How do we reduce harms to children from smartphones?

What's the impact of constant access to the internet on developing minds...
05 November 2024
Presented by James Tytko
Production by James Tytko, Will Tingle.

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A child with a smartphone

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Initially, the upside to children having access to a supercomputer in their pockets seemed obvious: immediate access to the reams of educational information on the internet, seamless communications with their friends, a source of constant entertainment. But as mental ill health amongst our youngsters continues to rise, many are pointing to smartphones, and particularly the social media platforms on them, as mainly to blame.

Today, we’ll hear what the screen age is doing to our stone age brains, how adolescents and adults differ in their social media activity, and discuss what the evidence says about smartphones in schools...

In this episode

A child with a smartphone

02:30 - Parents campaign for a smartphone free childhood

Is collective action the best defence against peer pressure...

Parents campaign for a smartphone free childhood
Joe Ryrie, Smartphone Free Childhood

Joe Ryrie is a parent and co-founder of Smartphone Free Childhood, a collective action campaign which is seeking to limit the age at which parents give their children these devices…

Joe - Smartphone Free Childhood started accidentally in February, and that was when my wife set up a WhatsApp group and we realised very quickly that parents the length and breadth of Britain and actually all over the world were really worried about this issue that we were worried about, which was that we didn't want to give our eldest daughter, who was eight, a smartphone. There were some other children in her class that were starting to get smartphones, and we could see that this issue was coming around the corner very quickly. And it turns out there were tens of thousands of other parents who felt the same way.

James - What are the harms that you are hearing about that you think is the reason this needs to be addressed?

Joe - The first one is obviously the correlation to the teen mental health crisis that we face today, and there was a study in 2023, 30,000 young adults that showed that the younger they got their first smartphone, the worse their mental health is today. There are all sorts of other studies that point to a direct correlation at the very least between the age of first owning a smartphone and the likelihood of facing mental health problems in the future. Harmful content is a huge one. Giving children unrestricted access to the internet in their pockets creates a gateway to the kind of content that we'd never dream of exposing children to in real life. Children seeing hardcore pornography or being exposed to extreme political views, sexual content, violent imagery, these kinds of things have just become normal. They're part of the fabric of modern childhood and we're saying that that's not okay. There are all sorts of issues that stem from the fact that these platforms are addictive by design. The fundamental objective of the social media platforms is to maximise engagement, i.e. get people to spend as much time as possible on their platforms. That's not up for debate, that's just the business model. A young person whose brain isn't fully developed, who finds it hard to control their impulses in the way that an adult can, and they're also hardwired the peer approval, and then you put it in their pockets 24/7? I think it was 29 hours a week, that's the average time that the average British 12-year-old now spends on a smartphone, and that's a huge amount of time. When we start to think about what children aren't doing in that time. That becomes really worrying.

James - Indeed, I guess the central conflict there is your conviction that there's something potentially damaging about giving smartphones to young children against the fact that if many of their peers have them, you really don't want this to damage their social standing in their peer group?

Joe - Exactly, you've hit the nail on the head there. There's become a rite of passage, particularly when children transition to secondary school, aged around 11. Because everyone else in their class has got a smartphone, then you don't really have a choice but to get your child a smartphone because their social life starts to migrate online and we think that's an impossible position. You either hand over a device that you know to be harmful or you risk alienating your child just at the point when you want them to spread their wings and become independent. So the main thing that we're trying to do is bring parents together to agree collectively to delay giving their children smartphones, because it's very difficult to do on your own, but if 5, 10, 15, 20 parents in the same class all agree not to give their children smartphones for a few more years, then that peer pressure reduces and it becomes a much easier conversation.

James - Do you have an age in mind? I'm thinking about the practicalities of what success will look like for the campaign.

Joe - This is much debated. Where we've landed is the end of year nine, so age 14, which is a bit more of an achievable goal than what a lot of people think is actually a safe age of a smartphone, which is 16. So we're just advocating to delay giving children smartphones for a few more years than what's currently become the norm.

James - I guess then it runs into the problem of the feasibility of pulling something like this off. As you say, by the end of primary school, a lot of kids have already had smartphones. By 14, I probably contend it's the majority of kids these days have a smartphone. Trying to reverse this almost ubiquitous possession of smartphones among young people when some will say the horse has already bolted, perhaps we're better off moving with the times and making sure the online worlds that our children inhabit are as safe as they can be?

