[Matthew Hasty]

Matthew Hasty  asked the Naked Scientists:

Hey Chris and Crew

My name is Matthew Hasty and I'm an artist living in Memphis Tennessee I'll try and be brief... but first the obligatory praise:

newbielink:http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/podcasts/ [nonactive]  

I just wondered if you could look into something... ( If you have already... I'll get to it soon)

I have recently found out about a product that is purported to rid the body of  quite a list of diseases.... one claim has been that is has cured over 75,000 people in Africa of Malaria...

It supposedly works on many viruses, bacteria, moulds and a host of parasites. It's called  MMS  (Miracle Mineral Suppliment) NaC1O2 or sodium chlorite ....Perhaps you could clear up what it does do and disseminate some of the  information about it...

Thanks for newbielink:http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/podcasts/ [nonactive] and keep up all of the brilliant work....

What do you think?

[Bored chemist]

It doesn't work.
Pity.

[NobodySavedMe]

It doesn't work.
Pity.

Actually it does work.I have a list.

[NobodySavedMe]

Matthew Hasty  asked the Naked Scientists:

Hey Chris and Crew

My name is Matthew Hasty and I'm an artist living in Memphis Tennessee I'll try and be brief... but first the obligatory praise:

I seriously LOVE your podcast!!!   

I just wondered if you could look into something... ( If you have already... I'll get to it soon)

I have recently found out about a product that is purported to rid the body of  quite a list of diseases.... one claim has been that is has cured over 75,000 people in Africa of Malaria...

It supposedly works on many viruses, bacteria, moulds and a host of parasites. It's called  MMS  (Miracle Mineral Suppliment) CLO2 or sodium chlorite ....Perhaps you could clear up what it does do and disseminate some of the  information about it...

Thanks for your show and keep up all of the brilliant work....

What do you think?

I urge you to bookmark and read this.

http://bioredox.mysite.com/CLOXhtml/CLOXprnt+refs.htm

Loads of scientific papers listed with references.

[PERSONAL REFERENCE REMOVED - PLEASE DESIST FROM ATTACKING OTHER FORUM MEMBERS - MOD, CS]

All the information about MMS is here from scientific sources over the last 100 years.

It is a long page but it describes in detail why MMS works.With scientific references.

http://bioredox.mysite.com/CLOXhtml/CLOXprnt+refs.htm

[Bored chemist]

Yes, you have a list. You are also the person who thinks you can cook popcorn with a mobile phone.

If it worked then malaria would be extinct because this stuff is cheap and easy to get.
No doubt this will get some trash response about the big pharmaceuticals companies. The claim that big pharma is stopping people using a wonder drug because it's not sold by one of the pharma companies doesn't make sense. there are a number of countries where malaria and HIV are causing such damage to the ecconomy that their governments would ignore the threats of the pharmaceuticals companies; they could produce and market the stuff independently.
As for the ( now removed) reference to me
"Disregard Bored Chemist.All his posts are on the side of the Establishment and corporate interests.He claims to be a union leader.I shudder to think what kind.The one that sells out?"

I'm a safety rep and sometimes ADC rep for these people.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prospect_(trade_union)
And I never claimed to be a leader- but NobodySavedMe and facts have never seemed to me to get on very well.
He also seems not to realise that the reason I post under an assumed name is that I don't think my "establishment" employers would like some of the stuff I post.

[Matthew Hasty]

