[demografx]

Hoax?

[demografx]

Nope, it's referring to the Naked Scientists group on facebook. We currently have both a "group" and a "page" on facebook, but want to concentrate on the "page" as it gives us more opportunity for interaction.

Nothing on thenakedscientists.com will change, we'll carry on here as normal, it's only facebook that will change.

[lauracostis]

"URGENT DANDRUFF

Hi everybody,

I have posted a similar question several times but I haven't got a right answer.
I have a dandruff since a year ago. I have got some product and I can treat it easily. But after each ejaculation it comes back in worst way (some hours after the ejaculation). Please tell me if you have the same problem and could it be due to POIS."

Prenobis - are you using a ketonazole shampoo by any chance?  That has some strange side effects.  See http://www.retaining-hair-health.com/2009/12/nizoral-ketonazole-shampoo.html What seems odd is the rapid onset of the condition post ejaculation.  Do you get really hot (temperature wise) or perspire a lot as this could cause an increase in the growth of Pityrosporum ovale which is the yeast responsible for dandruff.  Have you tried washing your hair immediately afterwards to see if that reduces the problem.  If not then it is probably not dandruff but some sort of eczema or similar dermatological condition worsened by chemical changes associated with sex.   

i get a bit of dandrif also while in pois

[demografx]

Latest news about Facebook

Hi Demo,

Don't Panic!  Nothing will change here, only the facebook group is changing.

Ben

Hi Chris, Hi Ben,

Can you please clarify Ben's post in Just Chat?

Will POIS have to move to Facebook?

Thanks,

Demo

Thanks, Ben!!

[GoingCrazy]

I have been diagnosed with neuralgia (headaches), tinnitus (ringing in the ear), PTSD and depression.
I was on gabapentin for a while, which worked great, actually too well.

While I was on gabapentin, you could literally hit me with a brick and I wouldn't even flinch.
I also noticed my drinking shot way up, since it seems to mask hangovers.
In fact, all of my gratuitous behaviors (including sex) increased.

I lost my job and medical coverage (predictably) and stopped taking the gabapentin.
The old symptoms came rushing back with a vengeance. Please, no sympathy for the devil.

Anyhow, I never liked being medicated. I have taken my condition into my own hands and I have been cleaning up my act for the past few months. I have stopped smoking, drinking, coffee, and now even sex. I am trying to isolate the cause of these symptoms.

If it turns out that "clean living" cures me, I am going to be at once grieved and relieved. Many lost years, but I will trade them all for any symptom free years.

I actually really hope its the sex thing - the last place I have looked. If it doesn't work, its back to the meds and associated risks.

BTW - its only through faith that I have been able to quit all the gratuitous behavior - I have simply traded the behavior for peace of mind and a sense of purpose - the promise of well-being rather than the pursuit of pleasure.

I will keep you all up to date, and invite all to join me in getting clean. It's the simple solution that is most often overlooked.

I'm on that same path

[THISFORUMROCKS!]

According to the following article from NINDS.NIH.GOV,

http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/pml/pml.htm [nofollow]

"Progressive multifocal leukoencephalopathy (PML) is caused by the reactivation of a common virus in the central nervous system of immune-compromised individuals.  Polyomavirus JC"

"Typical symptoms associated with PML are diverse, since they are related to the location and amount of damage in the brain, and evolve over the course of several days to several weeks."

What if you substitute pois for "PML" or at least consider some possible connections?

What if during "O" pois sufferers immune defenses are somehow weakened or attacked?

Maybe for less immune compromised individuals the virus can be deactivated more easily than what is suggested in the article, which is about very/consistently immune compromised individuals.

Maybe loss of myelin around nerve fibers is less noticeable when on gabapentin.

In the article, treatment suggested for PML is "reversal of the immune-deficient state". One way suggested for doing this is "anti-retroviral therapy".

Has anyone discussed "anti-retroviral therapy" with their DOC, or the best ways to strengthen their immune system?

I like the concept of strengthening the immune system through LDN therapy. Best of luck Lauracostis! [^]

[lauracostis]

THISFORUMROCKS,
i have looked into antiviral drugs for chronic fatigue syndrom.  the antiviral drugs you are looking for are expensive, about 2500$ per month.  you can get much cheaper nucleic acid synthesis inhibitors like famcyclovir and valtrex for cheap, but they probably wont do much for a retrovirus.