Joe - Yes, we absolutely think there's a lot of work that needs to be done to make sure that the online world is safe, and we support anyone who's working in that space. But the situation that we find ourselves in today is one where I think everyone agrees that it's really not safe for young people to have unrestricted access to the internet in their pockets. We find ourselves in a position where we either just have to accept this status quo or do something about it. It's also important to say that nobody asked for this. We didn't vote for this. It's just happened due to the speed of this technological change that has come about in the last five or 10 years. So yes, we could just say the genie's out the bottle, and we've just got to accept it and work within these parameters, but actually the fundamental question we need to ask ourselves is, do we as a society and as parents feel like the status quo is okay? And if the answer's no, then we have to say, all right, let's do something about it. Yes, it's a difficult challenge because 89% of 12 year olds in the UK have their own smartphone. Almost everyone has one, but the key to this is collective action. If we act together we can do something about it, and 70,000 parents signed this parent pact that we only launched six weeks ago. Parents everywhere really want this situation to change, and if we work together and act collectively, then we can actually solve this.

Abstract image of a phone displaying a neuron, and a person thinking.

08:00 - Are children really addicted to their smartphones?

We hear from Richard Cytowic, author of 'Your Stone Age Brain in the Screen Age.'

Are children really addicted to their smartphones?
Richard Cytowic, George Washington University

One of the central arguments against children having smartphones is that smartphones and the platforms on them are addictive. Is this true? And what other impacts could they be having as young brains are still developing? Richard Cytowic is a neuropsychologist and professor of neurology at George Washington University. His new book is called ‘Your Stone Age Brain in the Screen Age.’

Richard - People are familiar with physical addictions like alcohol, drugs and cigarettes, but there are also behavioural addictions like gambling, shopping and compulsive sex for example. The endless scroll that you do on your phone is an example of behavioural addiction, because when do you stop? You don't because there's no end in sight. So it's like a slot machine that you keep playing, hoping for a hit, something interesting, funny or important is going to come up and you just keep going at it. That's called positive intermittent reinforcement, because you get a hit every now and then and that's enough to keep you hooked.

James - Is it really inducing the brain chemistry changes associated with addiction in the same way a harmful drug does, for example?

Richard - Yes, there have been some studies with fMRI and tractography that show that we're getting the same kind of physical changes with these behavioural addictions as we do with physical addictions.

James - So that's addiction, a serious harm in its own right. You also talk about the risks, though, of the cognitive load imposed by screen devices and whether this is impacting on our brain functions?

Richard - Well, it is. The whole reason I talk about the stone age brain, I think this will surprise most of your listeners, is that we operate under a fixed bandwidth of available energy and no amount of diet exercise, sudoku puzzles or supplements is going to be able to change that. We've now reached the point where we're asking it to do so much that it's like over exercising a muscle. It fatigues and collapses.

James - What are the cognitive costs of that?

Richard - Well, take a look at school grades for attention spans. Everybody agrees that our attention spans have all gone to hell. It affects memory, it affects sleep. And of course your lack of sleep affects your ability to learn or not to learn, or retain what you've learned in school. If you've been paying attention in the classroom instead of looking at your screens, which is what so many kids do, they don't pay attention to the teacher. They're looking at TikTok.

James - Once your attention span deteriorates. or your memory gets worse, how easy is it to claw those capabilities back? Are younger people at a bit of an advantage perhaps in this area, in that there's time to turn it round up to the development of their brain, as you say?

Richard - Yeah, well they still have a lot of plasticity left, but all of us have some degree of plasticity even into our nineties. So the answer is yes, it's easy. Also, no it's really difficult. It's easy because the solution is simple. It's difficult because people don't want to do it. That is, turn the phone off, put it face down, put it in another room, go for a walk, talk to someone on the phone rather than texting them and interact in person. I mean, this is what the pandemic taught us. Kids were doing Zoom schooling and they weren't getting the socialisation that they needed in the first, second, third, fourth, fifth grades. That really affected their ability to interact with other people, to make small talk, for example. They're terrified of anything in person.

James - What's the role of face-to-face interaction for the developing brain?

Richard - We're a social animal, and so socialisation is where it's at. Infants and toddlers learn by imitation learning. They mimic their adults. Playing patty cake and imaginative games like restaurant or shoe store, these are imaginative exercises in socialisation. So is being able to talk to other kids or their parents, their relatives. The whole notion of social media is such a misnomer. It's not social at all. It's isolating! That's why we see so much anxiety in young people, particularly as they head off to college for the first time. They have no idea how to navigate life. It's really sad. This is what I mean by virtual autism, is that this heavy screen exposure induces autistic-like symptoms in heavy users. Poor eye contact, verbalisation and regression of social skills. Now if you take the phones away, these symptoms go away in a short period of time, something that never happens in real developmental autism. So the solution is easy, but the participants don't want to implement the solution.

James - Is that the only way to row back on the screens or is there a way of harnessing the potential for access to so much knowledge, to really positive opportunities to interact with the world, without all the negative aspects as you've outlined them?

Richard - Of course, my iPhone is a wonderful device and a tool. It's far better than anything on Star Trek, but you have to use it wisely, realising that, yes, it's a great boon, but it's also an narcotising agent. It calls on your emotional intelligence which is, first of all, self-awareness, the ability to regulate your own behaviour, the ability to have good social skills, adaptability, and most of all resilience. People who are addicted to their phones don't show any of this, because they're so sucked into the screen.

