[larens (OP)]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convection

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_exchanger

This exchange makes me realize that a spring emerging into a vacuum is going to build up a cone of solutes whose weight will increase the pressure in the spring. A counter flow exchanger extending radially across the surface from the base of the cone will help maintain conditions at the peripherally - not only thermally, but also with fugacities. Heat piping within the cone can maintain high thermal conductivities to prevent thermal hotspots and blowouts in the exchanger area.

[Kryptid]

The paper you cite is only a thought exercise which proves that you cannot extend Moore's law back that far.

What is the proof?

[Bored chemist]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convection

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_exchanger

" used to transfer heat between two or more fluids. "
The two fluids are...?

[Bored chemist]

fugacities

It's probably fair to say that , given that we are talking about very low pressures, you don't need to worry about activity coefficienst being far from 1 here.

[larens (OP)]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convection

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_exchanger

" used to transfer heat between two or more fluids. "
The two fluids are...?

Two aqueous solutions of different temperature and composition.

fugacities

It's probably fair to say that , given that we are talking about very low pressures, you don't need to worry about activity coefficienst being far from 1 here.

The solutes are in low concentration in the large majority of liquid so we don't need to worry about activity coefficients being far from 1 here either.

[larens (OP)]

The paper you cite is only a thought exercise which proves that you cannot extend Moore's law back that far.

What is the proof?

The proof, which is probabilistic as are all scientific proofs, is that the time lies outside the galactic habitable zone because of low metallicity.

[Bored chemist]

Two aqueous solutions of different temperature and composition.

OK, so what's the "pipe" between them.

I think you need to draw a diagram here.

The solutes are in low concentration in the large majority of liquid so we don't need to worry about activity coefficients being far from 1 here either.

unless magic happens and then it's saturated with ammonium sulphate - with few enough impurities that you get a meaningful ferroelectric effect from the crystals.

You are reaching the point where  Goddidit looks like a less bad explanation.

[Kryptid]

The proof, which is probabilistic as are all scientific proofs, is that the time lies outside the galactic habitable zone because of low metallicity.

I would contend that there is no such thing as scientific proof at all, but anyway...

I see what you are saying. I'm going to take a look around and see if I can find any terrestrial planets in systems where the star is estimate around 10 billion years old or more. Barnard's Star has a planet, but it appears to be at least partly icy. Just how much of the heavier elements is required to produce life?

EDIT: It seems that Kapteyn's Star is around 11 billion years old and possesses a nearly Earth-sized planet with a greater estimated density than the Earth. That would strongly suggest that it contains a significant proportion of heavy elements.

[larens (OP)]

Two aqueous solutions of different temperature and composition.

OK, so what's the "pipe" between them.

There are membranes between two counterflow channels, because I am also tallking about solute exchange, not just thermal exchange. There is no "pipe" between them.

The solutes are in low concentration in the large majority of liquid so we don't need to worry about activity coefficients being far from 1 here either.

unless magic happens and then it's saturated with ammonium sulphate - with few enough impurities that you get a meaningful ferroelectric effect from the crystals.

You are reaching the point where  Goddidit looks like a less bad explanation.

There is desalinization by freezing so solutes are being cycled back into solid phases. God is for people who want to have simplicity without having the "but no simpler than necessary phrase. One needs enough complexity to show that the system remains metastable for a long time. There need to be sealants that prevent the solids from redissolving. After a while polyserine mainly plays this role. In the abiotic stage it is whatever insoluble organic compounds are available.

To add a little complexity photocells are available to produce DC to complement the AC from the ammonium sulfate. These are anatase on calcite. The anatase is deposited from titanocene dicarbonyl dissolved in the oil phase. It is generated by gamma ray evaporation of tholin covered titanium rich refractory grains. The calcite is produced from aragonite solution. Calcite crystals are long and pointed such that they poke through the surface and serve as light tunnels for the anatase semiconductor.

[larens (OP)]

It seems that Kapteyn's Star is around 11 billion years old and possesses a nearly Earth-sized planet with a greater estimated density than the Earth. That would strongly suggest that it contains a significant proportion of heavy elements.

