 mo.), we get better despite what we eat. We haven't been able to show that we get better by diet alone (even after many months) while still engaging in sexual activity.

There have been one or two who claim such.... my suspicion is that they did not have POIS but a food or element sensitivity.

[daveman]

It really would be interesting to see what happens to your sperm!!

No, thanks! []

Aww jeeez, [flip of the wrist] come on!

LOL

[daveman]

And btw, I told a friend about my condition and he just said that he thinks I should just have a day where I have nothing on my to-do list but orgasm, and O like 50 times.  So I did just that yesterday, but not 50 times, 8 times, and I can say that today I do feel POIS.  But not too badly.  So as far as sexual abstinence goes in the long term, for me at least, it is working.  The way I feel now with 8 orgasms would probably be equivalent to one orgasm if I did it 2-3 years ago.

Man, I envy you. If I "O"d 8 times in one day, I'd be in the hospital! I "O"d twice in 2 days and wanted to die, and experienced my first depressive episode ever by the way.

[Habibou]

This is my Catecholamines blood and urina results :
Blood :               My results         Normal

-adrenaline           <0.50 nmol/l         < 1.00
-noradrenaline      8.53 nmol/l     < 4.00
                    1443 ng/l       < 675
-dopamine             <0.50 nmol/l         <1.00

Unrina :

-adrenaline      0.02 umol/l          < 0.10
-noradrenaline   0.42 umol/l          < 0.50
-dopamine        1.34 umol/l          < 3.00

Blood noradrenaline is 2.14 times the highest average... let's hear what my doctor tells!

[POISon]

I notice a lot of people mention antidepressants.I've been on at least 7 not because I'm some psychotic mess,but because not a one really worked.Only one that helped somewhat was Effexor  initially,but it became like the rest and only good for bringing awful side effect such as throwing up, worse lethargy,and splitting headaches.The only one wished I would have continued trying was Wellbutrin,but I could only stand 3 days of it because of the horrible agitation unlike the normal 6 weeks or more of the others. I think at least in my case and I suspect many others here Pois has a huge effect on dopamine.The only serotonin booster that works for me was mood wise is 5htp,but it made me even more lethargic and spaced out.It only relieves the irritability and sour mood aspect that Pois brings.

I never told my doctor about Pois because I'm sure he would think I was a complete loon.Except for a 3 week trial of Ritalin which worked about as good as a sugar pill,stimulants such as caffeine and herbs such as Siberian ginseng have worked wonders for me.If I haven't been on caffeine awhile it perks my mood,energy and attention way up.The only problem is the tolerance issue comes into effect pretty rapidly.

I've been on a lot of nutritional supplements and some have worked great even if only for a certain period of time.An adrenal extract(Solaray Adrenal Caps) which included Siberian Ginseng and Licorice root was absolutely awesome for me for almost 2 years,and Pois seemed like a thing of the past in that time.In fact people kept telling me my eyes sparkled and I seemed like a different person.Colors were more vibrant, and I was far more outgoing, transitioning from shy to very popular and made friends much easier, especially with the opposite sex.It also made me horny as hell,but It was rarely a problem because I could orgasm up to 8 times a day and not feel any different.It seemed like a miracle cure  besides having the occasional sometimes strong insomnia effect,but unfortunately I began to have strong seizure like episodes with my head jerking violently every time I started to take a nap or was in a relaxed state on the sofa.Scared the hell out of me.It makes me wonder though if like most nutritional supplements that aren't regulated I was ingesting some heavy metals like lead or mercury that either built up in my system from contamination or the last few batches I had were tainted.That's the problem trying to go the supplement route,but if doctors don't know how or are unwilling to treat you,what do you do? I sure as heck am not going to just suffer and do nothing about it.

Edit:What also supports my theory of dopamine is looking at the way I write.Usually it takes me forever to put up a paragraph on the internet and I have to keep changing my sentences, fix a huge amount of spelling errors, and continuously loosing my train of thought.I just took the 5 hour extra that come in the black bottles after being of of it for almost a week and wow I notice the difference in my mental capacity.The tyrosine and caffeine work wonders for my brain on Pois before the tolerance kicks in and the effect eventually becomes next to nill [] Sulbutiamine also seems to help  with dopamine,though i don't quite yet understand how it works since accrding to Wiki it has a somewhat confusing effect on dopamine in the prefrontal cortex

[GoingCrazy]

GC, I agree that many of us "just don't know" what we have, e.g., depression or POIS?

I mean, I know I have POIS but could you consider this depression? or is depression just a feeling sad kind of feeling.  If I had to pick one of the two I'd probably pick depression.

This is my Catecholamines blood and urina results :
Blood :               My results         Normal

-adrenaline           <0.50 nmol/l         < 1.00
-noradrenaline      8.53 nmol/l     < 4.00
                    1443 ng/l       < 675
-dopamine             <0.50 nmol/l         <1.00

Unrina :

-adrenaline      0.02 umol/l          < 0.10
-noradrenaline   0.42 umol/l          < 0.50
-dopamine        1.34 umol/l          < 3.00

Blood noradrenaline is 2.14 times the highest average... let's hear what my doctor tells!

Was this in POIS or out of POIS?  If so, how far out of POIS? 

http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/ssriwork.htm

scroll down to #4 and look at noradrenaline. 

Too much and you may feel nervous and jittery, too little and you may feel depressed. 

This is sort of like my POIS, in days 0-1 I feel very nervous and hyper, days 2-10 (wild guess) I feel pretty good. Days 11-next orgasm, I feel pretty good, but down at the end of the day, or if i don't get enough sleep.  It's almost like now my POIS is a  semi manic-depressive cycle.  I get pretty hyper and mean, and than a bit depressed if I abstain for too long.  Not too depressed at all just a little bit.

