[loweduane]

Onestep:

Your reference is about "monosaccharides" or the individual sugars.  No one questions whether the individual sugars can be digested, but the ingredients in Ambrotose are NOT monosaccharides, they are beta-linked polysaccharides, which to date, all studies say are non-digestible (cannot be broken into the individual sugars), so your reference is meaningless concerning glyconutrient mechanism of action.

[Andrew K Fletcher]

Main component of Glyconutrients is revealed by careful analysis.


It consists of  99.9% SPAM

The tins of SPAM are arranged in bulk to form a giant pyramid

This Pyramid emits a ray of  false hope quickly seized upon by thousands of people who are out to earn a quick buck off the backs of people desperate for anything that offers a remote chance of assisting illnesses that are often life threatening and to which allopathic medicine is not producing any significant improvements.

The pyramid has already produced over 89 thousand hits on a google search using its name as a search term and the 16th of May 2005!

There has obviously been a tremendous amount of money generated by this pyramid selling scam, and one would expect that this licence to print money could easily produce and reproduce scientific, placebo based double blinded trials to prove or disprove its efficacy.

Yet this is simply not happening, All we see is the emergence of many unsubstantiated individual case histories, expressing somewhat miraculous claims.

The sad part about this, is that it will inevitably add to the FDA’s and Eurocrats armoury against food supplements, many of which do indeed offer significant benefits to people who wish to avoid the myriad side effects from prescription drugs.

There is a move to have many of our vitamins and food supplements removed from the shelves of health stores, or to have their potency reduced to levels where they are useless, and this scam is playing right into the FDA and Eurocrats arms!  When this SPAM Pyramid bubble burst, and it will! The vultures will simply find another carcass to gorge upon.

I f this product does what it is supposed to do, You won’t even have to change the oil in your engine, houses will build themselves, the dead will rise again, and the deserts will turn green and flourish.

Where is the hard evidence??


 
Glyconutrients will play a major role in what economists are predicting to be the next trillion-dollar industry- the Wellness Industry. Are you ready to take your piece of the trillion-dollar pie by marketing and educating others about Glyconutrients and their benefits? Anyone who cares about their health and the health of others can be successful in this business if they are teachable, coachable and trainable. Your primary mission is to expose people to this information and let the educational and support tools to educate your prospects about the benefits of the products and the business opportunity. Does that sound like something you can do? And with our team approach, even though you are in business for yourself, you are never by yourself. You'll love the support system.
I remember being roped in to a Foreverliving products seminar, thanks to a friend who would insist that we were going to earn many thousands of pounds with minimum outlay. I told her it was a scam, and sure enough, this guy was trying to convince us that he experienced a miracle or three after taking alovera juice. He apparently healed his injuries, an internal medical problem, all the pain left his body, and he grew a third leg to boot. I had heard enough within a few minutes and we got up and left.. But there were several hundred people that didn’t leave, all with a blank expression shielded by £ signs in their brains.
Another venue when I was a lot younger was Golden Products, this was a range of household cleaning stuff, grossly over priced and sold under a pyramid scheme. My friend and I went to London and stayed in a hotel free of charge. But our reason for being there was to have a day in London at their expense, skipping out on all the bull. We had a great time thanks to them
I ASK AGAIN: WHERE IS THE HARD EVIDENCE FOR THE EFFICACY OF THIS PRODUCT? A quick search on pubmed produced 2 returns, from 2 vague trials, which lead me to ask, where is all the money going?? Maybe they have donated to the Tsunami victims families?

Andrew

[quietman18]

Does anyone know if glyconutrients have helped with the treatment of fibromyalgia ? I have seen claims of it doing so from websites with a vested interest, so would like an unbias opinion.

Thanks.

[Thorp]

SPAM ALERT, SPAM ALERT

quote:Originally posted by quietman18

Does anyone know if glyconutrients have helped with the treatment of fibromyalgia ? I have seen claims of it doing so from websites with a vested interest, so would like an unbias opinion.

Thanks.

There is a special glyconutrient, fucoidan, found in its most abundant form and most activated and bioavailable state in Original Limu based on 15 years of development of the non-chemical, proprietary extraction process of the seaweed limu moui. Much information can be found in Rita Elkins' book, Limu Moui, which is available in most health food stores.  She summarizes that an good extract of this seaweed has anti-cancer, anti-tumor, anti-inflammatory, anti-viral and anti-bacterial properties plus providing the body an exceptional immune boost as well as a moisturizing and rejuvenizing effect on the skin.

In fact, it does anything you want it to, except dry up torrents of SPAM

Probably its most profound effect is the doubling of the size of my wallet since I discovered it. Amazing how vulnerable and ill people will believe, and PAY, anything if I just feed them enough garbage to make them believe that it works.

Regarding fibromyalgia, I personally know of a woman who was about to be institutionalized with a combination of a fibromyalgia and lupus condition.  These were complicated by an arthritic conditions as well.  The woman I know today bounces CHEQUES around like nobody's business, BECAUSE SHE SPENT ALL HER MONEY ON SPAM - but she had been so bad off that she had to have a clock placed on her ceiling as she was restricted to bed and could not stand the pain of turning her head to look at the clock on the wall.  I know a number of other people personally with autoimmune diseases as well who are like new people today following their daily consumption of Original Limu.

The key component in Original Limu is fucoidan which is found only in sea-based plants.  Besides all the other tremendous nutritious components in limu moui including vitamins, amino acids, essential fatty acids, anti-oxidants, glyconutrients, live enzymes, and particularly the whole spectrum of minerals and trace elements in colloidal form found in the sea which our blood emulates, and still others, the fucoidan in limu moui stands out as perhaps the greatest nutrient and immune booster ever discovered.  The scientific and medical establishment is taking an ever greater interest as well as the studies on fucoidan have been growing exponentially since the mid-1970’s in the database of the National Library of Medicine at www.pubmed.gov [nofollow].  Anyone can go to this database and search the word fucoidan and turn up now over 600 studies and can narrow those studies to issues of interest simply by adding an additional word or more like cancer or tumor or tumors or carcinogen or carcinoma, immune, blood or platelets or leukocyte, inflammation or inflammatory, liver or hepatitis, lung or pulmonary, heart or cardiovascular, pancreatic or diabetes or insulin, virus or viral, bacteria or bacterial, wound or wounds, surgery, skin or dermatitis or dermal, etc.