James - So this is a big call to action really. This is something up to this point we've got badly wrong? The situation has crept up on us where children have access to these platforms and we are leaving many vulnerable to harm?

Richard - Yes. In the beginning, all the tech boosters approached this as if it were an unalloyed good. Anybody who said, "I don't know, maybe there's some downsides here" was dismissed as a technophobe or a Luddite. They were explained away. I think now the cows have come home, we're seeing the results of this. The critics would say there's not enough evidence, we should wait until we have evidence. Well, that's misunderstanding the precautionary principle which is, if something might be doing harm, then don't do it, or be careful of how you're using it. Doing research like this is so complicated, multifactorial and messy. By the time we get the data that the critics want, the damage will be done. We'll be waiting forever for that evidence to come out. So in the meantime, I say, there's a strong likelihood that these devices are doing harm when used in excess. So how about not using them in excess?

A child with a smartphone

Teens are more sensitive to social media than adults
Wouter van den Bos, University of Amsterdam

Establishing a causal link between screen time and the rise in poor mental health outcomes for adolescents is hard to do. But work in this area is underway. A recent study showed an increased sensitivity in adolescents to a core feature of many social platforms: the ‘like’ button.  Most of us are familiar with it by now. Whenever you post on your favourite feed, other users have the option to engage with you by clicking ‘like.’ The study, published in Science Advances, links a drop in likes with a comparatively bigger drop in mood in young people. I spoke to one of the authors of the study, Wouter van den Bos, who is an associate professor of developmental psychology at the University of Amsterdam…

Wouter - There was already a dataset and it was exactly the data that we needed because it had 8,000 teenagers and 8,000 adults that were on Instagram and it had all their posts and the likes they got on the posts. And that data could tell us how sensitive they are to the likes that they got on their posts.

James - How are you defining sensitivity in this sense?

Wouter - The effect that likes have on future posting and using the app. So we assume that if you get more likes, particularly more likes than you expect you would get, you are more motivated to pick up the phone and start using the app and start posting again. If you then don't get the likes you expect, you get demotivated and it will take longer before you start using the app again.

James - And the thinking underpinning that assumption is that young people, adolescents, are social creatures more so perhaps than adults, so that sensitivity would be increased?

Wouter - Yes. We based our hypothesis on the fact that adolescents are really sensitive to their social environment because also in this developmental period there's a lot changing. You have to shift away a little bit from your parents and your peer group becomes more important and also your position within the group. Those likes might be much more important signals for them. They're much more meaningful. That's what we thought and, in a way, what we found in our data: if the adolescents got more or less likes, they were much more responsive to it. If they got more, they started posting more. If they got less, they started posting less. We also saw that pattern in adults, it's not that they don't care at all, but definitely the adolescents were more sensitive to it.

James - So younger people are more sensitive to the amount of likes on their post. The next step, I suppose, is to necessarily say that they feel worse as a result. Maybe they just decide it's less worth their time posting. How did you show that lower likes may lead to lower mood?

Wouter - For us that was the next step in the second study: to also really look at their emotional states. And for this, we moved to the lab again and basically we built a social media simulator and an experiment in which the participants, including teenagers, could post things from a selection of memes that we gave them. When they posted them, they got likes based on other people's ratings. So those ratings were real, the only thing is that we manipulated, behind the scenes in this app, the memes they could select from. So sometimes we just give them really poor memes and that results in not so many likes. For both adults and for adolescents, if they got more likes for a while, they reported higher moods (because we also asked these questions during the experiment: 'how they were feeling at the moment?' And the mood would decline if you gave them all bad memes and they get less likes. Specifically for the adolescents, these effects were stronger and again, specifically for the negative mood. So they were definitely more affected by not getting the likes they expected or wanted.

James - What about a mechanism behind this association between reduced likes and lower mood? Are you able to say what's going on inside the brains of young people to perhaps explain why this enhanced emotional volatility is seen in relation to social media?

Wouter - Well, we think there's two things going on. One is, for them, it's much more important. The peer group, the connections they have on social media, 90 or more percent are basically the teens and the peers that they interact with in their daily life, from school and other things. If they're not getting the feedback, this is really a strong signal of not really belonging in the group they really want. However, they don't have alternatives often. The second thing is that emotional regulation itself is also a skill that's still developing during this period. We know that the prefrontal cortex and the connections with the subcortical brain regions, so the smaller emotional brain regions, are still developing during those years. And we also found some intriguing starting points to further explore this in a neuroimaging analysis that we did in a third study of the whole paper. We also found that the amygdala, which is one of those emotional brain regions that was highly correlated with the sensitivity to social feedback on Instagram, really stands out as one because it was also correlated with social anxiety and problematic social media use. So I think regulating the activity in that area could be really helpful to deal with the feedback that they get online.

