[tony6789 (OP)]

It's ok gecko

NEVER! underestimate youth

[Carolyn]

quote:Originally posted by gecko

i did not realize this person was 13, and am truly sorry. really.

i might have been taking out some vain agression where i shouldntve been.

im very embarrased

I also apologise.  I was a bit harsh.

Carolyn

[tony6789 (OP)]

So what about exercism

NEVER! underestimate youth

[tony6789 (OP)]

?

NEVER! underestimate youth

[upton]

quote:Originally posted by tony6789

So what about exercism

NEVER! underestimate youth

Though I understand that exorcism exists I do not know if any have been accurately documented. You would think that the recording of such an event, with witnesses, would help to establish a truth in this respect.

~~~I can't think of a signature~~~

[Kevinkrupp]

What is wrong with you all
There is a God and he sent his one and only son to die on the cross for you and you wont even believe in him

Well then how did humans get to be on this planet.
If the earth was tilted one direction up we would all burn and if it was tilted one direction down we would all freeze.
or if the earth was closer then everything would burn and it if where farther away we would all freeze

For example if i wound a wrist watch in the middle of a field i would not assume that it just appeared out of nowhere and i would not assume that it had always existed i would assume that it had a designer but you dont know the designer you would still KNOW there was a designer.

we realize that there will always be skeptics who have their own ideas concerning God. and will read evidence accordingly. and there will be some people who no amount of proof will convence them (it all comed down to fait.)

God shows himself through creation, and his word, and he sent his son jesus crist.

Kevin Krupp

[tony6789 (OP)]

that's exactly what we r arguing on. All the proof we have og Gad or Jesus is the Bible!

NEVER! underestimate youth

[gecko]

kevin krupp, you are everything i hate.

im so angry i cant even gather my thoughts well enough to tell you everything that is wrong with what you just said.

im retiring from this whole "debate". sorry to be the embodiment of the "angry atheist" but sometimes thats just the way it is...

[tony6789 (OP)]

we do not know if god really sent jesus or created the world. we have no proof if he does or has ever existed


NEVER! underestimate youth

[neilep]

You see this is the problem (Whilst writing this I am having a ' here we go again moment '...and it's not nice)

Kevinkrupp believes in God...he believes in God so much that what ever one might say, his staunch point of view (ie: belief) wins through every time and nothing anybody will say will change his mind.

Nothing wrong with that I respect his beliefs  ( I personally don't share them )...but please leave the proselytising for a non science site !!

Incidentally...I'm sure I saw a program which mentioned the finding the watch thing....of course a watch may well have a makers mark on it !..YES...I suppose one could argue that the earth and the universe etc has it's own makers mark too...I suppose *le sigh*)....I am sure Kevinkrupp is happy in his certainty so much so that he thinks we're all blind to the obvious.

I have found that such perspectives have a weakness though.....it's the inability to entertain the possibility that there may be another answer.
 However, he MIGHT be right. we just do not know and will never know unless God calls round for tea and a chat !!....and that's why (it's that 'here we go again' moment')....this thread...like all the religious ones before it.......never have a resolution to them.


For the recent members...I once held a running poll on this site as to whether one believed in God or not...I wanted to keep it simple so the premise was...do you believe in God..Yes or No ?....it's interesting that after about 8 months...the votes were split right down the middle...that did surprise me considering the nature of this site........

I deleted the thread because it later became a place of argument and derision...but I did think the results interesting.

Men are the same as women, just inside out !

[ejirolove30]

1. Does God exist?

Throughout history, in all cultures of the world, people have been convinced there is a God.
Billions of people, who represent diverse sociological, intellectual, emotional, educational makeups...believe that there is a Creator, a God to be worshipped. Now, the fact that so many people believe something certainly doesn't make it true. But when so many people through the ages are so personally convinced that God exists, can one say with absolute confidence that they are all mistaken?
"Anthropological research has indicated that among the farthest and most remote primitive people today, there is a universal belief in God. And in the earliest histories and legends of people all around the world, the original concept was of one God, who was the Creator. An original high God seems once to have been in their consciousness even in those societies which are today polytheistic.

