Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2900 on: 16/01/2009 07:33:39 »

[POIS'] existence causes fear, anticipatory fear. [Emphasis by Demo]


Underwater, this is an excellent point! When we assess the damage of POIS, we don't give ourselves enough credit for persevering through the dark cloud of non-POIS time spent - even if only subconsciously - but it's still there - in dreaded anticipation of "the (inevitable) next round" of POIS.

It's constantly hanging over our heads, the Sword of Damocles!
« Last Edit: 16/01/2009 08:01:32 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2901 on: 16/01/2009 07:52:06 »
FORUM SITE VIEWS

If my math is right, since yesterday it looks like we have about 1,400 site views per day here! Lots of (welcome) POIS-lurkers [:)]

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2902 on: 16/01/2009 14:35:41 »
wow!

B_Jim, it's because of your science! [:)]

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2903 on: 16/01/2009 14:59:37 »
POIS DIARY

Day 2 of Testosterone patches and, interestingly, it feels like they are speeding up this nasty POIS' winding down (Day 6). But it could be a placebo effect. The months ahead will tell.

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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2904 on: 16/01/2009 17:10:44 »
Spent 2 hours this morning in meditation. Revised percentages slightly.
                         
                    Total % loss
1) openness to dating    2% loss
2) dating                     5% loss
3) arousal behavior      10% loss
4) genital contact         20%loss
5) orgasmic sexuality   95% loss

For two days my partner and I have rolled back the Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome activating activity from stage 4) genital contact, to stage 2) dating only. Not at all surprisingly the pre orgasmic losses (loss of personality) have decreased four fold , as the numbers indicated they would.

Two things are surprising...First, how irritable I feel. Not really that surprising considering the level of dopamine, I believe, is released in my brain with genital contact.

But the shocking thing is the time. It seems that there is an inversely proportional relationship to the profundity of the effect of POIS, at all levels, and the amount of time that the disease takes up in my life. For example, orgasm only takes seconds to transpire but causes 75% of the loss of my personality, whereas 'openness to dating' causes only 2% of personality loss and yet takes up an indeterminately, but hugely large amount of time.

I'm going to enjoy all that free time that being free of Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome gives me...just for today

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Offline OmBass

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2905 on: 16/01/2009 17:45:30 »
Hey again guys,
I just wanted to share my experience in overcoming POIS, as i thought it might be helpful for people.
It all comes down to the adrenals!!!! Trust me on this. And the adrenals are VERY overlooked by Western medicine. Your endocrinologist will tell you that they are fine, as mine did. Thats because they dont recognize them as being a problem at all, until they are completely failing. Western medicine actually provides a lot of disservice in that regard, and they dont get to the bottom of problems, they just pile pills on top which often just makes it worse. They overlook very key organs such as adrenals and liver. I dealt with adrenal and liver problems for many years, and overcame them through simple, home methods.I can tell you these things for sure:

AVOID ALL STIMULANTS!!! This includes coffee, sodas, etc.

AVOID AS MANY DRUGS AS POSSIBLE!! This just puts a heavy burden on your liver, and an overloaded liver can also play a role in energy, sexuality, etc.

GET 8+ HOURS SLEEP PER NIGHT! This is very important. No 4-5 hours a night stuff, no jolting yourself awake with 10 cups of coffee.

GO SEE A GOOD TCM DOCTOR / ACUPUNCTURIST!! To overcome this problem, you need to open your mind to alternative therapies, especially TCM (Traditional Chinese Medicine) as they recognize the adrenals, liver, etc and pay them the importance they should be given.

READ UP ON ADRENAL FATIGUE/EXHAUSTION! This is a major condition, very overlooked, and from my personal experience, its at the base of the POIS problem.

I know its hard to understand that it all comes down to this vital energy force, but it kinda does. Your energy supply is so depleted, that an ejaculation puts you into energetic backlog. During this energetic "low" you feel like sh1t. I have been there! You need to get your energy reserves up, and once you have a store there, you can ejaculate without feeling bad afterwards. I know a friend who suffered through the same exact problem, and overcame it through the same methods.

If you have any questions for me, feel free to email me at ombass (at) mac.com

Good luck to all!

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2906 on: 16/01/2009 18:29:27 »
OMBASS:

From where do you get your wealth of experience about POIS, specifically? Have you treated sufferers successfully? What are you selling?

TO ALL:

If anyone emails OmBass and gets a personal pitch selling something, please let me know! It is not allowed here and he will be banned. Thank you.
« Last Edit: 16/01/2009 18:51:34 by demografx »

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Offline girlwind

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2907 on: 16/01/2009 19:28:28 »
Hey again guys,
I just wanted to share my experience in overcoming POIS, as i thought it might be helpful for people.
It all comes down to the adrenals!!!! Trust me on this. And the adrenals are VERY overlooked by Western medicine. Your endocrinologist will tell you that they are fine, as mine did. Thats because they dont recognize them as being a problem at all, until they are completely failing. Western medicine actually provides a lot of disservice in that regard, and they dont get to the bottom of problems, they just pile pills on top which often just makes it worse. They overlook very key organs such as adrenals and liver.

