[Ylide (OP)]

I've had tinnitus (ringing in the ears) since I was a teenager.  I'm not sure how it developed, I never listened to headphones very loud or very often..maybe from one too many blows to the head during football and wrestling.  I learned quickly to tune it out, however.  It's been over 10 years since I first got it.

But lately, it's been getting worse, sometimes the ringing is so loud it hurts.  Normal sound always overrides the ringing, even when it's really bad, so it doesn't interfere with my hearing, just with my sanity.  (especially when I'm trying to sleep!)

Is there a way to treat tinnitus or do I just need to readjust to the new level of volume?



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[Donnah]

Jay, have you been eating more salt lately?  Excess salt can make it louder.  I've had tinnitis off and on since childhood, and constantly for almost 20 years.  You can try taking 30 mg of CoQ10 and 10 mg of manganese daily with a good multivitamin.  It's supposed to help, but I haven't tried it yet.  You can be the guinea pig and let me know.[]

[Ylide (OP)]

Hmm...I HAVE been eating more in general lately, which could coincede with more salt since I tend to eat out and cook rich salty foods.  I'll cut out the salt and try some vitamins and see what happens.



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[chris]

Is this tinnitus in both ears, or just one ?

Any past history of severe infection, ear trauma, hearing loss, exposure to loud noise ? Any family history of thi problem ? Any exposure to ototoxic drugs like aspirin or gentamicin ?

Chris

"I never forget a face, but in your case I'll make an exception"
 - Groucho Marx

[Ylide (OP)]

It's in both ears.  I've never head a serious ear or head trauma, nor have I had an ear infection, and I don't think anyone else in the family has symptoms.  The only severe infection I ever had was a bronchial infection around age 10.  I don't think I starting noticing the tinnitus until my teens though.  I do have mild cauliflower ear in my left ear from being on the wrestling team in high school, but I don't think that's related since it's just some external scar tissue.  

I have had aspirin at various points in my life, of course.  






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[Donnah]

Question for you Chris.  I have tinnitis in my right ear and if I put a finger against my neck directly below the earlobe I hear a squishy, windy sort of sound.  That doesn't happen on the other side.  (No personal history of infection or hearing loss.  Several head traumas, some exposure to loud music, and a possible double dose of Tylenol during a particularly nasty migraine after which the noise was permanent.)  Why does it make a sound when I push on that side and not the other?

[tweener]

I've had tinnitus in my left ear since college (too much loud music) and have wondered what could be done.  I'm going to try your recommendation Donnah.  Thanks!


----
John

[Donnah]

You're welcome.  Let me know how well it works for you; I might try my own advice.  Right now I'm busy rebuilding bone mass (the joy of being a middle aged woman).

Hey, just thought of something.  Do you suppose tinnitis is the origin of the expression "s/he has a tin ear"?

[tweener]

I don't know about the origin, but mine sometimes sounds like a piece of tin being rubbed with a file.

Hey!  maybe that's why I'm so sensitive to certain scraping sounds (we had another thread on that).  The scraping sounds cause interference/dissonance with my internal sounds and freak out some of my brain cells.


----
John

[Donnah]

That's entirely possible.  Just the other day I was in a room with a fan and a pair of (noisy) external hard drives running and it gave me the willies because it combined with the tinnitis to create a horrible sound.

[Mikek]

