[demografx]

Pauliebaby,

I am seeing my doctor on thursday, hopefully to talk him into giving me whatever is needed to raise the neurotransmitter levels. I will keep you guys posted as to his opinion/remedy.
I cant speak for all pois sufferers, but the article i posted previously describes exactly what i deal with, everytime I O. This has to be the problem, for me anyway.It makes so much sense now. I finally understand what is happening and why. Now lets see if my doc can reverse it. Keep me in your prayers guys!

I bet he will advise SSRIs, and to that I say beware!

I agree with John.

[demografx]

Just read a very interesting piece that describes what happens to our bodies when we O. This may be a huge break in solving POIS:

"When you ejac with O, the serotonin level in your brain (hypothalamus) temporarily shoots up.......You will become depressed and cannot stand stress."

website is: http://www.herballove.com/article.asp?art=171

This would seem to explain...this misery!

I would be extremely skeptical about an "objective" article from any company that sells products to "remedy" what their articles write about.

Check their reputation, such as with Complaints Board, and other reviews. I think I have also seen concerns posted here.

Please be VERY careful. With the "information" and with the products.

[demografx]

Relora: many previous forum discussions here:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=relora+POIS+site%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fthenakedscientists.com&btnG=Search&aq=f&oq=&aqi=

[demografx]

My parents ordered LUCIDAL for me, and it is yet to get here.  I will post back once it does get here and I test it out.

There are some alarming posts on the internet. Search "Lucidal scam" or "Lucidal fraud".

I am not knowledgeable about the product, but when I see a lot of smoke, I get concerned about fire.

I just don't want to see anyone getting hurt by not having all the information, good and bad.

[demografx]

A question to all...

It may have been covered already but I did not see it through the hundreds of messages I read on the forum.

After orgasm, normally one feels like sleeping or relaxing. In my case almost all the time it is the opposite: my mind is racing at high speed as if I had been drinking strong coffee. That happens whether I have intercourse or with masturbation and also with NE.

Is it the same for you? Would that be part of the syndrome?  That kind of "wrong" adrenal response to orgasm could explain partly the exhaustion later.

Pablo, you're right. Search through some of the recent discussions and you'll find similarities.

[ophicus1213]

Do not waste your money on any of the herbal love products.  They were the first I found, that said anything about POIS.  Dr. Lin's writing was so informative, and I assumed his products would cure me.  I spent months on them with little or no change.  There is probably no one out there that writes as much as he does about the subject.  It is terrible that Herballove steals money from people who are just looking for relief.  They could at least help the subject gain populartiy, and conduct significant research.

[John21 (OP)]

Do not waste your money on any of the herbal love products.

Ditto

[demografx]

Do not waste your money on any of the herbal love products.  They were the first I found, that said anything about POIS.  Dr. Lin's writing was so informative, and I assumed his products would cure me.  I spent months on them with little or no change.  There is probably no one out there that writes as much as he does about the subject.  It is terrible that Herballove steals money from people who are just looking for relief.  They could at least help the subject gain popularity, and conduct significant research.

Do not waste your money on any of the herbal love products.

Ditto

Thank you, ophicus and John!

I have never heard good things about them. Unfortunately, the following is more typical of what I've heard.

From a Taoist Discussion Board:
"Dr. Lin is an online quack whose doctorate is in engineering, and I don't believe has been trained in TCM. He's taking a few techniques from TCM and Mantak Chia, thrown them up on a confusing series of websites, managed to get high up on search engine ratings, and he makes a killing ripping people off with overpriced herbal concoctions to treat various ailments, particularly sex-related ones.. His "medical advice" is sometimes harmful."

[demografx]

tazzy, welcome to the POIS thread of The Naked Science Forum!




Here are some POIS resources which may be helpful to you:

Our new POIS Information Website, built by "mat780", is here:
http://sites.google.com/site/POISwebsite/

Please see "B_Jim"'s POIS Summary of All Cases, here as well as others on the Web. This includes remedies that we have tested, and results.
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149009#msg149009

"Girlwind" has created an excellent POIS Video:

And filling out the POIS survey created by "Counterpoints" will enable you to share POIS information and details with others here. This will also enable us to work more easily with outside researchers by having more organized data available about us:
http://pois.olympe-network.com/

POIS Research Study

We have a copy of the first and only study on POIS by Dr. Marcel Waldinger,MD and Dr. David Schweitzer, MD.

