[championoftruth (OP)]

In my opinion, the na+ and cl-, so the salt you can find in water, are very tiny molecules.
Also, they interact strongly with water.
Therfore, if you have some "capilarity flow", i prefer to say "adsorption" of liquid by some "sponge" (some matter with wide surface), permitted (the flow is permitted) by the evaporation of water (water evaporate and is replaced by the liquid water that stand around), then the diffusion of "salt" is much greater then the flow.
So, no gradient of water with less or more salt.

I think we here do some confusion between the capilarity and the filtering possibility due to the tiny "pores" (they are not pores but some grid) you could have with some materials (here some paper towel).
What it sure here : The paper towel has not "pores" (or grid of cellulose) small enougth to permit only water to flow trought and not "salt".

You missed the point again.

Does capillary action from one cup to another cup via paper towel, etc reduce the amount of salt in the second cup and by how much or by what fraction or percentage.

Has as anyone every measured the salt concentrations in an experiment as I find very little research anywhere.
i have no interest at THIS point about filtration, etc.

[Deecart]

I dont think i missed anything.
But what you have to consider is that your "design" can not work continuously.
If you put some towel joining 1000 pots of water, then this will work 1 time.
Soon all towels are wet, there is no flow anymore.

So you can say : Yes but i will use the evaporation of water in the towels to maintain the flow.
Yes, sure. but salt do not evaporate and you will have more an more salt accumulating in the towels.
In fact your design permit you to concentrate the salt.
At least when there is no water anymore you end up with towels full of salt.

Now, if you think that salt will not follow the water, i dont understand why.
The diffusion speed of na+ and cl- is very high and i am pretty sure the water will remain salty even in the number 1000 pot.

[Deecart]

Does capillary action from one cup to another cup via paper towel, etc reduce the amount of salt in the second cup and by how much or by what fraction or percentage.

I dont think it will reduce the amount of salt, flow is less then diffusion speed.
If you could drastically lower temperature and therefore lower the diffusion speed of salt, perhaps, but because liquid water is constrained by the 0°C limit (so around) then there is no way to reduce the salinity in this way.

[Petrochemicals]

The capillary action shown in the video could be said to be a syphon, thus gravity assist. A gravitational impetus can be used as a source of energy in any filter. Capillary action uphill would be creditable as a theory.

So capillary theory is fake your saying?

As much effort as you put in.

[Bored chemist]

Here the example that contradict your belief :

You need to explain what is in that video which you think is a perpetual motion machine.

Because I watched it and I didn't see anything that violated the conservation of energy.

Is it that you don't understand how that fountain works?
(it has a heater in it)
"Superfluid helium, a state of matter existing at low temperatures, shows many remarkable properties. One example is the so called fountain effect, where a heater can produce a jet of helium. This converts heat into mechanical motion; a machine with no moving parts, but working only below 2 K. Allen and Jones first demonstrated the effect in 1938, but their work was basically qualitative. "
https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1361-6404/aa818c?gclid=Cj0KCQjw852XBhC6ARIsAJsFPN1ozHeoQcvJEe_Ph7I_H4g0UsgIGF5Kxz8QfURtCDFSspUlW_B5RYwaAmV8EALw_wcB

[championoftruth (OP)]

I dont think i missed anything.
But what you have to consider is that your "design" can not work continuously.
If you put some towel joining 1000 pots of water, then this will work 1 time.
Soon all towels are wet, there is no flow anymore.

So you can say : Yes but i will use the evaporation of water in the towels to maintain the flow.
Yes, sure. but salt do not evaporate and you will have more an more salt accumulating in the towels.
In fact your design permit you to concentrate the salt.
At least when there is no water anymore you end up with towels full of salt.

Now, if you think that salt will not follow the water, i dont understand why.
The diffusion speed of na+ and cl- is very high and i am pretty sure the water will remain salty even in the number 1000 pot.

That is not i asked and it has nothing to with perpetual motion.

say for instance the salinity was reduced by 20% in the second cup.

Then the 2nd cup could be used as the starting cup up for a third cup to reduce salinity by another 20%.

and so on.

[Bored chemist]

say for instance the salinity was reduced by 20% in the second cup.

Why would that happen?

I realise you don't understand this but, if it did happen, you would have made a perpetual motion machine and, since we know that is impossible, we know that your idea is wrong.

[championoftruth (OP)]

say for instance the salinity was reduced by 20% in the second cup.

Why would that happen?

I realise you don't understand this but, if it did happen, you would have made a perpetual motion machine and, since we know that is impossible, we know that your idea is wrong.

You are mixing me up the other guy. i never mentioned PMM

I am only interested in reducing salinity using capillary action.

[Bored chemist]

I am only interested in reducing salinity using capillary action.

And I am explaining why it is impossible.
If it worked as you are proposing, then it could be used to make be a perpetual motion machine.
But we know that is impossible.
So we know that you are wrong.

Why do you not understand this?

[Bored chemist]

OK. Here's the bit that I guess you are somehow not getting.
Imagine that letting the water soak through the paper continuously removed the salt.
Imagine making boxes round the first and last cups in the chain.
The vapour pressure of water over pure water is higher than that over salt water.
So the liquid in the least salty solution would evaporate and travel through the pipe and condense in the first cup.
And you could use that stream of water vapour to run a turbine- maybe not a big heavy one, but that's not the point.
And that turbine would provide free energy
But w know that's impossible so we know your idea doesn't work.

