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  1. Naked Science Forum
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  4. A gas problem?
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A gas problem?

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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #20 on: 17/02/2018 17:28:29 »
Quote from: alancalverd on 17/02/2018 16:13:27
You might corral a bunch of charged particles with a magnetic field. On release, particles with like charges will repel each other so the cloud will expand. The practical problem with plasma physics is that it is actually more difficult than herding cats.
I have never stopped considering the magnetic bottling problem in the attempted sustained generation of Plasma.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #21 on: 17/02/2018 17:48:40 »
Quote from: Thebox on 15/02/2018 23:23:05
That was avoiding the question,
I answered the question.
The answer is "it depends".
Quote from: Thebox on 15/02/2018 23:23:05
A box inside an electron
No, a box inside a cloud of electrons.
Quote from: Thebox on 15/02/2018 23:23:05
So if all the integer points of the box
What do you think "integer point" means?
Quote from: Thebox on 15/02/2018 23:23:05
electron points
What do you think  an "electron point "is?
Quote from: Thebox on 15/02/2018 23:23:05
what should happen to these points
How would we know?
You are the one who invented them.
Quote from: Thebox on 15/02/2018 23:23:05
What happens if we put protons and electrons in the box,
You get hydrogen (though my earlier caveat about temperature may also apply here).
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Offline Kryptid

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #22 on: 17/02/2018 21:13:58 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 17/02/2018 17:48:40
You get hydrogen (though my earlier caveat about temperature may also apply here).

And that gas will still have an internal pressure and attempt to expand even though it is electrically neutral.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #23 on: 17/02/2018 22:48:51 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 17/02/2018 21:13:58
Quote from: Bored chemist on 17/02/2018 17:48:40
You get hydrogen (though my earlier caveat about temperature may also apply here).

And that gas will still have an internal pressure and attempt to expand even though it is electrically neutral.
Unless it's really cold, in which case it will condense to a liquid.
Unfortunately the answer to the question "what will happen" is really "it depends" and the OP doesn't think that's an answer.
So I don't think this thread is going anywhere.
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #24 on: 17/02/2018 23:40:33 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 17/02/2018 21:13:58
Quote from: Bored chemist on 17/02/2018 17:48:40
You get hydrogen (though my earlier caveat about temperature may also apply here).

And that gas will still have an internal pressure and attempt to expand even though it is electrically neutral.
Thats because both halves of the atom gain charge equally so it always measures neutral
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #25 on: 18/02/2018 09:38:41 »
The charge of an atom is measured as being zero, because it is zero.
So what?
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Offline alancalverd

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #26 on: 18/02/2018 09:50:47 »
Quote from: Thebox on 14/02/2018 13:04:16
In the above air tight box there is a pressured gas.


When  I open the box will the gas expand?

Yes.
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #27 on: 18/02/2018 14:29:21 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 09:38:41
The charge of an atom is measured as being zero, because it is zero.
So what?
Quote from: alancalverd on 18/02/2018 09:50:47
Quote from: Thebox on 14/02/2018 13:04:16
In the above air tight box there is a pressured gas.


When  I open the box will the gas expand?

Yes.
Thank you for your direct and straight forward answer Alan.

If now in our box we have a low pressured gas or no pressure, when we open the box will it expand?
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Offline alancalverd

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #28 on: 18/02/2018 14:34:43 »
If the pressure inside is greater than the pressure outside, the contents will expand outwards when you open the box.

If the pressure outside is greater than the pressure inside, then whatever is outside will flow into the box when you open it.

Gases also tend to diffuse , so even if the pressure were equal inside and outside, after a while you will find some "outside" molecules inside the box and some "inside" molecules outside.
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #29 on: 18/02/2018 14:37:45 »
Quote from: alancalverd on 18/02/2018 14:34:43
If the pressure inside is greater than the pressure outside, the contents will expand outwards when you open the box.

If the pressure outside is greater than the pressure inside, then whatever is outside will flow into the box when you open it.