[hazey]

Hello everyone, just introducing myself I am 27 and believe I now have textbook POIS. I will give a rundown on my problems and history. You will see it transitions from sexual exhaustion to now classic POIS symptoms. Apologies for length.

I am 27 years of Age.

Very horny teenager, masterbated alot
Experienced problems from 20's??
Worked in IT for nearly 10 years now, alot of computer use though even used alot of computer in my teens
Partying/ clubbing alcohol on weekends from 18-25
Had chronic muscle tightness and pain
Libido on decline
Something just wasn't right, I wasn't energetic, and was not happy mood. Easily prone to stress
Used to always go over things repeatedly in my head

Current problems are:
- 0 Libido, none at all
- Don't have the energy and spark and motivation to do things or to excel in my Work
- MOOD - Not happy although I should be, Very serious all the time, 80% of the time I'm down and moody. Don't joke much
- Muscle stiffness and pain when touch, Muscles don't feel as strong as they should be (I am fairly solid)
- Last year have put on weight, So i think my metabolism is down
- At times I would wake up feeling un refreshed and just no energy throughout day. Everything a chore
POIS SYMPTOMS Over the last year I have developed post ejaculation problems
- Groggy hangover feeling, crash, irritable, mood swing, muscle tightness, flu symptoms, muscles would lose elasticity neck and shoulder would tense up and I would feel hot Lasts 3-5 days
When these symptoms subside I would just go back to feeling how I do most of the time, which is just not 100%
Over the last 6 months has not been so severe, now lasts 1-3 days. And I no longer get the immediate heat and neck stiffness.
Difference?? From my blood tests my cortisol and DHEA level was in the low range (But still considered normal)and usually I would feel better after eating a meal, So I started to treat adrenals, I was taking B and C vitamins, Magnesium, Zinc, But I also try to build stronger dopamine system to block the crash, so eating more protein, eggs, taking GABA, 5htp, L-glutamine

So I cant say which of the above is what has helped as the change was all at same time

CURRENTLY: So I no longer have the big crashes through out day (adrenals?) but I still feel sh1t
- I'm not happy
- Depressive mood
- Occasional morning erection 3 or 4 times a week?
- I get the POIS symptoms after sex most of the times but there has been odd occasions where Its only lasted 1 day and i recover alot quicker.
Recently I had sex then very early in morning i woke up and had severe hayfever, sneezing, itchy throat and eyes, worst I have had. Though I did not have the groggy hangover feeling, i was just mildly out of it and seem to recover in that day. So the next day i ended up having sex again and the next day I had 0 POIS symptoms, just the usual crap feeling i have which I now consider normal compared to POIS days.

After writing this, my neck stiffness is here, so can easily flare up from computer or stress.
TREATMENT
If anyone has any comments please feel free, I would like to get an idea of where i go from here? There is a very good Doctor here in Australia who specialises in thyroid, adrenal, hormone and anti aging. I am thinking of seeing her but at $300/hr i want to make sure I have all the right information and Know what to ask for with regards to blood/hormone tests etc. So if anyone can comment Thanks

Cheers

[demografx]

hazey, welcome to the POIS thread of The Naked Science Forum!




Here are some POIS resources which may be helpful to you:

Our new POIS Information Website, built by "mat780", is here:
http://sites.google.com/site/POISwebsite/

Please see "B_Jim"'s POIS Summary of All Cases, here as well as others on the Web. This includes remedies that we have tested, and results.
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149009#msg149009

"Girlwind" has created an excellent POIS Video:

And filling out the POIS survey created by "Counterpoints" will enable you to share POIS information and details with others here. This will also enable us to work more easily with outside researchers by having more organized data available about us:
http://pois.olympe-network.com/

POIS Research Study

We have a copy of the first and only formal medical investigation on POIS by Dr. Marcel Waldinger,MD and Dr. Dave Schweitzer, MD.

There are 2 ways to get it: (1) if you want a PDF copy, send me a Private Message (PM) with your regular email address (use "AT" instead of "@" ) and I'll send you back the PDF. Or, if you prefer, (2) I can simply reply with a Private Message (no regular email needed) and provide you with a simple text version embedded in your PM.

