[demografx]

This is Our Year, everyone!
Click HERE to donate, and help YOUrself to a POIS-free future!!

[kurtosis]

Doctors are saying that vitamin D as in fish and other diet elements requires sunlight to fully integrate into the body.

Obviously excess must be avoided but they are saying we are tending to go to extremes that other way, especially with children.

In winter I think we should look for a source of ultra-violet, in combination with the high-D foods or even vitamin supplements. Maybe not necessary to develop a full tan, but one 5 min session per week.

Also, especially for those who are finding that niacin has little effect, try bolstering it with Vitamin-C and iron. These specifically help in the production of 5-htp which is a precursor to serotonin. And or if we are low in those elements could explain partly why niacin isn't working.

I can vouch for niacin being most effective when I take iron and vitamin c. The combination of these is a great mood booster, for me in any case. Re. the fish oil, I'm not convinced that it's just about getting large amounts of EPA and DHA in our diets. Salmon is undoubtedly effective but some expensive fish oils with very high amounts of epa and dha per capsule have less effect for me than cheaper cod liver oil and krill oil, which is expensive but contains less EPA / DHA. There's something else at play here which seems to effect how easily and quickly the omega 3 can be used by our brains. This is not obvious from the cursory chemical analysis details shown on most supplements.

[POIS-SUFFERER]

I find the Niacinamide works for me very well and this is comes without much of a flush, sometimes I feel a small one, but then again I take 1000mg... this almost gets rid of the brain fog and flu..... BUT!!!!! I need to find something to help with the DRIVE.... I have no drive, I just want to sit and do nothing, I have no enthusiasm at all.... I am self employed, I have a line up of paying contracts, I am totally out of money, so you would think you could work at these paying contracts..... nope, I can not find any motivation to do almost anything..... its very bad.....

I have been reading this forum and have not noted much about fixing this part of the problem.

PS.

[observercenter]

I find the Niacinamide works for me very well and this is comes without much of a flush, sometimes I feel a small one, but then again I take 1000mg... this almost gets rid of the brain fog and flu..... BUT!!!!! I need to find something to help with the DRIVE.... I have no drive, I just want to sit and do nothing, I have no enthusiasm at all.... I am self employed, I have a line up of paying contracts, I am totally out of money, so you would think you could work at these paying contracts..... nope, I can not find any motivation to do almost anything..... its very bad.....

I have been reading this forum and have not noted much about fixing this part of the problem.

PS.

I just had an orgasm just 30 min ago, and i took the niacin (flush type) and i do not feel any brain fog, and i do not experience that lethargy that you are talking about. I had experienced it in the past: Brain fog, lethargy, tiredness, cognitive impairement, void of any emotion... but the niacin has stopped each one of these symptoms. Maybe you should give the flush type one opportunity. Have you tried it before?

[daveman]

I find the Niacinamide works for me very well and this is comes without much of a flush, sometimes I feel a small one, but then again I take 1000mg... this almost gets rid of the brain fog and flu..... BUT!!!!! I need to find something to help with the DRIVE.... I have no drive, I just want to sit and do nothing, I have no enthusiasm at all.... I am self employed, I have a line up of paying contracts, I am totally out of money, so you would think you could work at these paying contracts..... nope, I can not find any motivation to do almost anything..... its very bad.....

I have been reading this forum and have not noted much about fixing this part of the problem.

PS.

Interesting, niacin, at least for me, also fixed the drive. I've got lots of it. I don't know if that might be a difference between niacinimide and niacin or not. Also look at boosting with vitamin C and iron! See if that helps.

BTW when do you take your niacinamide, one hour before as well? Did you start out with 1000mg or less, and did you try with niacin before, if so what was your dose with that (as a reference)?.

[demografx]

Help raise awareness about POIS

Rare Disease Day (RDD) is an international awareness-raising event, and there are various ways for any of us to become involved.  You'd be helping to publicize the need for more research on rare diseases -- AND -- you'd have the opportunity to specifically bring POIS to the public's attention.

It takes place this year on February 29th -- a rare "leap day".

(1) In the USA, NORD is the official sponsor.  Go to their RDD website to find out if there's something you'd like to participate in --
http://rarediseaseday.us/
In particular, check out the "Meet the Community"page.  (http://rarediseaseday.us/meet-the-community/).