Okay....  Well here is my personal experience with the stuff... I have a friend that had told me he had some results with some varying ailments... so I got some of it (it's cheap... what could it hurt right?) It takes a minor amount of preparation (if you can test the Ph level in a pool you can prepare it....  So I got it and did a few drops....  I won't go into the prep however when you make it... it smells as though it will have an affect of some kind as it has sort of an acidic chlorine smell as the name sodium chlorite would suggest.  So I took it for a few days and having no real ailments of any kind, didn't notice much (no surprise there) except for the lack of taste in my mouth (perhaps a cure for halitosis...)  I decided to discontinue use, it hadn't made me sick so I decided to wait until I had something to experiment on.... Quite some time passed before I got sick with anything My wife and son had had colds perhaps the flu... I wasn't getting anything ( I didn't attribute this to the MMS)  ... Finally I got a cold/ or flu and tried the MMS stuff once, perhaps twice again.. It seemed as if It became worse relatively soon.. I felt horrible the next day but that was it perhaps two days of really feeling poorly and a few days with the residual cough... I did not have the effect of instant anything as it purports to cure malaria within hours. After this I decided to go and ask the proper authorities and write to the Naked Scientists who seemed as though they would take a look into almost anything to separate the legitimate from the bogus  for the common good. I hope that they are able to put this to rest... and perhaps it will be yet another miracle that will go the way of many other cure-all-miracles and quackery.... one of my personal favorites (and the name of my band if I ever get that together) "The Radio Disease Killer"....

Hey even placebos work sometimes....

[Matthew Hasty]

The Naked Scientists could actually do a whole show on Dr. Albert Abrams and the Electronic Reactions of Abrams or E.R.A.  (for the initiated )

[chris]

Hi Matthew

welcome to the forum - great to have you join us from the podcast!

To put it bluntly, my own feeling about this sodium chlorite business is that it is a load of crap. You might as well go and drink swimming pool water. I'd recommend saving your money and spending it on a packet of paracetamol for when you next feel ill, and some fresh fruit and vegetables in your diet every day.

That's guaranteed to have a bigger impact on your health than taking what amounts to something poisonous.

Chris

[Matthew Hasty]

Hey Chris Thanks for the welcome! 

I agree with you about the diet wholeheartedly.... It is just the idea that what if there are some benefits to be had... for example if I understand correctly the stuff is in our public drinking water.. (at least it was the last time the public was allowed to tour their local water works ---- Sept 10 2001)

 I don't read a ton of medical journals so I cant say for sure but the article by Thomas Lee Hesselink, MD

newbielink:http://bioredox.mysite.com/CLOXhtml/CLOXprnt+refs.htm [nonactive]

has some compelling info... at least for a layman like me. I am going to start at the top of his reference list and go from there...

 I would say some research in the matter wouldn't hurt...  I mean Doctors still blast the patients with radiation and chemicals all day & everyday over here....

 I'd  take a couple of drops of poison a day for a penny a pop if it worked just as well as some of the alternatives...

All that being said....   there were 3500 people administering ( no # ) patients in the 1920's with a machine designed to electronically discover what diseases you were suffering with... and magnetically cure you....  newbielink:http://www.americanartifacts.com/smma/abrams/abrams.htm [nonactive]

If the MMS stuff is "crap" could be good material to show that people are always going to hope like that for some magic bullet to cure us all... and maybe that is the "bigger" story...


Again Thank You for your Podcast and your show... I am still astounded by the connectivity of this medium.... in the chaos of the hive there is an order!

[Bored chemist]

OK, lets have a look at that web page. The first thing it says is
"Nothing in this article is intended as medical advice.
No claims, promises nor guarantees are made"
Interesting.

Then "This procedure rapidly eliminates malaria and other infectious agents in only one dose."
That's a claim, so one of the first things it says is a lie. So far, I'mnot impressed.

Thenit says "Chlorine dioxide (ClO2) is highly reactive with thiols, polyamines, purines, certain amino acids and iron, all of which are necessary for the growth and survival of pathogenic microbes."
Which is true enough. Of course, since all of those things are needed to grow microbes and there are microbes in the gut we have a problem. Any ClO2 in the gut would instantly react with one or more of those compounds- it would never get any further ( it would be destroyed in the mouth if it were there long enough).
Incidentally it also reacts with hydrochloric acid which is also present in the stomach.

Malaria is a relapsing disease- it comes and goes. If you have malaria and take snake oil it will sometimes look as if it has worked. Together with mankind's abillity to believe in what they want to happen, you can see how the section on "discovery" makes sense.

Then there are about 40 references that tell you that malaria is bad and what ClO2 is. Nice comprehesive background but of no real importance.
Looks impressive, buut doesn't actually tell you much, I mean what does "The Three-Electron Bond in Chlorine Dioxide. " have to do with malaria?.