So why is Original Limu the best source of this limu moui extract?  It is for very good reason that Original Limu is called the one, the only, the original!  It is the only proprietary non-chemical optimized extract on the market with proven value having over 15 years of research and development supporting it.  It is also harvested from the pristine pure waters of the Tongan Islands of the South Pacific where there are no pollutants or heavy metals contaminating the water due to industry or large-scale agriculture.  The people of the Tongan Islands have been consuming limu moui for over 3000 years and attribute their great vitality and good health and longevity to limu moui.

All the other seaweed products, like Sea Vegg, that seem to be multiplying monthly, are just trying to jockey for position for attracting the uninformed.  And, what a shame that people will be side-tracked from what looks to be the greatest health discovery of our time, Original Limu.  Our wretched Western diet polluted with preservatives and additives and sugar substitutes, etc. and our society’s one-dimensional focus on the economics of food distribution such as shelf life and premature harvesting almost totally eclipses any nutritional focus.  Also, our Western culture almost single-mindedly focuses on medicine that almost exclusively treats only the symptom and not the basis or underlying cause of a disease.  With this in mind, Original Limu is, in all reality, a Godsend for our nation and a world that we Westerners have infected with our poor nutritional and pill-pushing culture.  

Our bodies were designed for a particular kind of care including good, wholesome and complete foods and such is available in spades through Original Limu. If we feed the body what it needs, it can regulate its chemical machinery and heals itself as it was designed to do as evidenced by a cut on our finger healing itself or our overcoming a cold or flu with just rest and plenty of water.  In fact, that is what medicine is suppose to be all about, helping the body heal itself!  Hippocrates is the Father of Modern Day Medicine with all doctors having to take the Hippocratic oath.  Hippocrates says “Let food be your medicine and your medicine be your food.”  Our Western diet miserably misses the mark!  And in spite of his cautioning, “Above all, do no harm,” we poison ourselves with the often-horrendous side effects of man-made medicines that are promoted shamelessly on the airways by the pharmaceutical companies hoping that they can make the advertising enticement so powerful that people will in essence self-prescribe by going doctor shopping until they get what was promoted to them over the airways.

Regarding Dr. Strand and his recommendation of the USANA supplements, I respect him as a doctor for his nutritional perspective and I have personally tried USANA supplements and found them valuable but nothing like Original Limu.  USANA supplements are a product of man and his science; Original Limu is a natural product from the Creator, who has the full picture of our needs and the exact amounts needed.  I have also tried natural products like Barley Green or Barley Life also with some value but again nothing like Original Limu.  I have shopped for organic foods but they are nothing next to Original Limu.  I have heard of Noni and Mangosteen and green teas, etc.  None of these are sea-based natural products and, thus, none of them have the whole spectrum of minerals and trace elements nor, most importantly, do they contain fucoidan and none of them hold a candle to Original Limu.  Nothing in the health and wellness industry compares to Original Limu outside of good health practices like good nutrition, plenty of rest, plenty of exercise, plenty of pure water and fresh air drawn deeply into the lungs, sunshine, temperance and trust in God.

Now, I rarely take anything else but Original Limu and save a bundle of money and experience incredible, even miraculous health as in the case of the throbbing pain in my right arm disappearing where decompression with fusing surgery on my 3-5th cervical vertebrae was unsuccessful.  My skin is vibrant and no longer a flaky mess.  My sinuses and asthma are back under control.  I sleep much better.  I have more energy.  Even my toe and finger nails are supple and healthy again.  And, if ever I do come down with something by pushing myself too hard, the immune-boosting anti-viral, anti-bacterial and anti-inflammatory functions of the fucoidan gets me over it in a day or two without my ever having to see a doctor or get an anti-inflammatory and antibiotic.  The savings alone in doctor bills and supplement costs easily pays for my Original Limu.  Anyway, I simply cannot live without Original Limu!  

Email me at tfbail@sbcglobal.net or call me at 979-297-1919 and I will tell you of more stories I know about first hand, even of those with whom I have shared first-hand myself as with my son with acne and ADD / ADHD, a friend with multiple sclerosis, another friend with hepatitis, another with high cholesterol, triglycerides and LDL/HLDL ratio, another with migraine headaches, another with sinus headaches, another with chronic fatigue, another with an open wound in his leg for over 20 years without healing, another with scar tissue from adolescent acne fading away in her mid forties, another person experiencing her tumors and cancer receding and disappearing, another being better able to cope with chemotherapy and radiation treatment, another coming back from short-term memory loss and dementia, another with disabilities from two car accidents involving drunk drivers and high blood pressure and high blood sugar, and the stories keep unfolding daily and I haven’t even mentioned the many stories of other people outside those with whom I have personally shared Original Limu.  We now have a physician in our area who is directing his patients to Original Limu as he sees the hopelessness of the over-medication that Western medication has to offer as in the case of one medication being prescribed merely to mitigate the side effects of another medication!

I will conclude by making it clear that I am not a medical doctor.  I only hold a Ph.D. degree in organic chemistry and have been in active personal study of the health and wellness industry since 1997 when I was getting sick more often and required an anti-inflammatory in order for prescribed antibiotics to work.  Thus, I do not or will not prescribe, treat, diagnose in regards to any disease or condition.   Original Limu is simply a natural and spectacularly nutritious food by which the body can perform optimally in healing itself.  

[thedoc]

SPAM ALERT, SPAM ALERT

This bloke is about as worried about your health as I am about his.

This is a complete load of crap.

I have locked his login so he cannot return to alter the content of this post, from which I have removed the multiple references to his own website, leaving behind just his key-phrase rich content.

So now, every time someone searches for his crappy website, they'll also find our's. And whenever he goes promoting his website, he'll also be advertising our's.

Thanks Thorpe. Have a nice day.