Gases also tend to diffuse , so even if the pressure were equal inside and outside, after a while you will find some "outside" molecules inside the box and some "inside" molecules outside.
Thank you Alan.

If the low pressure inside the box was an imaginary mono-pole gas,  what would happen when we open the lid on the box?
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #30 on: 18/02/2018 18:19:22 »
Quote from: Thebox on 18/02/2018 14:37:45
If the low pressure inside the box was an imaginary mono-pole gas,  what would happen when we open the lid on the box?

Whatever you imagine  should happen.
That's the problem with magic, you can't science it.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #31 on: 18/02/2018 18:24:05 »
Quote from: Thebox on 14/02/2018 13:04:16
When  I open the box will the gas expand?


Quote from: Colin2B on 14/02/2018 13:37:26
Yes.



Quote from: alancalverd on 18/02/2018 09:50:47
Yes.
Quote from: Thebox on 18/02/2018 14:29:21
Thank you for your direct and straight forward answer Alan.


Was Colin2B's answer somehow not straightforward enough?
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #32 on: 18/02/2018 18:38:28 »

Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 18:24:05
Quote from: Thebox on 14/02/2018 13:04:16
When  I open the box will the gas expand?


Quote from: Colin2B on 14/02/2018 13:37:26
Yes.



Quote from: alancalverd on 18/02/2018 09:50:47
Yes.
Quote from: Thebox on 18/02/2018 14:29:21
Thank you for your direct and straight forward answer Alan.


Was Colin2B's answer somehow not straightforward enough?
Yes of course, I thanked Colin in post 2.
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #33 on: 18/02/2018 18:40:46 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 18:19:22
Quote from: Thebox on 18/02/2018 14:37:45
If the low pressure inside the box was an imaginary mono-pole gas,  what would happen when we open the lid on the box?

Whatever you imagine  should happen.
That's the problem with magic, you can't science it.
The magic of science, I always have another way to explain or ask the question,   I can simply ask about a polarised gas cloud which gives the same answer.  It expands because all points of the volume are likewise in polarity and gain strength and field density.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #34 on: 18/02/2018 18:45:52 »
What does " gain strength and field density." mean to you?

A bunch of electrons will repel one another.
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #35 on: 18/02/2018 18:53:59 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 18:45:52
What does " gain strength and field density." mean to you?

A bunch of electrons will repel one another.
Yes a bunch of electrons will repel each other and my single box full of electrons will empty rather fast if opened.   Luckily this box is ''magic'' and it also has protons which also repel each other.   But luckily the electrons and the protons hold hands in the box to stop each other being forced out of the box.  However if the box gains more energy , there is a problem , and both of the ''people''  in the box have to hands even tighter, because both people have a tendency of a self destructive nature, so when there is more energy added, both ''people'' increase in their self destructive nature at the same time, they are still  holding hands but become stretched, the stretching increase the density around them, space outside the box now occupied by the box. 
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #36 on: 18/02/2018 19:01:58 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 18:45:52
What does " gain strength and field density." mean to you?
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #37 on: 18/02/2018 19:07:22 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 19:01:58
Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 18:45:52
What does " gain strength and field density." mean to you?

It means that space becomes more solid nearer the body directly proportional to the transverse and going outwards directly proportional the the inverse less solid. The fields of bodies gaining more physicality relative to other fields.

my q.f.s and q.f.d  explains this

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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #38 on: 18/02/2018 19:46:08 »
Quote from: Thebox on 18/02/2018 19:07:22
my q.f.s and q.f.d  explains this
No. They explained nothing. That was the big problem with them.

Also this
Quote from: Thebox on 18/02/2018 19:07:22
It means that space becomes more solid nearer the body directly proportional to the transverse and going outwards directly proportional the the inverse less solid.
means nothing.

Space isn't solid.
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guest39538

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Re: A gas problem?
« Reply #39 on: 18/02/2018 21:24:48 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 18/02/2018 19:46:08


Space isn't solid.

Obviously space itself is not a solid, the fields are the solid,  you did not understand like u wont understand now, just consider the solid ''space'' between two likewise magnetic poles. 
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