[loweduane]

You can try contacting "pilotlight" at the curezone forum.

http://curezone.com/forums/m.asp?f=223&i=1547

He bought some in large bulk and is making it available for others.

[FYI]

Did you forget to mention that Pilotlight is making a profit?
His downline is looking pretty hefty.
Thus, we see the birthing of a new network marketing company and a new maketing forum.
It's a beautiful thing.

[Eric]

Thanks for the response.

Yes, I was aware of the person at curezone.
It's just that I'm not totally comfortable buying from an unknown person on some forum. I was actually hoping to buy from an esatblished business.

Anyway, I read over there at curezone that gum Arabic might sort of be a substitute for the gum Ghatti. But then again, in the new Advanced Ambrotose formula the Gum Arabic (acacia) is the first ingredient, and Gum ghatti is the 6th listed ingredient. So since they include both, the Arabic may not be an exact substitute.

And unfortunately, the Gum ghatti from Spectrum Chemicals is not food grade. So close, yet so far :-)

[loweduane]

It is an interesting topic.  If you believe the notion that these ingredients supply the "8 essential sugars" and then note which sugars are from each of these ingredients you will find that:

1. Larex deciduas (arabinogalactan)
Providing:  arabinose, galactose (Whister et al. 1970)

2. Anogeissus latifolia (gum ghatti)
Providing: arabinose, galactose, mannose, xylose, glucuronic acid (Merck Index, 1996)

3.   Astragulus gummifer (gum tragacanth)
Providing: galactose, arabinose, xylose, fucose, rhamnose, galacturonic acid (Merck Index, 1996; Davidson et al., 1980)

4.  Manapol (inner leaf gel of Aloe barbadensis Miller)
Providing: mannose (Merck Index, 1996)

5.   Rice starch
Providing: Glucose (Merck Index, 1996)

6.   Glucosamine HCL
Providing: glucosamine (Merck Index, 1996)

NOTE:  That none of the sugars that make up Gum Ghatti are unique.  They are all found in the other ingredients in this product.  Technically you could add a little more of each of the other ingredients, or just leave it out, and take a little more of it to get all of same amounts of these sugars.  

However, if you do not believe in the 8 sugar hypothesis, and note that different combinations of different soluble fibers (which Gum Ghatti, tragacanth, arabinogalactan, manapol are) cause production of different ratios of short chain fatty acids, (which may be what is causing many of the benefits of these substances), then the addition of the specific gum - Ghatti, may in fact be (1) important, and (2) be completely different from other gums.  So any substitution would be a "trial and error" that may or may not work, since they are in the same family, but are NOT the same structure.

[Eric]

I really have no idea what to believe. I haven't really spent any time on the subject of whether it supplies the 8 individual sugars or not. I once got Robin at newbielink:http://www.myglycos.com/ [nonactive] on the phone and asked her about this very question, but she just sounded like a very nice lady who had absolutely no idea.

I also mentioned to her that I was pondering getting the individual ingredients myself, to which she answered that Ambrotose was patented (Hmmm) :-)

The other question I had was whether the Manapol is just an isolated extract of Aloe Vera, or whether it was ALSO chemically broken down into other compounds that the digestive system itself could not accomplish. The reason why I ask is I have a number of Aloe Vera Barbadensis plants that I am growing. I'm hoping that this is a decent substitute for the Manapol, though I'll probably take some manapol anyway (interesting article here - newbielink:http://asktom-naturally.com/naturally/aloenews.html [nonactive]). I'm aware that some compounds oxidize in the Aloe when exposed to air, but I try to avoid that by taking the whole leaf, and then only slicing off a piece each day - as opposed to immediately taking grinding the whole leaf and leaving it all exposed to air for several days.

Probably of little interest to most folks, since most people can't grow this themselves... but it's a hell of alot cheaper.
 

[tphreak]

Hey guys, just want to let you know first off that I am no medical expert. I am just a guy who has done his due diligence and believes that glyconutrients are something worth looking at. I've been taking these glyconutrients for 3 months now, and have had phenomenal results. I play tennis at a professional level, so my level of fitness is very important to me. Since taking these glyconutrients, I've felt an increase in strength, stamina, agility, speed and a decrease in stress.

A response to the moderator (Ylide): From reading your first few messages, I can already tell that you are probably a medical expert from the terminology that you use and a huge skeptic of glyconutrients, which is perfectly fine! But I don't believe you have thoroughly done your research (i may be wrong). I believe that you're just spitting out opinions that you've been taught in University, which is not your fault. But please, I urge you to do your research on glyconutrients so you won't have any biased opinions.

