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Both observers experience the exact same amount of light seconds.
Quote from: Thebox on 21/03/2019 09:52:34Both observers experience the exact same amount of light seconds. I dont understand the diagram etc. But i understand the heading -- Killing Time Dilation -- so i will comment.There is no such thing as time, hencely no such thing as time dilation. Or, there is such a thing as time, it is the present instant, & this is universal, but it cant be dilated.It would be ok to talk of ticking dilation, ie where processes are slowed by something, the slowing being due primarily to the speed of the clock etc relative to the aether.The slowing in ticking might be exactly as described by Lorentz's gamma. Or it might be due to a macro process affecting macro ticking due to the indirect affect of Lorentz's gamma but here applied to one or more dimensions of the macro process (the dimensions having been contracted due to LLC).Observers are of course just such a macro process. I would think that the observer's tickerthalamus is a macro thing & has a complicated macro equation for ticking.An observer ant would feel ticking & time differently to an observer elephant.I think it depends on the distance from the eye to the tickerthalamus (with all due respect to the blind).What kind of animals are your observers? That was a major flaw in Einstein's train embankment lighting thortX -- he didnt cover the general case -- which would involve an elephant say in the carriage (the circus was coming to town) & an ant say on the embankment.
Actually , there is such a thing as time but not in accordance with present definition and semantics. The diagram is of the Einstein's famous light clock thought experiment that explains time dilation using length contraction . However this experimental thought is at error and my diagram demonstrates that time does not slow down or speed up for an observer in motion . However there is an actual real life experiment involving caesium clocks , these show a frequency dilation when the entropy is changed . This can be expresses delta S = delta t , where S is entropy and t is time . Time is not an independent entity , it is a quantifiable measurement directly proportional to aging. Meaning simply time is aging and aging has a rate of change that can be measured.
Ticking is aging & aging is ticking. Agreed. But the notion of time is superfluous.
Quote from: Thebox on 23/03/2019 00:03:57Actually , there is such a thing as time but not in accordance with present definition and semantics. The diagram is of the Einstein's famous light clock thought experiment that explains time dilation using length contraction . However this experimental thought is at error and my diagram demonstrates that time does not slow down or speed up for an observer in motion . However there is an actual real life experiment involving caesium clocks , these show a frequency dilation when the entropy is changed . This can be expresses delta S = delta t , where S is entropy and t is time . Time is not an independent entity , it is a quantifiable measurement directly proportional to aging. Meaning simply time is aging and aging has a rate of change that can be measured.Ticking is aging & aging is ticking. Agreed. But the notion of time is superfluous.Re your comment that time does not slow down or speed up for an observer in motion. I think that this might fit exactly with what i think. Me myself being an aetherist i believe that a ticktock has an absolute ticking rate when sitting still in the absolute aether reference frame, ie where the aetherwind is zero kmps. And when there is a wind blowing throo the ticktock the ticktock ticks slower. But, if the observer is sitting next to the ticktock the observer will see that the ticktock has a ticking rate equal to the ticktock's absolute ticking rate, because the observer's ticking is affected equally to the ticktock's ticking. Which sounds to me to be virtually the same thing that u mention.However i now have a problem. I used to think the above. But in recent weeks i have become aware that ticktocks are macro things & their ticking is affected differently depending on design, eg pendulum, balance wheel, atomic clock, light clock, animal tickerthalamuses, etc etc. Therefore the standard aetherian law that says that an observer will see & measure a ticktock's absolute ticking as long as the observer is sitting in the same frame, is wrong.This makes all science very complicated. The good old days are over. As we enter the more accurate more sensitive era we will find that ticking can no longer be relied upon.But what is that entropy stuff re the atomic clock? Has that got something to do with elevation?I dont know much about entropy except that it is a useless notion, & will never help anyone to get a Nobel. The same can be said about enthalpy. In fact i combine them to make enthaltropy, a completely useless word & theory.
