[teknix]

To get it on a more scientific track, we should consider the calcification of flouride in the pineal gland. This really will hinder your flow, and everyone is susceptible to this. Flouride from toothpaste and even water can accumulate and form crystals in your brain, even more of it accumulates in the pineal gland than in your teeth or anywhere else. There are tons of articles on this and a simple search on google would yield numerous results.

Here is a good one:

http://www.fluoridealert.org/fluoride-dangers/health/pineal/index.aspx [nofollow]

There are many all natural ways to aid in decalfication, but you should be aware that there is 2 processes involved. 1 to break it up, which natural kelp (natural iodide) will work, and 2 to carry it out which chlorella will work. There are also all natural metal detox.  This is not medical advice, and I suggest you do research on your own before deciding what is right for you or to contact a physician.

I personally think physician's are over-rated this day and age with the vastness of the known universe at your fingertips.

I would also wager that reducing the flouride intake in the 1st place, by using unflouridated water and toothe-paste would yield similar long term results.

[teknix]

I'm glad everyone is getting so much from this thread - not to pour cold water on anything, but this is a science forum, so please could we refrain from discussing non-scientific topics?

Are you claiming this anomaly that we all experience is beyond science? (rhetorical question)

This is just the surface of this all too real subjective science.

[teknix]

For those guys who claim to have felt this before puberty I would like to ask if you can be certain? I am under the impression the the celiac plexus which developes at puberty is also a key componet.

[BenV]

Are you claiming this anomoly that we all experience is beyond science? This is just the surface of this all too real subjective science.

Not at all.  I'm just keen that we stick to scientific discussions of it's cause.  A bit like the earlier reminder from Peppercorn (which I confess, I hadn't noticed until now!)

[teknix]

If you want that objective reproducibility, you can read about it after I recieve the Nobel Prize.



I have been looking for an objective scientific explanation for over 10 years, to no avail. The closest things I have found is in Eastern Medecine. which was afore mentioned. Do you have anything to add other than adding that you don't like what is being added?

[teknix]

You do realize that there will have to be a machine devised to measure this current to produce these results right?

[LimboDog]

I too am able to create goosebumps at will. I believe that what we are all experiencing is some sort of control over endorphin release. I can create goosebumps whenever I want and it makes my brain feel a little swollen if I do it a lot. I find that I can create these goosebumps particularly well when listening to music or when imagining myself as being ruler of the universe or dominating someone in a fight. When lifting weights I also can do this and it helps me lift more, which is part of the reason I believe it to be related to endorphins, the bodys natural painkiller. That would explain pushing through the pain of pushing oneself to the limit a little bit further.

I am also able to see through any prescription lens for whatever reason. I can focus my eyes through anyones glasses and it has always confused people when I show them.

I think all of this may be related to neurological sensitivity allowing for further investigation by those possessing it. This is called HSP. Highly Sensitive Persons are not very uncommon. About one in five.

Here are some wikipedia quotes you may find interesting:

"A highly sensitive person (HSP) is a person having the innate trait of high psychological sensitivity (or innate sensitiveness as Carl Jung originally coined it). According to Elaine N. Aron and colleagues as well as other researchers, highly sensitive people, who comprise about a fifth of the population, may process sensory data much more deeply and thoroughly due to a biological difference in their nervous systems.[1]

This is a specific trait with key consequences that in the past has often been confused with innate shyness, social anxiety problems, inhibitedness, or even social phobia and innate fearfulness, introversion, and so on.[2] The existence of the trait of innate sensitivity was demonstrated using a test that was shown to have both internal and external validity.[3] Although the term is primarily used to describe humans, the trait is present in nearly all higher animals."