[comely]

I'm not a scientist,  but stumbled across this website because my friend insists I try Mannatech's products.  When she told me the price, I was floored.  I've been enthralled by your back and forth over Glyconutrients.  I can see Kittycat's attempt to sell for sure.  She would be happy to know that my friend insists it is "curing" her husbands symptoms of possible luekemia.  He has not thrown up for 3 months and is slowly gaining his weight back,  which prompted me to do some searching.  
  I want to thank Duane. Your recommendation of the glyco-cocktail is very helpful.  Can we "talk"?
I have irritable bowel and endometriosis-I have been taking Alive! Whole food energizer by Nature's way.  I'm a big skeptic on Vitamins,  but for the past 2 years I have felt better.  Not great, but definitely have gained more appetite.  Should I think about looking into your cocktail,  and how much of all that stuff am I supposed to use per product?  I don't want to wake up with night sweats!  Thanks for your response.  

A layman that knows nothing really,  but so much more!  []

[ChristianElliot]

Hey all,

Wow, what a spirited dialogue you have going!  I happened upon this dialogue because a neighbor stumbled across someone's attempt to recreate Ambtrotose on their own.  Interesting endeavor.  (By the way the new Ambrotose is a good deal less money)  Anyway, I thought I might add my two cents to some of what I read.  First, an observation: there is nothing inherently flawed with bringing a product to market and making a profit off of it.  It's how everyone makes a living.  Right?  We could "trade blows" all day about when doing so crosses a threshold and tends toward greed.  That won't get anywhere.  

I honestly think the assessment that Mannatech is a money grabbing company is well, uninformed.  Are the exceptions in any organization, of course, but let's look at the big picture.  Ambrotose works.  A close family friend who had severe fibromyalgia for 10 years no longer has it, and hasn't for about two years now.  (I know, I know, "andedotal" cries the skeptic, but that's a darn good placebo.)  The people who say Ambrotose does not work are the same people who have not spent any time around people who have tried it over a long period of time.  Am I wrong?  Doctors who have, swear by it from everything I've seen.  Check out Dr. John Rollins of the US Patent office and his interview in the Atlana Voice Newspaper (August, 2004) for starters.

Marketing this discovery of necessary carbohydrates through a network was not the first choice.  The problem was it didn't sell when it sat on a health food store shelf.  The aloe discovery of Mannose did so for around a decade!  Why?  Because people didn't understand it's magnitude, and low quality copycats ruled the checkout stands.  So what's a company to do with that situation?  Do you take out big loans to try to spread the word through expensive advertising to an inherently skeptical public, or change the way you market the stuff?  

Is network marketing perfect?  Of course not.  Some get into the industry for all the wrong reasons, and give the whole industry a bad wrap because of it.  But how many of you would have heard about glyconutrients without Mannatech?  ANYONE?  How many other incredible health related discoveries have not made the news for lack of funding to promote what was learned?  Because of Mannatech (whether you choose to buy from them or not) you at least you know about something that can dramatically improve someone's quality of life.  If you have the stamina to source everything in Ambrotose, and try to recreate it, all the best to you.  (I don't personally have the expensive lab equipment to ensure I'm doing it right.)  For my money I'd rather know that the amounts I'm getting have been carefully tested and are precise and potent.  I'm glad to pay top dollar for someone to save me the time so that I can spend my time elsewhere (like on these exciting chat rooms).

Shoot, with enough effort I could recreate just about anything I buy, but my ability to do so doesn't make the company trying to sell the same thing to me inherenetly evil.  Or how about this question: Are doctors evil for rendering their services?  Afterall, they are running a business that is seeking to make money from you.  

As for the greed/cost issue, has anyone taken the time to look into MannaRELIEF?   newbielink:http://www.mannarelief.org [nonactive]  This is Mannatech's non-profit arm that prodives/donates these nutrients to children (in something like 40 countries) and doesn't make a cent.  I'm sure the glyco concoction suggested above can't beat that price!  Mannarelief gets Ambrotose AT COST, also funds large independent clinical studies, and even occasionally can give to adult charities. At a gathering of Mannatech associates in March of 05, 8,000 of those "greedy" people contributed $300,000 to MannaRelief.  MannaRelief also ponied up $250,000 to help fund the Global Aids Awarness Program.  Does that help add perspective for anyone?  I hope so.  If Mannatech didn't pay assocaites they'd have to spend even bigger bucks, I suspect, on advertising.  That wouldn't lower the cost at all.  Every company makes a profit.  If they don't there is no product.  Mannatech is not somehow unique.  They have a business to run.    

  Is Mannatech perfect?  No.  No institution/company/system is.  Are they doing the best they can to market something that is one of the few genuine breakthroughs in nutrition?  I believe they are.  It's easy to find postings on the internet that bad mouth this or that.  If it really matters that much to you, fly to Dallas and talk with their science team.  That's real investigation, googling, well...  The science team at Mannatech is no group of slackers I'll assure you.  You can view their crediential on the site.  One final bit of perspective I'll add as a juxtoposition to Mannatech is the chart below that shows the mark-up costs of prescription drugs.  Have a look at the chart.  The % number shows the actual mark-up.  Makes you sick doesn't it!

Here's to your health,

Christian

BRAND NAME OF DRUG CONSUMER PRICE 100 TABS  

COST OF GENERAL ACTIVE INGREDIENTS        PERCENT MARKUP
                                          Retail Cost                      Mark-up
Celebrex 100 mg      -   $130.27         $0.60                     21,712%
Claritin 10 mg            -   $215.17         $0.71                     30,306%
Keflex 250 mg           -   $157.39         $1.88                       8,372%
Lipitor 20 mg             -   $272.37         $5.80          ;             4,696%
Norvasc 10 mg          -   $188.29         $0.14                   134,493%
Paxil 20 mg                -   $220.27         $7.60                        2,898%
Prevacid 30 mg         -   $44.77           $1.01                      34,136%
Prilosec 20 mg          -   $360.97         $0.52                      69,417%
Prozac 20 mg            -   $247.47         $0.11                    224,973%
Tenormin 50 mg        -   $104.47         $0.13                      80,362%
Vasotec 10 mg          -   $102.37         $0.20                       51,185%
Xanax 1mg                -   $136.79         $0.024                    569,958%
Zestril 20 mg              -   $89.89            $3.20                         2,809%
Zithromax 600mg      -   $1,482.19       $18.78                       7,892%
Zocor 40mg               -   $350.27           $8.63     ;                   4,059%
Zoloft 50mg               -   $206.87            $1.75                       11,821%

[ChristianElliot]

Oh, and here are a couple names of people who worked with Ambrotose with tremendous results.  