I've had tinnitus for over five years in one ear only.  The past few months it has gotten worse and I have been reading a lot about it.  I recently found something that actually worked for me - i.e. it stopped the ringing.  I believe it is quite scientific.  From what I have read tinnitus can occur for many reasons - but a major reason is exposure to loud noise that causes a loss of "hair" cells in the ear.  These are not really "hair" cells but that is what some people call them.  I believe this is what happened in my case.  I have a slight hearing loss in the ear that rings - although it is still above the everyday audio range.  I know about this hearing loss because I have gone to several audiologists.  In cases like mine (I believe) where there is a hearing loss due to damaged "hair" cells, there is an issue with your nerve cells adjusting to the now absent sound.  I believe the nerve cells start to fire because they are healthy but the "input" device (the "hair" cells in your ear) is not.   Here's what I did to "fix" it.  On my computer I have a software music program that has a piano keyboard (I won't list the name of the program because I am trying to help - not to sell anything).  This software is very inexpensive (once you have a computer - or you could go to a friends house who might have it).  Using this program and a set of earphones (while my ear was ringing terribly) I found the exact tone of my ringing and matched it as best I could (the keyboard program had choices like "violin", "harpsichord" etc.)  The one called "whistle" was pretty close to my ringing sound, but the sound called "reed organ" was even closer to the exact sound.  I played this tone into my bad ear for several minutes turning the volume up and down (not ever too loud).  In fact, I especialy tried to turn the volume down so I could "just" hear it.  Believe it or not (and I am a big skeptic about tinnitus "remedies") - this worked!
I believe the reason is because I was able to exercise the nerve that had been laying idle (dormant) and "misfiring".  Once it got activated - it stopped ringing on it's own.  To find the "exact" tone of my ringing I played through the chromatic scale near the tone.  I found that at the exact ringing tone it started out loud but got softer if I waited.  On the tones near it - this did not happen.  I am NOT a doctor - but I beleive this is completely consistent with the Tinnitus Retraining Therapy offered at some clinics.  This relief may be only temporary - but when your ear is ringing all day - any relief (for several hours or days) is great.  Again, I am just telling you what worked in my case alone.

[Ylide (OP)]

Mikek, welcome to the forums.  Your method sounds interesting, maybe I'll give it a try.  My ringing sounds almost exactly like the "Emergency Broadcast System" alert they put on TV once in a while...I'm sure i could find a synth sound  like that.  



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[Ylide (OP)]

Oh and Chris, tinnitus question for you:

My doctor wants to put me on an SSRI for the anxiety I've been having.  I've heard from a few different sources that SSRIs can increase the intensity of the ringing in tinnitus cases, and then increase it even more if you go off.  My doctor calls bull**** on that.  What's your opinion?  I'm hesitant to start an SSRI for a variety of reasons, but this one's a dealbreaker.  





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[Donnah]

Hi Mikek, welcome to the forum.  Your remedy sounds (no pun intended) like a great idea.  I'll try to find something that simulates my tinnitis too.  Might be interesting for my family to know what I constantly hear.  Mine is very high pitched, like the sound you hear coming from electrical appliances (particularly TV) sometimes.  After a hearing test (prior to tinnitis) the technician said that I hear a higher range than most people and compared me to a dog (not the first time I've had that comparison[]).

Jay, can you talk yourself through these anxiety attacks?  I learned to do that when the mercury messed up my brain chemistry.  Just kept telling myself "this will pass, it always does" over and over to drown out the mental chatter exacerbating the anxiety.  I think it was you who said that anxiety is fear.  Can you find what your fear is and address that?  And how's your B vitamin intake?  You may be one of those people whose body has a higher requirement for B.  I noticed that B6 and B12 calmed the body and the mind.  I've forgotten now which one soothed the body and which the mind, but you can play with them.  I take a good B complex as a base and fine tune from there.

[Ylide (OP)]

Donnah,

I can talk myself through them in the sense I know exactly what's going on and that it's purely biochemical, but it's still rather uncomfortable.  A couple years of gobbling white blotter acid like Pacman gave me a rather insightful view into what's real and what's not and how to talk myself down from freaking out.

But that doesn't make the actual episode any less annoying...my heart rate and blood pressure shoot up, I become extremely light sensitive, my ears ring like crazy, my chest hurts, and I have this sensation that I'm going to die or go crazy, even though I consciously know what's going on.  It comes really suddenly, lasts a couple hours, and then has "aftershocks" that last about, oh, a week or so.  The doctor prescribed Xanax as a short term cure (which works marvelously I might add)  but wants me to go on Zoloft long term.  If there's even a chance that zoloft will increase my tinnitus,(or make me impotent!) fark that, I'll keep the panic attacks, thanks.  If my ear ringing gets any worse, I'd never sleep without chemical assistance.

