[Bored chemist]

And here we have the problem with a conspiracy theory.
The lack of proof a statement  is evidence of both the falsehood and of the truth of the statement.

Which is why they don't belong on science web sites.

[charles1948]

And here we have the problem with a conspiracy theory.
The lack of proof a statement  is evidence of both the falsehood and of the truth of the statement.

Which is why they don't belong on science web sites.

Except perhaps on websites run by cats

[Jolly2]

as they have also shown them false.

The conspiracy theorist can always claim that such documents are disinformation in order to keep their theory from being falsified.

It goes both ways, the Obama administration decided the best way to tackle 911 truth was to proliferate even more crazy conspiracies related to what happened on 911, and so disappearing planes amoung other nonsense were added to list of conspiracies by government.

Inherently the security services act in secret, everything they do is a conspiracy.

Supressed evidence is evidence, that is not the same as no evidence at all.

The problem is that what a lot of conspiracy theorists consider to be "suppressed evidence" cannot be distinguished from hearsay or rumors because it cannot be confirmed to be true.

Sure, my only point was that historically evidence has been suppressed intentionally, and that in the current climate, it appears some people feel the only way they can tell the truth is with some degree of protection.  Ultimately that is a climate the security establishment has imposed, and it's a bad sign.

Just because the health care worker spoke serctly is not in of itself a reason to reject the statement.

[Bored chemist]

It goes both ways, the Obama administration decided the best way to tackle 911 truth was to proliferate even more crazy conspiracies...

Is that meant to be irony?

[Kryptid]

It goes both ways, the Obama administration decided the best way to tackle 911 truth was to proliferate even more crazy conspiracies related to what happened on 911, and so disappearing planes amoung other nonsense were added to list of conspiracies by government.

Please don't tell me you're also a 9-11 truther.

Inherently the security services act in secret, everything they do is a conspiracy.

So how can you ever claim to know what it is that they are doing?

in the current climate, it appears some people feel the only way they can tell the truth is with some degree of protection

Again, since when was it established that these people are telling the truth? For all we know, they real reason they are keeping themselves anonymous is so that they cannot be held accountable if they are, in fact, lying. So yes, it is important whether they are telling the truth or not.

Ultimately that is a climate the security establishment has imposed, and it's a bad sign.

Evidence?

Just because the health care worker spoke serctly is not in of itself a reason to reject the statement.

That's right, but there is also no reason to accept the statement. There is no weight behind it and there won't be any weight behind it until someone can provide objective evidence to support it. Remember, the burden of proof is on the claimant, not the debunker.

[Zer0 (OP)]

" On a related note, how does a forum deal with a troll who doesn't realise they are a troll? "

LMAO! @ B.C.
🤭

P.S. - Hopefully Thee Sleeping Giant(C.H.R.I.S.) shall wake up soon & deal with the Trollz!
🙏
Special Thanks to the Mod who brought down an OP that triggered Me to create this OP.
👍👍👍
Also Thanks Alot for making the User  " palashinternationals " disappear in thin air.
🤗

[Zer0 (OP)]

@Jolly2

Hello there...
🙏

At first, i thought it would be simply futile to respond to your Post.
(I still feel somewhat the same)
But...i have this uncanny ability to surprise my ownself...hence, here's a Response.
👍
(Apologies for the delay)

Jolly...you kinda Misunderstood what i was tryin to point out at...
😑
I certainly wasn't questioning the Subject Matter of the OPs...
No Questions are Stoopid!
👍
     All i wished to state was that there needs to be a Limit per User inorder to create new OPs.
There are no specified limits set as yet by the Webpage Forum Designer...coz perhaps We all are mature enough to follow chat etiquettes & that's something taken to be part of basic principles of any forum...to be nice & courteous & follow unstated guidlines & silent rules.