We've already explored the issue of the adrenals here--as in the CORTISOL issue. And have recognized it as ONE
of the possible factors in creating POIS. It has definitely helped me to boost my adrenal energy/cortisol via use of
adaptogenic herbs and vitamin supplements for adrenals, as well as regular eating/sleeping habits--just recently
addressed here by C.P. However, there is more to the story of POIS than just adrenal dysfunction. We have an entire
frontier of hormonal and neurotransmitter issues to contend with in addition.

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Offline Counterpoints

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2908 on: 16/01/2009 21:27:48 »
Hi Ombass,

I believe cortisol is a factor in my post-orgasm symptoms.  However, your "vital energy" theory does not make sense in my case.  Sometimes orgasm can alleviate my symptoms! Besides, intense physical exertion does not cause these symptoms.

Also, I don't drink coffee (it makes me feel weird and actually does cause some POIS like symptoms), and I don't have soft drinks (it just doesn't appeal to me... I'd rather have water or milk, or tea).  And I get 8 hrs sleep a night.  I still get awful POIS symptoms though.  So that's not enough.  If cortisol is the key factor with me, then cortisol reducing supplements or medications might help. 

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Offline Counterpoints

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2909 on: 16/01/2009 21:37:09 »
Possible POIS source?

List of symptoms of Pheochromocytoma:

Symptoms vary greatly with each patient. Sterotyped textbook cases of Pheochromocytoma are rare. Symptoms can include:

    * Headaches
    * Nausea
    * Vomiting
    * Weight loss or gain
    * Hypertension
    * Hyperglycemia
    * Diabetes
    * Diabetes-like symptoms
    * Palpitations
    * Angina Chest Pain
    * Clammy skin Cold skin
    * Anxiety
    * Nervousness
    * Panic
    * Feeling of impending doom
    * Rapid pulse
    * Rapid breathing
    * Breathing difficulty
    * Vision disturbance
    * Impaired vision
    * Orthostatic hypotension
    * Fainting
    * Sweating
    * Flushing
    * Abdominal pain
    * Flank pain
    * Constipation
    * Paresthesia (tingling, prickling, numbness or burning sensations)

To read more, and to see about screening, see: http://www.pheochromocytoma.org/sys-tmpl/frequentquestions/

   

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2910 on: 16/01/2009 22:09:13 »
OMBASS---
Thanks for your contribution. Could you please elaborate a bit on your diet; any special foods to boost energy, strengthen adrenals? Any effective supplements?
Herbal Medicine (including TCM)? I would very much appreciate any specific recommendations that you know to be effective in your case. Thanks Again-------

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2911 on: 17/01/2009 00:00:23 »
Open Message To OmBass:   (also sent to his email)

After our email exchange, I feel that you do seem sincere.

We have had other new forum members here, banned for their sales pitch, claiming a "cure" on their very first post, so that was a red flag here. As Girlwind points out, besides adrenal dysfunction, there are a host of issues we have been exhaustively considering. And we also know "one size does not fit everyone", e.g., increasing cortisol may be important for one POIS sufferer, but lowering cortisol is more important for someone else.

"Adrenal fatigue scams" abound, unfortunately, and the integrity of this forum is crucial to its eventual success.

So, welcome again.

« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 00:09:47 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2912 on: 17/01/2009 00:31:32 »
Relora and Fenugreek

Any news here?

Any new supplements, drugs, techniques to report?

Good or bad, please let us know!
« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 01:20:49 by demografx »

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2913 on: 17/01/2009 04:16:19 »
Demo-----OUT of the BOX RAMBLINGS
In previous posts I believe you've discussed your fingers. For years I've been thinking about symptoms that just don't make any sense. Since the early 90's, I get back pain and groin burning. It's part of my POIS, but it is so illogical since it seems that it should derive from long distance running and basketball. So I believe it comes from both. About you finger sensations. Are they not pre-POIS as well as POIS? If so, might this discomfort arise from two conditions? Might orgasm with its (probable) hormones and neurotransmitters trigger such a tsunami of nervous system chaos that it joins up with a lot more than we think e.g. other predispositions, latent conditions, injuries , psychological reactions etc? POIS may join with other "weaknesses" (for lack of a better term) to appear quite varied, thus a great range of symptoms in different people. I recall that in years past, if my back was unusually relaxed, my POIS sympoms would be diminished. [The opposite is brutally true.] Thus, as I discussed about a month ago in one of my earlier posts, there may be neuromuscular weak points in some of us (as well as other vulnerable points in our body,mind) that are exploited by POIS and make "it" worse than it should be. Perhaps we should be looking at more than just orgasm, albeit orgasm the apparent precipitating act. This is why I think for some people POIS seems like a near permanent condition rather than a strict post orgasm issue. There may be POIS LIKE conditions already.Thus for me, when my GAD is gone (75% of my adult life), POIS is quite uncomfortable but tolerable: The other "weaknesses" don't pile on. But when GAD is present, POIS is just awful. Theoretically, if you could rid yourself of finger problems, do you think your POIS would be diminished. Could you isolate causes of your finger "weaknesses"?. For me, I've spent $5,000 last 6 months working on my back. But since my GAD has remained, I can't tell if it is worth it. I hope to know soon. 