It often comes on when I over-stimulate myself with too much caffeine for long periods of time and/or hyperfocusing on a video game or schoolwork for long periods of time and don't drink enough water.  (which is why I think it's purely biochemical and not psychological)
 
I take a regular multi-vitamin, I haven't tried any extra B-complex stuff.  I think it was you that recommended I try that and coenzyme Q10, I'd like to, I'm just awfully poor right now.

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[tweener]

Jay,
I'm certainly no expert here, but I'm going to drop in my 2c worth.

I've found that exercise is a great way to eliminate my depressive cycle.  When I workout 3 or 4 times a week (at least) for close to an hour, I feel really good all the time.  When I miss the workouts, my mood starts swinging down, I feel very depressed and sometimes have mild anxiety attacks.  Though it's nothing like what you describe.


----
John

[Ylide (OP)]

You know something John.....last semester I was working out regularly and I didn't have a problem the entire time.  I hadn't made that connection...wow, thanks.  I'm glad school's starting up again next week so I'll have access to the gym again.





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[Donnah]

Jay, that's great if exercise works for you!  The B vitamins are low cost, about 1/6 of the price of CoQ10.  Look out for those antidepressants, I was on Effexor for four years and even though I took much less than I was told to, it killed (as in dead, dead, dead) my sex drive.  Took a few years of being off the stuff to get back to normal.

[psychohawk]

Cannabinoid, have you been exposed to any benzene containing solvents?  It is one of the most common causes of tinnitus in both ears.   There is benzenes in cigarettes.

[Ylide (OP)]

psychohawk, welcome to the fourms.

No, my tinnitus started long before i ever touched a cigarette (it started in high school, well over 10 years ago), and I had never handled benzene until, oh, about 18 months ago when I took organic chemistry.  Maybe it's from all the blows to the head I took in football and wrestling.  =/

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[Thomas]

I have tinnitus for 3 years now but thanks to a strict avoidance of nerve stimulants like caffeine and alcohol it has continuously improved and is now just short of disappearing.
The occasional use of painkillers (Aspirin, Paracetamol) has also greatly contributed to reduce the ear-ringing (both in the short and long term). More receently I have discovered the calming influence of alcohol-free beer.
For more information see my website newbielink:http://www.mytinnitus.de [nonactive]

[Ylide (OP)]

I've heard that aspirin can actually cause tinnitus.  Maybe it's different for each person.  Low dosage of Xanax is actually doing quite well for my tinnitus.  As I said above, I've been taking it for other reasons, but my ears don't ring for days after taking one.  Too bad I won't take more than 2 week.  (because of the addictiveness of Xanax...last thing I need is to get hooked on it)



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[psychohawk]

Thomas The hops in beer Has a definite calming effect.  Hops are used botanically as a muscle relaxer.

[psychohawk]

Cannabinoid, does the loudness of the come and go or has the ringing gotten progressively worse over the 10 year period?

[Ylide (OP)]

It comes and goes.  Various factors affect it and my noticing of it varies too.  Sometimes it's not there, but usually it IS there, I just don't notice it.  I may not notice it for months then not be able to sleep for a week because I've suddenly focused on it.  I don't think the maximum intesity has gotten worse since I first developed it, but it's definately variable.  It seems to be worst after I have an anxiety episode like last week (I get them maybe once or twice a year), after getting drunk (once or twice a month), and after hyperfocusing on something for a long period of time.  (rather often, though less intense)


Donnah, that's one of the main reasons aside from tinnitus that I am loathe to go on an SSRI.  I don't have many years of good sex drive left, I'd like to keep it for a while, thank you very much.


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[Thomas]

quote:Originally posted by cannabinoid

I've heard that aspirin can actually cause tinnitus

As far as I am aware, this is only an issue if you take large amounts of Aspirin (about 2g a day) for an extended period of time, but anyway, Paracetamol may work as well in suppressing the tinnitus (at least it does for me). I find it logical that any analgesic (painkiller) numbs and calms the hearing nerve and hence suppresses the ear-ringing. The painkiller Katadolon is even prescribed by some doctors as a tinnitus therapy, but this is a rather strong substance which can have severe side effects and is clinically not very well tested over longer periods. If the occasional Aspirin or Paracetamol has a positive effect, this is in any case to be preferred over other medications which usually have more severe side effects.