Dr. Martin Milner (of the Health Science Institute).  After years of research on Ambrotose, he said "What was unproven in 1996 is now a compelling necessity of medical care in 2004.  At this point it would be unethical if I withheld the value and benefit of glyconutrient from my patients and medical students."  

Dr. John Axford of the Royal Soceity of Medicine in England.  Check out his work with Ambrotose and Rheumatoid Arthritis.  

Dr. Ben Carson of John's Hopkins University has spoken at two Mannatech Events at his own experience with Ambrotose.

Happy Research

Christian

[Andrew K Fletcher]

Hi Christian There goes that Darn Spam again!

Isn't Manna relief coined to closely resemble Manna from Heaven, meaning Money from Heaven? Therefore isn't Manna relief someone trying to relieve one of ones money? Or is that just another coincidence?

Glad you mentioned aloe and the pyramid scams. Aloe is actually a fantastic plant derivitive for burns and skin abrasions, and maybe even a few internal problems. This was all it needed to satisfy the massive industries that "became cultivated by the desert plant". The plant itself can be obtained from garden centres and is quite happy living on a sunny window until you burn yourself and need to rub the juice on it. So how did they manage to develop it into a multi-billion dollar business? Exactly! They piled it all up into a gian pyramid, where it emmited rays of hope, roping in everyone that wanted to earn a fast buck off the backs of people in desperate need for anything that offers a glimmmer of hope.

This business does not seem very Christian like to me!

[snookrz_2000]

wasn't the term 'manna' from the bible... referring to food? I don't think it was talking about money...

[loweduane]

Then why doesn't Mannatech put these individual sugars in their supplements?

As I have noted before:  Ambrotose ingredients are:  Arabinogalactan - 50%, Manapol 10% (fiber from Aloe), gum Ghatti - 10%, Gum Tragacanth - 10%, glucosamine and rice starch 10%.

Glucosamine and the glucose from rice starch are the only sugars that can be absorbed from your intestine from these substances.  The other ingredients, in every study and paper so far, have shown to be indigestible, and travel intact to your large intestine where they are fermented by microorganisms.  

None of those sugars you mentioned are absorbed from Ambrotose.  So while you are sincere, your hypothesis of these sugars being absorbed and increasing glycoproteins is wrong, and has zero scientific support.  

It is also interesting that while glycoscience.com has a section reviewing evidence that each individual sugar can be absorbed (when taken by itself, not from a non-digestible chain of sugars), the ingredients in Ambrotose are actually only complex chains containing 6 of those 8 sugars.  If they really believed that they could all be absorbed, why not add them.  Their explanation is that by taking the "precursors" your body makes the other two sugars.  

Science, of course, has already shown that you can make all 8 of these sugars by yourself without having to take Mannatech's supplement.  Ambrotose doesn't contain the 8 individual sugars because Mannatech knows that their supplement would not work if that was all it contained.  This supplement has many beneficial effects, but not by any absorbing any "essential sugars." That is where Mannatech fools its competitors.  If competitors try to put individual sugars in a supplement, patients don't get well.  Then Mannatech can claim their sugars are "better."  But it is apples and oranges.  

These sugars are not digested or absorbed by human intestines.  The mechanism of action is much more complicated, and the same ingredients can be bought from the same companies Mannatech gets their supplies from, so there is no reason to pay such high costs for the benefits.

In fact, not only can you get the same ingredients, but Manapol was designed and patented by Bill McAnalley when working at Carrington Labs.  He is the Ph.D. that formulated Ambrotose.  So the Manapol that you buy from Carrington (or retail stores) is the same product he patented.  

It is interesting to note that when Dr. McAnalley worked for Carrington Labs, he, with others, wrote a paper on Mannans (long chains of mannose sugars) in which it is noted that Mannans cannot be digested by the human intestine.  Since no research has been published that has ever shown these complex fibers to be digestible, I wonder why he changed his mind.

I realize that you are sincere and caring person about people, especially those that suffer.  But you know nothing of science, or how to read or interpret it.  Your information is sales information from a company that is promoting an unsupportable hypothesis to make them sound validated in order to sell a product.  I recommend that you stick to testimonials of the benefits.  Those are impressive, and in this case, more substantial than trying to substantiate these ingredients when all the science shows Mannatechs sales pitch about absorbing sugars is currently not possible with these ingredients.

Yes, I know, it sounds rude and irritating when I point out the problems with Mannatechs hypothesis.  Associates get frustrated because I am contradicting what they have been told by very intelligent people.  However, I would love to be proven wrong.  Contact all of your resources.  Contact the researchers in the company and tell them what I have said and get the references or research from them that proves me incorrect.  

I have made this request of multiple associates in the company, and even multiple researchers.  So far, they have not come up with anything that actually support their sugar hypothesis.  Though A couple have said that they have studies, but they don't publish them for various reasons.  I find this interesting considering the "10,000" scientific references that they have on their website (none of which have anything to do with the actual mechanism of action of their supplement).  Why would the only studies that prove your hypothesis be the only ones you hide from the public?  Not acceptable.  Especially when they own their own scientific journal that they could publish it in.  

Yes, I still see the benefits of these supplements, but unlike you I question the honesty and integrity and ethics of this company, especially when the technical advisors and researchers at the companies that supply these ingredients are more than happy to discuss the current research and problems with Mannatech's hypothesis, but Mannatech's technical advisors, customer service, and researchers will not talk about it, or offer up an explanation why their hypothesis has no scientific support.

Good ingredients, too expensive to buy from them though, and their marketing is based on bad science and ignorance of the public (which I am more than happy to help change).

I do appreciate your efforts to help others though, but you don't do it justice when you repeat science that has nothing to do with the supplement you recommend.