(2) NORD's sister-organization based in Paris -- EURORDIS -- is the official sponsor for those of you from Europe, the UK, the Ukraine, South America, and Latin America). Please feel free to use the EURORDIS RDD day site, www.rarediseaseday.org. The EURORDIS site translates to six languages.

Or, if you prefer, you may all use NORD's website.

Rare Disease Day is not a profit-making event for NORD or EURORDIS.  It's strictly an awareness-raising event.

And who needs awareness-raising more than we do?

[daveman]

The first survey is available on SMF, but it won't let you in if you're not on the list (both for SPAM reasons and survey control reasons). This frst survey will help to develop POIS goups and will associate you with one of them. So it's important that the biggest number of us fill it out.

Later I'll make a second identical one to be filled out by volunteers, who will go through the 150 or so members that had previously filled in data, and which we have in a Word doc, and fill in their data.

The reason for the second one is that it won't automatically associate the person's name who entered the data to that data, but will use the manually entered username of the survery. This second one in conjunction with the first one will give us a powerful database to be used in isolating remedial effects per POIS type.

Very exciting, but we will need your whole hearted cooperation. It's an important prelude to our research program.

A third survey to come soon is a niacin related survey. This will also be able to be cross-referenced by POIS group.

I hope to generate the list either today or tomorrow so that we'll be ready to roll soon.

[demografx]

Wonderful, daveman!

[POIS-SUFFERER]

I find the Niacinamide works for me very well and this is comes without much of a flush, sometimes I feel a small one, but then again I take 1000mg... this almost gets rid of the brain fog and flu..... BUT!!!!! I need to find something to help with the DRIVE.... I have no drive, I just want to sit and do nothing, I have no enthusiasm at all.... I am self employed, I have a line up of paying contracts, I am totally out of money, so you would think you could work at these paying contracts..... nope, I can not find any motivation to do almost anything..... its very bad.....

I have been reading this forum and have not noted much about fixing this part of the problem.

PS.

Interesting, niacin, at least for me, also fixed the drive. I've got lots of it. I don't know if that might be a difference between niacinimide and niacin or not. Also look at boosting with vitamin C and iron! See if that helps.

BTW when do you take your niacinamide, one hour before as well? Did you start out with 1000mg or less, and did you try with niacin before, if so what was your dose with that (as a reference)?.

So I will add IRON  + C, any dosage ideas? brands?

and keep with my niacin-amide (no flush) I will see how that works, the niacin-amide on its own gets rid of most of the issues except the lack of drive and no emotions.... which I hope will be fixed with IRON + C

If this does not work I will go for full flush and of course decrease my dose from 1000mg to 100mg or less to start....

I could start a fire with 1000! :-)

PS.

[POIS-SUFFERER]

I was unable to modify my last message, tried twice!

I am also under much stress from work and family so this may also be the reason the motivation and emotions are really broken, I am not depressed I have hope......

PS.

[mellivora]

Lack of emotions and drive have long been two key symptoms of POIS for me and stress seems often to make cognitive POIS symptoms worse. I can definitely identify with your situation POIS-SUFFERER. I'm afraid I don't have concrete suggestions for you other than to try to limit the stress but I know that is easier said than done. Niacin hasn't worked for me so far but I'm glad you have had at least partial success. Good luck. Its good to read you have hope. With the progress we've made over the last year there's more reason for us all to have hope. Sorry I can't offer more but I hope the iron + C helps...
According to NHS site, the recommended daily allowance of iron is 8.7mg/day for men.
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/vitamins-minerals/Pages/Iron.aspx
Adults need 40mg vitamin C per day.
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/vitamins-minerals/Pages/Vitamin-C.aspx
As you may know, vitamin C isn't stored in the body so one can generally take more of this. A popular brand of multivitamin supplement here in the UK (called Centrum) has 5mg Iron and 100mg vitamin C. Vitamin C supplements with far higher doses (eg. 1000mg) are available.

[demografx]

I am not depressed I have hope.

POIS-SUFFERER, thank you for the message of hope.

Your message may bring that same message of hope to other POIS sufferers who read this.

[POIS-SUFFERER]

I am not depressed I have hope.

POIS-SUFFERER, thank you for the message of hope.
Your message may bring that same message of hope to other POIS sufferers who read this.

Just like countless others on here, POIS has made a complete shambles of our lives, I have lost at least 10 years that I know of, and I mean lost!

I am still not better, but I am not as bad as I was at one time, and I have gone through depression, prior to POIS, and I know 100% what it means to say "I am hopeless", I am down, I am out, but I still think there are sunny days to come.