PMM.jpg (55 kB . 1190x770 - viewed 1510 times)

[championoftruth (OP)]

OK. Here's the bit that I guess you are somehow not getting.
Imagine that letting the water soak through the paper continuously removed the salt.
Imagine making boxes round the first and last cups in the chain.
The vapour pressure of water over pure water is higher than that over salt water.
So the liquid in the least salty solution would evaporate and travel through the pipe and condense in the first cup.
And you could use that stream of water vapour to run a turbine- maybe not a big heavy one, but that's not the point.
And that turbine would provide free energy
But w know that's impossible so we know your idea doesn't work.

PMM.jpg (55 kB . 1190x770 - viewed 1510 times)

Once again I don't understand your obsession with PMM and forcing it on me.

In your diagram there is no connection between output and back to input.

This videos shows all that is needed.

in this case water from 2nd glass is going into 1st glass with the tissue.

question is if water in 2nd glass is salty will it be less salty in 1st glass.

please dont mention PMM again... arrrghhhhh.

[Bored chemist]

Once again I don't understand your obsession with PMM and forcing it on me.

Because it answers your question, without having to do any experiment.

[Bored chemist]

In your diagram there is no connection between output and back to input.

There is.
The black pipe at the top.

[championoftruth (OP)]

In your diagram there is no connection between output and back to input.

There is.
The black pipe at the top.

Its his diagram and should be no connection. see the video

[evan_au]

say for instance the salinity was reduced by 20% in the second cup.
Then the 2nd cup could be used as the starting cup up for a third cup to reduce salinity by another 20%

You can interpret this the right way or the wrong way.

Wrong way: If each paper towel reduces the concentration of salt by 20%, then after 5 paper towels, the concentration of salt would be 0%

Right Way: If each paper towel reduces the concentration of salt by 20%, then there is 80% of the salt left.
After 5 paper towels, there is 0.8⁵ salt left, or 33% of the original concentration.

[Bored chemist]

In your diagram there is no connection between output and back to input.

There is.
The black pipe at the top.

Its his diagram and should be no connection. see the video

So; you don't understand the word "if".

[Deecart]

Here the example that contradict your belief :

You need to explain what is in that video which you think is a perpetual motion machine.

Because I watched it and I didn't see anything that violated the conservation of energy.

I never said it is a perpetual motion machine.
It is you who dit it.

If capillary action made water run uphill and drip into a beaker it would be a perpetual motion machine.

So here we have something acting like what you suppose it cant exists.
Here we have capillary action made superfuid helium run unhill and drip into a beaker, "so it is a perpetual motion machine" (this part is what you say it is...)

Of course it is not a PMM.

Is it that you don't understand how that fountain works?

I dont care about the fountain, so you were not able to see something else in this video ?

Many ordinary liquids, like alcohol or petroleum, creep up solid walls, driven by their surface tension. Liquid helium also has this property, but, in the case of He-II, the flow of the liquid in the layer is not restricted by its viscosity but by a critical velocity which is about 20 cm/s. This is a fairly high velocity so superfluid helium can flow relatively easily up the wall of containers, over the top, and down to the same level as the surface of the liquid inside the container, in a siphon effect as illustrated in figure 4. In a container, lifted above the liquid level, it forms visible droplets as seen in figure 5

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superfluid_helium-4
.

[Bored chemist]

Did you notice that the He started in a cup above the rest of the liquid, crept over the sides and fell DOWN.
Do you understand why that's not the same as what I said?

If capillary action made water run uphill and drip into a beaker it would be a perpetual motion machine.

[championoftruth (OP)]

say for instance the salinity was reduced by 20% in the second cup.
Then the 2nd cup could be used as the starting cup up for a third cup to reduce salinity by another 20%

You can interpret this the right way or the wrong way.

Wrong way: If each paper towel reduces the concentration of salt by 20%, then after 5 paper towels, the concentration of salt would be 0%

Right Way: If each paper towel reduces the concentration of salt by 20%, then there is 80% of the salt left.
After 5 paper towels, there is 0.8⁵ salt left, or 33% of the original concentration.

Obviously  the second method is correct.

[championoftruth (OP)]

Here the example that contradict your belief :

You need to explain what is in that video which you think is a perpetual motion machine.

Because I watched it and I didn't see anything that violated the conservation of energy.

I never said it is a perpetual motion machine.
It is you who dit it.

If capillary action made water run uphill and drip into a beaker it would be a perpetual motion machine.

So here we have something acting like what you suppose it cant exists.
Here we have capillary action made superfuid helium run unhill and drip into a beaker, "so it is a perpetual motion machine" (this part is what you say it is...)

Of course it is not a PMM.

Is it that you don't understand how that fountain works?

I dont care about the fountain, so you were not able to see something else in this video ?

Many ordinary liquids, like alcohol or petroleum, creep up solid walls, driven by their surface tension. Liquid helium also has this property, but, in the case of He-II, the flow of the liquid in the layer is not restricted by its viscosity but by a critical velocity which is about 20 cm/s. This is a fairly high velocity so superfluid helium can flow relatively easily up the wall of containers, over the top, and down to the same level as the surface of the liquid inside the container, in a siphon effect as illustrated in figure 4. In a container, lifted above the liquid level, it forms visible droplets as seen in figure 5

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superfluid_helium-4
.

Can you start your own thread about perpetual motion machines instead of hijacking mine?