Then there's a section headed "OXIDANTS AS PHYSIOLOGIC AGENTS"
It includes ther rather telling observation that "Some work has been done using dilute solutions of sodium chlorite internally to treat fungal infections, chronic fatigue, and cancer; however, little has been published in that regard". Well, positive results tend to get published so what does that say to you?
Then ther is another batch of only vaguely related references- things like "The Use Of Ozone In Medicine, " and "Decreased level of 2,3-diphosphoglycerate and
alteration of structural integrity in erythrocytes
infected with Plasmodium falciparum in vitro."
I'd love to see why someone thinks the first of those might be relevent to the use of chlorite- it's about an entirely different chemical.
At least the second is about themalaria parasite (Plasmodium falciparum ) but it's a report of someone having measured the effect (in a test tube ( in vitro)) on the levels some rather obscure chemical in red blood cells. That's worthy enough in its way, but it has nothing to do with using chlorite to treat malaria.

There are a few references like this one "Interferon-gamma activates the oxidative killing
of Candida albicans by human granulocytes. " that look like they might be relevent bu,t oxidative killing of freign cells by the body is one of its major defense mechanisms. It uses peroxy compounds- not ClO2.


Then there's a section headed "OXIDES OF CHLORINE AS DISINFECTANTS"
And a whole lot of references saying that chlorine and its oxides are useful disinfectants. There are two things to note here. Firstly none of these refers to malaria or plasmodium- which is a bit of a shame if you are trying to say this stuff killsthem. Secondly it's not news to anyone that strong oxidants kill bacteria etc. When Domestos advertised itself as "Kills all known germs. Dead." they were perfectly correct. (They didn't say that the same claim could be made by any bleach based product- but who can blame them).
Unfortunately you can't drink bleach and expect it to kill harmful bacteria. It's too reactive- all you will do is damage your stomach because the cells of the stomach are just as susceptible to bleach poisoning as the bacteria are.
The same is true of ClO2.

Then there's a section called "MALARIA IS OXIDANT SENSITIVE"
Which is true- so what? too high an oxygen concentration kills people.
Then there's lots of references, but none of them involves ClO2. There's a reason for that. The malaria parasite lives (at least some of the time) inside blood cells. If you add bleach or ClO2 you destroy the cells- so the malaria parasite is now "homeless".Its not a sensible test.

Trawling on there's a section about "TARGETING THIOLS"
Unfortunately,
1
that's what arsenic does- so it's not really a good start and
2
ClO2 dosn't really do it- it's a strong oxidant and atakcs pretty much the first thing it meets.

Again there's a whole lot of references that don't say much.


Then we have "HEME IS AN OXIDANT SENSITIZER"
Now that looks promising. The malaria parasite hangs out in red blood cells and there's a lot of heam in them. If the heam makes the oxidants more effective then it migh likk the bugs.
2 problems- if it makes the stuff more toxic in blood cells them most of what it kills will be blood cells. Not really what you want and also, remember way back at the begining I said that the stuff would be destroyed in the mouth and stomach. Well, just how much is going to get as far as the blood? How about none?
Then there's the usual run of references to make it look scientific.


We then come to "OVERCOMING ANTIBIOTIC RESISTANCE WITH OXIDATION"
Well, if this stuff kills malaria on its own we don't need to use the antibiotics. It seems they just admitted their claim was false.
Then they list a few pages more references to make it look good.