Does God exist?

God not only has revealed Himself in what can be observed in nature and the world as kevin mentioned below, and in human life, but He has even more specifically shown Himself in the Bible.
God's thoughts, personality, and attitudes can only be known if God chooses to reveal them. All else would be human speculation. We are at a loss if God does not wish to be known. But God wants us to know Him and has told us in the Bible all we need to know about His character and how to relate to Him. This makes the reliability of the Bible an important consideration.
Archaeological findings continue to confirm rather than refute the accuracy of the Bible. For example, an archeological find in northern Israel in August 1993 confirmed the existence of King David, author of many of the Psalms in the Bible.10 The Dead Sea Scrolls and other archaeological discoveries continue to substantiate the historical accuracy of the Bible.

 The Bible was written over a 1500-year span, by 40 different authors, in different locations and on separate continents, written in three different languages, covering diverse subject matters at different points in history.11 Yet there is an astounding consistency in its message. Throughout the entire Bible the same message appears:

God created the world we live in, and created us specifically to have a relationship with Him.
He deeply loves us.
We have sinned and are under God's judgment, in need of His forgiveness.
God provided a way for our sins to be forgiven.
He asks us to receive His forgiveness and have a relationship with Him that will last eternally.
Along with this central script, the Bible specifically reveals God's character. Psalm 145 is a typical summary of God's personality, thoughts and feelings toward us. If you want to know God, here He is.

No other book on earth can make 11 correct prophecies in the space of  2000 yrs, yet the bible has over 340 prophecies that was written over 2000 yrs ago and came to pass.

[ejirolove30]

If you truly want the answer read http://www.everystudent.com/features/isthere.html [nofollow]


No other book in this world can make 11 correct prophecies yet the bible  has over 340 prophecies that came to pass.

[ejirolove30]

quote:Originally posted by gecko

tony, i cant prove god doesnt exist anymore than you can prove he can.

 when you say something exists with no evidence whatsoever, just because of faith or belief, you can never be proven wrong. i believe theres a planet in the universe ruled by a race of skyscraper sized ants who eat nothing but pancakes. if you cant prove me wrong, than is that true?

 god is just about as likely, considering theres the same amount of proof for both. i always want to see evidence before i believe in something... for some reason objectivity and skepticism have taken a backseat to the whimsy and wonder of religion

You want to see evidence?  Look around you.  something you probally take for granted oxygen. think how plants breate in what we breathe out and produces clean air. think how the planet is position in such a way that one slight move to or from the sun can lead to destruction of planet earth.

God has left evidence all around us that He exists.  Only the fool say in his heart there is no God.

[science_guy]

here is an example of the truth of the bible:

ask yourselves when the bible was written.  Pre columbus times, right?  

in the bible, it never suggests that the earth is flat, and even mentions that it is round.  Now we have people proving, in science, what the bible already tells us.  There is no proof, in science, that God does not exist.  The universe had a beginning, and anything that has a beginning must be created.

E=MC2... m=deg/360 X C... C= PiD

therefore E=deg/360 X 2(PiD)

[ejirolove30]

It is a scientific fact that life can only come from pre-existant life, not from matter alone.  Therefore to trace life back to its source we must  come back to God Himself.

When you know that there is a God, now read the bible to find out if this book speaks of this God.

Read my argument above as to why the bible is the word of God.

[science_guy]

you know, there are other topics in this forum, you dont have to post in one topic only.

Aside from that, i agree, in a scientific perspective, with everything he has said


E=MC2... m=deg/360 X C... C= PiD

therefore E=deg/360 X 2(PiD)

[ukmicky]

quote:No other book on earth can make 11 correct prophecies in the space of 2000 yrs

So that one correct prophecy for every 181 years, not much luck then. How many did it get wrong? If I was to sit back and write a book I reckon I could do better especially if I had 2000 years of coincidence and luck to play with.