My only concern was, just as Some Users create 10(ten) different OPs in a single day...the other OPs get pushed down the page...& Most if em simply go unanswered.
🙏
Imagine...you register n login n create an OP for the very first time on this forum...& For complete 2(two) months there are no takers...not a Single response to your OP...would that really make you feel Jolly Good?
😑

Perhaps You do Not face the same dillema, coz you keep on n on posting comments single handedly in your OPs, hence they are afloat always atop each sub section of the forum.
🙏
(Again, plz do not misunderstand, im not complaining)

I cannot help but simply Agree with You on the point that " We need to have More discussions, Not Less ".
The Only aspect i wish to elaborate & emphasize upon is as " Quantity " matters, so does " Quality ".
👍
Less chitty chatter...but alot more meaningful wouldn't really be such a bad thing as it sounds.

I have No personal beef with you, none whatsoever!
🙏
But citing Conspiracy Theories & especially invoking GOD onto a Science Forum feels a bit disheartening & disrespectful.

Anyways, if i have ended up stirring all sorts of the wrong emotions in You...then Please do Forgive Me!
🙏
As i mentioned prior, i shall refrain from posting in your OPs but do not expect the same from You.
Please feel free to hijack my OPs with C.T.s & other stuff which is completely non evidental & pure work of Faith or Belief.


P.S. - May Your GOD/S provide You the Strength to Stop bowing down to Commandments & to Start Critically Thinking for your Ownself.
🤞
Tc!

[set fair]

" On a related note, how does a forum deal with a troll who doesn't realise they are a troll? "

LMAO! @ B.C.
🤭
🙏
👍👍👍
🤗

Tell them this is not facebook.
But they probably won't understand.

[Jolly2]

@Jolly2

Hello there...
🙏

At first, i thought it would be simply futile to respond to your Post.
(I still feel somewhat the same)
But...i have this uncanny ability to surprise my ownself...hence, here's a Response.
👍
(Apologies for the delay)

Jolly...you kinda Misunderstood what i was tryin to point out at...
😑
I certainly wasn't questioning the Subject Matter of the OPs...
No Questions are Stoopid!
👍
     All i wished to state was that there needs to be a Limit per User inorder to create new OPs.
There are no specified limits set as yet by the Webpage Forum Designer...coz perhaps We all are mature enough to follow chat etiquettes & that's something taken to be part of basic principles of any forum...to be nice & courteous & follow unstated guidlines & silent rules.

My only concern was, just as Some Users create 10(ten) different OPs in a single day...the other OPs get pushed down the page...& Most if em simply go unanswered.

Imagine...you register n login n create an OP for the very first time on this forum...& For complete 2(two) months there are no takers...not a Single response to your OP...would that really make you feel Jolly Good?
😑

If that happens I doubt it because others and posting too much, I used to look for unanswered question in the depths of the forum and answer then.

@
Perhaps You do Not face the same dillema, coz you keep on n on posting comments single handedly in your OPs, hence they are afloat always atop each sub section of the forum.
🙏
(Again, plz do not misunderstand, im not complaining)

I generally only ever do that to add I formation, or to return the conversation back to its actual theme, even when I copy a post I'll update it and add other information.

@
I cannot help but simply Agree with You on the point that " We need to have More discussions, Not Less ".
The Only aspect i wish to elaborate & emphasize upon is as " Quantity " matters, so does " Quality ".
👍

Its interesting I was watching a documentary yesterday about how big tobacco and the oil industry and plastics industry had funded science inorder to flood science with 1000s of studies that were intended to cloud the issues, big tobacco invested in studies that looked for other causes of cancer,  of plastics even worse funded studies that used animals that were not effected by plastics in the same way as other mammals as a means to muddy the waters with regards to how safe plastics were.

@
Less chitty chatter...but alot more meaningful wouldn't really be such a bad thing as it sounds.

I have No personal beef with you, none whatsoever!
🙏
But citing Conspiracy Theories & especially invoking GOD onto a Science Forum feels a bit disheartening & disrespectful.

It's sad you see things that way, science and faith completely different subjects looking at different things, evolutionary psychology has actually gained an appreciation for religion in recent years, Jordan Peterson is an example of a psychologist working in this area.
Still there is no conflict between religion and faith.