Then we come to the real killer (literally)
I will quote this in full
"SOME INCOMPATIBILITIES
Acidified sodium chlorite could provide a powerful new opportunity to improve or to restore sensitivity to quinolines by virtue of its oxidative power. However, quinolines contain secondary or tertiary amino groups which react with chlorine dioxide in such a way that both could destroy each other. Some possible strategies to resolve this incompatibility are suggested below.
Acidified sodium chlorite could be used as explained above only as a solo therapy.
Quinoline administration could be withheld until after the acidified sodium chorite has completed its action.
Patients already preloaded with a quinoline could stop this, wait a suitable period of time for this to wash out, then administer the acidified sodium chlorite.
The quinoline could remain in use and while the less active sodium chlorite is administered without acid. This should retain plenty of oxidant effectiveness without destroying any quinoline or wasting too much oxidant.
Switch from a quinoline to an endoperoxide (such as artemisinin) or to a quinone (such as atovaquone) before using acidified sodium chlorite, as these may be less sensitive toward destruction by chlorine dioxide.
Similar problems apply to methylene blue and many other drugs if they have an unoxidized sulfur atom, a phenol group, a secondary amine or a tertiary amine. Such are also very reactive with the chlorine dioxide component. [58a] "


Ok what that says is that the ClO2 reacts with some of the drugs used in (legitimate) treatment of malaria.
What they sugest doing about that is reckless if not criminal.
"Acidified sodium chlorite could be used as explained above only as a solo therapy.
Quinoline administration could be withheld until after the acidified sodium chorite has completed its action. "

They sugest using only this rubbish on its own and, if needs be, withdrawing treatment with an effective drug.

Yes, that's really what it measn
they are saying that you should stop taking drugs thatare known to work to treat malaria and take their impossible remedy instead.

Does anyone care what the particular problems with the rest of their page are?

[testtest]

Came across this post and felt obliged that I just had to say something when i read:

"No doubt this will get some trash response about the big pharmaceuticals companies." Yep right there. And:

"The claim that big pharma is stopping people using a wonder drug because it's not sold by one of the pharma companies doesn't make sense".

Doesn't make sense? That is somewhat of a naïve statement and please don't be offended but you need to put the chemistry books down and catch up with some economics and history. Unfortunately health care has become a business. Every sixth dollar spent in the U.S is on healthcare. Three out of every four drugs used in the world are produced by the U.K(2nd biggest export) and U.S. The pharmaceutical companies are awash with money and trust me they will not attract major investment unless they are satisfied things like this never reach the mainstream and are discredited etc, etc. Discrediting non-allopathic medicine has been part of pharmacuetical business model since the 1930's and they have suceeded in this as the misinformed public knows not of viable alternatives what they do hear about they beleive is quackery. As well as financial there are many geopolitical reasons for supression of cheap treatments like over-population and sustainabilty to consider - in other words some peoples viewpoint is why keep alive some useless-eaters in the third world who can do nothing but produce more useless-eaters.

MMS, Vitamin C and Ozone therapy have the same things in common:

1) They are extremely effective(1,2).
2) They are extremely cheap.
2) They cannot be patented.
3) They cannot make synthetic versions to be patented.
4) They threaten a large segment of allopathic medicines revenue.
5) Proponents have been murdered, jailed and otherwised harrassed. Even Linus Pauling was attacked in peer reviewed journals for his stance on Vitamin C(which he later received apologies for in the same journals).

For cancer Vitamin C and ozone therapy represent the finest most powerful treatments available. For infectious diseases they all excel with MMS taking the lead. I do not know MMS's effect on cancer I expect being similar to ozone it would also be good. Ronald Reagan and Rupert Murdoch both cured their cancer with ozone therapy.

To illustate Big Pharma corruption during 1965 Dr. Herbert Ley, FDA Commissioner testisfied during senate hearings that the FDA "protects" the big drug companies and are subsequently rewarded, and using the government's police powers they attack those who threaten the big drug companies. "People think what the FDA is protecting them. It isn't. What the FDA is doing and what the public thinks it's doing are as different as night and day. "First it is providing a means whereby key individuals on its payroll are able to obtain both power and wealth through granting special favors to certain politically influential groups that are subject to its regulation. This activity is similar to the 'protection racket' of organized crime: for a price, one can induce FDA administrators to provide 'protection' from the FDA itself." Secondly, as a result of this political favoritism, the FDA has become a primary factor in that formula whereby cartel oriented companies in the food and drug industry are able to use the police powers of government to
harass or destroy their free market competitors. "And thirdly, the FDA occasionally does some genuine public good with whatever energies it has left over after serving the vested political and commercial interest of its first two activities."