If you want a copy (PDF), send me a Private Message with your regular email address (use "AT" instead of "@" ) and I'll send you back the PDF.

To send a Private Message, click on "Messages" at the top of this page. At the Messages page, click on "New Message". From that point on, it works just like posting a message here, except that it only goes to the person(s) you designate.

Remember to put a quote around my name, i.e., "demografx".


New York Times article,

January 20, 2009
Mind
Sex and Depression: In the Brain, if Not the Mind
By RICHARD A. FRIEDMAN, M.D.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/20/health/views/20mind.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=friedman%20sexual%20January%2020&st=cse

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

In addition to serving our own informational interests, the resources listed above can be useful for you to show the medical world - which often shows little understanding and is sometimes skeptical of our condition - that POIS has scientific underpinnings and that POIS is not "just another psychological problem" related to sex - to be treated by the psychiatric/psychotherapist community. This can help fight the immediate reaction of some: IT'S NOT "ALL IN OUR HEADS"!

Also, it can be helpful when dealing with medical professionals to point out the successful existence of our rapidly growing forum for nearly 3 years, which has attracted over 150 POIS sufferers worldwide who have posted here, plus nearly 500,000 page visits. Not bad for a rare malady!

[demografx]

tazzy, this post will help you find information about POIS that we have already discussed, by tailoring a Google search to this forum:


SEARCH THE FORUM WITH GOOGLE

We have an overwhelming amount of data: over 2 years' worth of posts from 150+ Forum members, and an additional 150 POIS sufferers found on the Internet, but not on this forum.

In the Google search box, type
whatever-it-is-you're-interested-in-finding-out[space]POIS[space]site:http://www.thenakedscientists.com/

for example, I tried
demografx POIS site:http://www.thenakedscientists.com/

and 1,000+ results came up for "demografx" within the Forum.

be careful with spaces (you can use them before the word "site") and no-spaces (everything after the word "site")

Google even provides you results with the Message# for each result. But Message #'s do change, so be patient and look for the approximate Message#.

[martin88]

John, Demo, Ophicus thanks for mentioning all this. According to members who posted here, SSRIs were not effective to cure POIS, but they were helpful to lower sexual frequency for some people, not all.

SSRIs,SNRIs,NDRI were not helpful to cure POIS. But I was wondering if NRIs had been tested, just in case POIS sufferers have problem with noradrenaline only, and if playing with dopamine or serotonin is bad for us.
Did someone try a NRI to cure POIS ?
Not easy to find myself in only one NT of this list:
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/List_all_the_essential_neurotransmitters


Pablo, for me definitely a racing mind after NEs. Less with orgasm. But in POIS if I'm stressed, or if I'm too active before going to sleep, or if I drink coffee I'll have an awful time with this problem.

[CertainlyPOIS]

On dr.lin, stay away from does product if you dont want to loose your precesious testicles.  I used his product first and got little result contaminated with side effects.  The pills didnt do squat and if it supposedly contained dhea, i think there was to much in it and has affected my testicle size, or something else did. The gingseng stuff helped for like two days, but that was about it.

[CertainlyPOIS]

"I have an appointment with a neurologist this wed. for a possible mri, I'm thinking about pre-"O"-ing but I really don't feel like going through that whole cycle again.  Every time 'Im in POIS my work production is down, so in college I am baasically useless during that time."

Z one, i will go "drained" just to make sure.


I am going to psychiatrist to get cognition/concentration and i am going "drained"m hopefully without delibrate actions to fail, i do bad on that test and may be we can have one more proof to fight with.

[pauliebaby61]

Thank you all for the replies to my post about Dr lins theories. I am taking Dr lins theories and running them by my Dr, who is very well versed in this subject, and the workings of hormones and brain. I want to find out if this is actually the dominoes that fall after O, and if so, what can be done about it in his opinion, since this mimics my symptoms exactly. I do not expect SSRI's, because my Dr isnt big on meds unless medically a necessity.He is a rare find and not your typical pill pusher.
I also am skeptical of a company that describes a problem and sells products. I never planned on buying any product from this website, and would discourage anyone from doing so. I read the ingredients of one product and it amounted to just a multi vitamin.
My whole purpose in making the original post re Dr Lin was to understand what actually happens to our bodies at the time of O.
I dont believe, to date,that anyone has ever described what happens to our bodies at the moment of O on this website, and I thought the info, if accurate, could help everyone understand what is going on in their bodies, and could possibly give a clue as to how to correct this issue. I am taking this info to my Dr on Thursday to see if he feels this is the actual chain of events that leads to POIS. If he verifies this,and testing is ordered, and I am found lacking in any neurotransmitter type, i will make the correction, in the hope that pois can be relieved.

