[Bored chemist]

Under the definition where he lost because more people voted for the other guy, he lost.
On the definition that he's not the president, he lost.
The election wasn't "stolen"; it was squandered by that orange idiot.

It's being appealed.  So much for British justice Assange is in prison and being tortured by Britian with out any crime committed. His year for skipping a bail hearing is over.

All that time in jail because the Americans were trying to extradite him.
You should find out who was in charge and complain about them.

[Bored chemist]

in no way is Biden better,

Not saying he will build a wall is better.
Not bragging about grabbing woman by the ***** is better
Not inciting insurrection is better.

[Bored chemist]

You are a toady for the swamp.

Donald is the swamp.

[Bored chemist]

What criminal convictions?

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-associates-prison-faced-criminal-charges/story?id=68358219
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-bannon-associates-factbox-idUSKBN25G1YU

[Kryptid]

Foreign interference would have been only a part of the investigation. No evidence of widespread domestic voter fraud was found either.

If you are going to define a "stolen election" as one where politicians and other powerful interest groups have manipulated public perceptions, information, and laws in order to influence the results, then there had probably never been a presidential election in the United States that wasn't stolen.

[evan_au]

Quote from: Jolly2 on Today at 16:38:20
This article is a total confession that they rigged the election to prevent the population choosing a leader the establishment didn't want.

Explaining to voters that Trump is incompetent is not "rigging the election".

I disagree with both of you.

From my reading of this article, the people involved in this campaign spanned the whole spectrum of US politics
- That means that some of them wanted Trump to win
- That is why this group did not try to support one candidate over another (like all political parties do, and some lobby groups do)

The bipartisan goal of this group was to:
- Ensure that processes were in place so the results of the election could be stated with confidence (and proven)
- Ensure that as many eligible voters as possible were able to vote
        - some previous US elections found people who turned up to vote had their names struck off the list because they were supposedly dead;
       - or turned away because they didn't own a driver's license - because, obviously, car ownership is a better indication of being a True American than your citizenship...
       - funny enough, this tended to happen more often to African-Americans in the Southern Confederate states
- This became doubly important with COVID-19; many older people did not feel safe going to a crowded polling place in person, and many of the polling staff were retirees who didn't feel safe doing a day's work at the polling station.
- This had shut down a lot of polling stations earlier in 2020, leaving people with nowhere to vote.

So they worked with multiple states to inform people on the realistic options for postal votes that exist in most states
- This article claims that something like half of the ballots were cast by mail-in votes.
- Sounds very sensible in a pandemic!
- They also worked with media and state governments to set the expectation that it would take longer to get a result this year
      - The US is used to election results being reported as soon as the polling station closes
      - With "first past the post" voting and electronic polling machines, you close the doors and read the answer from the machine(s)
      - With postal voting, there is a lot of manual handling and identity checks, so it takes a lot longer
      - Trump always said that COVID was nothing, so Trump's supporters boldly went to polling stations in person; so the instant electronic results favored Trump
      - Biden's supporters knew that COVID was real, so they preferred to use mail-in votes. These were added to the tally hours later
      - That's why Trump's supporters wanted to "stop the count" before the mail votes could be counted

[Jolly2 (OP)]

Quote from: Jolly2 on Today at 16:38:20
This article is a total confession that they rigged the election to prevent the population choosing a leader the establishment didn't want.

Explaining to voters that Trump is incompetent is not "rigging the election".

I disagree with both of you.

From my reading of this article, the people involved in this campaign spanned the whole spectrum of US politics
- That means that some of them wanted Trump to win
- That is why this group did not try to support one candidate over another (like all political parties do, and some lobby groups do)

Factually incorrect as the news related to Hunter Biden shows. They suppressed the news story and still are, not only did many news sourses refuse to report on the story, Facebook and Twitter both banned reference on their platforms.

They clearly worked to promote negative news about Trump and suppress negative news about Biden, including stories of women who claimed Biden sexually assaulted them, so much for "me too" when it comes to the democratic nominee.

The bipartisan goal of this group was to:
- Ensure that processes were in place so the results of the election could be stated with confidence (and proven)
- Ensure that as many eligible voters as possible were able to vote

Even dead ones

        - some previous US elections found people who turned up to vote had their names struck off the list because they were supposedly dead;
       - or turned away because they didn't own a driver's license - because, obviously, car ownership is a better indication of being a True American than your citizenship...