I don't mean to have a dig at you, I'm just trying to paint a picture of how the pharmaceutical world operates.

1) http://www.understandingozone.com/docs/Scientific_References_Ozone_Therapy.pdf [nofollow]
2) US Patent 6086922 - Use of a chemically-stabilized chlorite matrix for the parenteral treatment of HIV infections
http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6086922.html [nofollow]

[Bored chemist]

If you are going to resurect a thread please make sure you have read it properly.
You say "Doesn't make sense? That is somewhat of a naïve statement and please don't be offended but you need to put the chemistry books down and catch up with some economics and history. Unfortunately health care has become a business. Every sixth dollar spent in the U.S is on healthcare. Three out of every four drugs used in the world are produced by the U.K(2nd biggest export) and U.S. "
True, but of no relevance.
Didn't you read the bit where I wrote "there are a number of countries where malaria and HIV are causing such damage to the ecconomy that their governments would ignore the threats of the pharmaceuticals companies; they could produce and market the stuff independently."?

The number of dollars spent in the US or UK has nothing to do with the decisions made by some malaria-ravaged developing country.
The FDA has nothing to do with it.
More importantly, with my head stuck in a chemistry book, I can recognise a snake oil salesman when I see one. That's why I pointed out just how pathetic their claims were.

Oh BTW, having told us all how the FDA works (though we already knew, and it wasn't important anyway) perhaps you need to find out how the patent office works. They don't actually check if a new idea works before issuing a patent- so the fact that someone has patented the idea of using this stuff to kill HIV proves absolutely nothing.

[testtest]

Yes I did read your post in it's entirety - "there are a number of countries where malaria and HIV are causing such damage to the ecconomy that their governments would ignore the threats of the pharmaceuticals companies; they could produce and market the stuff independently."

You say money has no relavance to a third world country not being influenced by big pharma when ravaged by a modern day plague, I beg to differ. As a recent example in South Africa Matthias Rath(who trained under Pauling) was conducting a well constructed study using vit c and green tea extract etc etc to treat HIV now this study was halted by the SA government half way through because the Treatment Action Campaign(TAC) who BTW receive funding from you guessed it big pharma were kicking up such a stink over it saying it was unethical. How anybody could of called this unethical is beyond me as the results could have been used by those taking and not taking meds. BTW Matthias Rath posted the results of the incompleted study showing major improvment in all patients.

Malawi IS using MMS 'for any purpose' after successful clinical trials with malaria and hopefully this will spread across Africa if Malawi officials don't try and keep it secret and make money out of it themselves. If you want references contact the Malawi ministry of health.

And yes I know how the patent system works but if you actually look at the data from the patent is shows obvious efficacy.

So before you write blanket statements like "It doesn't work. Pity" just remember there are actually sick desperate people trawling the web for solutions to diseases and for anybody on a scientific forum to critisise something without investigating it may end up affecting someones life.

"It doesn't work. Pity" = Condemnation without investigation.

If your interested a good primer on ozone(hence MMS as they work in the same way) is 'Ozone'-a new medical drug by Velio Bocci, Professor Emeritus of Sienna University.

[Bored chemist]

"How anybody could of called this unethical is beyond me "
Because that study deprived people of access to treatments that were know to work and foisted them off with snake oil.

"If you want references contact the Malawi ministry of health. "
No, you have it the wrong way round. You are making the claim so you have to supply the evidence.


"So before you write blanket statements like "It doesn't work. Pity" just remember there are actually sick desperate people trawling the web for solutions to diseases and for anybody on a scientific forum to critisise something without investigating it may end up affecting someones life."

I know there are lots of desperate people out there.
Sadly there are snake oil salesmen who are willing to take advantage of them.
I believe that it falls to scientific web sites like this to try to put their "evidence" into context.

""It doesn't work. Pity" = Condemnation without investigation."
OK, I didn't post the evidence of investigation at that time, but I subsequently did. I went through their claims and destroyed them one at a time. That took some investigation.
Pity you didn't realise that.