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2914 on: 17/01/2009 05:32:29 »
Demo-----OUT of the BOX RAMBLINGS
In previous posts I believe you've discussed your fingers. For years I've been thinking about symptoms that just don't make any sense. Since the early 90's, I get back pain and groin burning. It's part of my POIS, but it is so illogical since it seems that it should derive from long distance running and basketball. So I believe it comes from both. About you finger sensations. Are they not pre-POIS as well as POIS? If so, might this discomfort arise from two conditions? Might orgasm with its (probable) hormones and neurotransmitters trigger such a tsunami of nervous system chaos that it joins up with a lot more than we think e.g. other predispositions, latent conditions, injuries , psychological reactions etc? POIS may join with other "weaknesses" (for lack of a better term) to appear quite varied, thus a great range of symptoms in different people. I recall that in years past, if my back was unusually relaxed, my POIS symptoms would be diminished. [The opposite is brutally true.] Thus, as I discussed about a month ago in one of my earlier posts, there may be neuromuscular weak points in some of us (as well as other vulnerable points in our body,mind) that are exploited by POIS and make "it" worse than it should be. Perhaps we should be looking at more than just orgasm, albeit orgasm the apparent precipitating act. This is why I think for some people POIS seems like a near permanent condition rather than a strict post orgasm issue. There may be POIS LIKE conditions already.Thus for me, when my GAD is gone (75% of my adult life), POIS is quite uncomfortable but tolerable: The other "weaknesses" don't pile on. But when GAD is present, POIS is just awful. Theoretically, if you could rid yourself of finger problems, do you think your POIS would be diminished. Could you isolate causes of your finger "weaknesses"?. For me, I've spent $5,000 last 6 months working on my back. But since my GAD has remained, I can't tell if it is worth it. I hope to know soon. 

Underwater, wow, $5,000 for working on your back. I hope you get positive news soon!

My fingertips pre-POIS...one of my puzzles is trying to figure out just when my POIS started. I remember POIS episodes 30 years ago but before that I draw a blank.

One thing I'm certain though, is that the dry fingertips' intensity is never felt outside of POIS. And for whatever reason, the feeling can be agonizing. It's somehow related to the post-orgasmic, unleashed "nervous system chaos" you describe very well.

I do occasionally have a low-intensity fingertips problem, usually when I try to go beyond 5-6 weeks abstinence. In both cases, there seems to be an associated anxiety tinge, as well as a relationship to "sex" (either post-orgasm or from "orgasm-deprivation")

I don't have anything that I can pinpoint that is similar to your GAD-POIS correlation; my POIS seems like an equal-opportunity destroyer. I have not been able to isolate any one variable that makes POIS more or less sufferable.

One exception: if I have zero responsibilities and can just "sleep through POIS", it's more tolerable. Although at the end there is a remorseful feeling of waste, and more difficulty regaining adaptability to the outside world. I'm not sure if the tradeoff of more POIS tolerability for poor real-world post-POIS adjustment is worth it.

Interesting question you ask, "if you could rid yourself of finger problems, do you think your POIS would be diminished." The truth is, I don't know! But it would be nice to eliminate just that symptom.

Thanks, Underwater, your post definitely made me think more about "pre-POIS" pathology and POIS relationships.

« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 06:09:58 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2915 on: 17/01/2009 06:03:02 »
Possible POIS source?

List of symptoms of Pheochromocytoma:

CP, I'm missing something basic: why are you asking us to look at Pheochromocytoma and it's huge, all-encompasssing symptom list? You mention "Possible POIS source" - but I still don't understand what you have in mind. Probably my poor post-POIS adaptability [:)]
« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 06:20:08 by demografx »

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Offline Counterpoints

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2916 on: 17/01/2009 06:49:43 »
Possible POIS source?

List of symptoms of Pheochromocytoma:

CP, I'm missing something basic: why are you asking us to look at Pheochromocytoma and it's huge, all-encompasssing symptom list? You mention "Possible POIS source" - but I still don't understand what you have in mind. Probably my poor post-POIS adaptability [:)]

Pheochromocytoma can cause cortisol, adrenaline, noradrenaline, dopamine, vanylmandelic acid,  and blood pressure levels (amongst other things!) to fluxuate unpredictably.  It has been suggested to me by physicians that this could cause the unusual symptoms I feel post-orgasm (perhaps orgasm itself could further offset these chemicals, or could trigger some kind of leak).  Further, many of the symptoms that characterize this problem parallel what I've seen on this board -- especially those who mention heats, palpitations, etc.  I have already suggested a urine metanephrine test, which is one of the tests used to screen for this -- there is a more comprehensive list of tests in the site I linked, as well as more information.  If anyone feels they should get some testing done, these are tests definitely worth considering -- in addition to cortisol, prolactin, and thyroid.