"The research on sensory-processing sensitivity, however, builds on Eysenck's views on introversion and arousal and Gray's work on the inhibition system. This research in turn builds on Pavlov's work on sensory response to both physical and mental over-stimulation, and work by Jung and his contemporaries differentiating extroverted and introverted cognitive sensitivity types.[9] This research shows that about 15-20% of humans and higher animals have a nervous system that is more sensitive to subtleties. This means that regular sensory information is processed and analyzed to a greater extent, which contributes to creativity, intuition, sensing implications and attention to detail, but which may also cause quick over-stimulation and over-arousal.[5]"

"This temperament may also have some correlation with continuously high cortisol levels, which may cause hypervigilance and susceptibility to trauma, or the same traumas may encourage hypervigilance, which in turn may contribute to high cortisol. Being highly sensitive may amplify or create psychological issues when over-arousal occurs. The ability to unconsciously or semi-consciously process environmental subtleties often contributes to an HSP seeming "gifted" or possessing a "sixth sense". Sensitivity is often confused with shyness, but 30% of HSPs have extroverted personalities. Another common misconception is that only females can be HSPs; there are roughly the same number of male HSPs as female. The percentage appears to hold true for all animals possessing this trait.[3][5]"

Here is a link to the article newbielink:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highly_sensitive_person [nonactive]

I'm willing to bet we were as children and still are highly sensitive individuals and are thus able to take greater control over subtleties in the nervous system.

[teknix]

Thanks for the Post Limbodog.

I had 1st found it after Kundalini Awakening. I really doubt it is particular to ones gene make-up as much as it is to due life experiences as well.

Seriously, it is the third eye that allows you to do this.

You can regulate temperature with the celiac plexus as well, this is all a part of Internal Alchemy. Simply moving awareness, it is not fixed to the eyeballs like some would think and get stuck.

Furthermore, there is already a sixth sense and it is that of feeling. Which if you ever manage to put awareness to the center of the chest you will feel the prominent feeling of love (with a bit of work) , just as easily as you make the chills.

[peppercorn]

I, like BenV earlier, have also just noticed that we have been here several times before. 

To those straying from standard medical knowledge on this thread:
a) Please, please Read the site's Acceptable Usage Policy.
b) Be aware that continued infringement can, and almost certainly will, lead to a ban.

Also, please note: Although it may appear petty at times, we do encourage these behaviours for the purpose of an enjoyable and informative site for all.

[teknix]

That's all fine, but your grounds are unfounded, I have already said that third eye = pineal gland. It has been defined in a scientific term, you are arguing semantics.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate you adding to my post, if you want to make a complaint to me then make a seperate post or message me. Common courtesy.

As far as these being beliefs, you are wrong, these are experiences. Until you test this hypothesis you won't know. Even after the experience passes you still won't know that experience objectively, as it will be subjected to interpretation of the mind once upon interpretation and twice upon articulation.

The same way an observer effects a wavicle, an observer effects experience. It is the experience that should be the focus of this study, if you call it that. If someone does pinpoint what this energy that we feel is, than I will be first to retract my statements, until then your grounds are unfounded and just as much speculation as anything else.

I am simply asking those here to test this hypothesis and find if it is true for themselves, as that is the only truth that can be manifested, which is subjective. When we get these subjective experiences to correlate to one another we will be even closer to the truth.

I know you guys like your objective truth, but do not over-look the subjective truth as well. There are 2 sides (atleast) to this coin.

The only way to really prove any of what I say is to try it, it is not going to bring the proof of the physiology, but it will bring proof of the process.

[peppercorn]

Furthermore, I don't appreciate you adding to my post, if you want to make a complaint to me then make a seperate post or message me. Common courtesy.

And, as I explained in the addition to your post (in a nice friendly green to differentiate it), I included those words in public view to inform the wider reader (actually mentioning why I didn't simply PM).  Unfortunately, now you've seen fit to removed them, the point is lost.
I'll hope you'll also note, for future situations, that you had shown previous 'form' for making unsubstantiated medical claims. So if I was too quick in jumping the gun this time, I apologise. - The purpose was to inform both casual readers as well as those with a longterm interest; now part of that information is gone, which is a shame.


BTW, what exactly, in your opinion, is "subjective science"?

[teknix]

Self-evident truth.

[Froggy618157725]

I'm able to do this as an acquired skill. I picked it up after focusing on the sensation when it happened. I gained the ability to create the sensation of a shiver traveling down your spine, and eventually found I could essentially move the sensation throughout my body at will, and did not suspect it had any physical meaning until I noticed my hair standing on end roughly where I focused the sensation. I can, for instance, raise the hair on only one arm. Creating the sensation is trivial to me, however, causing goosebumps to rise is a little bit harder, and I can't get it 100% of the time. Often when I don't, the skin where I'm focusing the sensation gets blotchy, which makes me suspect I've consciously taken hold of part of the autonomic nervous system, since that's responsible for both goosebumps and constricting blood vessels.