"If your interested a good primer on ozone(hence MMS as they work in the same way)"
Got any proof of that? It's not easy to see why they would.

I just Googles malawi malaria and chlorite. One of the sites I found was this.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread319883/pg1

Those who have been on this site for a while will remember esecallum.
Not a good start in terms of credibility I'm afraid.

[testtest]

Please don't talk about credibility when you are condemning without investigating yet again.

"Because that study deprived people of access to treatments that were know to work and foisted them off with snake oil."

Snake oil? Vitamin C was one of the main treatments of this program its power to inhibit reverse transcriptase by the magnitude of greater than 99% and act as a cell fusion inhibitor by taking the equivalent of 10-20 grams daily was proved by Linus Pauling in his 1990 study titled:

Suppression of human immunodeficiency virus replication by
ascorbate in chronically and acutely infected cells.

Green tea(white tea is even better BTW) catechins also act as an HIV fusion inhibitor. Williamson MP et al. Epigallocatechin gallate, the main polyphenol in green tea, binds to the T-cell receptor, CD4: potential for HIV-1 therapy. J Allergy Clin Immunol 118: 1369-74, 2006.

There were also other compounds used so once again I fail to see how this was in any way unethical. It could of promoted cheap natural effective treatments to most of Africa the majority of which does not recieve anti-virals(of debatable use anyway). You can find details of the study here http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/nat_vit/index.html [nofollow]

This study had a solid scientific basis and publication of this important information, essential for millions of patients, is currently being challenged by organizations dedicated to the promotion of ARV drugs. For Matthias Rath to be labelled a charlatan quite simply doesn't hold up. If Pauling were still alive he would have given his support to Rath.

If you want to talk about snake oil let's talk about anti-viral meds for a moment, currently no long-term clinical proof for prolonged survival exists from controlled studies.  

http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/THE_FOUNDATION/the_truth_about_arvs/about_arvs_2.html [nofollow]

Also loads of info on HAART failure from http://www.healtoronto.com/ptease.html [nofollow] quote "The protease inhibitor drugs Crixivan (indinavir) and Invarase (saquinavir) caused T cell death in healthy HIV negative donor blood in three separate experiments.". You couldn't make this stuff up. All referenced on that page.

So here we have an expensive medication killing the very cells HIV positives are so gravely depleted of, to me this exactly fits the description of snake oil as laid out by the dictionary.

Dictionary: snake oil

n.

   1. A worthless preparation fraudulently peddled as a cure for many ills.*
   2. Speech or writing intended to deceive; humbug.

*Big pharma cover themselves in the small print of their product information, e.g Crixivan - "At present, there are no results from controlled clinical trials evaluating the effect of therapy with CRIXIVAN on clinical progression of HIV infection, such as survival or the incidence of opportunistic infections". Classic, wish I had a business like this.

Also from: Inflammatory Reactions in HIV-1-Infected Persons after Initiation of Highly Active Antiretroviral Therapy

"It is possible that HAART may actually promote the clinical expression and development of such infections, as well as AIDS-related malignant conditions and other noninfectious diseases" This is a review article with 95 references.

http://www.healtoronto.com/haart_aids2.html [nofollow]


I running short on time now will have to answer the rest of your post in a day or so.

[Bored chemist]

In the real world, if green tea and vitamin C cured aids then the disease would have died out ages ago.
In your world you cite a guy who thinks that feeding DMF - an industrial solvent and known human teratogen to people is a good idea.

[testtest]

I never said anything about curing using vit c and green tea just that they have the ability to inhibit HIV.

As far as DMF goes I know absolutely nothing about it so I can't comment until I've read both sides of it's use. If I believe that he has tried to profit from a dangerous substance I will say so.

I have learned from prior experience not to immediately dismiss something because the concept sounds strange.

[testtest]

Interesting this is all new to me.

Apparently he was using a slow transdermal delivery system of DMF called Virodene made by www.virodene.com [nofollow] according to their brochure the results of a study that was conducted at the Pretoria Academic Hospital in Pretoria, South Africa provided sufficient anecdotal evidence of Safety and Efficacy for Guy’s Drug Research Unit in London, UK, to undertake a Phase I Study on healthy volunteers.