Good luck

[casmr03]

I have a severe case of fibromyalgia complicated by RA in my hands, feet, knees and hips,IBS, and cognitive and memory problems. I stumbled on this forum researching glyconutrients. There are literally thousands of testimonials ranging from miraculous healings to " I feel a lot better now." healings for the mannatech system, and so far not even 1 which says," I have given the glyconutrients a good HONEST try and it did NOT work for me."
 For you nay-sayers out there do NOT speak to me of cost. Someone always pays. When I was taking all those prescription drugs, having all those fancy tests, going to see all those high priced specialists, SOMEONE was paying for it, and it was you and me, RIGHT? The health care system...yours and my taxes, the health insurance system...yours and my insurance premiums.
 So if you have not lost your health, your career, your business, your new house, your new vehicle, your life savings and almost your life itself, do not presume to put a financial figure on MY health and well being. If it is my finances that make someone wealthy and I get all of the above back...so be it, and welcome to it!
  Also, do not talk about solid scientific proof... placebo effect or real honest healing, who really cares as long as the end result is good health.
  I am considering trying the Mannatech system, and if you really care wether or not it works, and are really concerned about me spending my food, clothing and housing money on something that you truly believe does not work( or are you just playing the devil's advocate for the fun of it to see how many people you can P--- Off and offend), then find me 100 or even 10 verifiable testimonials against the glyconutrients from people who gave it a 100% honest try. I don't need to spend my money on stuff that doesn't work. I've already spent it all on everything from illegal drugs that were supposed to help with the pain, to Far eastern medicines, to Native American medicines and everything in between.
  So help me here. You say it doesn't work, and all I hear is that it DOES work. I am a sceptic and I welcome your help in PROVING yet again that something I DIDN"T tey doesn't work anyway

[moore4u]

It is a good thing that Dr. Michael Schlacter had not read duane's suggestion that Ambrotose doesn't work. Because if he had, he probably would not have been giving it to some of his patients, and especially to Greg Letourneau, a patient who had came to the emergency room with strep throat, a fever that spiked at 107 F and had developed toxic shock syndrome. He was seen by 10 different doctors, given every possible medication, but his body had shut down and he had been put on life support. A priest had given him his last rites and his family had been told he was dying. Dr. Schlacter asked the family if they would allow him to try the glyconutrients as a last resort. What did they have to lose? The doctor began putting the Ambrotose directly into his feeding tube. His extremities that had turned blue began to return to pink. The organs that had shut down, began to function again. His LIFE WAS SAVED! Bottom line...HIS LIFE WAS SAVED.

I have been diagnosed with Lyme Disease and 3 coinfections. I have been on massive antibiotics and a ton of vitamins, minerals and herbs. I have used a sound wave frequency "ParaZapper" recommended by Hulda Clark. I have suffered severe chronic fatigue as a result of my illness with very bad episodes of dizziness and brain fog. I also suffer from symptoms of a disease that is being called "Morgellons." I have large sores that would not heal and had biopsies done that 3 different labs COULD NOT IDENTIFY.

A friend who cares about me shared the info about glyconutrients and Mannatech. Her husband has throat cancer and is seeing favorable results from taking the products. He has already had chemo and radiation and the cancer came back. WHAT DOES HE HAVE TO LOSE? (Except his cancer!) UNTIL I BEGAN using the Mannatech products, none of the other treatments had produced results. After taking them for 10 days, all of my dizziness and brain fog have lifted. My sores are healing. SO DON'T TRY TO TELL ME THE PRODUCTS DON'T WORK.

As far as price goes, I am willing to pay the price. The products are no more expensive than many of the supplements I have gone into a natural health food store to purchase. So GIVE ME A BREAK!

By the way duane... you claim to be in the health business - do you charge money for your services?? WELL SHAME ON YOU FOR TRYING TO MAKE A LIVING IN THIS WORLD! Go pick on some other company that manufactures things that are harmful to our environment at the expense of making BIG profits and stop picking on a company that is offering hope to millions. Hope to the sick who are willing to pay the retail price and hope to those who chose to make a business out of providing a product THAT IS WORKING FOR PEOPLE WITH COMPROMISED HEALTH CONDITIONS. THERE ARE DOCUMENTED CASES!

I also offer here - a response from Mannatech to a person who was also making negative claims against the company and products:

Issue #3: Remainder of misleading issues in Bloomberg articles.

- In 1999, Bloomberg reporter David Evans wrote a short series of negative articles on Mannatech. No one knows what motivated Mr. Evans to launch such a seemingly purposeful attack, but his inflammatory reports were so misleading that our general counsel sent the attached letter (Attachment B) directly to the general counsel of Bloomberg, petitioning immediate relief from such unethical and potentially malicious conduct. The letter addresses the issues of (1) “telling consumers one thing and investors another about the safety and efficacy of Mannatech products” (See Attachment C, Further Disclosure Information), (2) “the use of a disputed study (Dr. Daryl See) to boost sales of its products,” (3) “the lack of double-blind placebo studies,” (4) the disclaimer concerning the effects of ephedra in MVP, (5) the claims of Mannatech’s involvement and problems with MannaCare, and (6) the reporter’s “suggestion” of potential stockholder law suits.

- As you can clearly see from our response to those issues, they ranged from misleading to absolute fabrication. Not one negative article has come from that reporter or Bloomberg since the receipt of our attorney letter.

- Dr. Jarvis, we were successful in halting the false and misleading reporting from the author of those articles, but this misinformation lives on through their posting on your Site. Please help resolve this issue.

Issue #4: The challenge of Dr. Steve Nugent’s credentials.
- We have several well credentialed MDs and PhDs on our staff and editorial board of our educational web site www.GlycoScience.org [nofollow]. However a reporter chose to take issue with the credentials of Dr. Steve Nugent, a naturopathic doctor we hired to assist us in both product formulation and customer education. When we met Dr. Nugent, he was the president of the American Naturopathic Medical Association and a highly sought-after speaker on the subject of nutritional science. While serving in the US Marine Corps, Steve completed his Associates, Bachelors, and Masters degrees in business from National University, San Diego and Vista, California campuses. In 1981 he received a PhD in Psychology from Clayton University in St. Louise, Missouri. In 1984 his desire to pursue alternative and complementary medicine led him to achieve a correspondence NMD (Doctor of Naturopathic Medicine) degree from the same Clayton University in St. Louis, Missouri, and ND (Doctor of Naturopathy) correspondence degree in 1991 from the Clayton School of Natural Healing in Birmingham, Alabama. In 1996, he received an MDMA (Doctor of Medicine in Alternative Medicine) correspondence degree from The Open International University for Complementary Medicine. In between those correspondence degrees he received a PDD (Professional Developmental Degree,
post graduate training) in 1992 from the University of Michigan, Dearborn Campus. Issue was taken with the “legitimacy” of one of the correspondence degrees received by Dr. Nugent due to the fact that the school has since gone out of business.