In this recent election many people were told on arriving at the polling station that they had already voted.

       - funny enough, this  more often to African-Americans in the Southern Confederate states
- This became doubly important with COVID-19; many older people did not feel safe going to a crowded polling place in person, and many of the polling staff were retirees who didn't feel safe doing a day's work at the polling station.

An excuse and a lie, as was stated repeatedly with social distancing and masks there was no risk in going to vote normally.

- This had shut down a lot of polling stations earlier in 2020, leaving people with nowhere to vote.

Shut down by Democrats how convenient.

So they worked with multiple states to inform people on the realistic options for postal votes that exist in most states
- This article claims that something like half of the ballots were cast by mail-in votes.
- Sounds very sensible in a pandemic!

Well it's all.about appearances. Reality is once a ballot is separated from it envelope, it is impossible to identify whose ballot it was or if it was legitimate,  hence anyone inclined to do so can easily add ballots that cannot be shown fraudulent.

- They also worked with media and state governments to set the expectation that it would take longer to get a result this year
      - The US is used to election results being reported as soon as the polling station closes
      - With "first past the post" voting and electronic polling machines, you close the doors and read the answer from the machine(s)
      - With postal voting, there is a lot of manual handling and identity checks, so it takes a lot longer

There should have been more checks, the law changes this cabal imposed, removed many of those checks.

      - Trump always said that COVID was nothing, so Trump's supporters boldly went to polling stations in person; so the instant electronic results favored Trump
      - Biden's supporters knew that COVID was real, so they preferred to use mail-in votes. These were added to the tally hours later
      - That's why Trump's supporters wanted to "stop the count" before the mail votes could be counted

No many states counted the mail in ballots first, but other states had allowed ballots to be received days after the election had finished the calls to stop counting were because before the law changes all countable bailouts had to be in on election day.

As I pointed out before once a ballot is removed from its envelope, there is no way to know if it is legitimate or not, hence the people calling for the count to stop were concerned fake ballots were being added.

The reality that they stopped counting during election night is also highly suspicious,  some have suggested they stopped counting to check the numbers needed to guarantee a Biden victory, then added them.

Bottom line the democracy this Cabal was defending is a democracy where faking elections results, is demanded and an essential element of it.

[Jolly2 (OP)]

Foreign interference would have been only a part of the investigation. No evidence of widespread domestic voter fraud was found either.

If you are going to define a "stolen election" as one where politicians and other powerful interest groups have manipulated public perceptions, information, and laws in order to influence the results, then there had probably never been a presidential election in the United States that wasn't stolen.

I know just Trump in 2016 which was an accident.

[Jolly2 (OP)]

You are a toady for the swamp.

Donald is the swamp.

Clearly demonstrated by the FBI CIA NSA and the Democrats inventing Russia gate to attack him. The swamp is the American establishment

[alancalverd]

Trump rigged the election. He said so. Then he lost, thus demonstrating his utter incompetence. Or was he lying when he said he was certain to win?

[Bored chemist]

Clearly demonstrated by the FBI CIA NSA and the Democrats inventing Russia gate

No
You forgot that you already showed that Trump is on Russia's side- his support for the fake Venezuelan president proves it.

And, of course, though you didn't seem to know about it, Trump's allies are involved with Russia.

GEORGE PAPADOPOULOS
The former Trump campaign adviser was sentenced in September 2018 to 14 days in prison after pleading guilty in October 2017 to lying to the FBI about his contacts with Russian officials and a Maltese professor who told him the Russians had “dirt” on Clinton.

And, just to add to the entertainment, here's a good point.


Trumpy.jpg (116.36 kB . 941x709 - viewed 2478 times)

[Jolly2 (OP)]

Clearly demonstrated by the FBI CIA NSA and the Democrats inventing Russia gate

No
You forgot that you already showed that Trump is on Russia's side- his support for the fake Venezuelan president proves it.

And, of course, though you didn't seem to know about it, Trump's allies are involved with Russia.

At no time did I suggest Trump supported Maduro. In one of our last discussions Trumps actions against Venezuela were part of my critic of his presidency.

So if you are going to comment you should atleast have a clue what you are talking about.

Trump massively sanctioned Venezuela,  he also supported Guaido. Trump even tried to stage a military cu against the Venezuelan government which failed and lead to the arrest of the military people involved.

