[Airthumbs]

I am in no doubt that Air Traffic controllers adopt a technique for routing aircraft that creates, what appear to be criss cross chequer like patterns of jet exhaust in the sky.  This is most likely a result of safety issues with aircraft vicinity and speed relative to each other.  Unfortunately this does also, climatic conditions permitting, create visible, long, thin artificial clouds in the sky above. These clouds have an albedo effect and reflect more of the suns radiation back into space cooling the ground below. 
There are something like 18 million commercial airline flights every year, these figures exclude military and private! So you could say that for the past 50yrs or so we have been engineering the climate by creating artificial clouds.
As per your conspiracy theory concerning chem trails, well they are chemical trails, they do contain lots of chemicals, in fact, most of them pretty nasty ones which drift slowly down and pollute your lungs and the environment.  It's worse then you thought, those chem trails are killing you slowly, don't worry though it will be your turn soon and when you get that flight next month you can get your revenge on the folk below.....

[Woman Made Scientist (OP)]

See Carnicom Institute for evidence. No intellectual could ever believe your description of criss cross, etc... when evidence of weather modification is  right on top of your head.

[imatfaal]

The Carnicom Institute is not a disinterested party promoting independent research it is a website dedicated to promulgating a set of ideas.  Do you have any evidence that is peer-reviewed or even presented by scientists who are not already affiliated to the institute?  Most of the 'papers' I sampled on the institute's site are written by amateurs or academics who specialize in vastly different areas.  I will reiterate Ben's question - do you have any scientific evidence?

[Woman Made Scientist (OP)]

What is your back round to state this bizarre statement? Carnicom was a government scientist and is a full fledged scientist. He has nothing to acheive financially.This has been proven for a very long time with hard evidence, by many influential scientists. There is nothing to prove as it sits proven for a long time. If you are trying to tear up the proof it is impossible. The truth will always stand.

[imatfaal]

My background is immaterial to the question - however the background of those making outlandish claims is more important. 

Here is a link to Google Scholar on Clifford E Carnicom 6 hits none academic papers. I realise there are better scientific paper search engines - but this one is easily accessible. If it has missed any academic papers please post links.

At present the case does not rest as proven - and no proof has been given to be torn up. 

[frethack]

I realise there are better scientific paper search engines - but this one is easily accessible. If it has missed any academic papers please post links.

At present the case does not rest as proven - and no proof has been given to be torn up. 

No worries imatfaal, I checked on Web of Science, which IS a comprehensive search engine (google scholar is still very good) and still no hits on C. E. Carnicom.  Nada...zilch...nothing.

Chemtrails are likely just contrails, made more visible by increases in atmospheric water vapor due to warming.  Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

[Woman Made Scientist (OP)]

Your back round is important. Google Carnicom Institute, scientific evidence is all there. Who knows, you might be one of the people doing weather modication to his or her own way. Obviously you are afraid of people knowing to the point of hiding who you are and trying to tear up truths about clear cut evidence that is truthfully obvious.

[imatfaal]

Oh you misunderstand W-M-S - I have googled Carnicom, and I have spent an instructive time looking through various parts of the site, and I have yet to see any proof.  I did not see anything that I would categorise as a scientific paper.

I post under a user-name because I am a director of public company and I do not want anyone to link my views as expressed in an off-the-cuff manner on the internet with those views of the company, my fellow directors, and the shareholders.  

And we have still to see a single link to a single independent academic paper/article/letter.

[CliffordK]

See Carnicom Institute for evidence. No intellectual could ever believe your description of criss cross, etc... when evidence of weather modification is  right on top of your head.

There is the spacing issue of jet aircraft.
As well as the drift of the clouds.  So, if two airplanes took the exact same course 10 minutes separated, the jet trails will drift, and not overlap.

What a conspiracy theory.
A top secret plan to make visible clouds.
And not tell anybody about it.

The Jet Trails are just that.  Primarily condensation of water vapor in the exhaust.  And, certainly we've had them in the sky for my entire life.  Nothing new there.  

Certainly any cloud seeding (getting rid of clouds) would be on a very small scale such as the Russian plan to reduce snow in Moscow, or the Chinese plan to have clear weather for the Beijing Olympics.

[Woman Made Scientist (OP)]

Well it does not take a genius to see who is covering constantly the truth and trying to make it into some thing that it is the opposite of. You boys are clearly involved.

[yor_on]

Please stop this nonsense, archiveX have a higher entertainment value than this. Seeding clouds to make rain is a thing some countries have tried, finding it a not especially trustworthy technique if I remember right. I think Russia tried it once, don't remember why, maybe in connection to the Chernobyl accident? To fell out particles from the air??

Anyway, as I remember it's not very trustworthy even though those using it constantly will defend it, naturally We humans work from dough, and there is quite some dough involved for those promoting this kind of ideas. Geoengineering from a global perspective doesn't exist. From a Jules Verne perspective I would love to see it though although I shudder for the consequences. This world is an incredibly fine tuned instrument, constantly interacting and feeding on its own interactions, creating a balanced non-linearity that actually keeps us alive. Then we come, newly down from the trees thinking we 'know it all', not unlike all adolescents.

We can't Geoengineer, not on any scale that matters, unless we're talking food, exploiting and refining resources. But that we do at the same instinctive level as bacteria seem do take care of itself. It's called survival, and also 'greed' when it comes to humans. We can't even live in peace in our own homes, can we? Take a look at the small arm wars around you. And you expect us to have the power, and consensus, to change a earth??

America may be the cradle of modern hard SF, but that's it, Geoengineering as a consensual way do not exist yet, and if we ever comes to it I doubt we would throw into it without very good reasons, and, it would need a consensus from all nations existing, at least the majority of them. Nobody owns this world, we're just transients in Earth's history. Maybe we will find a way to stay longer than the geological upheavals we can see historically depicted, but if they are right this world will in some hundred thousand years make a clean house, again, and start anew.

Simply expressed. We're not the crown of existence, never was, never will be. But we have curiosity, and history, and some of us try to learn from it.

Give me a break, will'ya.

[daveman]

I'm not sure what your goal is WMS, you sound really upset!

But you just can't control everything by simply STOPPING it.

If that startegy had been used, from the begining with everything, we'd maybe live to median age of 30 yrs old.

Medicine, modifies nature. If I didn't have blood pressure meds I'd be dead by now. If we had stopped the use of medicine, surgery, materials developement, technology and science because it disrupts the natureal flow of nature, we'd be in a horrendous state.

I'm no scientist, and know very little of weather systems, for all I know, we're doing a terrible job.... but that's not the reason to condemn it. There may well be good potential if we are allowed to learn from our mistakes and develop a technology that extends and betters the life of millions.

Now would be the time to develop, while there are still many more aircraft con-trails than chem trails in the air.

If you want to help, work at bettering the system, in a scientific way, not tearing it down....

Much more can be done "working WITH the system".

I don't think we're here for tearing things down!

[Geezer]

I think the Carnicom Institute has received more than enough free publicity from this thread. As WMS has presented no credible evidence to support the claims, I'm locking the thread.