One must realize that even though complementary medicine is finally being taught in major medical schools and recognized by governmental agencies (NIH), it was not that way 20 years ago. Correspondence was one of the few avenues to take in becoming educated in that field, which simply makes Dr. Nugent a pioneer in what is now becoming main-stream. Dr. Nugent is the author of “Nugent’s Physicians Desk Reference for Applied Clinical Nutrition,” sold to thousands of MDs for their guide to complementary approaches to health care. I challenge anyone to read that text and then challenge Dr Nugent’s knowledge of nutrition or of complementary medicine. It is extremely unfortunate that this character assassination was levied and continues to be perpetuated on such a knowledgeable and well-respected professional.

Finally, Dr. Jarvis, I would like you to consider the following highlights of Mannatech achievements in your reporting on our company.

- Successfully introduced Manapol®; a stabilized, standardized and patented aloe vera extract into a market filled with cheap, fraudulent aloe vera products.
- Developed a chemical assay to determine the presence and volume of aloe vera’s functional
ingredient that is deficient or missing in most aloe vera products.
- Developed chemical assays for the measurement of other biologically active sugar molecules
necessary for glycoprotein synthesis and cell-to-cell communication.
- Formulated the first blend of necessary glyconutrients (trademarked Ambrotose®, patents filed
worldwide and issued in 15 countries)
- Developed chemical assay that can measure the synergistic effect of combining both lipid- and watersoluble antioxidants. (Patent filed on assay.)
- Formulated the most efficacious blend of lipid- and water-soluble antioxidants. (Assay validated, patents filed on formula.)
- Introduced safety-filing system for its products in 1997. (Safety filing programs are now being
recommended to industry by the FDA and being discussed in congress as potential new law.)
- Developed the first educational web site for nutrition, www.GlycoScience.org [nofollow], with direct links from referenced papers to Medline. (Patents filed on business method.)

Dr. Jarvis, you might find the next two achievements interesting. Both HON and www.Healthawards.com [nofollow] have teams of scientific experts that analyze the quality of the scientific information posted by a company on the Web.

- www.GlycoScience.org [nofollow] was winner of 2002 merit award and of 2003 silver award from the World Wide Web’s www.Healthawards.com [nofollow]. (See Attachment D for information on this awards program.) This award presented to other 2003 winners include health Web sites from the “US Food and Drug Administration” (Merit Award), the “American Institute for Cancer Research” (Bronze Award), “Kaiser Permanente” (Bronze Award, and the “Mayo Clinic” (Silver Award) (See Attachment E for 2003 Fall winners.)

- www.GlycoScience.org [nofollow] was winner of 2003 Health on the Net (HON) Award for program accreditation. (See Attachment F for information on this organization.)

- www.GlycoScience.org [nofollow] editorial staff invited to make presentation at Health On The Net’s
International Conference in Geneva, Switzerland in 2003. (We were the only nutrition company in the world to be invited to present at conference.) - Co-sponsored 2003 international Glycobiology Conference in France.
- Recognized in business section of Dallas Morning News (May, 2004) as second fastest growing
public company in Dallas, Texas in 2003.
- Chairman and CEO Sam Caster invited to sit on Board of Directors of CRN (Council for Responsible
Nutrition) in 2003.
- Negotiated exclusive rights for patent-pending freeze-dried Australian Bush Plum (found to have highest level of naturally occurring Vitamin C complex of any plant on earth).

Hopefully, Dr. Jarvis, this information will aid you in your ongoing report on Mannatech. If you have any questions on any of this material, please feel free to contact me immediately.
I thank you in advance for your consideration.

Sincerely,
Sam Caster Chairman and Chief Executive Officer
Mannatech
SC/tb
Enclosures

[loweduane]

For Casmr03:

I have read messages from several people who had conditions that did not respond to glyconutrients, and many more whose conditions improved.  I do not believe that it is the miracle cure for all conditions that many associates believe it is, but I have never said that it is not beneficial or that it doesn't work.  On the contrary, it has many benefits and can help many people.  I highly recommend glyconutrients.  

If you can afford Mannatech's supplement, that is great, take it.  However, for those who want to try the exact same ingredients, from the same companies that make it for Mannatech, and do so for a fraction of the price, I think that is great too.  I have seen the same benefits from both avenues.  Which only makes sense because the ingredients are from the same manufacturers.

For Moore4U:

Please read my posts more closely.  You will see that I am an advocate of glyconutrients, and agree with you and Dr. Schlacter that they are beneficial for patients.  I have always said that they work, and I am glad that you are getting relief with your regimen, as have many others.  My problem with glyconutrients falls into other realms:

1. The currently unsupportable explanation on how they work.

All studies on these ingredients show that you cannot absorb the individual sugars from these substances, hence you are not absorbing these sugars and they are not increasing your glycoproteins.  Are there other scientifically supported mechanisms that support how they are having their effects?  Yes, but the "8 essential sugar" hypothesis for these ingredients is marketing hype that has NO scientific support.  (Yes, you can absorb the sugars if taken individually, but NO you cannot absorb these sugars from the ingredients (polysaccharides) in Ambrotose.

2.  Price

As I said to Casmr03, I recommend these ingredients/substances, and feel confident that they help many people. I do not begrudge Mannatech's ability to make a profit by charging the exorbitant prices necessary for multi-level marketing.  If you can afford these ingredients, or want to pay for them by getting your friends and family to pay these ridiculously high prices, great.  However, not everyone wants to pay that much to try these ingredients.  In fact, despite the enthusiasm of associates, I have known a number of people who had conditions ideal for glyconutrients, but they did not take them because of fixed and limited incomes.

