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  4. What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
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What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?

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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #20 on: 17/04/2023 03:43:54 »
The second video demonstrates electric spark generation and blockage.
Idea for follow up videos : To use various materials with different thickness as the barrier between the electrodes.
« Last Edit: 17/04/2023 03:48:04 by hamdani yusuf »
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #21 on: 17/04/2023 03:47:07 »
The third video demonstrates the effect of the high voltage generator on a gas discharge lamp.
Idea for follow up videos : To use various materials with different sizes and shapes as the electrode to transfer energy to the gas discharge lamp.
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #22 on: 18/04/2023 12:51:58 »
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 17/04/2023 03:47:07
The third video demonstrates the effect of the high voltage generator on a gas discharge lamp.
Can anyone try to explain how a steel pliers can make the UVC lamp glows brighter?
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #23 on: 19/04/2023 13:11:17 »
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 18/04/2023 12:51:58
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 17/04/2023 03:47:07
The third video demonstrates the effect of the high voltage generator on a gas discharge lamp.
Can anyone try to explain how a steel pliers can make the UVC lamp glows brighter?
More surface area thus more capacitance, thus more coupling of the electricity into the lamp.
What I can't explain is why you choose to expose yourself to hard UV for no reason.
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #24 on: 20/04/2023 10:58:52 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 19/04/2023 13:11:17
More surface area thus more capacitance, thus more coupling of the electricity into the lamp.
Which factor do you think is more significant? Is it the capacitance, or the coupling?
If a capacitor is added to the output of the generator, will it affect the glow?
The lamp glows brightest when its electrode is in contact with the pliers.
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #25 on: 20/04/2023 11:42:43 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 19/04/2023 13:11:17
What I can't explain is why you choose to expose yourself to hard UV for no reason.
Thanks for your concern. The reason is I didn't have a better alternative to demonstrate glowing of gas discharge lamp.
The lamp is designed for use in aquarium, thus I think it's safe enough for humans. Further precautions are keeping the duration of exposure short, and avoid staring directly to the glowing lamp. During the experiment, observation was made through the smart phone display.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #26 on: 20/04/2023 13:05:02 »
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitive_coupling
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #27 on: 23/04/2023 13:20:28 »
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 20/04/2023 10:58:52
If a capacitor is added to the output of the generator, will it affect the glow?
It seems like the best way to find out is by just do it. But it may took some time for me to replace the faulty generator, and purchase the high voltage capacitor. Perhaps building DIY capacitor can also be considered.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #28 on: 23/04/2023 14:15:56 »
Do you understand that the electricity only gets through the glass because  the gas in the tube; the glass tube wall, and the wire or pliers outside the tube form a capacitor?
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #29 on: 29/04/2023 07:32:55 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 23/04/2023 14:15:56
Do you understand that the electricity only gets through the glass because  the gas in the tube; the glass tube wall, and the wire or pliers outside the tube form a capacitor?
Have you watched the video thoroughly?
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 20/04/2023 10:58:52
The lamp glows brightest when its electrode is in contact with the pliers.
Note that without the pliers, contact of lamp electrode and generator electrode didn't show significant glow.
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #30 on: 02/05/2023 15:15:33 »
Meanwhile, I've repeated the experiments using another model of high voltage generator. It has similar basic structure as previous one. But it also has notable differences.
The oscillator part is visibly more complex than previous one. There are more electronic components, including some integrated circuits. I guess they are for power regulation or overcurrent protection.
The output electrodes of the voltage multiplier is connected to a 1 nF capacitor rated at 20kV, without dissipating resistor. The advertised voltage is 15 kV, compared to 400 kV in previous model. This is reflected by the length of the spark it produces, which is notably shorter than before.
Interestingly, it can somehow produce brighter glow in a UVC lamp tube.
« Last Edit: 03/05/2023 13:13:03 by hamdani yusuf »
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #31 on: 04/05/2023 05:27:12 »
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 20/04/2023 11:42:43
The lamp is designed for use in aquarium, thus I think it's safe enough for humans. Further precautions are keeping the duration of exposure short, and avoid staring directly to the glowing lamp. During the experiment, observation was made through the smart phone display.
Another important thing as consideration, is that UVC lamp tube doesn't have fluorescent coating which may interact with the electromagnetic field applied, and make the problem more complicated. 

Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 13/11/2021 08:34:33
A few months ago I've made an experiment investigating microwave transmission through plasma.  At the time, I found a counterfeit money detector with UVA source from a gas discharge lamp. The experiment can show a weak but convincing difference of opacity in microwave frequency between on and off UVA lamp.
Unfortunately, the plasma inside the lamp is not the only electrically conductive material there. There's also phosphor coating inside of the lamp glass which may also change its conductivity when powered on..
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 15/11/2021 02:51:46
Here it is.



Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 22/11/2021 09:25:13
Quote from: Bored chemist on 13/11/2021 12:14:42
If you want to be really certain, you can buy a UV C bulb with no phosphor.
You will probably want to screen the UV it produces.
That's what I did last week. I've done the recording of the experiment, but the editing and uploading may take a while.
For safety precaution, I only power it up for short durations at a time.
You can wait for the video to be available. But if you have no patience or time to watch it later, you can sneak a peek at the results.