I've noticed a number of uses for this. First of all, it allows me to ignore the temperature a bit. If a room is uncomfortably warm, it makes me feel a bit cooler, likely because I associate it with a response to it being cold. It also seems to act as a refresh for my senses. If I focus the sensation somewhere where I'm experiencing a dull pain, I feel a sharp pain at the source. Afterwards, the pain spreads and dullens again. I can also use it to alleviate pains that don't seem to have causes, or induce minor pain in a specific region. I can manipulate headaches, often simply stopping them, if not just changing where I feel like the headache is. It also temporarily heightens my awareness. From this, I've learned how to trigger the 'second wind' phenomenon at will when I'm pulling an all-nighter. It is, however, a hairline trigger, and a one-shot. It's difficult for me to think about it late at night without accidentally triggering it.

On a slightly less useful note, I can do things with it that just increase quality of life, like causing the sensation to move through my body in time to music, or activating it during particularly emotional parts of a movie or something. My experience is pretty much the same as the guy here on newbielink:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Goose_bumps#Significance_of_voluntary_goose_bumps [nonactive]

[sascad]

I've been able to do all this also. Even on the hottest humid day I can create goosebumps at will. Make myself stronger. Make my vision clearer. Make my hearing sharp. Use it to adapt to physical strategy games. We are able to control the the hypothalamus. The control of hormones entering the blood stream. It makes us stronger, faster, think quicker, sensitivity to radio waves, sound and light and heal faster. It's the control of the "fight or flight" response.

[gbc89]

Because of the fight or flight response we control I believe we can train longer than others so it's easier to get stronger.
At least, if you have the determination to go at you limit and beyond to push even when you're at your limit.
If I go beyond my limit I get uncontrollable (not stopable) strong goosebumps as long as I hold on going at it.

[mauser]

Interesting thread, not exactly the same, but I posted a thread in new theories about being able to cause pain or damage to parts of the body, possibly by manipulating blood flow or releasing chemicals (possibly adrenalin) as a form of self harm. I've now realised it tends to mainly happen when at rest when the mind is wandering.

newbielink:http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=41173.0 [nonactive]

[rocketman]

Wow, glad to see I'm not the only one that can do this.
Searching the web got me here, but still no closer to finding a definitive answer for the how and the why.

Here's something interesting.
When I was a kid, one of my friends had this toy "lie detector" game and it came with a device that you clipped to your fingers and it would beep (supposedly) if you told a lie. I don't think it monitored your pulse, but your skin conductivity. -At any rate, I was quickly able to amuse my friends by causing the lie detector to beep on demand. Basically, I'd induce a "surge" or "tingle" and the machine would beep in response.

Later, as a young man, I applied for a job at a large chain pharmacy and part of the hiring process was taking a polygraph. Now, I had completely forgotten about that old lie detector game from years ago, but when the technician started hooking me up to the polygraph, including clipping sensors to my fingers, I recalled the old game and started doing surges during the questions "Have you ever stolen from an employer?", "Do you take illegal narcotics?" etc., just to see what would happen.

After about two minutes, the tech stops, looks right at me and says "Stop. Doing. That." –(in sort of the same tone as a parent would say to their kid caught picking his nose.)

Suddenly chastised, I stopped the "tingles" and "surging" and completed the polygraph interview. -I never thought to ask the tech how he knew I was doing anything, but it was obvious from his reaction that, not only was it measurable, but he knew I was consciously causing it.

I can only assume from his line of work, that he'd encountered a few people who could do it before.

I’ll bookmark this thread so I can come back and check it from time to time, to see if any new info comes up.

-TB Rocket

[ablestmage]

I've been looking for others who can do this, and it appears that search has met with success. 

I started getting them in response to music since about age 13, when a particular passage we played in band would always give me chills, but none of the rest of the tune would. Over the years I've discovered other forms of music that help it along, but later came to the conclusion that I could duplicate the physiological process that occurred whenever I heard those passages and get goosebumps without any music at all, purely from wanting to and making it happen.