Thomas
newbielink:http://www.mytinnitus.de [nonactive]

[Thomas]

quote:Originally posted by psychohawk

Thomas The hops in beer Has a definite calming effect.  Hops are used botanically as a muscle relaxer.

The hops may well contribute here, but herbal tablets containing hops do not work half as well for me. Either it has something to do with the other ingredients in the tablets or the additional fluid of the beer (an increased intake of fluid is anyhow beneficial for tinnitus).
It has to be stressed though that the alcohol in normal beer will tend to aggravate the tinnitus, so the hops will work best in the case of alcohol-free beer.

Thomas
newbielink:http://www.mytinnitus.de [nonactive]

[Ylide (OP)]

Yep, getting drunk will ring my ears like heck every time.  I'm starting to notice that caffeine is doing the same thing, which really makes me sad, I can't live without coffee.  =/



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[tweener]

I don't use alcohol enough to know if it makes a difference.  Coffee makes it a little worse, but not enough to be worth stopping.  []

I notice that when I'm retaining extra water, like after a salty meal, it gets worse.  Coffee is a good diuretic and sort of helps.

Lately, my ears have been very stuffy and the tinnitus has been much worse. I've taken some decongestant (guaifensen) (sp?) off and on and it helps some, with the stuffiness and the tinnitus.  I wish I knew of some other decongestant that would help more with unclogging ears.  (HINT HINT)


----
John

[Niles]

havent slept in about 36 hours, ringing is increasing.... gawd help

[Ylide (OP)]

Niles, I'm sorry to hear that, but I understand what you're dealing with, believe me.  Is it the ringing that's keeping you awake or is it that you've been awake for so long that's making your ears ring?

I'd get myself to a doctor if this is a common thing you're dealing with.  At the very least they can make sure there's nothing seriously wrong with you (severe tinnitus can be a symptom of something far more sinister) and give you a sedative.

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[Donnah]

Niles, have you tried taking some Valerian with a hot milk drink?

[Niles]

I feel a lil better, slept on-off for a couple hours. My tinnitis comes and goes. I have been researching this thing like crazy and think in my case that it has something to do with adrenaline (fight/flight reaction) but am not sure. Many things like caffeine, cigarettes, etc. cause it to be worse, however I think I know what started this episode and have since stopped all those things that keep it getting worse. I have had it for 20 years and it comes and goes alot. This time was bad, but I am a lil better. History: ARMY bomb squad 10 years, water in ear for two weeks from swimming, dangerous procedure on one ear while in Haiti, etc etc. I try to minimize all the things that start it up/ make it unbearable again, but have no control over subconsious (flare-up with adrenaline). Maybe if we could get a cure started with how to quickly get rid of excess adrenaline in the body faster? i dunno...

[Ylide (OP)]

Talk to your doc about using a benzodiaziprene to treat it.  (xanax, klonopin, etc)  Speaking from experience, they wonders for anxiety-induced tinnitus.  (it's helping mine greatly)  Don't rely on it as a long-term medication, but take it on occasions where the ringing is really bad.

disclaimer:  I'm not a doctor, I'm simply suggesting what worked for me in a similar situation.  Your doctor should hopefully know what's best for you.  If you were in the Army, you should still have access to VA doctors, and they tend to be quite well trained.



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[tweener]

Donnah,
I thought I'd give you a little feedback.  I've been taking CoQ10 for a couple of weeks, and the multivitamin I take has manganese.  So far my tinnitus has not improved.  It kinda comes and goes depending on how much sleep I do or don't get.   Much of the time, my ears feel a little stuffy and I'm wondering if I have some low grade infection or something.  Thanks for the suggestion - I'm going to keep taking it and see if more time will help.