I just took the 5 hour extra that come in the black bottles after being of of it for almost a week and wow I notice the difference in my mental capacity.The tyrosine and caffeine work wonders for my brain on Pois before the tolerance kicks in and the effect eventually becomes next to nill [] Sulbutiamine also seems to help  with dopamine,though i don't quite yet understand how it works since accrding to Wiki it has a somewhat confusing effect on dopamine in the prefrontal cortex

Yeah I've noticed that too.  Actually took an AMP energy drink a week ago and felt great.  And the funny thing is I actually fell asleep that night instead of my usual 2 hour trying to go to sleep frenzy.  I felt great that day.  I was going to post something on the drink but decided not too.  Next is I'm going to try that in POIS.

[CertainlyPOIS]

demografx have you ever tried an inflammation drug with your testosterone to see if recovery gets closer to 100%.

No, but the combination of T and norethisterone-progesterone (the male contraceptive idea we've been discussing for a long time) sounds like a very interesting possibility.

What kind of inflammation drug were you thinking? NSAIDS?

from nsaids to the Big boys like predisone or alternative like wobenzym just to see if it will help you.
it will be interesting if any of them helps you, it will add to the proof that this is an inflammatory diseases.

[demografx]

It really would be interesting to see what happens to your sperm!!

No, thanks! []

Aww jeeez, [flip of the wrist] come on!

LOL

Oh, all right, daveman, you're so dang persuasive. But only if it's in the name of Science!

[demografx]

And btw, I told a friend about my condition and he just said that he thinks I should just have a day where I have nothing on my to-do list but orgasm, and O like 50 times.  So I did just that yesterday, but not 50 times, 8 times, and I can say that today I do feel POIS.  But not too badly.  So as far as sexual abstinence goes in the long term, for me at least, it is working.  The way I feel now with 8 orgasms would probably be equivalent to one orgasm if I did it 2-3 years ago.

Man, I envy you. If I "O"d 8 times in one day, I'd be in the hospital! I "O"d twice in 2 days and wanted to die, and experienced my first depressive episode ever by the way.

I gotcha beat, daveman, I'd be in the morgue! []

[demografx]

demografx have you ever tried an inflammation drug with your testosterone to see if recovery gets closer to 100%.

No, but the combination of T and norethisterone-progesterone (the male contraceptive idea we've been discussing for a long time) sounds like a very interesting possibility.

What kind of inflammation drug were you thinking? NSAIDS?

from nsaids to the Big boys like predisone or alternative like wobenzym just to see if it will help you.
it will be interesting if any of them helps you, it will add to the proof that this is an inflammatory diseases.

"Big boys"! []

Seriously, CC, I've taken anti-inflammatories, but the side effects scare me. My creatinine readings are not good. I THINK that's related, but I'll confirm with my GP next week. BTW, my new GP was Medical Director for the Olympics! Thanks, CC, you brought up a very interesting new possibility for me.

[demografx]

This is my Catecholamines blood and urina results :
Blood :               My results         Normal

-adrenaline           <0.50 nmol/l         < 1.00
-noradrenaline      8.53 nmol/l     < 4.00
                    1443 ng/l       < 675
-dopamine             <0.50 nmol/l         <1.00

Unrina :

-adrenaline      0.02 umol/l          < 0.10
-noradrenaline   0.42 umol/l          < 0.50
-dopamine        1.34 umol/l          < 3.00

Blood noradrenaline is 2.14 times the highest average... let's hear what my doctor tells!

Habibou, thanks for sharing these results!

[demografx]

...providing you could control NEs of course.

The only way I could ever control those miserable, life-destroying NE's was by getting older!!

But some people here (CC?) found success with posture, sleeping at a couch on an angle, etc.

[nick2k22]

It's interesting that you mention Norepinephrine(also called noradrenaline).
This may be a wild goose chase but you know what blocks Norepinephrine?
Steroids like testosterone.

Scroll down to uptake modulators.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norepinephrine

[nick2k22]

In the same vein, another norepinephrine inhibitor is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phenoxybenzamine

Has anybody tried that?
It is doubly interesting in that it blocks sperm production while retaining the ability to O.

[GoingCrazy]

"Norepinephrine is a neurotransmitter that signals the presence of stress. It also keeps a person awake, alert. It helps improve focus. It triggers the male orgasm/ejactulation. It clears up the lungs so one can breath more easily. It increases heart-rate and the pumping of blood by the heart to improve the response for stress. It causes anxiety, fear or anger as a response to a stress. It increases blood pressure so one can change positions and not faint. It opens one's pupils so more light can come in. These, to name a few, are all appropriate functions when not in excess"

http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/mens-health-forum/excessive-norepinephrine-134246999.html#ixzz1CMKXbImU

[Habibou]

Thank you for all those answers !
Those results were D-3 after the O. It seems strange that my Noradrenaline is that high (even if i feel stressed while i don't want and don't have reason!) because i really feel so exhausted after an O, and even while i abstain...
I never tried Naids specially after an O.
My testosterone D-0 was high about 740   (normal = 320 to 840) so it is weird with the noradrenaline results...
It would be worth to try pills to lower noradrenaline for my case, perhaps some time before the O.
And it is normal i share my results demo i have the chance to have almost free laboratory.

[nick2k22]

Hmm interesting GoingCrazy and Habibou.

Another thing on that norepinephrine axis : norepinephrine increases could be a sign of cortisol decreasing.  

Hey Habibou have you had any cortisol tests?

i.e. for Addisons disease.

(Post O of course )


This stuff is pretty complicated.  Somebody call House!

[Habibou]

Yes ! I had a normal cortisol level, POIS D-0 to answer you