Excerpt:
Quote
Pheochromocytomas are catecholamine producing tumors of chromaffin cells, that can occur sporadically or as part of a familial syndrome. Although the majority are found in the adrenal glands, pheochromocytoma can basically be found wherever chromaffin tissue can be found. Ninety-seven percent have been found in the abdomen, 2% in the thorax and 1% in other regions.

The tumor is named for its colorful reaction in fixatives containing chromic acid salts. In modern day language, these tumors are often referred to as "pheos". Most pheos secrete a number of hormones, including norepinephrine, epinephrine, dopamine, vanylmandelic acid, and metanephrines. Pheochromocytomas are usually benign (non-cancerous), but can cause dangerously high blood pressure and other symptoms, including pounding headaches, heart palpitations, flushing of the face, nausea, and vomiting. Pheochromocytoma symptoms usually include paroxysms of extreme hypertension, accompanied by sweating, headache, and other autonomic disturbances, probably resulting from physical compression and/or ischemia of the "pheo". Doctors and patients often refer to these bouts as "episodes".

Pheochromocytomas can be found anywhere in the body, though most occur in the adrenal medulla. Even a tiny benign pheochromocytoma can make a person very sick. Regardless of location and appearance, the patients will usually report anxiety, headache, palpitations, panic attacks, sweating, and dizziness as some of the main symptoms. Extra-adrenal paragangliomas (often called extra-adrenal pheochromocytomas) are closely related and less common tumors. These tumors originate in the ganglia of the sympathetic nervous system and are named based upon the primary anatomical site of origin.
« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 07:08:47 by Counterpoints »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2917 on: 17/01/2009 07:09:30 »
Counterpoints, thanks for the clarification.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2918 on: 17/01/2009 07:17:59 »
POIS Research Study

The first and only study on POIS by Dr. Marcel Waldinger,MD and Dr. David Schweitzer, MD.

If anyone wants a copy (PDF), send "Pyropeach" a Private Message with your email address and he'll send you back the PDF.

To send a Private Message, click on "Messages" at the top of this page. At the Messages page, click on "New Message". From that point on, it works just like posting a message here, except that it only goes to the person(s) you designate.

Remember to put a quote around the recipient's name, e.g., "pyropeach".

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2919 on: 17/01/2009 08:00:46 »
So for pheochromocytoma or adrenocortical carcinoma, a urine test is best? What else should we test for as long as we're doing urine testing? Do you think everyone should take the test? What's the treatment for pheochromocytoma or adrenocortical carcinoma?
« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 08:11:01 by demografx »

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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2920 on: 17/01/2009 08:24:29 »
You should check out what she and her partner have written about this. http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_in_the_brain
It might be very enlightening for you.

Girlwind,

My partner and I just finished reading your link recommendation. It was not enlightening, but it was very comforting and we both really appreciated it.
What she and I sense is that whether we travel guided by our feelings (as we do) or whether we eruditely study neurochemical treatises we arrive at the same truthful place.
Thank you.

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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2921 on: 17/01/2009 08:35:36 »
But since my GAD has remained,

CP , forgive my ignorance , but what is GAD?

Perhaps we should be looking at more than just orgasm, albeit orgasm the apparent precipitating act. This is why I think for some people POIS seems like a near permanent condition rather than a strict post orgasm issue.

If we were studying heart disease would we fearfully not study pre-infarction conditions?


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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2922 on: 17/01/2009 08:36:04 »
I mean Underwater!

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2923 on: 17/01/2009 08:43:40 »
"ombass" pharmaceuticals?

Not sure at all if it's the same "ombass", but I wonder if someone is selling a "cure" in this photo? [;D]
http://flickr.com/photos/ombass/

An amazing coincidence, though, the name here is "Jason" (a self-described "psychedelic individual" on this website) and..."Jason" was the name on his email reply back to me...
« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 09:00:09 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2924 on: 17/01/2009 08:53:30 »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2925 on: 17/01/2009 09:09:13 »
forgive my ignorance , but what is GAD?