PS.

[POIS-SUFFERER]

Lack of emotions and drive have long been two key symptoms of POIS for me and stress seems often to make cognitive POIS symptoms worse. I can definitely identify with your situation POIS-SUFFERER. I'm afraid I don't have concrete suggestions for you other than to try to limit the stress but I know that is easier said than done. Niacin hasn't worked for me so far but I'm glad you have had at least partial success. Good luck. Its good to read you have hope. With the progress we've made over the last year there's more reason for us all to have hope. Sorry I can't offer more but I hope the iron + C helps...
According to NHS site, the recommended daily allowance of iron is 8.7mg/day for men.
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/vitamins-minerals/Pages/Iron.aspx
Adults need 40mg vitamin C per day.
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/vitamins-minerals/Pages/Vitamin-C.aspx
As you may know, vitamin C isn't stored in the body so one can generally take more of this. A popular brand of multivitamin supplement here in the UK (called Centrum) has 5mg Iron and 100mg vitamin C. Vitamin C supplements with far higher doses (eg. 1000mg) are available.

We have Centrum in Canada also.... UK/Canada a lot of similarities :-)

So all I need is a good multi then, I will check to make sure what I use has at least the daily recommened and go from there....

Would extra IRON be bad?

Also has the NIACIN+IRON+C mix also help with the joint and muscle pain, this too is bothersome, and is part of my POIS.

PS.

[POIS-SUFFERER]

Just another small note.

I also take 1mg ATIVAN (a benzo) every 24-48 hours when things get rough, these pills are magic, they are not a cure but a bandaid. BUT they make me feel like myself again, but I take them only when I feel really out of control and not on a regular basis as they are very addictive. They did for a long time help with the motivation but not so much anymore.

For anyone who is really on the edge of maybe feeling "crazy" over POIS, talk to your DR about these, they are a good way to get over the bump when used properly and again only on a as needed basis when you literally feel yourself falling apart.

They were first used during my first very large depression and hence anxiety attack ridden life around 14 years ago, when my first daughter died, without them I probably would not be here today, they allowed me to continue the fight.

POIS followed this, but I have never really been able to pin down exactly when it started.....

PS.

[daveman]

I was unable to modify my last message, tried twice!

I am also under much stress from work and family so this may also be the reason the motivation and emotions are really broken, I am not depressed I have hope......

PS.

Since the "upgrade" the quick edit (the small icon in the corner) doesn't work, but "modify" above next to quote does, or at least has worked.

We'll make a note to the mods if they're not already on it.

[daveman]

Lack of emotions and drive have long been two key symptoms of POIS for me and stress seems often to make cognitive POIS symptoms worse. I can definitely identify with your situation POIS-SUFFERER. I'm afraid I don't have concrete suggestions for you other than to try to limit the stress but I know that is easier said than done. Niacin hasn't worked for me so far but I'm glad you have had at least partial success. Good luck. Its good to read you have hope. With the progress we've made over the last year there's more reason for us all to have hope. Sorry I can't offer more but I hope the iron + C helps...
According to NHS site, the recommended daily allowance of iron is 8.7mg/day for men.
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/vitamins-minerals/Pages/Iron.aspx
Adults need 40mg vitamin C per day.
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/vitamins-minerals/Pages/Vitamin-C.aspx
As you may know, vitamin C isn't stored in the body so one can generally take more of this. A popular brand of multivitamin supplement here in the UK (called Centrum) has 5mg Iron and 100mg vitamin C. Vitamin C supplements with far higher doses (eg. 1000mg) are available.

We have Centrum in Canada also.... UK/Canada a lot of similarities :-)

So all I need is a good multi then, I will check to make sure what I use has at least the daily recommened and go from there....

Would extra IRON be bad?

Also has the NIACIN+IRON+C mix also help with the joint and muscle pain, this too is bothersome, and is part of my POIS.

PS.

First, If I take a multi-vitamin with "the works", it makes me worse, often much worse. So limit the vitamins to just what is working. Look for a C+Iron combo, preferably with more like 500mg C. The 5mg iron sounds good. This will keep the "tests" focused in a specific area.

The "C plus Iron" is directed at better serotonin synthesis, so probably won't help the muscles and joints.

And Mel if the niacin isn't working for you, it would be a fantastic test if you could take the C+Iron as well with niacin to see if that makes a difference. I'd like to start isolating the situation for those where niacin doesn't work.