To send a Private Message, click on "Messages" at the top of this page. At the Messages page, click on "New Message". From that point on, it works just like posting a message here, except that it only goes to the person(s) you designate.

Remember to put a quote around my name, i.e., "demografx".


New York Times article,

January 20, 2009
Mind
Sex and Depression: In the Brain, if Not the Mind
By RICHARD A. FRIEDMAN, M.D.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/20/health/views/20mind.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=friedman%20sexual%20January%2020&st=cse

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

In addition to serving our own informational interests, the resources listed above can be useful for you to show the medical world - which often shows little understanding and is sometimes skeptical of our condition - that POIS has scientific underpinnings and that POIS is not "just another psychological problem" related to sex - to be treated by the psychiatric/psychotherapist community. This can help fight the immediate reaction of some: IT'S NOT "ALL IN OUR HEADS"!

Also, it can be helpful when dealing with medical professionals to point out the successful existence of our rapidly growing forum for nearly 3 years, which has attracted over 150 POIS sufferers worldwide who have posted here, plus well over 500,000 page visits. Not bad for a rare malady!

[demografx]

hazey, this post will help you find information about POIS that we have already discussed, by tailoring a Google search to this forum:


SEARCH THE FORUM WITH GOOGLE

We have an overwhelming amount of data: almost 3 years' worth of posts (nearly 7,000 posts!) from 150+ Forum members, and an additional 150 POIS sufferers found elsewhere on the Internet by Member B_Jim.

In the Google search box, type
whatever-it-is-you're-interested-in-finding-out[space]POIS[space]site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

for example, I tried
demografx POIS site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

and 1,000+ results came up for "demografx" within the Forum.

be careful with spaces (you can use them before the word "site") and no-spaces (everything after the word "site")

Google even provides you results with the Message# for each result. But Message #'s do change, so be patient and look for the approximate Message#.

[acronym]

"URGENT DANDRUFF

Hi everybody,

I have posted a similar question several times but I haven't got a right answer.
I have a dandruff since a year ago. I have got some product and I can treat it easily. But after each ejaculation it comes back in worst way (some hours after the ejaculation). Please tell me if you have the same problem and could it be due to POIS."

Prenobis - are you using a ketonazole shampoo by any chance?  That has some strange side effects.  See http://www.retaining-hair-health.com/2009/12/nizoral-ketonazole-shampoo.html What seems odd is the rapid onset of the condition post ejaculation.  Do you get really hot (temperature wise) or perspire a lot as this could cause an increase in the growth of Pityrosporum ovale which is the yeast responsible for dandruff.  Have you tried washing your hair immediately afterwards to see if that reduces the problem.  If not then it is probably not dandruff but some sort of eczema or similar dermatological condition worsened by chemical changes associated with sex.   

i get a bit of dandrif also while in pois

For dandruff, I can highly recommend the medicated shampoos that contain ketoconazole..but get the one that is at 2%. This was the only shampoo that actually helped me in this regard. I did not use it continually though.
I have sometimes suffered from eczema when I have been particularly unwell, and used a tropical cortisoid lotion with great outcome.
I suffered from dandruff for years. It came on the same time as I got POIS. While the ketoconazole shampoos helped and avoiding sugar + junk food also definitely helped, the biggest break through (basically it cured it) for me was testosterone replacement therapy. I have heard 2 other guys make the same observation when they started on TRT as well, though as far as I am aware dandruff is not a 'classic' sign of low testosterone.

[demografx]

acronym, as you probably know, TRT has cured my POIS at about 90% average.

Just curious, what dosage strength do you use? (I use 15mg daily via T-patches)

[prism]

I think the moderator just wants me to go away...

Not true!

I see huge improvement in the form of give-and-take. Keep in mind that we have had true disrupters here from time to time, with massive hidden agendas and not-in-the-least-interested in exchanging ideas. It's not always easy to identify early on, and in some cases waiting way too long - giving people more and more leeway - has proven detrimental to the forum.

So I apologize if I've been too hasty!

no, definitely no hidden agenda,
it is purely a concern for other peoples well-being, because i've gone through it
and know how depressing this problem can be.