Generalized Anxiety Disorder

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2926 on: 17/01/2009 15:42:09 »
Steve--
As Demo observed, GAD stands for a generalized anxiety disorder. For me, it is a parallel condition to POIS. When GAD is present, which historically for me is a long 2 or so year episode, it multiplies the symptoms of POIS. I use the word multiply, because the symptoms are very similar. When GAD is gone (which I am expecting soon w/ help of psychiatrist), then POIS will most likely -if history is repeated for me- stand by itself as my major disability. Since for me, as GAD has psychological, chemical and genetic components, I have always considered POIS to have the same components. What distinguishes POIS is its discrete time frame and its flowing onset after orgasm. And then I wait for it to lift after X number of days. I look at POIS as a unique event, but for me as you can see, I just can't separate it from my larger condition. Over the years, I have come to believe that key hormones such a prolactin, cortisol may play a part as well as all our neuotransmitters such as epinephrine, gaba and dopamine. But I absolutely know (but will not share my psychological and my behaviour history) that there is a "rock solid case" for a concommitant psychological and behavioural genesis, if not actual cause. Thus for me, POIS is a clear trigger, but probably built upon a complex past. Thus, I try to work on all aspects of POIS to diminish it: exercise, sleep, nutrition, my mind, my back, supplements, psychiatrist, chiropractor , you know all the stuff we talk about all the time. The important thing for me is to try to remain calm if my experiments and personal therapies don't yield immediate fruit. I can be walking on the beach and feel like I'm in bliss for a couple of hours, all problems vanished. Then hours later, I'm feeling lousy. I have not had "O" for about 6 weeks. But since I'm feeling significantly better the last 10 days or so generally, and hope this is a sign that GAD is going, I don't want an "O" to interfere. Basically, I don't want POIS to interfere with the (hopeful) conclusion of this GAD episode for me. Some people have to take powerful meds for GAD such as SSRI's or Benzos for very long periods of time or forever. I have taken them in the past but I can get off. I'm free of them right now. Some people are lucky, take them all the time and "seem" happy as can be. Others sink into a horrendous pit, because they screw up their whole nervous system. I don't know what the statistics are. For me, I prefer natural methods. By the way, when I have used these powerful meds, I take subtherapeutic amounts, which is very strange and shouldn't really amount to much. But they do!!

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2927 on: 17/01/2009 17:36:58 »
Quote
Do you think that fatigue/exhaustion are major symptoms of POIS?

I think of course fatigue and exhaustion are major symptoms. There are few cases of Pois without any fatigue. But fatigue is a so inaccurate symptom.
Some cases have general fatigue (lack of energy), mental fatigue (can't focus), muscular fatigue... Yes, fatigue can be consiered as the chief symptom.
At this moment, my idea is we can make 2 groups : cases with  and without flulike symptoms.

Thank you, B_Jim! I'd like to see Counterpoints reply.

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2928 on: 17/01/2009 18:45:27 »
Regarding fatigue as a symptom of POIS--
For me, I measure it against my normal, non-pois condition-
I am more tired swimming. I don't feel like I have the requisite energy to do work that requires significant concentration. I would call it fatigue, physical and "mental"; but for me it falls short of exhaustion. However, if I were to be hit with multiple pois episodes during a short period, then I could call it, perhaps, exhaustion. I haven't quite understood "brain fog" as it has been used here. I think classification is essential to any endeavor to understand POIS. However, intuitively, I think there may ultimately be 100's of symptoms or more, not unlike other nervous system illnesses, notwithstanding the fact that POIS has a specific, powerful trigger.
Perhaps as we come up with specific remedies that begin to make inroads into POIS, we will see a pattern emerge [as certain remedies improve certain symptoms]. But classification is very important, as it may point the direction to additional, broader descriptors to POIS or perhaps even a different term that is "POIS LIKE."

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Offline SickLifeSaver

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2929 on: 17/01/2009 21:50:07 »
hello everyone,  I am new to this forum and hope someone can help.  For the past several years my sexual relations have been severely hindered by a sudden onset of severe nausea, weakness, and hot flushing feeling immediately after ejaculation. It has not been a severe as the cases (duration wise) as I have seen in these post, but has basically forced me to avoid sexual activity.  I also a major increase in heartrate.  I have a full physical exam and even wore a halter monitor to rule out arrhythmias.  The only time I have these feeling is with ejaculation.  I currently do not take any medications, but have been treated for depression in the past and do not feel like I am depressed now.  I allergic to buspar so that would not help.  Does anyone know what this could be and if any treatment is available?  I am in NC and none of the doctors I have seen to know or are willing to answer anything about it.

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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2930 on: 17/01/2009 21:54:11 »
hello everyone,  I am new to this forum and hope someone can help.  For the past several years my sexual relations have been severely hindered by a sudden onset of severe nausea, weakness, and hot flushing feeling immediately after ejaculation. It has not been a severe as the cases (duration wise) as I have seen in these post, but has basically forced me to avoid sexual activity.  I also a major increase in heartrate.  I have a full physical exam and even wore a halter monitor to rule out arrhythmias.  The only time I have these feeling is with ejaculation.  I currently do not take any medications, but have been treated for depression in the past and do not feel like I am depressed now.  I allergic to buspar so that would not help.  Does anyone know what this could be and if any treatment is available?  I am in NC and none of the doctors I have seen to know or are willing to answer anything about it.

There are a number of us here , using different techniques, to ameliorate this disease, that have found relief. You're in the right place.

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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2931 on: 17/01/2009 22:08:16 »
Perhaps as we come up with specific remedies that begin to make inroads into POIS, we will see a pattern emerge. But classification is very important, as it may point the direction to additional, broader descriptors to POIS or perhaps even a different term that is "POIS LIKE."