@
Anyways, if i have ended up stirring all sorts of the wrong emotions in You...then Please do Forgive Me!
🙏
As i mentioned prior, i shall refrain from posting in your OPs but do not expect the same from You.
Please feel free to hijack my OPs with C.T.s & other stuff which is completely non evidental & pure work of Faith or Belief.


P.S. - May Your GOD/S provide You the Strength to Stop bowing down to Commandments & to Start Critically Thinking for your Ownself.
🤞
Tc!

Oh dear, these ideas you Express are highly simplistic,  and stem from miseduaction, no one is called to bow down to the commandments, no where does the actual text tell people to 'obey the law', rather a better translation would be 'repsect the teaching' not something many christains are interested in as the teaching is dead according to Paul.

You would agree that its wrong to kill people? Or to steal? The entire moral framework of the west, innocent til proven guilty, along with many other ideas, are all built on biblical teaching.

[jeffreyH]

Wow, using Jordan Peterson as an example may not be a good move.

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jordan_Peterson

[Jolly2]

Wow, using Jordan Peterson as an example may not be a good move.

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jordan_Peterson

Rather then simply citing wikipedia which is a highly politicized site that often distorts the actual truth about people, why not just make your point?

[Bored chemist]

why not just make your point?

He did.

On an unrelated point, Practically every post that Dave Lev has made is trolling.
Why is he still here?

[evan_au]

wikipedia which is a highly politicized site

Wikipedia has a very diverse and open editorial committee, and an editorial policy of citing sources.
- Both of which mitigate against it becoming highly politicized
- If it did make objectively false political statements, people of the opposing political view would produce their verifiable sources, and it would be changed

The fact that Jolly2 thinks Wikipedia is "highly politicized" strongly suggests to me that in fact Jolly2 is "highly politicized".
- And he is making unfounded statements here that would not be accepted on Wikipedia

[Kryptid]

Wow, using Jordan Peterson as an example may not be a good move.

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jordan_Peterson

Rather then simply citing wikipedia which is a highly politicized site that often distorts the actual truth about people, why not just make your point?

That's RationalWiki, not Wikipedia.

Since you brought it up, I'd like for you to point out what content of Wikipedia you think is politicized. What evidence do you have for it?

[Jolly2]

Wow, using Jordan Peterson as an example may not be a good move.

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jordan_Peterson

Rather then simply citing wikipedia which is a highly politicized site that often distorts the actual truth about people, why not just make your point?

That's RationalWiki, not Wikipedia.

Since you brought it up, I'd like for you to point out what content of Wikipedia you think is politicized. What evidence do you have for it?

Jimmy dore is a perfect example he has been complaining about false information about him on the site as have other journalists and wikipedia refuses to remove it, seems clearer by the day that wikipedia is a site that is being used by those in power to impose what is and what is not accepted to be true. Just seems to be a tool of power now.

What wikipedia claims and how it actually behaves in reality are not the same thing.

[Kryptid]

Jimmy dore is a perfect example he has been complaining about false information about him on the site as have other journalists and wikipedia refuses to remove it,

What, specifically, is the false information that has been posted about him?

He appears to be a conspiracy theorist, so I'm already suspicious of his reliability.

seems clearer by the day that wikipedia is a site that is being used by those in power to impose what is and what is not accepted to be true. Just seems to be a tool of power now.

Please support this extraordinary statement with reliable evidence. Not that Wikipedia is the be-all-end-all of sources anyway. It's supposed to cite sources itself.

[Jolly2]

Jimmy dore is a perfect example he has been complaining about false information about him on the site as have other journalists and wikipedia refuses to remove it,

What, specifically, is the false information that has been posted about him?

He appears to be a conspiracy theorist, so I'm already suspicious of his reliability.

seems clearer by the day that wikipedia is a site that is being used by those in power to impose what is and what is not accepted to be true. Just seems to be a tool of power now.

Please support this extraordinary statement with reliable evidence. Not that Wikipedia is the be-all-end-all of sources anyway. It's supposed to cite sources itself.