To answer some of your questions: Yes, the body can synthesise the 6 or 7 sugars that are void in our diet (We get glucose from just about everything, and galactose from dairy products, the rest are void), but it takes a lot of time and energy to do so. Thats why we need to supplement. No one claims that you should take glyconutrients alone and that it will cure all things (if you are, stop doing it, because you can't make a drug claim on a natural product). All glyconutrients does for your body is give it the materials it needs to do its jobs. The scientific focus aims at cell to cell communication. When cells have these eight biological sugars (not normal table sugars, or any other carbohydrates/monosaccharides that turn into glucose, but eight specific biological sugars that do not turn into glucose) this helps the intercellular communication. When cells communicate better, cells get healthier. When cells get healthier, our bodies get healthier, and thats when we can perform at our optimal level.

As far as sugar ultimately killing you. Once again, these are eight specific biological sugars that do not turn into glucose. These sugars coat our DNA! So I guess I should be dead now right? (Excuse my sarcasm, but I want to get my point across =) ).

As far as eating synthesised food and natural food. Natural food is definitely the way to go. Your cells know when you're giving it synthetic food or natural food. Synthetic food, the cells will take up some of it, yes, but it will reject most of it. If you give it natural food like fruits and vegetables, or in this case, glyconutrients that are derived from fruits and vegetables, the cells will take up all of it. If you're talking about your body synthesising the sugars, then I'm not sure if it takes up all of it. I'm guessing it will seeing as though its come from the body, but once again, it takes up a lot of time and energy to do so.

Im sure you wrote more on the topic Ylide, but I unfortunately didn't take the time to look at them all. Hope it answers some questions for you all. If any of you have any questions, please feel free to email me. If I can't answer a question, I'll find someone who can.

Dr John Axfod and Dr Boyd are coming to Melbourne, Australia tonight to talk about glyconutrients. Should be very informative. They are both members of the Royal Society of Medicine, so highly respected professionals. Royal Society of Medicine, I'm told, is probably one of the most, if not the most, prestigious medical fraternity in the world (correct me if I'm wrong).

Anyway, gimme a holla if you have any questions on glyconutrients, peterbong21@yahoo.com.

Peter

ps, oh, someone said that we don't get the nutrients we need in our bodies because of how our food is shipped and processed. That is true. Grocery stores like Coles and Safeway, and even Walmart, pick their fruits and vege's green to prevent bruising during shipment, then they gas 'em to make them big and red. But of course, you're not getting the nutrients in them, you're just getting the look of a ripe fruit. I could be wrong in saying this, maybe you could email Walmart, Safeway or Coles to find out? I doubt they'd tell you the truth though.

pss, Damnit, i forgot to refer you guys to some websites. newbielink:http://www.glycoscience.org [nonactive] (an award winning website). newbielink:http://www.dralex.com [nonactive] <~~~~ just found this site. There are others, but I'm not allowed to say. Just do your research! Good luck.

[tphreak]

Forgot to mention. These are 100% natural products. There are no toxic side effects whatsover, so you can't overdose on the product. So for those people who think "I don't know what to believe with supplementation, there are so many adverse side effects". Well, I can tell you for fact that these have no side effects whatsoever. And once again, you take these products in supplementation to the normal food you eat. You don't eat glyconutrients alone!

Mannatech, the nutriceutical research and development company that have produced these products, tried to make these products into a drug because of how powerful they are. They couldn't. They failed one test. Its called an LD 50 rating, where you have to kill a certain number of rats (50% of the population) for it to become a drug. You know that drugs are toxic in definition right? Well, how many rats we killed? None! We did the reverse, we made them healthier! lmao. Well, ok, i lied, we did kill one rat. We just fed it glyconutrients over and over again, and because rats can't regurgitate, the one rat suffocated. But ya, couldn't make it into a drug. Mannatech's products go through regular testing by the governing bodies of health. The TGA governs the products here in Australia. Im not sure in other areas of the world. You'll have to find that out yourselves.

All I can tell you is to do your research for both parties (for and against) or take the products on blind faith and see what happens.

Peter

[tphreak]

Manna doesn't mean "what is it?". I have no idea where you got that from Falariel. Manna was the food GOD provided for the Israelites in the desert when Moses was taking them away from Egypt. Do you remember reading that? Correct me if I'm wrong though.  

