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With the pond, the waves travel relative to the water which acts like a medium. There is no medium for light traveling in a vacuum. So the waves made by a boat in the pond is not a valid analogy.But neither does light behave exactly like a bullet fired from a gun according to Newtonian physics. A bullet fired from a moving train has its speed increased relative to the ground as measured from the ground, light does not. While the observer would measure it traveling at an angle along a diagonal, they would also measure it as moving at c along the diagonal.You can also examine the train scenario by reversing the roles. Put the source on the ground and have the observer on the "moving" train. The train observer will measure the light as traveling at a diagonal relative to the train. In other words, it doesn't matter which one, the source or observer, you assume is moving, the observer observes exactly the same thing, and he can't tell which one is "really" moving. The very idea of who is "really moving" and who is "really stationary" is meaningless.
However, if you plug the speed of light into the SR equations, photons should not have a variety of wavelengths.
SR does not say that
Quote from: Bored chemist on 29/05/2021 19:15:44SR does not say thatI kind of admire you for taking the time to read Puppypowers ramblings, hopefully you did not read CrazyScientist post in the same time frame, that could have a negative impact on anyone's IQ. I think there should be a pseudoscience overload warning when those two have consecutive posts.
Quote from: Origin on 29/05/2021 19:57:48Quote from: Bored chemist on 29/05/2021 19:15:44SR does not say thatI kind of admire you for taking the time to read Puppypowers ramblings, hopefully you did not read CrazyScientist post in the same time frame, that could have a negative impact on anyone's IQ. I think there should be a pseudoscience overload warning when those two have consecutive posts. They should both be kicked off for trolling.
Years ago I had the theory that the wave/particle nature of photons, was grounded on the particle nature of the photon, moving at the speed of light, while also being a spinning particle. Since spin is an acceleration, it has the units of d/t/t. The spin contains an extra dimension of time, compared to photon's linear velocity at the speed of light; d/t. The photon spin and extra time potential is connected to the frequency of its wave nature.
If we had a wheel on a wagon, that is rotating as the wagon moves forward, with the hub of the wheel and wagon moving at the speed of light, there will be points in the rotation of the perimeter of the wheel, that will exceed the speed of light. The reason is the perimeter of the wheel has to get ahead of the hub each turn of the wheel, for the wagon to move forward.
Since the speed of light cannot be exceeded in space-time, that fraction of the rotation that exceeds the speed of light, will not be seen within its particle state.
Rather it will appear as the wavelength in space connected to the hub frequency. This is consistent with the uncertainty principle and wave functions. The particle has uncertainty due to cyclically and partially exceeding the speed of light. The wavelength is connected to the uncertainty void, and helps fills in the wave probability volume.
The paradox of photons is that they move at the speed of light, yet show a variety states in terms of wavelength and frequency; radio waves to gamma rays. However, if you plug the speed of light into the SR equations, photons should not have a variety of wavelengths. They should all be the same due to the discontinuity in time and space that v=c creates in the math. The photon does not behave like something in a pure c-reference according to the math. Something causes it to behave more like matter, while moving at the speed of light.
The work around is again connected to the particle rotation. Since this is an acceleration, the rotation causes the speed of light particle to contain extra time potential, so the photon is not fully definable by SR; d/t. It becomes more definable by GR; d/t/t. This allows a wider range of finite expressions in space-time. Photons are impacted by gravity, due to the extra time dimension of its rotational acceleration. The result can be a time or frequency shift; inner clock changes time and the wavelength follows.
When photons interacts with matter, they immediately decelerate from the speed of light to the velocity of the matter into which they are absorbed. When matter gives off photons, we have an immediate acceleration to a final velocity at the speed of light. The difference between each state is time potential; d/t <--> d/t/t* , due to t*. While the quantum leap in each direction, appears to be connected to the hidden aspect of the particle rotation, from which the wave emerges.
Like a lot of quantum physics, the principles behind squeezing light involve some mind-boggling concepts.It begins with the fact that wherever there are light particles, there are also associated electromagnetic fluctuations. This is a sort of static which scientists refer to as “noise”. Typically, the more intense light gets, the higher the noise. Dim the light, and the noise goes down.But strangely, at a very fine quantum level, the picture changes. Even in a situation where there is no light, electromagnetic noise still exists. These are called vacuum fluctuations. While classical physics tells us that in the absence of a light source we will be in perfect darkness, quantum mechanics tells us that there is always some of this ambient fluctuation."If you look at a flat surface, it seems smooth and flat, but we know that if you really zoom in to a super-fine level, it probably isn't perfectly smooth at all," Atature said. "The same thing is happening with vacuum fluctuations. Once you get into the quantum world, you start to get this fine print. It looks like there are zero photons present, but actually there is just a tiny bit more than nothing."Importantly, these vacuum fluctuations are always present and provide a base limit to the noise of a light field. Even lasers, the most perfect light source known, carry this level of fluctuating noise.This is when things get stranger still, however, because, in the right quantum conditions, that base limit of noise can be lowered even further. This lower-than-nothing, or lower-than-vacuum, state is what physicists call squeezing.In the Cambridge experiment, the researchers achieved this by shining a faint laser beam on to their artificial atom, the quantum dot. This excited the quantum dot and led to the emission of a stream of individual photons. Although normally, the noise associated with this photonic activity is greater than a vacuum state, when the dot was only excited weakly the noise associated with the light field actually dropped, becoming less than the supposed baseline of vacuum fluctuations.Explaining why this happens involves some highly complex quantum physics. At its core, however, is a rule known as Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle. This states that in any situation in which a particle has two linked properties, only one can be measured and the other must be uncertain.In the normal world of classical physics, this rule does not apply. If an object is moving, we can measure both its position and momentum, for example, to understand where it is going and how long it is likely to take getting there. The pair of properties – position and momentum – are linked.In the strange world of quantum physics, however, the situation changes. Heisenberg states that only one part of a pair can ever be measured, and the other must remain uncertain.