Yes, there are recipes for "glyconutrients" on the internet using mushrooms and fenugreek, etc.  These do contain many polysaccharides and beneficial substances beyond the glyconutrients, but they are NOT the same as Ambrotose.  They also have many testimonials that they have helped people, but whether they help people or not, has nothing to do with whether Ambrotose would be beneficial.  If people want to try Ambrotose, but cannot afford the cost, they can get the exact same ingredients (not alternatives, but the same from the same substances from the same manufacturers that supply Mannatech) for a fraction of the cost.  Not only that, but they can alter the amounts, or even drop ingredients to find what combination works best for them.  Some people get the same benefits from just taking Manapol alone.  I would not begrudge them that benefit.

Yes, I am a healthcare worker.  Do I charge my patients?  No, in my situation I don't need to.  (which makes a double your money back guarantee easy to offer).  My colleagues who do charge, are also business people, whom I do not begrudge making a profit.  For example:  There are many chiropractors in our city.  Each one charges fees for their services.  When asked for my advice, I note that there are many good chiropractors, but if they don't have insurance, or the money to pay higher prices, they can try the chiropractor who charges $10.00 per visit.  He has practiced for over 20 years, does not have the debt that drives other chiropractors and rents space to an acupuncturist, naturopath and massage therapist, so he can afford to charge one low flat fee.  I have been treated by him, and he is very skilled in many techniques and thorough, but he has very little stress because the business side of his business is very simple.  It requires no employees, no filing of insurance, etc.  Is his chiropractic less than that offered by others in the city?  No.  Would I tell people they have to go to chiropractors charging $40-60 to get the effective treatment?  No.  If people try this doctor, and find no relief after 3 to 4 visits they have spent the price of one treatment elsewhere, and then they can try the more expensive alternatives.  I have not found any who have tried this doctor and not been impressed and gotten relief. The same holds true for the ingredients in Ambrotose.  

If you can afford Ambrotose, take it, but if the price is keeping you from taking it, then try taking the same ingredients, but buying them separately (50% Arabinogalactan, 10% of each of the rest of the ingredients) and trying that.  Or try just one or a combination of a few of the ingredients.  Only Arabinogalactan, Manapol, and Glucosamine have any research showing they can have beneficial effects on the human body.  Gums Tragacanth and Ghatti, in over 1000 years of use have no studies of helping any conditions except as dietary fibers in digestive complaints, and may or may not be necessary.

My posts have not questionned anyones credentials.  Who cares about their credentials?  It is the accuracy of the information that gives credibility (or takes it away).

My posts never mention Dr. See, or the information from Dr. Jarvis' site.  The rationale from those websites on the problems with Mannatech are weak at best.  So defending them is a waste of time.

I don't care what awards the glycoscience.org website has received.  I don't care how pretty it is.  It is a smoke and mirrors site that confuses the ignorant public.  Look at the section on "Introduction to glyconutritionals."  Read about these essential sugars.  It sounds very impressive, and very convincing.  However, read it again and realize that all of that information has nothing to do with the ingredients in the main supplement they sell.

They say "Glyconutritionals are designed to make the necessary sugars available to the cells quicker and in greater quantity" which makes sense, but they don't tell you that the ingredients in their supplement, while made of these sugars, have been shown to not be able to be digested, so none of these sugars can be absorbed.  In fact, most of their website doesn't even note the individual ingredients in their supplement.  In one section it says: "That is, polysaccharides other than starch (i.e. beta-linked polysaccharides) can be digested or absorbed whole in the small intestines. Bacteria in the colon can break down others into their monosaccharide components, which can then be absorbed and used by the body." but it is one of the few claims that gives no references, and if you research the substances, you will find just the opposite to be true.  Why give hundreds of scientific references on so many other sections, and when the most important claim, central to their hypothesis, is made there is no scientific reference given?  Which is why this topic has been so frustrating.  Yes the ingredients work, but the explanation they give has nothing to do with these ingredients.

The people responsible for the science of Mannatech, are the same people who have published detailed scientific papers before being involved with this company.  They know for a fact what specific, and relatively simple studies would be needed to be done to support their hypothesis, but they have never done it.  In fact, one of the papers on Mannans (such as Manapol) written by Bill McAnalley (formulator of Ambrotose) and others, notes that the human intestine does not make the enzyme necessary to digest these beta-linked polysaccharides. (Mol Biother. 1989;1(6):290-6. The biological activities of mannans and related complex carbohydrates. Tizard IR, Carpenter RH, McAnalley BH, Kemp MC.) I have seen no papers since then by him or others that would lead me to conclude that anything has changed.  Why not? Most of the research noted in that paper was concerning injectible forms.  Eating it and injecting it are two different things.  For example, insulin is effective if injected, but not if taken orally.  

Want to know if your blood glucose in going up after eating that food?  Eat the food and test the sugar in your blood.  Is that so hard?  Yet none of these sugars has ever been shown to be increased after taking this supplement, but the company claims you absorb sugars from these ingredients, contrary to all published studies on these polysaccharides so far.  Why not do the study?  Why publish multiple articles showing each individual sugar is absorbed, and then NOT put those individual sugars in your supplement?  And yet have no studies showing any sugar can be absorbed from the fibers in the actual supplement?  

The glycoscience.org site is impressive, unless you compare the information with the actual ingredients in their supplement and realize that their information has nothing to do with the mechanism of how their supplement is actually working.  It is merely marketing because it sounds impressive.  If they really believed everything on their site, they would make a supplement with each individual sugar in it, not non-digestible fibers.  Or they would pre-digest the fibers with specific enzymes derived from micro-organisms that can break these substances into the individual sugars, or even add those enzymes to the product so that the digestion would happen in your intestine.  But they don't.  I have confirmation from their company that no pre-digestion or digestive enzymes are used in their product.

Again, let me reiterate:  

YES the ingredients in this supplement work.(and they can be bought separately, cheaper).

NO the main ingredients in Ambrotose provide NO sugars (other than glucose and glucosamine). Their hypothesis that they do, and that it increases glycoproteins and cell-to-cell communication has absolutely ZERO scientific support.  (glycoscience.org...thousands of scientific references and ZERO support for their hypothesis from these ingredients?  I would say there is something suspicious).

Respectfully,

Duane
Trying to stay objective.