The dictionary says its also "Spiritual Nourishment of divine origin" among other things.

Peter

[tphreak]

I've been reading more of the forum, just wanted to answer a few question I read.

For all you people asking "I have/my friend has/my dad has... will glyconutrients help?" Think about this. The scientific focus is on cell to cell communication. When cells can communicate better, they get healthier; when they get healthier, our bodies get healthier. Let me explain it this way:

Cells communicate in much the same way as we do. We have letters in our words. If one of the letters are missing in a word, we can't make out the word right? Right. So cells also have a cellular alphabet to make up words. They have eight letters (which are the 8 glycoproteins/sugars). Now what happens is your good cells/killer cells goes around your body rubbing over other cells to read it (they rub over each others glycoproteins to communicate). To find out things like, if the other cell needs feeding, cleansing, regulating, to be left alone if its a good cell, or to be killed if its a bad cell. Now if one of the letters/glycoproteins are missing from the cell, then the killer cell can't read it. So it has two choices. Choice number 1 is it can kill it, you know its better safe than sorry right? But if that cell is a good cell, than your body is attacking itself. Which is an auto immune problem. Which are diseases like AIDS, allergies, asthma, arthritus, lupus, Multiple Sclerosis, Hepatitis C, and diabetes. Its just your body attacking itself. Or choice no.2 is, because the killer cell can't read the other cell because one of the glycoproteins are missing, choice no.2 is it can leave it alone. But if that cell is a cancer cell, then you've got a tumour growing! You don't have cancer because your chemotherapy deficient and its not a problem with your immune system, your killer cell could kill the cancer if it knew you had cancer... Interesting ay?

So as far as other diseases not mentioned above, think of it this way. Your body isn't getting the nutrients or materials it needs to defend itself. Once your body gets the materials it needs to defend and repair itself, your body will get better. Your body is an amazing thing, if you cut yourself, it heals. If you sprain your ankle, it heals itself over time. All you have to do is give the body the materials it needs to repair itself and glyconutrients may be the materials it needs.

As far as asking your doctor about this, he/she probably won't know about this stuff because it wasn't introduced till 1996. They would have got their degrees before that and wouldn't have studied this new technology. Doctors rarely update themselves on new technology because of how busy they are. I would suggest you do your own research on this stuff for both sides or take these glyconutrients on blind faith and see if they work.

There are many scientific/medical journals and magazines that talk about glyconutrients and how its going to impact people's health (whoever says their is little research done on this subject is totally wrong). Its already impacting peoples health. There have been many clinical studies done on this new science. The Fisher Institute has done extensive research on it and have published their findings. You can buy these documents from their website.

You must also remember that medical professionals will rebuke this new technology. Why? Think about it. The average cancer patient is probably worth $300,000 to them. Why would they want a natural supplement taking away their $300,000? They would say, take this drug, it'll make you feel better. Then you'll come back with another symptom because of the drug that you're taking. The doc will say "here take this drug to cure that symptom". The next thing you know, you'll be taking 25 different drugs trying to cure the drug you took before that.

So please please please do your own research. Don't take their word for it, don't take my word for it. Just do your own research and satisfy your own mind.

Peter

ps newbielink:http://www.glycoscience.org [nonactive]

[smilzandchuklz]

Things really heated up again.

Duanne, your story changes so often it's not funny. One post you're arguing that Mannatech does not have the research, the next you're posting like a zealot how people can get great results of Mannatech's product by concocting their own version. Then you advise people that if they have the money, to buy it from Mannatech.

You try to write like you're such a professional and as if you know all your research and facts like the back of your hand, but your attitude is holier than thou. It seems that you're writing in this way because you hate MLM. Then you recommend to people to purchase one of the ingredients from an MLM. You attempt to intimidate those who recommend the product in your postings (one person in particular).

It does not seem to be a coincidence that you often respond right after Kitty Cat. Do you think no one notices your beligerence and intolerance?

From reading your postings I have gathered that you are really not in disagreement that the product actually works in the human body. You have gone to great lengths to provide people with a way to produce their own. So come clean. Let go of your silly argument that the research is not there. It's there, just not in the way you want to see it, and that's the point you're using to try to dissuade people from Mannatech. Things do not have to go your way, and they won't. You are not God, it is not compulsory for research to be done your way in order for a product to be effective for many people, and you should be ashamed of yourself for purposely attempting to get under people's skin and for trying to defame a company which produces a product that you undoubtedly know produces a product that works. I say that you undoubtedly know the product works because if it did not, you would not be recommending to people to make their own, you would not be passing on a recipe for 'the exact same thing' and you would not be telling people the names of the companies to buy the ingredients from as well.