It looks safe so far from the data provided by them with their phase 1 and 2 clinical trials, however it looks like even though their data shows it was safe they did not conduct the clinical trials according to procedural rules. This got them into trouble and the drug was subsequently removed for use in SA.

In credit to virodene.com the editor of the South African Medical Journal did write a story titled 'Give Virodene and the minister a break' saying things are so bad in the country from AIDS that there is a need to find out the truth about virodene. One AIDS sufferer commented "Were dying anyway so why not give us the bloody virodene to try?".

From their brochure: http://www.virodene.com/downloads/Virodene_Executive_Brouchure.pdf [nofollow]

PHASE I CLINICAL TRIALS – LONDON UK

A double blind, placebo-controlled Study was conducted to evaluate the safety, tolerability and pharmacokinetics of a single dose of Virodene® PO58 on ten healthy male volunteers. 1997 - 2000 Various accredited international Clinical Research Organizations (CRO) and Laboratories were contracted to conduct the Study according to ICH guidelines for Good Clinical Practice (GCP).

• A Supranational Review Board, consisting of top international Peers, authorities in their relevant fields of expertise reviewed and approved the Study Protocol
• The Medicines Regulatory Body (MRA) in Great Britain did not regulate Phase I Studies until April 2004, and as such, only an Institutional Ethics Committee Approval was required to conduct this Study
• Guy’s Hospital Ethics Committee reviewed and approved an amended version of the Protocol, after recommendations by London Toxicologist, Prof Anthony Dayan
• Lloyds of London insured the Study
• Quintiles Guy’s Drug Research Unit (GDRU) of Guy’s Hospital, London, were responsible for the Clinical Trial Management, Monitoring and Pathology Analyses Drs Tim Mant and Dipti Amin were the Principal Investigators for the
Study Dr LW Sequeira, a British Virologist was contracted as an Independent Monitor
• The National Institute of Public Health, Prague, determined the drug absorption rate
• FARMOVS-PAREXEL , Bloemfontein, South Africa, an accredited Biopharmaceutical Laboratory conducted the Pharmacokinetics Analyses
• Quintiles ClinData were responsible for the Data Management, Statistical
Analysis, Data Audits, Medical writing as well as the Final Study Report

Phase I Safety Results
• The drug was generally well tolerated
• There were no clinically significant changes in the relevant blood values
• There were no serious adverse events
• Mild transient discomfort such as nausea, headache, or local skin irritation was experienced in some cases

Clinical Conclusion
• The Study Report indicated that a single dose of Virodene® PO58 is safe
• The data derived from this study provides the information for Phase II Clinical Studies in HIV/AIDS volunteer subjects

PHASE II CLINICAL TRIALS – TANZANIA

A double blind, placebo-controlled Clinical Trial was conducted to evaluate the safety, tolerability, pharmacokinetics and efficacy of multiple doses of Virodene® PO58 on 64 HIV/AIDS infected male volunteers. 2000 – 2004 With the exception of GDRU, the Clinical Research Organizations (CRO) involved in the Phase I Study were contracted to conduct this Clinical Trial according to ICH guidelines for Good Clinical Practice (GCP).

• Quintiles ClinData wrote the Protocol for the above Study in co-operation with the Company and designed and provided all the required study documentation
• Quintiles MCC Consultants designed the Clinical Trial Standard Operating Procedures (SOPs)
• Quintiles Clindepharm did a feasibility study for conducting the trials in Tanzania at the selected sites, Lugalo General Military Hospital and Chadibwa Medical Clinic
• The Tanzanian Peoples Defence Force were contracted to conduct the trial under the guidance and supervision of the Clinical Trial Manager
• Lugalo General Military Hospital was selected as the main contracted site centre and Chadibwa Medical Clinic to handle the subjects overflow Drs Jason Bigambo and Neema Simkoko were appointed as the local Investigators who conducted the Clinical Trial with the support of comprehensive local clinical teams Dr LW Sequeira, a British Virologist was contracted as the Co-Investigator
• Two local Independent Medical Monitors were contracted to:
Ensure ICH for GCP adherence during the Trial
To take medical decisions regarding patient safety