James - How does this knowledge potentially help us reduce harms from smartphones? I know Instagram had a push recently to remove the like counter from posts and they also have more recently been developing accounts specifically for adolescents to mitigate some of the predispositions they have to having a difficult time on social media. Are those steps in the right direction?

Wouter - Here, we've only focused on one element: the likes. There are other things that also in very different ways might be very dangerous. If you talk about the likes, I think that's definitely a good step. Of course, it was only optional and it was still visible but not entirely. It's still easy to give the likes, and I think it would be nice if you could focus really on making those interactions online a little bit more meaningful. Strip it away even more.

Young girl with smartphone

What does the evidence say about smartphones in schools?
Sonia Livingstone, LSE

In countries like Australia, smartphones are effectively banned in all state funded schools, and have been in some states for over a year. Could this approach be having a positive impact on grades and mental health? Sonia Livingstone is Director of the Digital Futures for Children programme at LSE. She co-authored a recent report titled, ‘Does the evidence support a school ban on smartphones?’

Sonia - There's surprisingly little evidence given the amount of publicity that this issue is getting. What exists is a mixture of some studies showing keeping smartphones out of class improves children's academic outcomes, and some research doesn't really show any effects at all. We think that's partly because schools aren't really implementing outright bans. They have all kinds of nuances. There's kind of weak evidence that restricting smartphones in class is helpful and a little evidence that the benefits are particularly strong for children who are more disadvantaged or struggling in school and that makes sense. They may need more support to concentrate and learn.

James - In terms of the counterpoints, what are the potential benefits of having smartphones in schools?

Sonia - Well, for a long time we have thought as a society that having children with smartphones in school could support their learning, especially if it's embedded within the curriculum. Teachers know when to call on children to use their phones because they're powerful computers. They can enable personalised learning, they can enable children to pursue their particular interests. They're also useful for linking how children learn at home and at school, because they can take work they're halfway through, or they can complete work elsewhere, or they can bring something they've done from home into school. So a device that connects spaces of learning and offers children personally motivated opportunities for learning, the potential is considerable. I think, in what we're doing at the moment, schools find it too hard to control how children use their smartphones in class. Schools would prefer if they have the funding to provide children with school owned tablets or laptops.

James - Broadening our conversation out now, we've been hearing throughout the programme that social media is addictive by design. Some people say it takes children away from the activities that are crucial to their healthy development, playing face-to-face, sleep, of course. Do we see these harms borne out in any of the studies when comparing children who have less smartphone use?

Sonia - I think we can certainly see evidence that children who use their phones a lot are more likely to report some adverse outcomes like losing sleep or missing out on social interaction, or indeed seeing their school grades drop. The children who don't use the phone very much at all, some research says they miss out on the kind of social interaction and the peer culture that is part of school life and part of growing up. The ones in the middle - the ones who use it what's become a 'normal amount,' if you like - is where we see all kinds of outcomes. For some children, it gets in the way, it becomes a problem, they don't feel quite in control of it. For other children, it's a welcome relief or a source of relaxation or fun. So the outcomes of using the phone are about as variable as our children's lives, and that's why it's so hard to summarise.

It's not that there are no effects, but there are lots of different effects depending on children's backgrounds and starting points and what it is they want to do with the phone. I do think, on your point about addiction, we have seen a shift in what the phone represents in the last few years from a fantastic device that children can do many things with, to a device that increasingly has apps on it that are designed to grab and hold children's attention. If we can separate the phone from some of the apps and platforms on it, we might want to talk about restricting use of some of those apps or thinking again how to support children to use them in a way that is healthy for them and not excessive.

James - What about raising the age limit for social media, which stands at 13 for the most popular platforms, to 16?

Sonia - Well, I would much rather see restrictions on the platforms than I would restrictions on the children. Rather than raising the age limit, because social media offers children lots of benefits, I would rather see platforms being required to produce an age appropriate service for teenagers. For teenagers they could be required, and in some ways they are now being required by regulation, not to use the most addictive and attention grabbing algorithms and not to collect children's data and use it in ways that are not healthy or beneficial for them. So I think there are ways that we should be regulating the platforms to serve children better.

I'll refer to research that I've done with children and young people because they themselves have a really long and smart list of what they want to see. It's a mix of fewer features that grab their attention, better control over autoplay or endless scroll, more control over the algorithms so that they don't find themselves in those kinds of rabbit holes of negative content, it's better reporting functions and quicker take down so that when children and people do report problematic content something is done about it promptly.

It does feel sometimes like the platforms are kind of dragging their heels and only making the changes when they are made to, rather than, you know, seeing what is truly beneficial for young people and serving their audience better, which I think is likely to be better for their business as well as for young people.

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