----
John

[MachineGhost]

quote:Originally posted by tweener
Lately, my ears have been very stuffy and the tinnitus has been much worse. I've taken some decongestant (guaifensen) (sp?) off and on and it helps some, with the stuffiness and the tinnitus.  I wish I knew of some other decongestant that would help more with unclogging ears.  (HINT HINT)

Ephedrine or any of its derivatives.  The bad news is it almost always requires LARGE amounts to clear up chronic ear congestion and this is not something you want to do by yourself without competent clinical supervision unless you have a death wish.

Guaifenesin is not really a decongestant, but a mucus thinning agent which also increases the expulsion rate by acting directly on the kidneys.  It would be best to combine it or carbocisteine with ephedrine to maximize effectiveness.

Machine Ghost

[Ylide (OP)]

You can buy medicines that have both Guaifenesin and ephedrine in them in your local drug store.  I can't think of any brand names off the top of my head.



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[tweener]

I haven't taken time to look yet.  Meanwhile the problem is persistent and seems to be getting worse (slowly).  I'm going to have to get with it sometime.


----
John

[Donnah]

John, I think it would take more than a few weeks to heal a problem like that.  Got some CoQ10 myself so I'll try it as well.  The top 4 supplements that my book recommends are CoQ10 (30 mg daily), manganese (10 mg daily), a multivitamin and mineral complex (for balanced nutrition) and potassium (99 mg daily).  My tinnitis gets worse if I'm tired, stressed, or at that "special time".  I've slacked off with my vitamin regimen lately and need to get back on the wagon.  Thanks for the feedback.

[OzzieMom]

Cannabinoid, have you ruled out neurological problems?
I went through all the panic episodes through out my life.
I was dx with chiari malformation when I was 37. I had my 1st surgery in 98 and another on in 2002, Through a 3-D Ct it showed I had Spina Bifida Occulta at c2&3. Had a redo of the 1st surgery and my neck fused. Over the years of researching CM and related disorders, I was pretty amazed with nerves and muscles. And the brain too.
Last surgery helped for awhile now it is back worse than ever. My hearing has gotten worse to.
Mine sounds like the washing machine filling in the other room. I can't hear the phone ring unless I have it with me. Tv gets louder and louder. Ent Dr. says if it gets worse next year I will have to think of hearing aids. He said it would help with the tinnitus. I sure hope so because it can drive me nuts sometimes!

[tweener]

Donnah,
I'm taking CoQ10 150mg daily and the multivitamin, but have not been able to find a manganese supplement.  The multivitamin has some manganese in it.   I'm not taking extra potassium yet.  I'm going to keep after it.  

I'm still thinking that I may have some sort of low grade sinus infection.  I've been using a neti pot for a week now, and can't get anything to flow through.  I can breathe through my nose, but can't get the water to do anything.  

I need to get back on an exercise regimen.  I'm doing ok on the vitamins, but I've slacked way off on exercise and it is really getting me down.  I don't know if it'll help my ears.


----
John

[Donnah]

There are a number of us in the forum with tinnitis, so why don't we look for some sort of commonality?  

John, I have suspected some sort of low grade infection too.  My ears, particularly the right one (which is most affected by the tinnitis) are frequently itchy and the itch feels like it is both in front of and behind my eardrum.  Sometimes it feels like it's itchy in the middle of my head (very annoying, no scratching there).  Since rhinoplasty my sinuses have been constantly irritated and I've had two abcessed teeth (both teeth with roots that intrude into my sinus cavity).

[MachineGhost]

quote:Originally posted by MachineGhost
Ephedrine or any of its derivatives.  The bad news is it almost always requires LARGE amounts to clear up chronic ear congestion and this is not something you want to do by yourself without competent clinical supervision unless you have a death wish.

I have since come across what may be a safer decongestant to use in larger doeses.  It is called "synephrine" and does not act upon the heart or breathing channels as ephedrine does, just thermogenesis.  But why that would have anything to do with decongesting is beyond me.

Also, lobelia extract is another effective decongestant, mainly for the lungs.  It contains at least 10 different alkaloids.

Machine Ghost

[Ylide (OP)]

OzzieMom:  I don't think anything is ruled out yet.  Something doesn't feel "right" in my head, almost like I can sense the brain chemistry is not quite where it needs to be, but I have a hard time really verbalizing the sensation.  The stuff I'm on right now covers it up and keeps symptoms from expressing, but I don't think it's a cure.  