[Itsmebutwho?]

Hi guys!

Im just curious about our body weight... Is there any similarities or does it varies a lot among us? Im very skinny guy, not much at all fat/muscles under my skin, no matter what i eat or do. Always been like that. 186cm / 65kg ( 6'1" / 143.3)  It feels that it is impossible for me getting fat or muscles. So im wondering has it anything to do with POIS symptoms.  []

It is kinda funny that i used to eat lot of candies in order to feel a bit better/feeling a bit energetic some years ago but i had no change on my weight. Now i have stopped to eat candies and white sugar.

I think ive been able to cut a bit my POIS recovery time by taking 15mg zinc supplement/day, some D-vitamin supplement, eating more eggs (2/day), more meat, also high proteine cheese. Im also eating often honey and raisins in order to try to fill up my body energy resources. If eating like this i start to feel better after ejaculation usually in 1-2 days...before it was something like 1 week. Full recovery takes now about 3-4 days. When i start to feel horny, i also start to feel a lot better, and now it happens usually in 3-4 days  []

Still it is annoying that have to feel depressed/sad/unhappy/powerless/cold/allergy symptoms 1-2 days. Btw, the allergy symptoms makes me crazy, i need to scratch every part of my body and i get little red spots/pimples + with that get bad muscle tension/pain and myokymia...  [!]

I suppose here has been talking about over-masturbation? Im wondering could POIS symptoms come from it? Like i masturbated like crazy in my 13-23 ages before my body came more sick and got worse POIS symptoms.

Ive tried to search info about that and follow some hints, like here:
newbielink:http://abchomeopathy.com/forum2.php/48321/ [nonactive]

[hazey]

Do majority of people here only have problems post orgasm? What about in between?
I know that even if I hold off for weeks, my body and mood is just not right. I'm still:
- sensitive to stress
- Not happy, dull feeling, no excitement

And I'm also coming to the conclusion that if I'm stressed or not feeling well and I have sex I dont feel as strong and confident in wanting to orgasm, then this usually results in pois

If I am feeling relaxed and no stress then I usually feel more confident and willing to orgasm which most of the time results in very very minor pois.

Also when I am more relaxed and confident to orgasm, I usually have a firmer erection and my orgasm is stronger my sperm is thicker and not watery.
But if I have a bad orgasm and it was ordinary with watery sperm then I will get pois.

[Itsmebutwho?]

Do majority of people here only have problems post orgasm? What about in between?
I know that even if I hold off for weeks, my body and mood is just not right...

Well, that sounds like myself before. Weeks after weeks just depressed and so on. Things began to come better when i radically changed my eating habits and decreased ejaculation times.

Yeah, and i know that feeling, having pre-POIS or something (low mood, no much energy, not feeling horny, not so wanting orgasm, not relaxed, low self-confidence), if having then ejaculation it leads to more severe POIS symptoms. Sometimes i do this mistake bcause wanting so much feeling a bit better...but usually it just leads to worse condition.

Im not sure yet but i feel too that if im feeling really horny, confident and then having sex/masturbate really concentrated on what doing/the good feeling without thinking anything else than the great pleasure moment, i dont have so much POIS symptoms afterwards. I have a problem that my mind tends to travel around and my eyes looks around, not concentrating and enjoying so much, not relaxed, not letting happen it naturally. Ive tried to get rid of this annoying habit.

[prism]

Welcome Itsmebutwho?.
You know, there are 50-60 old men starting to have Pois symptoms after intercourses. So, talking over-masturbation is not correct. Dispite a difference between masturbation and sexual intercourse is possible. And stopping ejaculation will never be a therapy. It's just avoiding symptoms. We want to return to a normal sexual life, not abstinence for life. Your symptoms are close to mine (especially underweight, myokymia...).
--
I think itchings and scratchings during Pois days might be a sign that endorphins are involved.

Very interesting article :

Endorphins and enkephalins are important opioid neurotransmitters in the CNS that mediate the sensation of itch. Although morphine alleviates pain, it aggravates itch, as itch and pain share common neurological pathways. The central elicitation of itch by morphine results from binding to opioid receptors and this binding may mimic normal physiological binding of endorphins and enkephakins at these receptor sites. Naloxone, an opioid antagonist, has been found to reduce histamine-provoked itch.