[demografx]

I want to find out if this is actually the dominoes that fall after O

For a reliable look at the neural-physiological correlates of orgasm, I would recommend the text,

The Science of Orgasm: Barry R. Komisaruk, Carlos Beyer-Flores, Beverly Whipple.

Also recommended: the Los Angeles Times article, "Science Of The Orgasm":
http://www.latimes.com/features/health/la-he-orgasm11feb11,0,7227478.story

"Doctor" Lin may have "borrowed" some of his ideas from the above sources, but why not get it "straight from the horse's mouth"?

From medical writers.

[demografx]

With all due respect to anyone's physician or doctor, the science of orgasm is in it's infancy. You can count the truly knowledgeable on one hand.

One more is Dr Gert Holstege:
http://www.jneurosci.org/cgi/content/full/23/27/9185

[demografx]

Worth quoting the first sentence from Dr Holstege's abstract cited above:

"Brain mechanisms that control human sexual behavior in general, and ejaculation in particular, are poorly understood."

[demografx]

Mainstream neurotransmitter testing, according to my endocrinologist, who is a major university research professor with a world-class reputation, is not yet accurate at all. Please be careful.

[demografx]

Ironically, he ["Dr" Lin]'s the only person very active about post-orgasmic symptoms because he makes money with our problem.I'm fairly pessimistic about chance to find someone to help us.

You're right, money does drive a lot of research, including shoddy research such as his. But if we all fight together, we will have a much better chance.

B_Jim, you were here at the beginning of this forum. Look at how much we have accomplished with no help! We have a social network, a compendium, a website, research interest expressed by Watson, and much more, including your fantastic compilation of theories and treatments!

And you and I have both made very significant progress in our own POIS healing.

And forum members have pledged $4,500! We can hire a researcher today if we want to. It might only be a graduate student in endocrinology, but compare that to 3 years ago!

All that we have accomplished makes finding someone easier. And anyone who wants to make a career in sexual dysfunction should be interested. But it's up to us to proactively seek these people out. With more than just "demo" sending out a letter here and there. We need to mount an aggressive campaign.

Please understand that I agree with you: it's difficult to find someone to help us. I'm simply trying to inject a small dose of positive thinking.  []

[martin88]

Ironically, he ["Dr" Lin]'s the only person very active about post-orgasmic symptoms because he makes money with our problem.I'm fairly pessimistic about chance to find someone to help us.

You're right, money does drive a lot of research, including shoddy research such as his. But if we all fight together, we will have a much better chance.

B_Jim, you were here at the beginning of this forum. Look at how much we have accomplished with no help! We have a social network, a compendium, a website, research interest expressed by Watson, and much more, including your fantastic compilation of theories and treatments!

And you and I have both made very significant progress in our own POIS healing.

And forum members have pledged $4,500! We can hire a researcher today if we want to. It might only be a graduate student in endocrinology, but compare that to 3 years ago!

All that we have accomplished makes finding someone easier. And anyone who wants to make a career in sexual dysfunction should be interested. But it's up to us to proactively seek these people out. With more than just "demo" sending out a letter here and there. We need to mount an aggressive campaign.

Please understand that I agree with you: it's difficult to find someone to help us. I'm simply trying to inject a small dose of positive thinking.  []

I'm glad you're giving your opinion B_Jim. I think you're right it will be very difficult to find someone to help us but little by little I'm confident something will happen. Dr Waldinger made some tests, tried some medications to help POIS sufferers, and wrote a paper saying that it's not psychological. It's not nothing a psychiatrist who say this. If other MDs can make exactly like Dr Waldinger did, the theory will have more credibility and from there maybe some money will be invested in research.

There are many research on anxiety. Perhaps we can tell them that all POIS have a problem with anxiety in POIS only..

Demo, it's difficult to be agressive with POIS. Let's take a break!