Also if god created us and the earth why did he wait over 4 billion years before he created us and put us on it , Did he fall asleep .

why did he create the dinosaurs first, were they more important than us.


 

quote:You want to see evidence? Look around you. Something you probably take for granted oxygen. Think how plants breathe in what we breathe out and produces clean air.

And evolution has had 4 billion years to do it, no god required.



 

quote:Think how the planet is position in such a way that one slight move to or from the sun can lead to destruction of planet earth.

When you consider there are over 100 billion stars in our galaxy and as far as we can tell most of them have planets around them, then the chances of at least one of them having the correct condition for life as we no it, is pretty good. A god isn’t required to position our planet where it is. A god isn’t required for a planet to have an atmosphere like ours.

 

quote:It is a scientific fact that life can only come from pre-existent life, not from matter alone. Therefore to trace life back to its source we must come back to God Himself.

It’s a scientific fact is it, if that’s the case then show me these scientific facts.


 

quote:in the bible, it never suggests that the earth is flat, and even mentions that it is round.

Take a look at the moon it looks round to me ,so why wouldn’t they also think the earth is  round, Something round can still be flat.


 

quote: Now we have people proving, in science, what the bible already tells us. There is no proof in science that God does not exist.

There is also no proof in science that god does exist,the good thing about science it deals with evidence, something written in a book is proof of nothing.

 

quote:The universe had a beginning, and anything that has a beginning must be created.

So our universe had a beginning but who is to say that our one is the only one, as far as we know there could be multiple universes ,billions of the things. also what happens to your creationist theories if our universe  started through events in one of those other universes.

If everything has to have a beginning who created god did he just pop up from nothing.

The earth has been around for over 4 billion years more than enough time for evolution to sort itself out and create what we see today.


Michael

[ejirolove30]

Maybe you need to take a look at nature and do a little studing.  Evolution cannot cause such order as we see today. Maybe take a look at the food chain or do a study on gravity. I guess evolution placed gravity as well.    You cannot bring God down to your state of mind and ask who created God. We are subject to time not God.

[ejirolove30]

Also you misread my part about prophecies.  I stated that the bible has over 340 prophecies that already came to pass.  No one cannot make such accurate prophecies.   There are extensive prophecies dealing with individual nations and cities and with the course of history in general, all of which have been literally fulfilled. More than 300 prophecies were fulfilled by Christ Himself at His first coming. Other prophecies deal with the spread of Christianity, as well as various false religions, and many other subjects.

There is no other book, ancient or modern, like this. The vague, and usually erroneous, prophecies of people like Jeanne Dixon, Nostradamus, Edgar Cayce, and others like them are not in the same category at all, and neither are other religious books such as the Koran, the Confucian Analects, and similar religious writings. Only the Bible manifests this remarkable prophetic evidence, and it does so on such a tremendous scale as to render completely absurd any explanation other than divine revelation.

If one will seriously investigate these Biblical evidences, he will find that their claims of divine inspiration (stated over 3,000 times, in various ways) were amply justified.

[ejirolove30]

Another striking evidence of divine inspiration is found in the fact that many of the principles of modern science were recorded as facts of nature in the Bible long before scientist confirmed them experimentally. A sampling of these would include:

    * Roundness of the earth (Isaiah 40:22)
    * Almost infinite extent of the sidereal universe (Isaiah 55:9)
    * Law of conservation of mass and energy (II Peter 3:7)
    * Hydrologic cycle (Ecclesiastes 1:7)
    * Vast number of stars (Jeremiah 33:22)
    * Law of increasing entropy (Psalm 102:25-27)
    * Paramount importance of blood in life processes (Leviticus 17:11)
    * Atmospheric circulation (Ecclesiastes 1:6)
    * Gravitational field (Job 26:7)
    * and many others.

These are not stated in the technical jargon of modern science, of course, but in terms of the basic world of man's everyday experience; nevertheless, they are completely in accord with the most modern scientific facts.