I think it might be the best explanation for immediate or early Pois symptoms.

--

Hazey, in the past I felt normal between good between cycles. Now, I'm sensible to stress.

I 100% agree - this 'over-masturbation' term is not correct at all, its total rubbish, because the majority of men can masturbate alot and never get POIS. It maybe a case of 'how' you do it rather than how much.
A full recovery is possible despite how much masturbating you have done in the past, its a case 'unwinding' some the tightness that has been accumulated over a life time of stress.

I also agree with the 'itch' analysis.
When I was recovering from POIS I noticed one of my testicles felt 'tickly', like I just wanted to scratch it,
but the itch was too internal and out of reach,
the although the tickle sensation felt good it would alternate between
'fearful' feelings, like I was about to feel pain, which would cause me to lock my hip muscles, in case I felt a zap of pain.
Over time I learnt how to relax and stay released through these feelings getting rid of the 'tickle' and POIS.

[demografx]

[Mine] is purely a concern for other peoples well-being, because i've gone through it
and know how depressing this problem can be.

Welcome again to the forum!

[demografx]

Itsmebutwho?, welcome to the POIS thread of The Naked Science Forum!




Here are some POIS resources which may be helpful to you:

Our new POIS Information Website, built by "mat780", is here:
http://sites.google.com/site/POISwebsite/

Please see "B_Jim"'s POIS Summary of All Cases, here as well as others on the Web. This includes remedies that we have tested, and results.
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149009#msg149009

"Girlwind" has created an excellent POIS Video:

And filling out the POIS survey created by "Counterpoints" will enable you to share POIS information and details with others here. This will also enable us to work more easily with outside researchers by having more organized data available about us:
http://pois.olympe-network.com/

POIS Research Study

We have a copy of the first and only formal medical investigation on POIS by Dr. Marcel Waldinger,MD and Dr. Dave Schweitzer, MD.

There are 2 ways to get it: (1) if you want a PDF copy, send me a Private Message (PM) with your regular email address (use "AT" instead of "@" ) and I'll send you back the PDF. Or, if you prefer, (2) I can simply reply with a Private Message (no regular email needed) and provide you with a simple text version embedded in your PM.

To send a Private Message, click on "Messages" at the top of this page. At the Messages page, click on "New Message". From that point on, it works just like posting a message here, except that it only goes to the person(s) you designate.

Remember to put a quote around my name, i.e., "demografx".


New York Times article,

January 20, 2009
Mind
Sex and Depression: In the Brain, if Not the Mind
By RICHARD A. FRIEDMAN, M.D.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/20/health/views/20mind.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=friedman%20sexual%20January%2020&st=cse

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

In addition to serving our own informational interests, the resources listed above can be useful for you to show the medical world - which often shows little understanding and is sometimes skeptical of our condition - that POIS has scientific underpinnings and that POIS is not "just another psychological problem" related to sex - to be treated by the psychiatric/psychotherapist community. This can help fight the immediate reaction of some: IT'S NOT "ALL IN OUR HEADS"!

Also, it can be helpful when dealing with medical professionals to point out the successful existence of our rapidly growing forum for nearly 3 years, which has attracted over 150 POIS sufferers worldwide who have posted here, plus well over 500,000 page visits. Not bad for a rare malady!

[demografx]

Itsmebutwho?, this post will help you find information about POIS that we have already discussed, by tailoring a Google search to this forum:


SEARCH THE FORUM WITH GOOGLE

We have an overwhelming amount of data: almost 3 years' worth of posts (nearly 7,000 posts!) from 150+ Forum members, and an additional 150 POIS sufferers found elsewhere on the Internet by Member B_Jim.

In the Google search box, type
whatever-it-is-you're-interested-in-finding-out[space]POIS[space]site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

for example, I tried
demografx POIS site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

and 1,000+ results came up for "demografx" within the Forum.

be careful with spaces (you can use them before the word "site") and no-spaces (everything after the word "site")

Google even provides you results with the Message# for each result. But Message #'s do change, so be patient and look for the approximate Message#.