Maybe my levels of C and iron are normally good, so the effectivity of niacin is good, and in some others, their normal C+Iron are low? A couple of tests and we should know.

I imagine that the c+iron wiuld be taken daily, whereas the niacin just 1 hr before orgasm as always.

[mellivora]

And Mel if the niacin isn't working for you, it would be a fantastic test if you could take the C+Iron as well with niacin to see if that makes a difference. I'd like to start isolating the situation for those where niacin doesn't work.

Maybe my levels of C and iron are normally good, so the effectivity of niacin is good, and in some others, their normal C+Iron are low? A couple of tests and we should know.

I imagine that the c+iron wiuld be taken daily, whereas the niacin just 1 hr before orgasm as always.

Daveman, you are right that C+iron only instead of multivits would keep the tests more specific. I find your statement that multivits made you worse interesting. Perhaps you are getting too much of something in that case. But are you saying you tried niacin whilst on mulltivits and the niacin didn't work so well or that your symptoms used to be worse when you were on multivits (before you discovered niacin).

I have recently been taking multivits (not the case in my previous niacin tests) - I do this from time to time (probably just once or twice a year) when I know I haven't been eating as much fruit and veg as I normally do. And I plan to test niacin again in next couple of days. This time I plan to test in the morning because I haven't tested a good flush-O combination at this time of day and also it'll be empty stomach. It'll likely be my last test before I move on to levocetirizine dihydrochloride (antihistamine tested by Joe Burger). I suspect taking multivits could affect one's niacin flush threshold as they contain niacin.

We've also seen one or two cases where taking niacin regularly hasn't helped people much but when regular doses were stopped and and niacin was taken before O only, the niacin became more effective. So multivits containing a regular smallish dose of niacin might take the edge off the effectiveness of the pre-O dose in a similar way. Or it could just raise one's tolerance to Niacin meaning more is needed for a flush. (Or it could mean less is needed for a flush because the body is already quite well saturated with Niacin although we have read how one can build a tolerance to Niacin)

[daveman]

The list is ready for SMF surveys. For those who want to start, please PM me either here or on SMF for your user/pass to access the survey.
Thanks

[daveman]

And Mel if the niacin isn't working for you, it would be a fantastic test if you could take the C+Iron as well with niacin to see if that makes a difference. I'd like to start isolating the situation for those where niacin doesn't work.

Maybe my levels of C and iron are normally good, so the effectivity of niacin is good, and in some others, their normal C+Iron are low? A couple of tests and we should know.

I imagine that the c+iron wiuld be taken daily, whereas the niacin just 1 hr before orgasm as always.

Daveman, you are right that C+iron only instead of multivits would keep the tests more specific. I find your statement that multivits made you worse interesting. Perhaps you are getting too much of something in that case. But are you saying you tried niacin whilst on mulltivits and the niacin didn't work so well or that your symptoms used to be worse when you were on multivits (before you discovered niacin).

I have recently been taking multivits (not the case in my previous niacin tests) - I do this from time to time (probably just once or twice a year) when I know I haven't been eating as much fruit and veg as I normally do. And I plan to test niacin again in next couple of days. This time I plan to test in the morning because I haven't tested a good flush-O combination at this time of day and also it'll be empty stomach. It'll likely be my last test before I move on to levocetirizine dihydrochloride (antihistamine tested by Joe Burger). I suspect taking multivits could affect one's niacin flush threshold as they contain niacin.

We've also seen one or two cases where taking niacin regularly hasn't helped people much but when regular doses were stopped and and niacin was taken before O only, the niacin became more effective. So multivits containing a regular smallish dose of niacin might take the edge off the effectiveness of the pre-O dose in a similar way. Or it could just raise one's tolerance to Niacin meaning more is needed for a flush. (Or it could mean less is needed for a flush because the body is already quite well saturated with Niacin although we have read how one can build a tolerance to Niacin)

My bad reaction with multis was almost a year before even knowing about niacin. If I would take them, my POIS would be several time worse. I didn't seem to have any other effects from the vitamins otherwise.

Most multi-vits have only about 15mg of niacin, not enough I don't think, to effect the tolerance level. I don't know, but cerial probably has that amount!

On you next test with niacin in the morning, 100mg should give you a good flush. My flushes in the morning have been strong, but more tolerable for some reason. If you ca,n try to take the vitamin C+iron for a few days before to get the levels up and without the multis.

Happy "O"ing!