The star only has only 14 % of the Sun's iron concentration. If it is indeed denser than the Earth, than the percentage of elements between helium and iron may be even lower. These are the ones most necessary for life. It is unclear in just how high a concentration these need to be. I say that a gamma ray burst is necessary to produce all the processes that lead to life. For instance, the titanocene dicarbonyl to produce photovoltaic cells could only have been produced by a gamma ray burst. These do not occur until several billion years after stellar formation.

It also does not take just one suitable planetary system for life to spread. It takes a sizable population so that there is a sizable probability that life would survive long enough to make the interstellar trip. To get from the early Milky Way to our epoch would probably take many generations of trips. As metallicity increased the average number of offspring in each generation would increase. If so, why do we not see more evidence of extraterrestrial life? After all we are talking about more than twice the age of the Solar System.

[larens (OP)]

Calcite crystals are long and pointed such that they poke through the surface and serve as light tunnels for the anatase semiconductor.

After spores are formed the calcite also points down through a membrane to the flow of water out of the spring. There are at least three membranes. The top one separates vacuum and oil. The middle one separates oil and water and is where most of the activity takes place. Halloysite nanotubes lie along this membrane and extend into the calcite crystal cutting it in half during reproduction. They are of different types. During cold periods most of the polar fluid freezes leaving a saturated ammonium sulfate/formamide (ASF) solution at both ends and through the middle of one type of nanotube. This sets the fundamental chemistry that eventually leads to the largest part of biochemicals. Proteins have very low solubility in ASF solution, so ribonucleoprotein complexes concentrate in the gap between the two halves of the calcite crystal. This gap is the protocyanobacteria zone.

A second type of nanotube codistills hydrocarbons and water through the nanotube when a there is a temperature difference between the ends. This selects for hydrocarbons with about the same vapor pressure as water. Most notable is benzene which combines with serine to produce phenylalanine. The tubes also move in this process, mainly longitudinally. The bottom membrane is selectively permeable and separates water flowing in opposite directions. With a transverse current this concentrates metal ions to be used in the biochemistry. This is the proto-Deinococcus zone because it is cannibalized during the reproduction process.

When a layer of dust has collected above the top membrane it is punctured and oil permeates the layer. A new hydrocarbon membrane then begins to form by UV irradiation so the function of each layer moves up a step. Proto-virus/spores invade the newly refunctioned layers to perform the metamorphosis. The volume with nanotubes surrounding the calcite crystal, including some vertical ones, is the protoeukayote zone. The nanotubes will eventually be replaced by microtubules. The outlying areas are the protoarchaea zone.

Nitric oxide from the gamma ray blast was the original oxidant. As it was replaced by electrooxidation, surplus NO was used to oxidize methane. The catalyst here was the initial foundation for both nitrogen fixation and chlorophyll production. NO was the signal that new dust was being introduced into the system and still is the signal for Deinococcus to reproduce. Glass droplets with a high water content were formed after the blast because they were in a high H environment. On devitrification the water was released to hydrolyze the absorbed poly-NS and HCN. This is the source of the crucial ASF solution.

[Bored chemist]

To add a little complexity photocells are available to produce DC to complement the AC from the ammonium sulfate. These are anatase on calcite. The anatase is deposited from titanocene dicarbonyl dissolved in the oil phase. It is generated by gamma ray evaporation of tholin covered titanium rich refractory grains. The calcite is produced from aragonite solution. Calcite crystals are long and pointed such that they poke through the surface and serve as light tunnels for the anatase semiconductor.

You just jumped the shark.

[larens (OP)]

To add a little complexity photocells are available to produce DC to complement the AC from the ammonium sulfate. These are anatase on calcite. The anatase is deposited from titanocene dicarbonyl dissolved in the oil phase. It is generated by gamma ray evaporation of tholin covered titanium rich refractory grains. The calcite is produced from aragonite solution. Calcite crystals are long and pointed such that they poke through the surface and serve as light tunnels for the anatase semiconductor.

You just jumped the shark.

Jumping sharks is necessary to prevent collisions when kitesurfing. What do you have to say about my last reply, which gives a lot more detail about how my model fits modern biology?