                    Total % loss...For me
1) openness to dating    2% loss
2) dating                     5% loss
3) arousal behavior      10% loss
4) genital contact         20%loss
5) orgasmic sexuality   95% loss

After a two day experiment at stage 2), for us, dating, my partner and I went back to stage 4), for us, non orgasmic genital contact.

I'm feeling fatigued, confused, flushed, tired, runny nose, arthritic in my knees and lower back.
I'm negotiating with my partner to do a three day experiment at stage 2, for us, after the long weekend and before a three day trip we have next week.

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2932 on: 17/01/2009 22:30:15 »
Steve--
My lower back issues are tied into POIS and my GAD. When I get anxious, there goes my lower back. It is so tied into it that if I fix my back, GAD diminishes. If GAD diminishes it helps my back!!It is even tied into POIS. My nervous system is integrated, real integrated. These things have helped with my back whenever it flares:
ice, electrostimulation (at chiropractor), massage of lower abdominal muscles (see Trigger Point Therapy Workbook by Clair Davies--This seems counter intuitive, but it's not). I have noticed (not 100%) that many times the ice (on back) works moderately to diminish GAD and POIS. I have also noticed that electrostimulation at chiropractor has worked with both; same with massage. I have no idea if it would help you. For me, it seems like my brain is connected to my pelvic area. No sh1t. It's weird. Maybe I have POIS and post orgasmic neurosis.

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2933 on: 17/01/2009 22:55:20 »
Hi SickLifeSaver---
I'm "relatively new" here too. This is without a doubt the BEST PLACE to seriously discuss this illness and related issues. I find that engaging in "conversation" with other members is tremendously beneficial. This forum has already made contributions to diminishing POIS (some concrete observations), and I believe that many new and valuable observations will be shared this year. Personally, I can relate to your: hot flushing, nausea, weakness, increased heart rate, and your past history of depression. I get those and a few more. I also have anxiety and depression issues, separately and tied into POIS. I've had this crap 20-30 years. I'm very optimistic.
WELCOME--------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2934 on: 17/01/2009 23:16:35 »
hello everyone,  I am new to this forum and hope someone can help.  For the past several years my sexual relations have been severely hindered by a sudden onset of severe nausea, weakness, and hot flushing feeling immediately after ejaculation. It has not been a severe as the cases (duration wise) as I have seen in these post, but has basically forced me to avoid sexual activity.  I also a major increase in heartrate.  I have a full physical exam and even wore a halter monitor to rule out arrhythmias.  The only time I have these feeling is with ejaculation.  I currently do not take any medications, but have been treated for depression in the past and do not feel like I am depressed now.  I allergic to buspar so that would not help.  Does anyone know what this could be and if any treatment is available?  I am in NC and none of the doctors I have seen to know or are willing to answer anything about it.

SickLifeSaver, welcome to the POIS thread of the Naked Science Forum.

As Underwater and Steve noted, this is a great place to discuss your post-ejaculatory problems.

I wish we had a magic answer for you, but we're still looking for treatment answers ourselves.

I would suggest going through the posts and finding similarities to your case - - and that might spark some ideas for you! For example, this link directly below will show you the previous posts here for "flushing", one of your symptoms. Note that the message ID number, although it changes, will tell you approximately where you can find the post. Your first message post above, for example, is MessageID 218146, found under your name.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=hot+flushing+POIS+site%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fthenakedscientists.com

Other sources which may be helpful:

Please see "B_Jim"'s POIS Forum Summary of All Cases, here as well as others on the Web. MessageID: 149009
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149009#msg149009

"Girlwind" has created an excellent POIS Video. A first!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWBxAUC9k1g

And filling out the POIS survey created by "Counterpoints" will enable you to share POIS information and details with others here. This will also enable us to work more easily with outside researchers by having more organized data available about us:
http://pois.olympe-network.com/


SickLifeSaver, we're looking forward to more of your posts!

Don't give up!


« Last Edit: 17/01/2009 23:19:27 by demografx »

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2935 on: 17/01/2009 23:35:20 »
SickLifeSaver, you may also wish to get a copy of the first study done on this malady/illness called POIS. More details below.

Then bring it to your doctor. We have had the same problem as you with medical credibility: most doctors don't understand our condition.

Many of us see POIS' problem as hormonal, so you may think of seeing a local endocrinologist (which I am doing). The co-author of the paper below is an endocrinologist. Other Forum members here have other ideas of the "best" medical practitioner to see. You will see that by searching the posts.


POIS Research Study

The first and only study on POIS by Dr. Marcel Waldinger,MD and Dr. David Schweitzer, MD.

If anyone wants a copy (PDF), send "Pyropeach" a Private Message with your email address and he'll send you back the PDF.

To send a Private Message, click on "Messages" at the top of this page. At the Messages page, click on "New Message". From that point on, it works just like posting a message here, except that it only goes to the person(s) you designate.

Remember to put a quote around the recipient's name, e.g., "pyropeach".

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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2936 on: 18/01/2009 03:21:11 »
Steve--
 My nervous system is integrated, real integrated. For me, it seems like my brain is connected to my pelvic area. It's weird. I have no idea if it would help you

It's all integrated for me, too....and I'll try anything. Today it was fasting and two 6 ounce glasses of wheatgrass.


