The Naked Scientists
  • Login
  • Register
  • Podcasts
      • The Naked Scientists
      • eLife
      • Naked Genetics
      • Naked Astronomy
      • In short
      • Naked Neuroscience
      • Ask! The Naked Scientists
      • Question of the Week
      • Archive
      • Video
      • SUBSCRIBE to our Podcasts
  • Articles
      • Science News
      • Features
      • Interviews
      • Answers to Science Questions
  • Get Naked
      • Donate
      • Do an Experiment
      • Science Forum
      • Ask a Question
  • About
      • Meet the team
      • Our Sponsors
      • Site Map
      • Contact us

User menu

  • Login
  • Register
  • Home
  • Help
  • Search
  • Tags
  • Recent Topics
  • Login
  • Register
  1. Naked Science Forum
  2. On the Lighter Side
  3. New Theories
  4. Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« previous next »
  • Print
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 17   Go Down

Reactionless Drives Possible ?

  • 334 Replies
  • 67667 Views
  • 3 Tags

0 Members and 5 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Bored chemist

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31101
  • Activity:
    11.5%
  • Thanked: 1291 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #20 on: 10/11/2018 22:01:12 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 10/11/2018 21:20:35
It's a simple matter of kinetic energy transfer , which I already broke down . 
No.
It does not matter how many times you say that, it will not be true.
You need to do the momentum calculation.
A ship can lose energy to the rest of the universe by radiating heat.
It can't lose momentum without something to push.
Logged
Please disregard all previous signatures.
 



Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #21 on: 11/11/2018 01:21:24 »
Momentum = Mass × Velocity .
Two ships are inside a giant box , they launch from opposite sides , tethered to giant reels .  Before they collide , the reel-drags activate , bringing the ships to a halt .  Their momentum drops to zero , the box never had any .  Where the bleep did the momentum go !? Come on , I know you got this !
P.M.
Logged
 

Offline Kryptid

  • Global Moderator
  • Naked Science Forum King!
  • ********
  • 8082
  • Activity:
    1.5%
  • Thanked: 514 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #22 on: 11/11/2018 01:37:34 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 01:21:24
Momentum = Mass × Velocity .
Two ships are inside a giant box , they launch from opposite sides , tethered to giant reels .  Before they collide , the reel-drags activate , bringing the ships to a halt .  Their momentum drops to zero , the box never had any .  Where the bleep did the momentum go !? Come on , I know you got this !
P.M.

Assuming that your two ships were identical to each other, then the entire box-ship system had zero momentum throughout your entire scenario. Each individual ship has momentum when considered in isolation, but the fact that they are traveling in opposite directions from each other means that they cancel each other's momentum contribution out from the viewpoint of the entire system. Momentum is a vector quantity: it has both magnitude and direction. The momentum of this system was zero from the beginning to the end.
Logged
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #23 on: 11/11/2018 03:30:27 »
So NOW the overall system is the point ! 
Haha !
Logged
 

Offline Kryptid

  • Global Moderator
  • Naked Science Forum King!
  • ********
  • 8082
  • Activity:
    1.5%
  • Thanked: 514 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #24 on: 11/11/2018 03:43:03 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 03:30:27
So NOW the overall system is the point ! 
Haha !

It always was.
Logged
 



Offline Bored chemist

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31101
  • Activity:
    11.5%
  • Thanked: 1291 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #25 on: 11/11/2018 09:43:17 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 01:21:24
Where the bleep did the momentum go !?
Wrong question.
Where did it come from?
The ship moved forward because its propellers  pushed the water backwards.
That water pushed on the big box.
And the momentum of the water + box + ship system never changed.

But, if there was just 1ship in the box and you were watching carefully from the outside, you would see the box move one way when the ship moved the other way.
Then, when the ship stopped- because it dropped anchor, or the rope went taught or even it just shut off the engines + coasted to a halt; the momentum would be transferred back to the box+ship+water system.
And the box, as viewed from the outside would stop moving.

The box would have moved slightly (in the opposite direction to the ship).
The centre of gravity of the whole system would have stayed still throughout the process.
Logged
Please disregard all previous signatures.
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #26 on: 11/11/2018 12:19:08 »
"It can't lose momentum without something to push ." Your words .
My words : The space-ship's momentum was transferred into additional momentum of the elec-trons , atoms , and molecules , of the reel-drag mechanism .  Heat stores a LOT of energy , that is why a little fuel goes such a long way . 
"Hey Rocky , watch me pull some momentum out of my hat !" .
P.M.
Logged
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31101
  • Activity:
    11.5%
  • Thanked: 1291 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #27 on: 11/11/2018 12:24:54 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 12:19:08
My words : The space-ship's momentum was transferred into additional momentum of the elec-trons , atoms , and molecules , of the reel-drag mechanism .  Heat stores a LOT of energy , that is why a little fuel goes such a long way . 