<<link removed>>

Report from the OPCW showed that the Barrels claimed to have been dropped by a plane or helicopter by the Assad regime were actually placed at the location, probably by the white helmets.

Ergo the chemical attacks were a staged event to gain support for the bombing of Syria. And those hurt in these false flags were hurt by western powers. Nothing new here as Chomsky loves to point out "what happened in 911 is no different to the kinds of attacks America Carries out routinely around the rest of the world"

It was this act that caused Trump to change his non interventionist stance and actually his daughter that convinced him to attack Syria in retaliation
<<link removed>>

Marking a striking U-turn from the anti-interventionist stance Mr Trump took during his campaign, on Friday he ordered the firing of 59 cruise missiles at a military target in the war-torn country

Jimmy Dore has been listed as a conspiracy theorist on wikipedia for reporting this information, seems to be a successful campaign afterall you just called him one.

It's Jimmy Dore Vs the war machine, and the war machine has a lot more influence over wikipedia then you might imagine. They play everyone they play the fish. It's honestly shocking how every country that has resources the west wants always manages to be ruled by a monster, there is clearly some monster university somewhere in the world just ready to provide 3rd world nations with horrible leaders.

[Bored chemist]

OK, lets' have a look at what they say.
"It is possible, the OPCW said, “that the cylinders were the sources of the substances containing reactive chlorine”. Testimony, environmental and biomedical samples and toxicological and ballistic analyses, “provide reasonable grounds that the use of toxic chemical as a weapon took place.” In other words, the canisters had fallen from the sky."

So, the testimony, the environmental samples the toxicology and the ballistics say it was a gas attack.
On the other hand the report which isn't that repressed since it's reported in the Indy... says
"engineering sub-team cannot be certain that the cylinders at either location arrived there as a result of being dropped from an aircraft".

That's not saying "they are sure that they were not dropped"- just that they can't be sure if they were dropped or not.

So, the evidence is that the people were gassed with chlorine. we can't be sure if the gas was dropped from a helicopter.
But it sure wasn't sent by post.

So the evidence still completely supports the story.
Someone gassed these people.


And yet you somehow read that as

Ergo the chemical attacks were a staged event to gain support for the bombing of Syria.

Well that's absurd.
There is no logical way to get from the evidence to your claim.


However, it might be possible if there was a massive conspiracy.

You have already been warned about implausible conspiracy theories.
Posting them is trolling.
You are one of the trolls running amok.
Why shouldn't we just ban you?

[Jolly2]

OK, lets' have a look at what they say.
"It is possible, the OPCW said, “that the cylinders were the sources of the substances containing reactive chlorine”. Testimony, environmental and biomedical samples and toxicological and ballistic analyses, “provide reasonable grounds that the use of toxic chemical as a weapon took place.” In other words, the canisters had fallen from the sky."

So, the testimony, the environmental samples the toxicology and the ballistics say it was a gas attack.
On the other hand the report which isn't that repressed since it's reported in the Indy... says
"engineering sub-team cannot be certain that the cylinders at either location arrived there as a result of being dropped from an aircraft".

That's not saying "they are sure that they were not dropped"- just that they can't be sure if they were dropped or not.

So, the evidence is that the people were gassed with chlorine. we can't be sure if the gas was dropped from a helicopter.
But it sure wasn't sent by post.

So the evidence still completely supports the story.
Someone gassed these people.


And yet you somehow read that as

Ergo the chemical attacks were a staged event to gain support for the bombing of Syria.

Well that's absurd.
There is no logical way to get from the evidence to your claim.


However, it might be possible if there was a massive conspiracy.

You have already been warned about implausible conspiracy theories.
Posting them is trolling.
You are one of the trolls running amok.
Why shouldn't we just ban you?

You really enjoy defending horror dont you chemist. You should get a job with Mi6.

<<link removed>>

You can watch Jimmy Dore as he reviews discussions in the European parliament and the United nations
<<video removed>>

[Bored chemist]

You must be mad.
Because we can not prove that the cylinders were dropped from a helicopter, you assume they must have been put there by locals who, presumably, wanted to gas themselves.

Is that really how your mind works?