Biden is doing this same thing as Trump and supporting Guaido.

Trumps failed cu attempt against Mauro
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-53686509

Biden's position is worse then Trumps,  Trump was nominating an elected official to be the president of Venezuela,  Guaido has since lost that position in the last election,  Biden is now nominating a member of the Venezuelan public with no public support to be president.

His choice to do so, shows not only his intention to continue Americas policy of cu attempts,  it also shows an utterly simplistic reading of the situation.  Let's see if he drops Trump's sanctions on the country. They are not even allowed medicines, apparently socialism destroys countries,  those that claim it somehow ignore the horror sanctions impose.

GUAIDO SUPPORTS US SANCTIONS
https://www.aljazeera.com/videos/2019/8/8/juan-guaido-supports-us-sanctions-against-venezuela-government

The idea anyone could support sanctions on his own country that stops children getting medications is bad enough but coming from someone claiming they should be president is a testament to just how unfit Guaido is for the office he claims to deserve, the guys a disgrace. Somehow mr chemist supports this, for shame.

If you are gonna keep being a toady troll for the swamp you need to research better.

GEORGE PAPADOPOULOS
The former Trump campaign adviser was sentenced in September 2018 to 14 days in prison after pleading guilty in October 2017 to lying to the FBI about his contacts with Russian officials and a Maltese professor who told him the Russians had “dirt” on Clinton.

And, just to add to the entertainment, here's a good point.


Trumpy.jpg (116.36 kB . 941x709 - viewed 2478 times)

They also arrest people for lying.  Really doesnt change that Russia gate and the alleged hacking of the DNC was nonsense,  as was Russian interference in the election, as was the John pedesta "hack" and the steal dossier.

[Jolly2 (OP)]

Trump rigged the election. He said so. Then he lost, thus demonstrating his utter incompetence. Or was he lying when he said he was certain to win?

If the Cabal hadn't acted the way they did he would have won. It's their confessed reason to have acted, "democracy" isnt self sustaining, it needs a Cabal to work.

Of course only the secound definition of democracy given by
chomsky needs that.

[Jolly2 (OP)]

¼

What criminal convictions?

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-associates-prison-faced-criminal-charges/story?id=68358219
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-bannon-associates-factbox-idUSKBN25G1YU

Yes convictions. Not allegations

[Jolly2 (OP)]

.

It's being appealed.  So much for British justice Assange is in prison and being tortured by Britian with out any crime committed. His year for skipping a bail hearing is over.

All that time in jail because the Americans were trying to extradite him.
You should find out who was in charge and complain about them.

The British didn't need to arrest him, over extradition, they dont need to keep him in prison now, they certainly dont need to be torturing him.

Extradition isnt a justification  to arrest and hold him. This is Britian actively persecuting a journalist.

[Jolly2 (OP)]

in no way is Biden better,

Not saying he will build a wall is better.

Not the be outdone Some are claiming Bidens surveillance wall will be worse.

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/biden-immigration-surveillance/

Not bragging about grabbing woman by the ***** is better

Sorry Trump said women LET you grab them, if you're famous. Hence the word LET. Which was a comment made while joking with others it was a comment.

Biden actually has women claiming he physically assaulted them. Trump is words, Biden is actions.  Biden is worse by far

Not inciting insurrection is better.

Which trump didn't do.

During the speech he said, "let's walk peacefully to  the Capitol"

[Hayseed]

Politics is like science and journalism.  The participants start believing their own lies.

[Jolly2 (OP)]

Politics is like science and journalism.  The participants start believing their own lies.

I don't agree, politicians know they are lying,  they have to keep a track on their lies or they will get shown up.

[Bored chemist]

This is Britian actively persecuting a journalist.

Yes it is.
And they were doing it long before Biden was elected so it's not because Biden is president, is it?
It's irrelevant.

[Bored chemist]

¼

What criminal convictions?

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-associates-prison-faced-criminal-charges/story?id=68358219
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-bannon-associates-factbox-idUSKBN25G1YU

Yes convictions. Not allegations

Yes convidtions e.g.
Manafort was found guilty on a slew of financial crime charges related to his lobbying work in Ukraine and is currently serving an 81-month prison sentence. Meanwhile, Gates, who had struck a plea deal early on in the case, was recently sentenced to 36 months probation and 45 days in jail