• The following Regulatory Bodies and Ethics Committees approved the Protocol
A Supranational Review Board (IRB/IEC)
The Tanzanian Minister of Health
The Tanzanian Military Medical Council
Lugalo General Military Hospital Ethics Committee
Chadibwa Medical Clinic Ethics Committee

• Lloyds of London insured the Clinical Trial
• Pharma Research Consultants were contracted as Clinical Trial Manager, to manage, oversee & monitor the Clinical Trial and CRF completion
• Pathcare, an Internationally Accredited Laboratory in SA did the Bio-Pharmaceutical Analyses
• Quint i les Cl inData were responsible for the Medical wr i t ing, Data Management, Statistical Analysis, Data Audits, as well as the Final Study Report

Safety Results

• The drug was generally well tolerated
• There were no clinically significant changes in the relevant blood values
• No serious adverse events occurred

Side Effects

• Mild transient discomfort such as nausea, headache, or local skin irritation was experienced in some cases

Efficacy Results

• The immune system indicator (CD4/T4 cell count) increased from a mean of 225 to 324 cells/mm3 of blood
• By comparison, subjects who did not receive Virodene® (placebo group) showed an insignificant increase (260.5 to 291 cells/mm3)

Clinical Conclusion

Virodene® PO58 proved to be safe, well tolerated, and efficacious in immune compromised (HIV/AIDS) volunteers.

[testtest]

Bored Chemist I am currently sourcing the data with regards to ozone and chlorine dioxide and why their mechanism of action is so similar. Be patient with me as it's tax return time.

Here is a link to Jim Humbles book all about his experiences with MMS/sodium chlorite/chlorine dioxide if your interested, please ignore the title of this link Jim humble only ever claimed that it cured malaria not HIV or hepatitus.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/932837/Sodium-Chlorite-Rid-Body-of-HIV-Hep-Malaria-in-3-days- [nofollow]

[Bored chemist]

If you are going to say "As far as DMF goes I know absolutely nothing about it so I can't comment until I've read both sides of it's use." then you really need to read the other side too.
http://msds.chem.ox.ac.uk/DI/N,N-dimethylformamide.html
"Harmful by inhalation, ingestion or skin contact. May act as a carcinogen. Ingestion or absorption through skin may be fatal. Exposure may result in foetal death. Long-term exposure may result in kidney or liver damage. Irritant. "
I'd also like to see the statistics behind this claim
"• The immune system indicator (CD4/T4 cell count) increased from a mean of 225 to 324 cells/mm3 of blood
• By comparison, subjects who did not receive Virodene® (placebo group) showed an insignificant increase (260.5 to 291 cells/mm3)"
Since the changes are both of similar magnitude this is a rather weak claim. Doing nothing increased the count by about a third as much as the "treatment", which is odd in a progressive disease.
So there's, at best, weak evidence of a beneficial effect (which almost certainly isn't clinically significant) and strong evidence of long- term toxicity (which could never have shown up in the so-called safety testing cited because it was very short term.)
That's not the sort of evidence I'd like. At best it shows that small doses of the stuff don't cause harm that is aparent within a short timr (of course, all the volunteers might have died the day after the trial ended- that's why I'd like to see a proper trial, but only after there's some good animal data showing that the stuff offers a real benfit in terms of disease progression and or longevity)

Also, while you say there's no evidence that the conventional treatments work I think it's clear that AIDS patients in the West now live longer than they used to, so something must be helping them. If it's not the drugs then what  can you sugest?

As for Chlorite vs malaria I covered it before. I'm not reading the whole 275 page book. It starts off by describing exactly the sort of thing you would expect for a relapsing disease- no evidence other than that malaria comes and goes- it's famous for dioing that.
You still need to explain how a very reactive species gets from the stomach into the blood and then into the parasites without reacting with something on the way. Until you can do that the story isn't plausible.