After doing yoga for an hour, at sunset, on the San Francisco Bay beach...talk about lucky...I was talking to my partner about how I feel surpisingly badly today. I would expect that if I were orgasmic, with the accompanying 375% increase in symptoms (see below), but I'm not. Then, I realized that moving from dating to genital contact is a 300% increase in symptoms...The road looks like it may be beginning to narrow.

 Total % loss...For me
1) openness to dating    2% loss
2) dating                     5% loss
3) arousal behavior      10% loss
4) genital contact         20%loss
5) orgasmic sexuality   95% loss

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Offline Pro

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2937 on: 18/01/2009 07:25:55 »
Hello-

I am new here. This is utterly amazing how I found this  (searching google to see wtf is up). For a long time (after masturbating for 20 years) I have been living in an "unawakened" state. The effects are not at all unlike those I have read here (I am glad I'm not alone in this)- let me tell you my side effects :

Failure, Brain fog, anger, irritability, confusion, back pain, tiredness, loss of self-confidence, disassociation, anxiety, depression, guilt AND the urge to repeat the process...

I could go on but these effects are enough to completely alter (or destroy) one's life. The peculiar thing is that despite the observation that I thought it MIGHT be causing these things, I continued (and maybe continue?) to do it. I have been taking antidepressants for a few years...

My theory is that some people are more susceptible to having this disabling illness just as some people are more susceptible to having depression or alcoholism.

Of course, guilt is one of the symptoms of depression. I am non-religious. But this illness may be the source of some religions teachings for abstinence etc. This is huge... but WHY is this here? WHY has it destroyed my life- or has it?


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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2938 on: 18/01/2009 08:38:55 »
Hello-

I am new here. This is utterly amazing how I found this  (searching google to see wtf is up). For a long time (after masturbating for 20 years) I have been living in an "unawakened" state.
My theory is that some people are more susceptible to having this disabling illness just as some people are more susceptible to alcoholism.

This is huge... but WHY is this here? WHY has it destroyed my life- or has it?

Pro,

Welcome.

 I don't know why I have it either, but, like you, I think it's kind of like alcoholism....some are susceptible, some aren't. The good news is that there are some techniques that ameliorate the symptoms, not the least of which the 'talk therapy' that this forum provides.

Again welcome

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Offline SteveD

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2939 on: 18/01/2009 08:41:29 »
Hello-

I am new here. This is utterly amazing how I found this  (searching google to see wtf is up). For a long time (after masturbating for 20 years) I have been living in an "unawakened" state. The effects are not at all unlike those I have read here (I am glad I'm not alone in this)- let me tell you my side effects :

Failure, Brain fog, anger, irritability, confusion, back pain, tiredness, loss of self-confidence, disassociation, anxiety, depression, guilt AND the urge to repeat the process...

I could go on but these effects are enough to completely alter (or destroy) one's life. The peculiar thing is that despite the observation that I thought it MIGHT be causing these things, I continued (and maybe continue?) to do it. I have been taking antidepressants for a few years...

My theory is that some people are more susceptible to having this disabling illness just as some people are more susceptible to having depression or alcoholism.

Of course, guilt is one of the symptoms of depression. I am non-religious. But this illness may be the source of some religions teachings for abstinence etc. This is huge... but WHY is this here? WHY has it destroyed my life- or has it?

PS I haven't masturbated in 18 1/2 years...It's possible

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Offline Pro

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2940 on: 18/01/2009 09:20:22 »
So Steve,

By not doing it in 18 1/2 years- are you cured? Or for you does it apply even to intercourse?

And B_Jim- Dissociation from Wiki : newbielink:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissociation [nonactive]


"depersonlization" also sums it up.
« Last Edit: 18/01/2009 09:33:40 by Pro »

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2941 on: 18/01/2009 15:26:17 »
PRO
WELCOME---
I have many of your symptoms--I've had POIS at least 20 yrs-------------
You have found the right place for help--A lot of support---------------
You will get better---Talk to you later---------------------------------

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Offline fellow sufferer

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2942 on: 18/01/2009 16:36:57 »
Welcome Pro and SickLifeSaver ! Maybe can you give more details (number of days, flulike symptoms or not, tips helping you ... )

Pro, i really love your description of "unawakened" state, dissociation. I feel the same thing. You find the good expression. It's the more difficult symptom to explain to my doc.
I used the words :
- mental confusion
- stupor
- derealisation
- "i feel like sleeping" / dreamlike state
- loss of vigilance and loss of consciousness
   
At the moment, my best theory to try to explain this is the unbalanced ratio DHEA/cortisol. Saving cortisol release might be a key factor (avoiding all physical , psychological stressors as diet or light) and for flulike cases at least , inflammation.