I don't appreciate your arguments because of the chip on your shoulder. Get rid of it. Drop your immature bit about 'insufficient research'. You must be real unhappy and miserable with life. That's the message you put across. It's disappointing that it's sold only through MLM, but it makes a happier life to leave well enough alone rather than go to all the effort of spreading a bad word. You must be tired from all your arguing.

Sick'n'tired of being sick and tired?
newbielink:http://www.mannapages.com/candyk [nonactive]

[Eric]

Ok, I'll bite. :-)

Is the human body really capable of breaking down plant polysacharides, restructure them into small sugars, and use that to create the glycoproteins found on cell surfaces?

Or is it only possible to create glycoproteins by ingesting monosacharides?

[loweduane]

For Eric.

No.  These substances are not broken down by your body into the monosaccharides.  A small amount may be liberated by certain microorganisms, but the amount would be so small as to be virtually insignificant.  

You could take the monosaccharides, most of them are available via the internet, but you would find that the results would not be the same as the ingredients in these supplements.  This is because they don't work by forming glycoproteins. That is marketing hype by Mannatech.

Do they have some health benefit?  Yes.  

There is research on the individual substances that show their benefit is because of other mechanisms, such as stimulating immune function via receptors inside the intestine, and increasing production of short-chain fatty acids by bacteria in your intestine, and prohibiting growth of yeasts and opportunistic microorganisms in the large intestine, as well as other mechanisms.  There is research on the individual substances which show health benefits, but nothing I have read in the hundreds of articles/abstracts that I have read suggest that any benefit is because of absorbing any individual sugars other than possibly glucosamine (which is well known use for arthritis).

Smilz you seem a little uptight.  You need to relax more.

Yes, these substances can have health benefits for some people, including stimulating the immune system, and there is a lot of research on the individual substances that explains how this happens.

I have a problem with Mannatech promoting a fairy-tale hypothesis about absorbing 8 sugars, and trying to support it with research articles that have nothing to do with their product, while they ignore the research that shows the actual mechanisms.

I am glad that Mannatech has put together a supplement that can help a lot of people, but anytime someone sells something to help people for 1000% mark-up, I find that ridiculous.  Especially since you can buy the same ingredients from the same companies that they buy them from.  

Have I recommended Ambrotose?  Yes.  For some who just want to initially find out if it can help them, but don't want to take the time and effort to put together the ingredients separately, I have suggested that they try one container of Ambrotose.  If it works, and they are going to take it for a longer time, then they will be more motivated to put together the ingredients for themselves.

48% Arabinogalactan (ImmunEnhancerAG made by Larex)
12% rice starch (filler that makes it dissolve in water better)
10% of each of the other ingredients.

The Curezone.com forum has listed many places to get the various ingredients for great prices.

When someone posts information to this forum that states information as if it is fact, I try to point out where the the science ends, and the marketing material begins.

Yes Ambrotose can help some people.
No, I think Mannatech is a mercenary company whose prices rape the public.
Kitty Cat and I actually get along quite well, though we disagree on some things.
And yes, I have an attitude.  But at least my attitude is based on knowledge, and not on ignorance and dogma, and is many Mannatech Associates.
No, Mannatech Associates don't like me, but non-associates seem to love me, and constantly ask for more information.

Good luck.
Duane

[smilzandchuklz]

Duane, I would prefer that you don't display your attitude at all, if you can't make it positive for everyone, no matter how much you hate the company. Some of your comments make it unenjoyable for people who are trying to understand how the glyconutrients work because they have to filter out the attitudes, pokes and judgements. You're actually distracting people from your own points. You obviously would like to see MT go under and cease to exist, but if weren't for MT, the many people who have started searching on the internet for info on this topic would never have come across this forum, and ultimately, would never have come across your illegal recipe. By the way, I would also rather pay a company for a product with absolute correct portions of product especially when you're putting in active ingredients rather than doctor up my own. What if some people mistakenly add incorrect portions? What if their ingredients have sat on the shelf so long they are no longer active? Who's to blame? What might happen? (I thought of this when I considered making my own.)

I personally would never have known about these sugars, and that these particular 8 are commonly found in the sugar chains of glycoproteins, which in turn, are absolutely essential for proper cellular communication, if it weren't for a Mannatech Associate. If she hadn't have known about it, I would still be exhausted, and my son would still be frequently ill I'm sure.