I've been thinking about it more lately, though, and I have a hypothesis.  I have almost constant pain in my teeth from some wisdom teeth that aren't coming in quite right and several untreated cavities.  I've been too poor to go to the dentist, so I've just been dealing it with it.  I am starting to wonder if the stress of almost constant pain can affect mental state.  I don't consciously notice it so much except for when I'm having problems focusing.  The increased frequency in anxiety coincides with the progressively greater pain.  Something to think about anyway.  (On the bright side, I'm getting my teeth fixed in about a month!)

Either that or it's all the acid I took in my early 20's.

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[Quantumcat]

Ozzymom: Question ... why did you call yourself 'ozzie' if you're from the US? 'Oz' is a familiar term for Australia, and 'Ozzie' for Australian ....

Am I dead? Am I alive? I'm both!

[OzzieMom]

2 answers. My maiden name was Osborne, and I live in a town called Ozark. No connection between the two. My father was from Ky. and my mom is from here.

Cannabinoid- have you ever seen the nerves that run around to your mouth? maybe when you get your teeth fixed some of the problem will ease!? Good luck.

[Donnah]

Jay, the nerve that goes to your teeth is in the C2 and C3 region of your neck.  My chiropractor uses gentle percussion to adjust vertebrae and when he does those two disks there's pain in my teeth.  And I can tell you from experience that constant pain affects your mental state.  The pain also tends to make people clench their teeth which can cause muscles in your head, jaw and neck to spasm.  Try massaging the muscles that run vertically in front of and behind your ears.  You can also pull your ears away from your head.  Then rub the muscle over the spot where your jaw hinges.  You might be surprised at how painful that one can be.

[OzzieMom]

Donna, clinching teeth is a big problem of mine. I do it when I get out and I have to remind myself to loosen up! I was in a halo for 4 months.
I rub those spots alot!. I have been doing that for a long time. here is a link to a cranial nerve site I thought was neat.  http://www.gwc.maricopa.edu/class/bio201/cn/cranial.htm [nofollow]
Here is another neat site.
http://faculty.ncarts.edu/generalstudies/pounds/anatomyphysiology/HeadNekMPost.htm [nofollow]
I have to see pictures to understand why things do what they do. All my muscles at the back of my head/neck are attached to a plate running across the whole back of my head. My muscles have atrophied and there is nothing I can do for it. Botox? Not quite ready for that. Don't care much for needles and more pain!

[Donnah]

Pam, you are Wonderwoman!  A halo for four months would put me in the looney bin.  I had a neck brace for a few weeks.  Why don't you try visualization to reverse your muscle atrophy?  You've said yourself that you are a visual person.  Why did you have to get a plate put in?

I have a friend who is quadraplegic and gets terrible muscle spasms.  She goes a couple of times a year for botox injections and it helps her tremendously.  Is botox something your doctor has recommended?

[MachineGhost]

quote:Originally posted by cannabinoid
I've been thinking about it more lately, though, and I have a hypothesis.  I have almost constant pain in my teeth from some wisdom teeth that aren't coming in quite right and several untreated cavities.  I've been too poor to go to the dentist, so I've just been dealing it with it.  I am starting to wonder if the stress of almost constant pain can affect mental state.  I don't consciously notice it so much except for when I'm having problems focusing.  The increased frequency in anxiety coincides with the progressively greater pain.  Something to think about anyway.  (On the bright side, I'm getting my teeth fixed in about a month!)

Sad to say, but when I had both of my wisdom teeth extracted, it did not get rid of the ear fluid and tinnitus.

If you suspect you have a sinus or dental infection, then you should take a course of roxithromycin (generic name) which is one of the safest antibiotics (commonly prescribed antibiotics are not) and especially effective for ENT problems.  It will not kill the good bacteria in your gut either.

Erythromycin (while less safe than roxithromycin) has a special affinity for stimulating inactive cilia in the Eustachian tubes.

Neither of the above helped me, but may help others.

Machine Ghost