 

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Offline fellow sufferer

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2943 on: 18/01/2009 16:43:50 »
my POIS is debilitating too. None of the physicains I have approached are able to diagnose the problem. I have worked on the overlying GAD which has somewhat reduced the dread I used to have but the terrible brain fog, severe pain in R hip and R leg still continue .
I have a delay post "O" of about 1 to 6 hours before this awful condition begins. This is my first time on this site. I hope it is the right place for me. You all seem to be very helpful for this mysterious complex plague!

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2944 on: 18/01/2009 17:38:00 »
Pro--
Here are a few observations I didn't have time to make this morning. [By the way, I noticed that among your symptoms are back pain, anxiety and depression. I also took meds for anxiety and depressions in the 90's] Just to let you know, I have a dual condition of POIS and Anxiety (GAD). I have found that exercise is a life saver for Anxiety and a temporary improvement for POIS. I've been long distance runner/swimmer for 32 yrs. Exercise = Endorphins. When I drink plenty of fluids, I feel better (hydration). Has helped me with both conditions. For me, staying away from alcohol and caffeine has helped with both conditions. When my anxiety disappears, my POIS is reduced; in other words, when my back pain, anxiety and depression goes, my POIS is not so debilitating. Except, I think my backpain might be here to stay due to age?  Supplements: I've taken supplements for over 30 years. Vitamin C is my constant forever (1,000-4,000 mg daily). I've changed supplements over the years and they never stay the same. Right now, on top of vitamin C, I take a B complex, D, fish oil, garlic, magnesium and potassium, also some calcium. I have many more vitamins, minerals, herbal medicines and supplements I experiment/alternate with, but have not recently added any permanently to my daily intake. Although I'm not sure what permanent means in the context of nutrition.  I exercise extreme prudence when it comes to engaging in an event that causes stress. These are anxiety triggers and POIS triggers. If I don't feel real strong, I avoid all stress triggers if I can help it. For back pain and groin pain which comes from anxiety and POIS, I get relief from self administered trigger point therapy and from the chiropractor. I have gone to chiropractor after POIS and have actually felt better for a short period of time. Deep breathing helps me for both anxiety and POIS. Psychiatric support has helped me with anxiety, and thus derivitively with POIS also, but not directly with POIS. This forum has helped a lot, because it gets one to focus.
For me, this forum is therapeutic and cathartic. I actually feel better as a result of constructive, positive dialogue. Since I feel better as a result, it strengthens my immune and nervous systems. It reinforces healing. It seeps into the subconscious. It actually becomes a tool. But I won't get into that. Too esoteric. 
This is on top of the physiological, theoretical, nutritional discussions etc. OKAY, I can't think of anything more right now------Too long winded-----------------

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Offline underwater

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2945 on: 18/01/2009 18:39:51 »
Hi fellow sufferer--
You're at the right place--
You'll find this place comforting, helpful and most of all focused on finding answers to the POIS nightmare. Personally, I'm more optimistic than ever since my discovery of this site. Great people, great dialogue and multiple perspectives. Just to let you know, I have GAD and POIS too.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2946 on: 18/01/2009 20:32:32 »

WHY is this here? WHY has it destroyed my life- or has it?


Welcome, Pro.

Your questions are part of the agony many of us experience. I know this might sound childlike, but to me, POIS just doesn't seem "fair". What did we do to deserve this?

But the progress here has been phenomenal. Two years ago, there was no resource like this forum available. Anywhere.


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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2947 on: 18/01/2009 20:42:39 »

None of the physicians I have approached are able to diagnose the problem....You all seem to be very helpful for this mysterious complex plague!


Welcome, fellow sufferer.

The number of medical practitioners who understand POIS is miniscule. One way to help that is to show your physician a copy of the medical study of POIS written up by Dr. Marcel Waldinger. (Please see my note above to SickLifeSaver how to obtain it).

Thank you for your compliments. We look forward to your future posts.

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Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2948 on: 18/01/2009 21:09:59 »
To the newcomers:

Some people here have experimented with the supplements Fenugreek and Relora. This is not a medical endorsement; ask your doctor or health care advisor if this is right for you. Previous forum posts below:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=fenugreek+relora+site%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fthenakedscientists.com&aq=f&oq=
« Last Edit: 18/01/2009 21:36:14 by demografx »

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Offline SickLifeSaver

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #2949 on: 18/01/2009 22:08:09 »
Thanks for all the kind reply and I do think I made a great discovery with this group.  One thing I did not mention, is that my symptoms are usually not as bad when I masturbate, but even in my past relationship the persisted.  It was not like being nervous that got better, if anything it got worse.  I have taken in consideration GAD, and I do think it may be part of it, but my anxiety levels seem to have decreased over the past couple of years.  I am wondering if I need to some medication like buspar to help or maybe a beta blocker.  I find that most of sign/symptoms disappear as my heartrate decreases. As far as depression issues go, I was on prozac for a while and it caused me to be unable to ejaculate. I am not showing any of the signs or having any of the feeling of depression that led me to seek that medication and have been off of it for over a year now. Does anyone know if there is an alternative to Buspar?  Has anyone had their MD put them of betablockers for the condition?