[moore4u]

Duane~
I appreciate your clarification and your trying to stay objective.
I am pleased to hear you say that glyconutrients DO work. So far, (and I am brand new to this company) in all the material I have read, as well as when hearing the people in the company I've heard speak, NEVER have they claimed that Ambrotose or glyconutrients are the "cure-all" for all diseases.
In fact, it has been just the opposite.

I understand that many people may not be able to afford the expense of purchasing the products from Mannatech, just as many people can not afford to receive the proper medical care they need from doctors or dentists.

I do believe Mannatech has set up their sales plan to assist those who truly believe in the product and believe it can improve the health of others when taken as directed, to be able to afford to take it for themselves.

I commend you for making available the information to the public about how to make the glyconutrient supplemnents for themselves to save money. I just don't think the average person wants to do that or has the time to do that. For some, if that is what they want to do, fine. I just don't have the time or energy to do that for myself.

I will seek some answers to the questions you raise, because I have the pure motivation to help others get well behind my willingness to tell others about glyconutrients. I am NOT doing it to make a lot of money. Would I like to make enough to help me pay for my own product, yes. But greater reward would be to hear that a person's life was saved or the quality of their life greatly improved because I told them about glyconutrients. I would also be willing to tell everyone I talk to... about the alternative of purchasing the ingredients for themselves to save money...let them make the choice. But I think you have to tell both sides of the story.

There are so many doctors and medical professionals that are seeing positive results with glycontrients that it is hard to ignore the facts that SOMETHING is being absorbed by the body and allowing the body to heal itself for many people. I also think a study needs to be done regarding HOW the people take the product. IF they don't take enough for a long enough period of time, it would be easy to say, "That stuff didn't work."  So, I agree that more research and broader studies need to be performed. But for me, the evidence for what it has done for me is all the proof I need for now.

Thank you, duane!

[moore4u]

Hi Kittycat!
I am pleased to meet you too and I am relieved to hear something positive here about the use of and efficacy of glyconutrients. All I know, is what I know! The TRUTH of the fact that in 6 months of suffering, NOTHING (and I mean I had about tried everything!) made a real difference until I added the glyconutition to my regimen.
I would love to hear more about results you have witnessed.
I have told one friend who has breast cancer about this and her sister-in-law has a brain disease that is inoperable and is turning her brain to mush. She bought some for her and I pray that they are giving it to her. I need to follow up on it and make sure they are giving her enough. This same lady called me back to get some for herself and another man I talked to has a wife with Alzheimer's and he is buying some for her. I am so excited and anxious to see if it helps her. Please tell me your experiences with these things if you can.
I KNOW there will be negative stories that surface regarding Mannatech, some of the distributors, misrepresentation, etc., but so far I have only experienced VERY positive results and a very positive experience with the company, so that is what I have to go on until that is proven wrong. But I can NOT deny the difference in how I feel since starting the products myself. Plain and simple!

[moore4u]

OH! Kittycat! I just went back and clicked on your link. I had JUST ordered that book and it came yesterday. I am going to start reading it today! I also got the book "A Gift Called Michelle" about the little girl with Downs Syndrome who began using glyconutrients. Not only did they allow her to heal from severe respiratory illness (Asthma and allergies - she lived on inhalers, medications and a breathing machine most of the time), but they also improved her mental condition dramatically and EVEN HER PHYSICAL APPEARANCE. Have you seen her photos? It is truly amazing. She has lost much of the characteristic features of a child with Downs Syndrome and looks like a different child. Her story is worth reading. She is an A Honor Roll student in the 10th grade now (I think) and has excelled academically and physically way beyond her teachers and parents expectations! She was taught sign lanquage at an early age (4) because she could not talk. Of course, she later went on to learn to talk and once she did it was like a flood gate opening! But she has maintained her ability to sign and I read at the end of the book she goes into nursing homes to assist the Elderly and signs for deaf people and was recently invited to sign at at Garth Brooks concert! AMAZING! You can find that little book at www.glycotools.com [nofollow]  Click on the books and print tab and you will find it.

[momof4]

For what it's worth,I thought I would add my personal story to the list of arguments for and against glyconutrients.  I am very grateful that a friend introduced me to glyconutrients just 5 months ago.  For over 20 years I have suffered from chronic neck and lower back pain.  Two of my children have suffered from "full blown" asthma since early infancy.  My youngest child had severe eczema to the point of bleeding.  Winter months were a nightmare with bottles of oxygen lined up in my garage.  I am happy to say that in the last few months I have been pain free.  There has only been 1 asthma attack (and I believe this was due to the fact that we were without product for over 2 weeks) and no sign of eczema.  It is so easy to get caught up in the arguments, as I have been reading in these pages, but to me the only proof I need is the healthy kids living in my home.  I wouldn't go a day without them and as a single Mom of 4, that is saying a lot.

[Kittycat]

Hi Momof4 and Moore4u,

It is great to hear of how glyconutrients have helped you and/or your loved ones. It is very encouraging for so many to know that others are doing so well.

Please continue to share regardless of the negative attitudes.
Unfortunately these negative attitudes are typical and I can only imagine what doctors go through who support glyconutrition.
I have come to the point of realizing that it doesn't matter what others say or think regarding this topic. So many have tried to disqualify and tear down anything good said about this technology, however the results are changing peoples lives.

The sad part is that those who are so negative are robbing themselves of a blessing!

I have decided to ignore these destructive attitudes and focus on people who are open minded.

Please continue with your posting here and join me in ignoring the negative attitudes. God bless, KC


His grace is sufficient and His strength is made perfect in my weakness

[moore4u]

Momof4 and Kittycat!
Your acknowledgement of what the glyconutrients have done for your family and friends really makes me so thankful. I agree with what you say about "the proof is in the pudding" so to speak.

I know for sure now, that the glyconutrients are what have improved my Lyme symptoms - the brain fog, dizziness and chronic fatigue. I too ran out on Saturday and I have to wait until my next order comes in next week due to lack of money to get any, any sooner. I can feel the symptoms rolling back in...sinking back into that fog and the tired, exhausted feelings returning. This is not my imagination, I am a believer.

Please continue to share your successes here and I will too! [:I]