Spoiler: show

- the UV lamp doesn't produce detectable microwave.
- when unpowered, the lamp (with the gas in it) is almost completely transparent to microwave.
- when powered on, the lamp becomes slightly opaque to microwave.
 
I thus conclude that in previous experiment with UVA lamp, the phosphor coating obstructed the microwave transmission because it's partially conductive in microwave frequency. But when it's fluorescing, it becomes slightly less conductive.

Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 24/11/2021 09:51:13
Here it is.
This is a follow up of the experiment in previous video. This time the gas-discharge lamp has no phosphor coating, so the effect on the microwave transmission should be produced specifically by the phase change of gas in the lamp into plasma.


Please let me know if you want something to check or verify regarding these experiments.

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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #32 on: 04/05/2023 05:34:58 »
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 02/05/2023 15:15:33
Meanwhile, I've repeated the experiments using another model of high voltage generator. It has similar basic structure as previous one. But it also has notable differences.
The oscillator part is visibly more complex than previous one. There are more electronic components, including some integrated circuits. I guess they are for power regulation or overcurrent protection.
The output electrodes of the voltage multiplier is connected to a 1 nF capacitor rated at 20kV, without dissipating resistor. The advertised voltage is 15 kV, compared to 400 kV in previous model. This is reflected by the length of the spark it produces, which is notably shorter than before.
Interestingly, it can somehow produce brighter glow in a UVC lamp tube.
I think this video can explain what happened with my experiments above.

Closing a POWER ARC Switch with a WEAK ARC (LATITY-012)

The higher voltage generator can produce higher voltage when there's no load, but once the electric current flows, the voltage and power drop significantly.
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #33 on: 22/05/2023 13:34:36 »
This is the model I used to replace the broken high voltage generator used in previous videos. Its abilities to produce continuous arc and withstand short circuited load are important advantages over the previous model.

Quote
Model Number : Boost Coil Module
Brand Name : NCVHRT
Origin : Mainland China

Product Description
100% Brand New and High Quality
Voltage within 9V can work for a long time continuous arcing for 1 day.
When the voltage is longer than 9V, it is necessary to add heat to the fan.
5 ~ 12V power supply, available 2-3 18650 battery series power supply, or ordinary router power supply or 9V/12V power supply.
Power must be supplied within the nominal voltage range for proper operation! If the voltage is too low, the module will undervoltage and stop working. Never reverse, overpressure, otherwise it will damage the module or even cause the capacitor to explode!
This product poses a certain risk to non-professionals and must be operated in strict accordance with the electrical specifications!
Note: This product is a semi-finished product without a shell. It is recommended that it be potted with paraffin or epoxy to improve durability.

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Input voltage: 5V~12V
Input current: 0.2A~0.5A
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Arc characteristics: white, low temperature 24 hours continuous arc, short / no load can be, high efficiency and low heat circuit design, no radiator!

(If the voltage is not enough, up to 4 modules can be connected in parallel, the output terminals can be connected in series, and the arc can be increased by 4 times)

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1 x Boost Coil Module
72095

Description:
It is stated that the output power of this module is affected by many factors such as the front power supply and the post load in addition
« Last Edit: 24/05/2023 00:53:03 by hamdani yusuf »
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #34 on: 29/05/2023 14:14:29 »
This is the video introducing new high voltage generator with better control.
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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #35 on: 01/06/2023 09:35:21 »
in this video we repeat the experiment with gas discharge lamp tube, but this time we use the new high voltage generator.


Near the end of the video, you can see the effect of electric spark to the brightness of the gas discharge glow.
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #36 on: 17/09/2023 09:53:48 »
I'm preparing a video to show electrostatic force using my generator.
But meanwhile, I'll share someone else's video which also shows interesting effects using high voltage generator.
Plasma pinwheel.
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Offline hamdani yusuf (OP)

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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #37 on: 18/09/2023 03:53:51 »
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 17/09/2023 09:53:48
I'm preparing a video to show electrostatic force using my generator.
Here it is.
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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #38 on: 23/09/2023 19:46:16 »
Quote from: hamdani yusuf on 06/04/2023 08:47:13
Jump starting gasoline cars is usually needed because of dead battery. It requires good condition of other components. It also requires high power. Normally, the engine is started using 12V car battery, and can draw current to hundreds of Amperes typically 400A, hence 4.8 kW is required. When the power is too low, it would be cooled down by the fuel and fail to ignite.
When I couldn't afford a new starter battery, I used to start my old Skoda MB with a 12V dry battery temporarily attached to the ignition system. The starter battery only had to crank the motor over one or two revolutions before it picked up and the dynamo (pre-alternator days!) put some life back into it. Adding a diode in the "proper" supply line made it all very easy! 
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Re: What phenomena can be demonstrated by a cheap high voltage generator?
« Reply #39 on: 23/09/2023 19:52:35 »
Incidentally the idea of encapsulating the HV generator in paraffin wax (candle wax) is a good one - makes life a lot safer and provides mechanical protection for the coil too. I built a 100 kV 10 mA unit about 50 years ago with a voltage multiplier inside a liter of paraffin wax, driven by a 20 kHz oscillator. Great fun!
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