[acsinuk (OP)]

I suppose the democratic thing to do is to ask the ladies of the Sahara for their opinion on what would be best for them.
Do they want lots of hungry children ?
Or just a few well fed healthy children?

[Bored chemist]

I suppose the democratic thing to do is to ask the ladies of the Sahara for their opinion on what would be best for them.
Do they want lots of hungry children ?
Or just a few well fed healthy children?

Well, you can ask..
If you find any who want their children damaged by overexposure to synthetic hormones while they are babies and children, then you have got the people who agree with your policy here.

They will need to feed themselves and become self sufficient in every way using technical aid from everywhere but refusing free food aid unless it has been treated with a contraceptive.

it is surely the Security Council that needs to act and advise UN and aid agencies/charities to only provide free food aid that has been treated with a contraceptive.

[alancalverd]

The problem is that in many parts of the world, nobody asks women what they want, and democracy is a dirty word. God has spoken and all must obey. And you have no right to criticise or interfere with anyone else's culture and traditions - that's imperialism.

So all we can do is demonstrate how to make the next few centuries survivable for our descendants, and hope that the rest of the world will learn from our example rather than starve and boil their own.

[acsinuk (OP)]

We all want to stop the war and there are protests in many western nations but both sides are Abrahams children .
But if Israel insists that the nations that protest must accept their fair share of Gaza refugees.  What then??
Think of Indian and China; will they get UN aid or are we just moving the problem of over population in self sustaining refugee camps somewhere else?

[alancalverd]

We all want to stop the war

Who we? Some of us want Israel to win the current round,  some want a ceasefire so Hamas can regroup and continue its mission to destroy Israel.

It will never end until people stop listening to priests and politicians, who make their living out of conflict.

[Petrochemicals]

win the current round

Contradictory. Repetition. Self defeating.

[Bored chemist]

We all want to stop the war and there are protests in many western nations but both sides are Abrahams children .
But if Israel insists that the nations that protest must accept their fair share of Gaza refugees.  What then??
Think of Indian and China; will they get UN aid or are we just moving the problem of over population in self sustaining refugee camps somewhere else?

Why would there be refugees from Gaza?

[alancalverd]

win the current round

Contradictory. Repetition. Self defeating.

Essentially repetitious, because there's always money to be made from Hamas, but winning one round can make life in Israel more pleasant for a while, so not selfdefeating.

[Petrochemicals]

can make life in Israel more pleasant for a while, so not selfdefeating

Until this generation of children grow to be old enough to join hamas, and ruin the peace again?

I would awfully like to see this thread split now, it was about population and resources. 15 percent of the population use something like 50 percent of all resources and the world cannot even sustain this rate of depletion. If everyone on earth had a western standard of living, the population would need to be 1.5 billion for it to be sustainable, co2 is just one factor and a factor that would cease to be considered a problem if the population declined to the mentioned level.

[alancalverd]

Until this generation of children grow to be old enough to join hamas, and ruin the peace again?

Yes. This nonsense has been going on for about 6000 years, and will continue for as long as politics and religion are tolerated.

[alancalverd]

If everyone on earth had a western standard of living, the population would need to be 1.5 billion for it to be sustainable, co2 is just one factor and a factor that would cease to be considered a problem if the population declined to the mentioned level.

That is too true, too obvious, and too simple, for anyone to do anything about it. Too many careers depend on promoting the inevitable disaster.

[Petrochemicals]

 

If everyone on earth had a western standard of living, the population would need to be 1.5 billion for it to be sustainable, co2 is just one factor and a factor that would cease to be considered a problem if the population declined to the mentioned level.

That is too true, too obvious, and too simple, for anyone to do anything about it. Too many careers depend on promoting the inevitable disaster.

Moaning about CO2 seems like rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic.

[acsinuk (OP)]

Just watched Aljazeera Bottom line on Gaza conflict and you should to. 
They do not see a solution with existing Israel PM but fail to realise that Gaza is a refugee city and can no longer be ruled by  Hamas but only by Israel as a province with full voting rights...
All Hamas supporters must be immediately exiled anywhere  2000 km from Israel by Saudi Arabia or Iran asap. 
Not the UN so who would you choose?

[alancalverd]

How would you define and identify a Hamas supporter? Do they wear team colors?

If you managed to do so, and they were welcomed by some other bunch of scum, wouldn't said scum simply rearm them and send them back home rather than accommodate foreigners with no other qualifications, experience or abilities than being terrorists?   

Worse still, your beloved "Hamas supporters" might even have slightly differing religious views from their unwilling hosts, which would make Northern Ireland look like a vicarage tea party in comparison.

[Bored chemist]

There aren't many Christians in Gaza but, if I was one of them, and I saw that Hamas was at least trying to hold the fort against Israel's attacks and invasion, I might have a lot of sympathy for them.

Would I be involuntarily deported to Saudi Arabia under ACS's plan?

[alancalverd]

If I lived in Gaza and saw that the IDF was trying to rid the country of a bunch of religious criminals who have held us all to ransom by indiscriminately attacking Israeli citizens and hiding under schools and hospitals for the last 20 years, I'd defect to the good guys.

[Bored chemist]

the IDF was trying to rid the country of a bunch of religious criminals

How successful would that have to be?
Also, how successfully are their actions recruiting more people  to the Hamas cause?

If the net effect is to hand more power to the religious nutters*, who is winning?

* on eitehr side.

[paul cotter]

One sure way to unite disparate groups is to attack the nation. Look at the history of Afganistan: when attacked from outside they unite, when free they fight among themselves.

[alancalverd]

Fact is that the Middle East is a basket case, thanks to millennia of organised crime labelled as religion. As long as fools can be  persuaded that somebody else's superstitions are important or that some historical misdeed can be righted by killing the descendants of the perpetrators, some scum, whether arms manufacturers or sexual perverts, will profit from it. And in the case of  the Middle East, it will all be funded by everyone else's need for oil. 

[acsinuk (OP)]

The Middle East is mostly desert and as such there is a low limit to its population size if it is to be self sufficient. Well, we all know that green fertile land can support many more people per square kilometre  World Bank has some stats on population density of countries     https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/EN.POP.DNST    .
Problem is overpopulation per square kilometre causes starving refugees that no one wants so turn up at UN refugee camps that are totally and absolutely un-self sustainable.  Advanced or forced family planning avoids poverty!!.