I find it hard to believe your comment that the research has nothing to do with the product. I don't mean to sound interrogative, but I'd like to cull your brain a bit. Answer me this: have you read up on the history behind how glycobiology came to be, and have you read up on how MT came up with the product? Have you read the studies that brought the doctors and scientists together which confirmed their own findings, and the article in Harper's Biochemistry 24th Edit (1996) by Dr.R.K. Murray that confirmed these doctor's findings? The author of the article in Harper's Bio that I quote here noted specifically that the 8 sugars: Glucose, Galactose, Fucose, Mannose, Xylose, N-acetylglucosamine, N-acetlgalactosamine and N-acetylneuraminic acid are commonly found in the sugar chains of glycoproteins.

Are you aware that drug companies now are finding ways to incorporate glycobiology into the manufacture of their drugs? The reason why is because they are well aware that cellular communication is key to efficacy of their drugs. (Cha Ching!) I'd rather be giving my money to a company that produces a preventative product rather than let sickness catch up with me and end up paying who knows how much for a toxic drug to be more readily absorbed by my body.

Please quote the studies that you mention. I want to read them if I haven't already. I'd like to get a grasp on where the heck it is that you're coming from. I think you really misunderstand glycobiology and glycosylation, from what I've read of your posts.

For those of you trying to understand how/where the 8 sugars are being 'absorbed':

Glycosylation is a metabolic process by which the saccharides (the aforementioned sugars) are chemically attached to the various substrates such as proteins or lipids. These may be surface molecules or specific enzymes, for example. (copied from The Healing Power of 8 Sugars, compiled by A.C. Somersall, Ph.D., M.D.  

The point of the 8 in one product: as quoted from The Healing Power of 8 Sugars: "Almost all plasma proteins in human - except albumin - contain sugars. All cellular membranes have proteins containing sugars. A number of blood group markers are proteins with sugars. Some hormones (such as that used for confirming the pregnancy tests) are proteins with sugars. The sugar chains contain many different linkage possibilities giving rise to a code of biologic information...Then, if the addition of the vitally necessary sugars makes these precursors more readily available to the cells for inclusion in glycoprotein synthesis - that could readily explain why 'sugars' as nutrients (glyco-nutrients) could be so effective when used in supplement form. All evidence to date seems to concur" (The book is first printed and copyrighted 2005).

Sick'n'tired of being sick and tired?
newbielink:http://www.mannapages.com/candyk [nonactive]

[smilzandchuklz]

Oh, and another important fact about the 8 sugars in Ambrotose:

5 of them are found in breast milk.

Does this help anyone who is interested in the 8 sugars?

[Kittycat]

Hi Smilz,

I enjoyed your reference to drug companies developing drugs with the carbohydrates. Here is a good site. Maybe if they didn't put so much money into their site the drugs wouldn't be so expensive. Just a thought.
http://www.pro-pharmaceuticals.com/aboutus-video1.htm
Thanks for your involvement in this forum, KC

His grace is sufficient and His strength is made perfect in my weakness

[Eric]

quote:Originally posted by smilzandchuklz

Oh, and another important fact about the 8 sugars in Ambrotose:

5 of them are found in breast milk.

Does this help anyone who is interested in the 8 sugars?

It only helps if you're willing to sell some breastmilk. :-)

[loweduane]

Smilz

I don't post for MT Associates.

I don't stop posting for MT Associates either.

You continue to spout the MT marketing line, and you have no idea what you are talking about or you would know that glycobiolgy and "glyconutrients" as marketed by MT are two completely different things.  If you can't find the references I have talked about in PUBMED, then I highly doubt that you have the vocabulary and scientific background necessary to read the actual articles.

I will continue to post when incorrect material is listed here to market the products.  And those looking for an "objective" evaluation of these substances will continue to thank me for it.

Have a great day, I am.

Duane

[smilzandchuklz]

For those who are researching glyconutrients, and their effectiveness:

Glycobiology and Glycoscience both refer to the new emerging science which seeks to understand the chemistry, biochemistry and physiology of glyconutriens and glyconjugates, and their applications to health and disease.

Glyconutrients are a food supplement, and do not treat, mitigate, or cure any disease. Glyconutrients refer specifically to the eight monosacharides (sugars) commonly found in glycoproteins and glycolipids. They are nutrients inasmuch as they can be supplied exogenously in dietary foods or food supplements. They are absorbed efficiently in the body.