I've gotten it down to a couple of mental visual cues that set them off easily, and can get them in isolated regions, mostly mirrored in both sides (left and right) and rarely in either right or left alone.  However, I've noticed at least five stages of intensity.

The first stage is the attempt to get them started, a little like running your finger over the surface of a roll of sticky tape seeking for the edge to pull up.

The second stage is erratic, with random patches of chills firing off here and there, as if I know I'm close to making them pop out firmly is within grasp, a little like an engine choking and sputtering when trying to start.

The third stage is when goosebumps are achieved, and may last only for a few seconds if you get distracted or lose grasp on focus for keeping them going somehow.

The fourth stage is the laughing/crying stage where they become so intense that you either start to giggle about how cool it is, or begin to make tears in amazement of how profound it is to have lasted this long.. perhaps 10-30 seconds.  If you can make it through this stage WITHOUT giggling or crying, which will distract you, you can make it to stage five.

The fifth stage I have only hit twice in my life, and perhaps a year plus between. At this stage you are not even focused on maintaining them, but are slipping into a surreal, trippy experience where your existence is the embodiment of a single concept, like you are in tune with the universe and you are the broadcast signal to the universe and each heartbeat is a pulsating transmission of that signal. My good qualities and bad qualities form a coherent one-ness of identity, and every hair everywhere is positively on it's fullest outward stretch and with a feeling of glowing, raw energy. 

If there's a sixth stage I've never hit it, but I'd like to find out someday =)

I might note, however, that I've got a nerve disorder also, Essential Tremor, with the possibility of early-onset Parkinsons (at age 34, male, from Texas). I have long wondered if the ability and the disorder is connected. I've never done drugs not prescribed to me except over-the-counter meds for normal reasons. I've had nitrous oxide at the dentist (with trippy, hyper-philosophical results), but only in controlled amounts as warranted by dental activities. I don't drink alcohol, and have even been without caffeine for over a year.

My attempts at evoking them have little to do with religion or spiritualism or mind-body energy and all that, but mostly with visualizing complex spatial problems.  The one that works best for me so far is this -- and any parallel to some mind-energy concept by some asian whatever is purely coincidence:

(1) Imagine a traditional-looking rudder wheel like you'd find on a pirate ship that the steering person would use to turn the rudder with, except without the knobs around the edge. Whether it has finer details like wood may not really matter. The wheel isn't attached to anything yet and is freely floating in the air, with no background, just floating in an imagined space.  Imagine the wheel starts spinning in one direction slowly, gradually building up in speed, faster, faster, faster still, faster, faster, and then as fast as you think you could possibly imagine in spinning. 

(2) Next, imagine that another wheel proportionally larger than the first wheel emerges behind it, and slowly begins rotating, as if the fastest speed the first smaller wheel is the proper gear ratio to begin to turn the next wheel in series.  Imagine the larger wheel spinning gradually faster and faster just as the first wheel did, but that the speed at which the smaller wheel was turning to get the larger one started, is proportional/multiplied by the speed at which the larger wheel is turning, to the point where the larger wheel is now spinning at the speed the first wheel had been in order to get the larger one started, and by now the smaller wheel is practically invisible it is spinning so fast.

(3) There is now a third, largest wheel behind these two that acts in a manner reflective of the relationship between the smallest and next largest, that begins turning slowly, gaining speed, and spinning as fast as you can imagine, all the while the gear ratio/multiplication being transferred to the speed the other two are spinning, at a blinding speed on the middle, and a completely incomprehensible speed for the first one.  If I can manage to keep all three wheels in focus, then I've probably hit stage five by then, but it takes a lot of focus to concentrate on only that single idea of the wheels and not be distracted by anything else.

I can be contacted at ablestmage@gmail.com, if anyone would like to compare notes. I'd like to start a Facebook group or small site dedicated to the idea of creating goosebumps on purpose..

[teknix]

None of you guys feel it in your face at all? I feel it come from the crown and travel through my head as well.

See if you can send it to your right palm and make it heat up.

Sounds like ablemage is taking about something similar to the Merkabah.

[gbc89]

All of you might find this interesting:
http://biologyofkundalini.com/article.php?story=ExhaustionPhase [nofollow]

I can feel it in my face, it's also a bit visible.