Ticking is not complicated , all observers experience 1 light second per photon experienced light second . The ticking of aging is var(x) You could age slower on Venus say if your clock ticked at half the rate . Entropy is the number of ways a system can change , when a clock is at relative rest , it's entropy is pretty constant if the temp is constant and the v=0 . Motion or a change of temp , energy levels, is change in entropy hence ΔS=Δt
Quote from: Thebox on 23/03/2019 01:47:02Ticking is not complicated , all observers experience 1 light second per photon experienced light second . The ticking of aging is var(x) You could age slower on Venus say if your clock ticked at half the rate . Entropy is the number of ways a system can change , when a clock is at relative rest , it's entropy is pretty constant if the temp is constant and the v=0 . Motion or a change of temp , energy levels, is change in entropy hence ΔS=ΔtYes then we agree, as i said, entropy is a useless notion.So if u change an atomic clock's speed or acceleration or position or angle or height or temperature, then its ticking changes. Will anyone get a Nobel for that? Were any clocks hurt in that experiment? I can add that if u take out the batteries the ticking will change.Noise, what about noise, that must have an effect.Magnetism. Lightning. What about water, what if u dropped the atomic clock in a swimming pool?Thats the trouble with cheap atomic clocks. They are affected by entropy. U only get what u pay for.
Quote from: mad aetherist on 23/03/2019 01:59:00Quote from: Thebox on 23/03/2019 01:47:02Ticking is not complicated , all observers experience 1 light second per photon experienced light second . The ticking of aging is var(x) You could age slower on Venus say if your clock ticked at half the rate . Entropy is the number of ways a system can change , when a clock is at relative rest , it's entropy is pretty constant if the temp is constant and the v=0 . Motion or a change of temp , energy levels, is change in entropy hence ΔS=ΔtYes then we agree, as i said, entropy is a useless notion.So if u change an atomic clock's speed or acceleration or position or angle or height or temperature, then its ticking changes. Will anyone get a Nobel for that? Were any clocks hurt in that experiment? I can add that if u take out the batteries the ticking will change.Noise, what about noise, that must have an effect.Magnetism. Lightning. What about water, what if u dropped the atomic clock in a swimming pool?Thats the trouble with cheap atomic clocks. They are affected by entropy. U only get what u pay for.Yes , expensive clocks affected by change of entropy .
I guess all three of my theory argument threads were all affective arguments ?
Quote from: Thebox on 21/03/2019 15:38:51I guess all three of my theory argument threads were all affective arguments ? Why would you think that?
Perhaps you'd like another diagram .
Quote from: Thebox on 23/03/2019 16:54:11Perhaps you'd like another diagram .Not really,but I'd like some actual explanation of what you mean.What you have so far are nonsensical claims It's impossible to mount a counterargument when there isn't a valid argument to counter.
Observer A , Alice is onboard a spaceship that is in motion .Observer B , Bill is on Earth and relatively at rest . Alice measures 1.33333 l.s per 1.33333 l.s Bill measures 1.33333 l.s per 1.33333 l.s Both observers experience 1.33333 l.s Bill observes Alice's time to run at the same speed as his time . added- I'll add vector analysis t = + = 1.33333 l.s t'= = 1.33333 l.s
I'd like some actual explanation of what you mean.What you have so far are nonsensical claims It's impossible to mount a counterargument when there isn't a valid argument to counter.
Quote from: Thebox on 23/03/2019 17:08:38Observer A , Alice is onboard a spaceship that is in motion .Observer B , Bill is on Earth and relatively at rest . Alice measures 1.33333 l.s per 1.33333 l.s Bill measures 1.33333 l.s per 1.33333 l.s Both observers experience 1.33333 l.s Bill observes Alice's time to run at the same speed as his time . added- I'll add vector analysis t = + = 1.33333 l.s t'= = 1.33333 l.s Quote from: Bored chemist on 23/03/2019 17:02:16I'd like some actual explanation of what you mean.What you have so far are nonsensical claims It's impossible to mount a counterargument when there isn't a valid argument to counter.
there is no time dilation .
Quote from: Thebox on 23/03/2019 19:19:16there is no time dilation .Except, it's known that there is.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hafele%E2%80%93Keating_experiment
The Hafele Keating fraud has been sunk.
Quote from: mad aetherist on 23/03/2019 21:26:12The Hafele Keating fraud has been sunk.I think this site has rules about libel .Anyway, in the real world, time dilation is real.It is, for example, the reasons why GPS works.