The 8 monosaccharides are:
Glucose
Galactose
Fucose
Mannose
Xylose
N-acetylglucosamine
N-acetylgalactosamine
N-acetylneuraminic acid

Some papers/articles on glyconutrients and the Immune System:

R. K. Murray, "Glycoproteins" Harper's Biochemistry 24th edit.

Adachi K, Nanbo H, Kuroda H, Kuroda H, "Potentiation of host mediated antitumor activity in mice by Beta-glucan obtained from Grifola frondosa (Maitake)." Chem Pharm Bull, 1987

Kossi J, et al., "Effects of hexose sugars: glucose, fructose, galactose, and mannose on wound healing in the rat" Eur Surg Res. 1999

Dwek RA, Lellouch AC, Wormald MR, "Glycobiology: the function of sugar in the IgG molecule" J.Anat. 1995:187

Sathyamoorthy N, et al., "Evidence that specific high mannose structures directly regulate multiple cellular activities" Mol Cell Biochem. 1991

Campbell B, Busbee D, McDaniel H. "Enhancement of immune function in rodents using a proprietary complex mixture of glyconutritionals" Proc Fisher Inst. Med Res. 1997

Carbohydrates and Biology. Science Magazine 2001

Feizi T. 1989 Carbohydrate recognition in cellular function. Ciba Foundation Symposium, vol. 145 Wiley, New York

Fukuda M., ed. 1992. Cell surface carbohydrates and cell development CRC Press, Boca Raton, Fl

Presentation - 3rd Annual Conference, New Initiatives in the Prevention and Intervention of FAS/FAE for Aboriginal People of Canada, May 2003, Vanc, BC, Available as a technical syllabus from the Fish. Instit.

Sick'n'tired of being sick and tired?
newbielink:http://www.mannapages.com/candyk [nonactive]

[loweduane]

For those looking here for an objective perspective: (I don't work for any company selling these substances)

Yes, the 8 individual sugars are absorbed.  

However, the ingredients in Mannatech's products are not the individual sugars.  But undigestible chains of sugar (dietary fiber).  

Research continues to show that the beneficial effect of these supplements is not related to the absorption of the individual sugars (except maybe glucosamine - for arthritis), and most of them are metabolized into short chain fatty acids by bacteria in your large intestine.  And there is no current evidence that they increase the production of even one glycoprotein.

This is not to say they don't work, they just don't work the way Mannatech says they do.  There is an abundance of research that shows the actual mechanims at work when you evaluate the actual ingredients in the supplement (Arabinogalactan, Acemannan, Gums, etc.)  

They don't cure everything, contrary to the belief and claims of Associates, but they can have some significant impact on various conditions, and are worth a try.  

The curezone.com forum has a lot of posts where you can buy the actual ingredients separately for much cheaper than Mannatech, or you can try the alternate recipe by Dr. Bird, which many people have great effects from becaused of the other beneficial nutrients that it contains as well.  One person there posted his resources and got the recipe down to about $5.00 per 100gm.  Now that is a savings.

Feel free to contact the chemistry department of your local college/university and ask for a person who specializes in this area of "glycobiology" or "glycochemistry" who are not associated with Mannatech, and they will verify what I have said about the digestibility of these substances.

Duane

[Glycogeek]

Hey Duane,
Good to see you in this forum.

Smilz brought up one of the concerns I have about homemade glycos. Especially for people who have serious health problems.

Hey we are doing the same thing. I help people with the products too. I help them get them for free and pass on my bonuses etc to them. No commission made here either. I do like the idea of dealing with a respectable company knowing that their products are standardized and that they use top notch ingredients.
What's your opinion? Thanks in advance, Geek

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by smilzandchuklz</i>

Duane, I would prefer that you don't display your attitude at all, if you can't make it positive for everyone, no matter how much you hate the company. Some of your comments make it unenjoyable for people who are trying to understand how the glyconutrients work because they have to filter out the attitudes, pokes and judgements. You're actually distracting people from your own points. You obviously would like to see MT go under and cease to exist, but if weren't for MT, the many people who have started searching on the internet for info on this topic would never have come across this forum, and ultimately, would never have come across your illegal recipe. By the way, I would also rather pay a company for a product with absolute correct portions of product especially when you're putting in active ingredients rather than doctor up my own. What if some people mistakenly add incorrect portions? What if their ingredients have sat on the shelf so long they are no longer active? Who's to blame? What might happen? (I thought of this when I considered making my own.)<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">