Personally, I consider both those options as completely wrong and physically impossible.
Whatever you think about puppypower, he's the only one in this thread, who tries.to have an actual scientific discussion with me ... Oof?
Quote from: CrazyScientist on 29/05/2021 02:31:39Personally, I consider both those options as completely wrong and physically impossible.Can you do better than an "argument from personal disbelief"?For example, can you show us actual reasoning, based on observed facts?
Quote from: CrazyScientist on 29/05/2021 21:18:07Whatever you think about puppypower, he's the only one in this thread, who tries.to have an actual scientific discussion with me ... Oof?So, the only one who engages in "scientific" conversation with you, is the one how gets stuff just plain wrong.You might want to think about the implications of that.
Quote from: Bored chemist on 07/06/2021 08:45:26Quote from: CrazyScientist on 29/05/2021 02:31:39Personally, I consider both those options as completely wrong and physically impossible.Can you do better than an "argument from personal disbelief"?For example, can you show us actual reasoning, based on observed facts?How nice of you to give me a question, which has something to do with actual science - and not only with some subjective impressions. Sure, that I can show you some actual reasoning! I'm sure, that you know what is "wave interference": As you probably know, EM waves which propagate in vacuum don't interact with each other - and without the presence of matter as an intermediate medium, there's no physical limit to the number of EM waves, that can occupy one volume of space.- in shortcut, theres no critical limit to the light, which is trapped inside a spherical mirror. Does it satisfy you in some part?
EM waves which propagate in vacuum don't interact with each other
Sadly, in this thread, I don't have the luxury of choice, when it comes to any scientific discussion...
Quote from: CrazyScientist on 07/06/2021 09:07:57Quote from: Bored chemist on 07/06/2021 08:45:26Quote from: CrazyScientist on 29/05/2021 02:31:39Personally, I consider both those options as completely wrong and physically impossible.Can you do better than an "argument from personal disbelief"?For example, can you show us actual reasoning, based on observed facts?How nice of you to give me a question, which has something to do with actual science - and not only with some subjective impressions. Sure, that I can show you some actual reasoning! I'm sure, that you know what is "wave interference": As you probably know, EM waves which propagate in vacuum don't interact with each other - and without the presence of matter as an intermediate medium, there's no physical limit to the number of EM waves, that can occupy one volume of space.- in shortcut, theres no critical limit to the light, which is trapped inside a spherical mirror. Does it satisfy you in some part?But we know from E= MC^2 that the energy trapped in the mirror has mass so we know that thisQuote from: CrazyScientist on 07/06/2021 09:07:57EM waves which propagate in vacuum don't interact with each otherIs true in (very) classical physics, but not in GR.And that's what causes the gravitational collapse.That's why the science says what it does; if photon pressure doesn't break the shell then gravity will collapse it.
Quote from: puppypower on 29/05/2021 18:52:39However, if you plug the speed of light into the SR equations, photons should not have a variety of wavelengths. SR does not say that.
That's why the science says what it does; if photon pressure doesn't break the shell then gravity will collapse it.
OK, the inside of the sphere is perfectly-reflecting, and there's an ideal optical diode to let light in but keep it inside. As you keep the light turned on, the photon density in the sphere goes up and up, of course. It "looks" brighter and brighter, but you don't see that because the light can't escape. After turning the light off, it stays bright, the photons just keep bouncing around. If you "stick your head in" to look, you see a bright uniform glow that quickly dies away because your head and eyes are absorbing all the photons.But do the photons bounce around forever? No!! Even a perfectly-reflective sphere will still interact with the light, because of radiation pressure. Each time a photon bounces off a wall, the wall gets kicked backwards, gaining energy at the expense of the photon (on average). Light can't produce a smooth force, only a series of kicks with shot noise statistics, because one photon hits the wall at a time. These kicks eventually heat up the walls, and cool down the photons. (From the photon's point of view, the photon frequency is going down because of Doppler-shifts during reflection off the moving walls.) Eventually everything equilibrates to a uniform temperature, hotter than the sphere started out. I don't know how long that would take. [In any realistic circumstance this radiation pressure effect can be ignored, because it is much less important than the "reflection is not 100% perfect" effect.
Nothing will happen. because, you are relaying the waves oscillations only through the photon's simple harmonic motions linearly by p- wave only(pressure wave). Not any mass at all. Here, only the moment is conserved, without any increase in mass. The mass doesn't gain any thing at all,At the focal point, if the light is of thermal,the heat developed is diluted into the space. If it is of plasma light, led or bio luminous cold light, there won't be any heat also.In opposite collisions, they absorbs and or relinquishes . The waves balances their echo system well during compacts either by demoting or by promoting within themselves amicably. like two slit interference or crowd polarisation.