You really need to get to grips with the idea that energy doesn't have a direction but momentum does.
Logged
Please disregard all previous signatures.
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #28 on: 11/11/2018 12:49:04 »
That one direction becomes many directions when the object's momentum is transferred to a multitude of electrons .  Heat is normally omni-directional .
P.M.
Logged
 



Offline Bored chemist

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31101
  • Activity:
    11.5%
  • Thanked: 1291 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #29 on: 11/11/2018 13:23:34 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 12:49:04
That one direction becomes many directions when the object's momentum is transferred to a multitude of electrons . 
How?
In every single collision of every atom or electron momentum is conserved- essentially if the impact came in from the left, there's no way to stop it being unsymmetrical.
Logged
Please disregard all previous signatures.
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #30 on: 11/11/2018 13:47:48 »
It is not so simple on the atomic level .  The shock of impact causes vibrations and shock waves to propagate back and forth throughout the material .  The components of the material may also shift around , rearranging their directional orientations in the process .  Lastly , electrons in an electron shell act more like a trapped wave , than a circling particle .  They do not preserve directionality the way a free electron does .  This is why when you apply  a disc brake , the resulting heat is omni-directional .
P.M.   
Logged
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31101
  • Activity:
    11.5%
  • Thanked: 1291 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #31 on: 11/11/2018 14:43:30 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 13:47:48
They do not preserve directionality the way a free electron does . 
Yes they do.
Because, at every single stage, momentum is conserved.
You still insist on muddling energy (which is dissipated) and momentum (which isn't- leading to you going over the handlebars if your bike stops suddenly).

All you did then was patronisingly try to say that you are right because you are right.

That's not going to work on a  science web page.
You need to admit that you are incapable of doing the maths.
Logged
Please disregard all previous signatures.
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #32 on: 11/11/2018 18:48:18 »
Your Humble-Pie awaits at "What is the best..." .
Also , they're just different descriptors .  Kinetic energy is simpler to phrase , as in KE=M×V .
Calculators , get used to them !
P.M.
Logged
 



Offline Bored chemist

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31101
  • Activity:
    11.5%
  • Thanked: 1291 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #33 on: 11/11/2018 20:46:00 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 18:48:18
Also , they're just different descriptors
No. They are fundamentally different things- as I already explained. Momentum has a direction; energy does not.
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 18:48:18
Your Humble-Pie awaits at "What is the best..." .
I didn't see any.
I just saw you showing that you can't do high school maths.
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 18:48:18
Calculators , get used to them !

Unlike you, I am well enough used to them to recognise that they don't really do mathematics.
They do arithmetic.
So, once again,
please show us your calculations of the momentum transfers in the scenario you put forward.

Also, don't waste time posting anything else.
Logged
Please disregard all previous signatures.
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #34 on: 11/11/2018 21:54:36 »
Time for YOU to vacate , since you keep begging me to .  Your arguments have NOT disproven MY process , only misrepresented certain parts of it . Your H.S. math has been based on these mis-representations , while mine is based upon obvious , rock-solid , "Arithmetic" .  It's kind of hard to deny that 2 + 2 = 4 , now isn't it ?  To the readers out there , I say "Dive right in and do it yourselves , just use the straght-forward process AND math I've laid out , and you should get observable results .  Ignore the negatives and their smokescreens , and you should be good to go !
P.M.
P.S.- I work Sundays !
Logged
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Naked Science Forum GOD!
  • *******
  • 31101
  • Activity:
    11.5%
  • Thanked: 1291 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #35 on: 11/11/2018 22:10:49 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 21:54:36
It's kind of hard to deny that 2 + 2 = 4 , now isn't it ? 
Nobody sought to do that.
However if someone asks you "what do you get if you multiply 3 by 4?" and you reply
"2+2=4 ", you have sill given the wrong answer.

It's not that you get the arithmetic wrong. It is that you are doing the wrong arithmetic.
Logged
Please disregard all previous signatures.
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #36 on: 11/11/2018 22:33:14 »
Well , be that as it may , 99MJ still outweighs 1MJ any day of the week .  I stand by that fundamental logic , especially since no one has debunked my actual design .  I've been researching it for enough years !  I'm a good sport though , and am willing to entertain others presumptions and beliefs , as long as they don't  bite at me too hard !
P.M.
Note - I consider the "vacate" talk a form of running away .
Logged
 



Offline Kryptid

  • Global Moderator
  • Naked Science Forum King!
  • ********
  • 8082
  • Activity:
    1.5%
  • Thanked: 514 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #37 on: 11/11/2018 23:10:07 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 18:48:18
Kinetic energy is simpler to phrase , as in KE=M×V .

That is not the correct equation for calculating kinetic energy. The correct equation is KE = (1/2)mv2. The equations for momentum and kinetic energy are not synonymous.
Logged
 

Offline Professor Mega-Mind (OP)

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • 681
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Thanked: 6 times
  • Naked Science Forum Newbie
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #38 on: 11/11/2018 23:37:22 »
I said the full equation earlier , that's just the idea , which by the way , I stated for the easy understanding of the uninformed !
P.
Logged
 

Offline Kryptid

  • Global Moderator
  • Naked Science Forum King!
  • ********
  • 8082
  • Activity:
    1.5%
  • Thanked: 514 times
Re: Reactionless Drives Possible ?
« Reply #39 on: 12/11/2018 01:27:38 »
Quote from: Professor Mega-Mind on 11/11/2018 23:37:22
I stated for the easy understanding of the uninformed !

Which means you told them the wrong thing.
Logged
 



  • Print
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 17   Go Up
« previous next »
Tags: new space engine ?  / ff to reply#91  / pg.5 . 
 
There was an error while thanking
Thanking...
  • SMF 2.0.15 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines
    Privacy Policy
    SMFAds for Free Forums
  • Naked Science Forum ©

Page created in 0.81 seconds with 67 queries.

  • Podcasts
  • Articles
  • Get Naked
  • About
  • Contact us
  • Advertise
  • Privacy Policy
  • Subscribe to newsletter
  • We love feedback

Follow us

cambridge_logo_footer.png

©The Naked Scientists® 2000–2017 | The Naked Scientists® and Naked Science® are registered trademarks created by Dr Chris Smith. Information presented on this website is the opinion of the individual contributors and does not reflect the general views of the administrators, editors, moderators, sponsors, Cambridge University or the public at large.