[Bored chemist]

What do you have to say about my last reply,

I'm not bothering to read it.
Not once you explained just how far-fetched your house of cards was.

[larens (OP)]

What do you have to say about my last reply,

I'm not bothering to read it.
Not once you explained just how far-fetched your house of cards was.

Of course not; it is not a house of cards. For instance, one of the problems of starting photosynthesis from a photovoltaic cell is getting the semiconductor pure enough. The best way to solve the problem is by depositing it from a hydrophobic chemical. So I showed under what conditions the natural process of a gamma ray burst generates the hydrophobic chemical  titanocene dicarbonyl. As for the calcite crystal I just suggest you look at some of the online images of large, beautifully shaped calcite crystals. By the way, anatase is the crystalline form of titania that naturally deposits on calcite.

[larens (OP)]

 

Fortunately the community of Halloysite nanotube creatures at the top has learned how to regulate the nuclear reactor so that it does not create a geyser. They add chloride as a neutron absorber when they detect radioiodine.

The nuclear control system works as follows:

Radioactive iodine-131 with a half life of 8 days binds to tyrosine within electroluminant material at the bottom of the calcite crystal. The light generated by the beta rays passes to the photovoltaic cells remaining on the sides of the bottom half of the crystal. The electricity passes by nanowires  to the locations of deposits of neutron absorbing materials, e.g., chlorine and boron. To prevent them from redissolving these have been covered by membranes that are sutured by diselenide bonds in selenoprotein K. When the electricity reduces these bonds the protein splits and the membrane ruptures releasing the neutron poisons and reducing the power of the reactor.

This system was added after the heat from radioisotopes aluminum-26 and iron-60 diminished, which was long after the basic genetic code had been fixed. A stop codon was given an alternative interpretation as a codon for selenocysteine, which contains one half of the diselenide bond. The purpose of selenoprotein K today is unknown. Its high redox potential and intrinsically disordered character were tailored to its original purpose. The electroluminant material today is in the coat of Deinococcus Radiodurans, the general purpose extremophile. A selenium containing molecule regulates the removal of iodine from tyrosine today. Iodine-131 removed itself because it decays to the inert gas xenon.

[Bored chemist]

Of course not; it is not a house of cards.

If there was a satellite, and if it was in the right place at the right time , and if it had the right springs and if the calcite gre in the wrong shaped crystals and if the temperature was right and if the vapour pressure was right and if the layer of goo had the right properties and if the ammonium sulphate grew into clean crystals (It reacts with calcite, btw) and if the universe decided to favour it with titanocene dicarbonyl then there's still a stack more cards to go.

[larens (OP)]

Of course not; it is not a house of cards.

If there was a satellite, and if it was in the right place at the right time , and if it had the right springs and if the calcite gre in the wrong shaped crystals and if the temperature was right and if the vapour pressure was right and if the layer of goo had the right properties and if the ammonium sulphate grew into clean crystals (It reacts with calcite, btw) and if the universe decided to favour it with titanocene dicarbonyl then there's still a stack more cards to go.

Well, so far the data easily satisfies all the ifs, (except the calcite has the right shaped crystals). The games on! Keep dealing the cards. (I am aware, btw, that calcite reacts with ammonium sulfate. The calcite automatically gets coated with an insoluble coating of anatase).

[Kryptid]

Of possible relevance: https://phys.org/news/2020-05-cosmic-rays-left-indelible-imprint.html

[larens (OP)]

Of possible relevance: https://phys.org/news/2020-05-cosmic-rays-left-indelible-imprint.html

This one of the most stupid articles I've seen. Maybe I should give it an award. If the chirality of electrons from cosmic rays can influence us, why should they outweigh the vastly larger number of electrons in the matter around us? To compound the stupidity the author lets us assume that the whole cosmic ray shower carries the chirality of matter. The shower is produced by the energy of the ray, independent of its type, so there are equal numbers of particles of opposite type making the entire shower achiral! (This assumes the cosmic ray that induced the shower is a photon or is baryonic, which is generally the case. (Baryons cannot pass through the atmosphere without being stopped.)  If it happens to be an electron, the shower will just have the one unit of chirality of that one electron.)